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Do educated persons really need to use expletives?

Based on what I read here, these persons would do well to proof-read what they write. It would make it easier for educated persons to understand what they are writing/saying.

Censorship is necessary when MY rights (not to have to read/view crap) are not taken into consideration by someone who is posting.

Totally OT, but...

Someone needs to come down off the high horse. You talk about educated people being able to communicate effectively while not using expletives, implying that you are one of those so gifted. Also implying that those here who have used expletives (which are starred out, mind you) are not so intelligent or educated as you. Yet you then use one yourself. Hmmm.

You can argue and say that crap is merely a euphemism for excrement that you prefer instead of s**t. But would you be OK with having your hypothetical four-year-old daughter say "I have to take a crap daddy" because that would be effective communication without resorting expletives?
 
I really dont know what is with the censored *** marks....the actual passage read:


Now, "The Downward Spiral" the album is not available anywhere in the iPhone app. The song "The Downward Spiral" I believe is in a podcast that can be streamed to the app. Thanks Apple for the clear description of the problem - as in, what do you want us to change to get past your stupid cheesy standards?
....
You can buy The Downward Loopable Spiral on iTunes, but you can't allow an iPhone app that may have a song with a bad word somewhere in it. Geez, what if someone in the forum in our app says damn or jerk? I suppose that also falls into indecent material. Hey Apple, I just got some SPAM about Viagra THROUGH YOUR MAIL PROGRAM. I just saw Bob Dole right there in Safari! On my iPhone!

Come on Apple, think your policies through and for pete's sake get your app approval scenario together.
 
Trent taught a lot of kids to use The Pirate Bay when he released his free stuff to the 'net. I doubt that Apple wants something similar to happen to them.

Trent Reznor doesn't have enough pull to actually sway Apple. If something changes, it won't be because of this little tantrum. If you believe that he does have this much power, you're just sucking on his ego like he wants you to.
 
This is insane.

Facebook app - better ban it, some people might swear on Facebook.

Youtube app (that APPLE include themselves!!!) - gives you access to numerous videos with bad words in!!

Wikipedia apps - better ban that, might contain articles on offensive topics.

Dictionary apps - better ban those, they give you access to a whole load of naughty words!!!
 
Gotta say, I'm with Trent. This stuff can't always just be automated, it has to be case-by-case.

Comparing Apple's policies to Wal-mart's (in Trent's original post)... ouch.
 
Do educated persons really need to use expletives?

Based on what I read here, these persons would do well to proof-read what they write. It would make it easier for educated persons to understand what they are writing/saying.
 
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I don't see the problem, if I had kids I wouldn't want them downloading apps with bad language in them. I can block explicit songs.

If you had kids and decided to give them the password to your iTunes account thus allowing them to download whatever they want, well, then that's your screw up as a parent. We all shouldn't be affected by shi**y parenting.
 
They're not worried

I think that this is a key part of Trent's case. He's basically thrown down the gauntlet, promising to release the app -- one way or another. If Apple isn't willing to play along, he'll happily release it to the Jailbreak kids, then tell everyone how to Jailbreak their phone.

Trent taught a lot of kids to use The Pirate Bay when he released his free stuff to the 'net. I doubt that Apple wants something similar to happen to them.

Apple isn't worried about that. If NiN fans think this is the "killer app" that will deal damage to Apple's control over the platform, then NiN fans have a highly inflated opinion of themselves.

Apple will no doubt eventually address these issues and make the process less painful for developers. They'll probably merge the content guidelines of the App Store with the iTunes Store also. But it will take time to implement that thoughtfully.

Reznor's rant reminded me of why I stopped listening to NiN in high school. And he doesn't seem to understand Apple's goal with the App Store. It is specifically not an open desktop platform like the Mac, nor is it an open content platform like the Web. His comparisons to what he can see in Safari or what is showing up in his inbox are ridiculous.
 
Trent Reznor doesn't have enough pull to actually sway Apple. If something changes, it won't be because of this little tantrum. If you believe that he does have this much power, you're just sucking on his ego like he wants you to.

It's less about bringing down a house of cards than it is putting a chink in the dam.
 
******* ******!

What's the point of having words taken out and replaced with ******* when u know exactly what they are. Same thing on TV when they beep over a bad word... Come on Apple and everyone else. We all curse and love it too....

Stop this ************ ********** ********** *********** nonsense...
:rolleyes:
 
While I agree with Reznor's argument, posting it the way he did will NOT sway Apple. If anything, the obscenities only reinforce Apple's resolve. Right about now, whoever rejected the app at Apple is thinking, "Reznor can go **** himself!". But he won't post that publicly.

Mark
 
Apple isn't worried about that.
You state that as if it were a fact. What are your sources?

If NiN fans think this is the "killer app" that will deal damage to Apple's control over the platform, then NiN fans have a highly inflated opinion of themselves.

Like I said before, this particular case is less about total destruction than it is putting a chink in the armor over at Apple. This is a small case, but it's a big deal to a lot of very technologically sophisitcated users.

This won't destroy Apple, obviously, but it's going to leave them with a black eye to the NIN kids just like the Tweetie disaster left them with a black eye there.

I don't see how this gets the boot, but trash like Baby Shaker makes it through. That doesn't make any sense.

Apple will no doubt eventually address these issues and make the process less painful for developers. They'll probably merge the content guidelines of the App Store with the iTunes Store also. But it will take time to implement that thoughtfully.

Eventually, Apple will be forced into an open marketplace by the competition. I'm guessing that it isn't that far into the future, either.

Reznor's rant reminded me of why I stopped listening to NiN in high school.

Intellectual superiority FTW!

And he doesn't seem to understand Apple's goal with the App Store. It is specifically not an open desktop platform like the Mac, nor is it an open content platform like the Web.

I accept that this is the case, but I reject the notion that this is how it should be.

His comparisons to what he can see in Safari or what is showing up in his inbox are ridiculous.

Are they, really? Apple rejected the NIN app because it included a link to a song about shooting yourself. That would be fine, except that the YouTube app could grant access to a video of someone actually shooting themselves, while the iTunes Store app lets you download the song for a paltry 99 cents.
 
this is really bad of apple, hopefully they will take this back. Didn't this happen with tweetie as well?
 
Do educated persons really need to use expletives?

Based on what I read here, these persons would do well to proof-read what they write. It would make it easier for educated persons to understand what they are writing/saying.

Censorship is necessary when MY rights (not to have to read/view crap) are not taken into consideration by someone who is posting.

When it comes to profanity, I agree with this article.

http://www.vegasrex.com/2007/01/26/there-is-no-such-thing-as-profanity/
 
well

You state that as if it were a fact. What are your sources?

I have none. Just reasonably sound speculation.

Like I said before, this particular case is less about total destruction than it is putting a chink in the armor over at Apple. This is a small case, but it's a big deal to a lot of very technologically sophisitcated users.

Very sophisticated users that are willing to abandon the iPhone platform for the jailbroken iPhone platform and accept what comes with that. I'd say its a few rather than a lot.

Eventually, Apple will be forced into an open marketplace by the competition. I'm guessing that it isn't that far into the future, either.

I'm highly skeptical. Smartphones existed for many years before the iPhone, all with the "download files off random websites and unzip them, pay for them all separately entering your credit card info over and over" model (aka the Desktop model) and it didn't lead to the mass adoption of smartphones or smartphone applications. Selling apps like songs seems to have done the trick.

All of the current/planned app stores I'm aware of on other platforms have terms of service. Even ones that seemed very open, like Android. Perhaps someone will have a go at it and be successful. But that assumes they've got a good installed base with their platform to begin with. We'll see what the Pre does.



Intellectual superiority FTW!

I don't mean to be dismissive of the guy's talent. He's a heck of a talent. But at some point (ok, I think it was college) I said "Ok, I get it, you're depressed" and moved on. And his public persona doesn't really inspire me to give his more recent stuff a chance. My loss, perhaps.

I accept that this is the case, but I reject the notion that this is how it should be.

I agree, but I still like the advantages of this model for a hand held device. But I'd like to see some changes, and I'm sure we'll see some.
 
Trent Reznor doesn't have enough pull to actually sway Apple.
Probably not, but he has quite an influence and the NiN community tends to be cohesive and active, so I wouldn't discount him having some kind of influence.
I don't mean to be dismissive of the guy's talent. He's a heck of a talent. But at some point (ok, I think it was college) I said "Ok, I get it, you're depressed" and moved on. And his public persona doesn't really inspire me to give his more recent stuff a chance. My loss, perhaps.
You'll probably be happy to learn that he's not depressed anymore.

Also, yes.
 
Maybe as a parent you should do some parenting. Why would you allow your kids who are too young to hear curse words download any and all apps from the app store? Do you give them free reign on the internet too?

No amount of software can block everything. It will always remain the parents job to filter what they think their children should and should not be exposed to.


Gotta agree with this. People need to stop expecting the government and businesses to raise their children. Parents need to parent.
 
As to your first question, here is a book recommendation: http://www.amazon.com/********-Harr...=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1241448332&sr=8-1

As to your statement, it would seem as though more educated persons are in a better position to apply deductive reasoning to a seemingly unintelligible post, thereby figuring out what the poster was attempting to say. See my "fowl" v. "foul" post earlier in this thread as an example. Whereas others may experience more difficulty.

A better book recommendation for the good doctor is http://www.amazon.com/Fahrenheit-451-Ray-Bradbury/dp/0345342968

No, censorship is not cool. No, truly educated people aren't in favor of it.
 
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