OK...so let's say I buy the new 17" MacBook Pro with a non-interchangeable battery...

[179202]

oh dear another flame war over the non removeable 17" macbook pro battery, im not even going to get involved but i think we need to stop people making threads about this issue already. Steve knows what you want, and you want non removeable batteries.

Boom!

 

[Tosser]

Subtle southpark reference. I guess, for you, one needs to put a smiley after every single passing joke just so you don't get offended. You do seem to be overly defensive.

If that was a Soutpark reference, then you should have looked at the rest of the post, but apparently you decided to post ONLY a "Southpark reference"?

Besides, one should be wary of using telly- and cartoon references on an international board. They really don't translate well, nor do they transmit well to, say, somewhere thousands and thousand of miles to the east of you.

There are batteries with larger capacities on that site. The 444Wh model would probably cover a day's shooting pretty easily, but weighs 9lbs.

And it's huge. I seem to recall saying that? 9 lbs and huge.

As long as the internal battery is fully charged to begin with, you won't be charging the internal with the external, and one would expect to get the full use out of both without the losses you talk about here.

Lets say you get the advertised 8 hours from the 95Wh battery. Whats that, something like 45 hours, of 'advertised' battery life using the 444Wh external battery?

Very true. But as I ALSO have mentioned – several times by now – there are problems with having an external box. Did you not read the thread?

If you assume half the life goes up in smoke from temperature or inefficiencies, or because the OP hammers the HD with his constant shooting, thats still 22 hours or so.

I don't assume that, though, lol.

The world does not revolve around you....not even close. You are in such a neglectable minority, that its almost a non-issue.

I'd like to see the statistics for that claim?

most pro's use a power source, since it is required for things other than taking a a thousands of shots, tethered to a macbook pro.

Again, where do you get those tings from? Since when does most pros (I assume you mean pros working in the field, not thethered to a desk at an office) use external power sources?

there are so many solutions to this...like carrying an external power source which can charge your macbook pro via its power adapter.

Yet another person who didn't bother reading the thread.

We have established that the external UPS's does NOT carge the laptop (which is a good thing, as it eliminates the loss that would otherwise be there with charging one battery with another battery), but it sure doesn't eliminate the other problems with using a magsafe for the connection, the bulk or the weight, nor the problem with having your huge power source dangling loose.

 

[airmac]

ye 15" is what you gotta use then.

ChrisN

Another stupid reply. So when Apple update 15" with non-interchangeable battery I guess your advice would be ... buy a prev gen 15" MBP?!

...

 

[lscangus]

I doubt people who will do a day of photo shooting outdoor without having a car to carry their equipment, or power generator for their powerful lights, and have to import, manipulate, tune and export them specifically on their 17" not bigger or smaller, but 17" and have to finish them off adjusting them in an Outdoor environment, where the ambient lighting will cause a dramatic effect on the perception of photo, and then send them off to the client immediately right after the photo shooting, where driving off back to the studio will just be too long!

But if thats what you do, then Macbook Pro 17" is a no no for you. For dell, you can get the M6400, which is an amazing laptop, and can carry 12 extra battery IN YOUR RUCKSACK, because u do not use a car, as u can get AC power out of the car's engine.

 

[Tosser]

I doubt people who will do a day of photo shooting outdoor without having a car to carry their equipment, or power generator for their powerful lights, and have to import, manipulate, tune and export them specifically on their 17" not bigger or smaller, but 17" and have to finish them off adjusting them in an Outdoor environment, where the ambient lighting will cause a dramatic effect on the perception of photo, and then send them off to the client immediately right after the photo shooting, where driving off back to the studio will just be too long!

Ah, yes, nothing like sarcasm based on ignorance. With your argument (I do audio mostly, not so much photo), we can make do with with two hours of real world usage, and then for the rest of the time be tethered to a car or a noisy generator. It makes me wonder how many of you actually have any real world work experience, or you are writing this in between doing your homework.

But if thats what you do, then Macbook Pro 17" is a no no for you. For dell, you can get the M6400, which is an amazing laptop, and can carry 12 extra battery IN YOUR RUCKSACK, because u do not use a car, as u can get AC power out of the car's engine.

Sure, it's always nice being tethered to a car, that will have to be running, btw, since you'll quickly drain a starter battery if you don't. Do you realise that there's a huge difference between a starter battery and a deep discharge battery?

 

[179202]

If that was a Soutpark reference, then you should have looked at the rest of the post, but apparently you decided to post ONLY a "Southpark reference"?

Besides, one should be wary of using telly- and cartoon references on an international board. They really don't translate well, nor do they transmit well to, say, somewhere thousands and thousand of miles to the east of you.

Hey buddy, he's not your guy!!!

Chill out and watch more silly television. It'd do wonders for your stress levels!

 

[Tosser]

Hey buddy, he's not your guy!!!

Chill out and watch more silly television. It'd do wonders for your stress levels!

Ah, yes. TV, the cultural bearer of ignorance and stupidity.

I'll get right on it – I'm gonna get myself a satellite dish so I don't get "offended" when some american high-schooler regurgitates some pop-cultural tv-phenomenon on an international forum

 

[MasterNile]

We have established that the external UPS's does NOT carge the laptop (which is a good thing, as it eliminates the loss that would otherwise be there with charging one battery with another battery), but it sure doesn't eliminate the other problems with using a magsafe for the connection, the bulk or the weight, nor the problem with having your huge power source dangling loose.

I'm not a pro or anything, but (just addressing the magsafe problem here, the others I have no answers to) couldn't you use the external UPS connected to your laptop before discharging the battery, kind of using the battery as a back up if you do lose connection to the UPS?

Edit: BTW I did read every single post in this thread before posting this so Tosser didn't beat me

 

[Tosser]

MN,

Yes, that would be a possibility. But, once again, this workaround introduces the problem, that you will have to _always_ carry your UPS as part of the computer. So suddenly you don't actualy have a "laptop", but merely a portable desktop with a UPS.
Or in other words, you will use the internal battery as the UPS, making the combo the ordinary set-up. Just so one can save a few grammes on the latch and casing on the laptop. This, quite frankly, is like saving a dollar, well knowing that that dollar saved will cost you hundreds the next day.

P.S. Don't worry, I wasn't going to "come after" you

 

[MasterNile]

Yeah the ideal solution would be....some kind of removable battery so you can replace it with spares when needed. Novel idea

 

[lscangus]

Ah, yes, nothing like sarcasm based on ignorance. With your argument (I do audio mostly, not so much photo), we can make do with with two hours of real world usage, and then for the rest of the time be tethered to a car or a noisy generator. It makes me wonder how many of you actually have any real world work experience, or you are writing this in between doing your homework.




Sure, it's always nice being tethered to a car, that will have to be running, btw, since you'll quickly drain a starter battery if you don't. Do you realise that there's a huge difference between a starter battery and a deep discharge battery?

O right. So what kind of audio you do? Mixing? Monitoring? Recording?

Tell us so we can help you out.

 

[Tosser]

O right. So what kind of audio you do? Mixing? Monitoring? Recording?

Tell us so we can help you out.

Are you freaking kidding me? Does it sound like any of you guys can actually help with any of your pseudo workarounds? So far, all I have seen are apologetic nonsensical workarounds that simply doesn't cut it in the real world for many of us.

If you must know, I work in broadcast, but also have to do web et al.
I do radio documentaries (of course not solely) and sometimes I do audio for telly and the odd concert and so on.

I basically do the lot: Monitoring (who the hell do anything audio related without it?), recording, and the mixing – both running and post.

I'm astounded. This is the third time within a week someone thinks they can give "advice" to me (and others) all the while thinking that ignorant and stupid workarounds is perfectly fine, and all without anyone actually asking for "advice", since no amount of "advice" will make a non-interchangeable battery swappable, nor, say, a lack of firewire suddenly appear (or work, in the case of the MB "Pro").

Edit:
What's worse, I just took a look at your posts – there is nothing wrong with them - but the lack of audio related and lack of posts concerning anything field related is in itself rather telling. What on earth makes you think you could give any of us advice in this context? It sure as hell proves my point, that the only ones trying out the tactics of "let us know, and we will help you" when no advice was asked, are the ones that really have no clue. I hope your gaming will turn out to be great ...

Yeah the ideal solution would be....some kind of removable battery so you can replace it with spares when needed. Novel idea

Haha, exactly

 

[lscangus]

Are you freaking kidding me? Does it sound like any of you guys can actually help with any of your pseudo workarounds? So far, all I have seen are apologetic nonsensical workarounds that simply doesn't cut it in the real world for many of us.

If you must know, I work in broadcast, but also have to do web et al.
I do radio documentaries (of course not solely) and sometimes I do audio for telly and the odd concert and so on.

I basically do the lot: Monitoring (who the hell do anything audio related without it?), recording, and the mixing – both running and post.

I'm astounded. This is the third time within a week someone thinks they can give "advice" to me (and others) all the while thinking that ignorant and stupid workarounds is perfectly fine, and all without anyone actually asking for "advice", since no amount of "advice" will make a non-interchangeable battery swappable, nor, say, a lack of firewire suddenly appear (or work, in the case of the MB "Pro").

Edit:
What's worse, I just took a look at your posts – there is nothing wrong with them - but the lack of audio related and lack of posts concerning anything field related is in itself rather telling. What on earth makes you think you could give any of us advice in this context? It sure as hell proves my point, that the only ones trying out the tactics of "let us know, and we will help you" when no advice was asked, are the ones that really have no clue. I hope your gaming will turn out to be great ...



Haha, exactly

Oh i am so sorry i dare not to give you advice, my honor.

Coz i am amazed that all your audio equipments, mixing desk, MIC peramp, all run on swappable batteries.

I am not not a pro anyway. I did a few live audio mixing and a few studio recording sections in my life.

 

[Tosser]

Oh i am so sorry i dare not to give you advice, my honor.

Since I didn't ask for your advice, that's perfectly fine, lassie.

Coz i am amazed that all your audio equipments all run on swappable batteries.

What in the term "field work" do you not understand? And no, not all my equipment run on batteries, but my computer, my field recorder and field mixer (novel ideas, huh?), and cameras do.
As I figured, you were merely trying to pretend you were in a position where you were actually able to give advice

I am not not a pro anyway. I did a few live audio mixing and a few studio recording sections in my life.

See above.

 

[lscangus]

Since I didn't ask for your advice, that's perfectly fine, lassie.



What in the term "field work" do you not understand? And no, not all my equipment run on batteries, but my computer, my field recorder and field mixer (novel ideas, huh?), and cameras do.
As I figured, you were merely trying to pretend you were in a position where you were actually able to give advice



See above.

Coz i cannot imagine the scenario you have. Like recording , and mixing LIVE at the same time but at some where it is impossible to get any AC.

 

[Tosser]

I see you added to your post:

Coz i am amazed that all your audio equipments, mixing desk, MIC peramp, all run on swappable batteries.

Sigh:

(oh, they funnily enough have preamps inbuilt, as does the field mixer)

Field mixer:

And, finally, a camera –*although, not the specific one I use:

Weird how "field work" actually does mean "field work" and mostly does include batteries, huh?

Coz i cannot imagine the scenario you have. Like recording , and mixing LIVE at the same time but at some where it is impossible to get any AC.

Sigh. It's called L- and M-series batteries. I rarely plug in – mostly because I want to avoid the risk of getting a buzz-sound from the electrical grid.

 

[Quu]

I think not making the battery removable was a bit foolish. I mean if you actually look at the new 15" battery it is very similar to the 17"

No I'm not saying they are the same. They are a different shape. But there is no mechanism to release the 15" battery, it just has a plastic pull tab (just like the 17" one) I do not see a specially crafted latch or coin release or anything like that. Just an easy latch to remove the base cover.

I don't see why they couldn't of allowed the battery to be user-changeable just by having you remove some screws and selling after-market batteries. Or added a single latch. I'm not saying that I'm a hardware designer and I'm definitely not saying I'm better then Johnny Ive but even I could add a latching mechanism to the 17" to make that battery user accessible.

I really get the sense that Apple just like locking batteries in to their devices. How many people who own iPods do you think just buy a new one when its battery dies. They look at it like 'Well I got to send this in for $60 to get the battery replaced, or I could just get the new shiny model!' - I think they are trying something similar on these MacBook Pros.

I know loads and loads of people who still use PowerPC based Powerbooks and iBooks and they love them. And being able to purchase cheap batteries from practically anywhere (Ebay etc) makes it easier to live with these older machines. But Apple obviously wants people to keep buying new machines. By adding in this 'Battery replacement tax' they are making it more difficult in the future for users who are happy with the performance of their machine to keep using it without shelling out more money.

Obviously I think Apple had a difficult problem with the 17" power wise it consumes a lot more then the 15" so they needed a larger battery but wanted to keep the entire thing under an inch thin. But I believe they could have made the battery removable and simply chose not to. Did anyone else notice that the slides of the 17" in their Video that showed the Huge battery mechanism wasn't even from an older generation 17" ? It looked more like a G4 iBook or G4 PowerBook latching system and those were huge.

 

[lscangus]

I see you added to your post:



Sigh:

(oh, they funnily enough have preamps inbuilt, as does the field mixer)

Field mixer:

And, finally, a camera –*although, not the specific one I use:

Weird how "field work" actually does mean "field work" and mostly does include batteries, huh?



Sigh. It's called L- and M-series batteries. I rarely plug in – mostly because I want to avoid the risk of getting a buzz-sound from the electrical grid.

Is the scenario i am interested, not equipment. i.e. in what kind of situation, you will use these equipment, which needs real time mixing and recording for more than 6-7 hours.

You do not need a 17 inches anyway, as you are not working with many tracks.

 

[Tosser]

Is the scenario i am interested, not equipment. i.e. in what kind of situation, you will use these equipment, which needs real time mixing and recording for more than 6-7 hours.

You do not need a 17 inches anyway, as you are not working with many tracks.

Do you not read? I do not plug in, mostly in order to avoid grid-buzz? Hello? Are you there?

I use my 15 incher, and have no intention of going to a 17 inch. However, if you haven't noticed, Apple will introduce (or remove) one feature on a single laptop and later on it will happen to them all.

What makes you think I don't do many tracks at times? That I showed you one of my mics?
I have two "personal" audio interfaces –*one at home (fw, multitrack) and one portable, driven by the fw-port.
I cannot believe how arrogant you act, trying to pretend you know more about my work than I do myself. Man, this surely must be a joke. You don't even know, that there is a rule when working with field gear: "Bring extra batteries". It's there for a reason – not because we _in theory_ might be able to get by on a single charge. ***** happens out there.

 

[lscangus]

Do you not read? I do not plug in, mostly in order to avoid grid-buzz? Hello? Are you there?

I use my 15 incher, and have no intention of going to a 17 inch. However, if you haven't noticed, Apple will introduce (or remove) one feature on a single laptop and later on it will happen to them all.

What makes you think I don't do many tracks at times? That I showed you one of my mics?
I have two "personal" audio interfaces –*one at home (fw, multitrack) and one portable, driven by the fw-port.
I cannot believe how arrogant you act, trying to pretend you know more about my work than I do myself. Man, this surely must be a joke. You don't even know, that there is a rule when working with field gear: "Bring extra batteries". It's there for a reason – not because we _in theory_ might be able to get by on a single charge. ***** happens out there.

So is you do not want to plug your equipment in, rather than you do not have an AC supply right?

So you can use an AC adapter for your MBP

And if you are working at home with multi-tracks, u can get an external monitor right away.

And tell me what scenario u work in?

 

[OPsDad]

In a hole!

Some people, when they find themselves in a hole, respond by digging faster.

Not only should there be swappable batteries, but chargers you can use for just a battery.

I frequently have a place a few minutes away where I can plug in a battery while I use my MBP on battery power. To have a charged battery to swap in, over and over, that would be a beautiful thing. Like my Sony camera, came with a charger for (industry standard) batteries, as WELL as the camera charging the battery while plugged in.

Sigh. I feel your pain, Tosser.

 

[Tosser]

So is you do not want to plug your equipment in, rather than you do not have an AC supply right?

What are you asking?
I prefer to NOT plug in, because when you work with AUDIO you might pick up electrical noise from the electrical grid. What the hell is so difficult to understand? Often I am nowhere near an electrical outlet, but even when I am, I prefer to not use it.

So you can use an AC adapter for your MBP

Sheesh!

And if you are working at home, u can get an external monitor right away.

An external monitor? Are you trying to give me "advice" yet again? Do you even know what "monitoring" means when it comes to audio?
It's bloody near-field monitors (SPEAKERS!) and HEADPHONES – it's NOT some LED- or LCD-display

Still trying to give "advice", huh!?

Some people, when they find themselves in a hole, respond by digging faster.

Not only should there be swappable batteries, but chargers you can use for just a battery.

I frequently have a place a few minutes away where I can plug in a battery while I use my MBP on battery power. To have a charged battery to swap in, over and over, that would be a beautiful thing. Like my Sony camera, came with a charger for (industry standard) batteries, as WELL as the camera charging the battery while plugged in.

Sigh. I feel your pain, Tosser.

Thanks, OPsDad

 

[lscangus]

What are you asking?
I prefer to NOT plug in, because when you work with AUDIO you might pick up electrical noise from the electrical grid. What the hell is so difficult to understand? Often I am nowhere near an electrical outlet, but even when I am, I prefer to not use it.



Sheesh!




An external monitor? Are you trying to give me "advice" yet again? Do you even know what "monitoring" means when it comes to audio?
It's bloody near-field monitors (SPEAKERS!) and HEADPHONES – it's NOT some LED- or LCD-display

Still trying to give "advice", huh!?




Thanks, OPsDad

Where do you usually work? I have never been to the america, but i am amazed that is difficult to get AC power in that country

Of course i know Audio monitor means, those rubbish KRK, genelec, PMC, or ADAM. but what i mean is u do not need a 17 inches as you can have a bigger monitor as in LCD

I mean what kind of job and scenario you do? tell me so!

 

[Tosser]

You added again.

And tell me what scenario u work in?

I have already told you as much as you need. You don't even know what "monitoring" means when it comes to audio, so there is no need to have to explain every little thing I do and don't do, so you can pretend to be able to give advice on something you know absolutely zero about.

Of course i know Audio monitor means, but what i mean is u do not need a 17 inches as you can have a bigger monitor as in LCD.

Sheesh!! For Christ's sake! No, you STILL don't know what you're talking about. I am NOT talking about ANY SORT OF DISPLAY when I talk about "monitoring audio". I am NOT talking about "audio monitor" (whatever that might be), I am talking about "audio monitoring" which is entirely different from what you THINK it is.


I am using a 15" and I have at no point expressed any sort of short comings when it comes to display size, nor any inability to plug in an external display, nor anything about not having an external at work or at home. An external display is nowhere NEAR what we talk about. I have no idea where you got the idea from that this was an issue whatsoever.

I mean what kind of job and scenario you do? tell me so!

See the last couple of posts.

Again an edit:

Where do you usually work? I have never been to the america, but i am amazed that is difficult to get AC power in that country

I do NOT work or live in the US. I live in Denmark. But again, you show utter ignorance about this. Is the term "field work" too hard to fathom?

Of course i know Audio monitor means, those rubbish KRK, genelec, PMC, or ADAM. but what i mean is u do not need a 17 inches as you can have a bigger monitor as in LCD

See the previous response.

I mean what kind of job and scenario you do? tell me so!

I told you. I work in broadcast and mostly do audio, but also web and a little photography.

 

[lscangus]

You added again.


I have already told you as much as you need. You don't even know what "monitoring" means when it comes to audio, so there is no need to have to explain every little thing I do and don't do, so you can pretend to be able to give advice on something you know absolutely zero about.



Sheesh!! For Christ's sake! No, you STILL don't know what you're talking about. I am NOT talking about ANY SORT OF DISPLAY when I talk about "monitoring audio". I am NOT talking about "audio monitor" (whatever that might be), I am talking about "audio monitoring" which is entirely different from what you THINK it is.


I am using a 15" and I have at no point expressed any sort of short comings when it comes to display size, nor any inability to plug in an external display, nor anything about not having an external at work or at home. An external display is nowhere NEAR what we talk about. I have no idea where you got the idea from that this was an issue whatsoever.





See the last couple of posts.

XD