Heaven forbid you should have the choice of what portable music player you get to listen to the songs you've paid for onI hope Apple don't allow this.
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Palm Pre Emulating an iPod to Accomplish iTunes Sync?
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You know, if it was Microsoft rather than Apple trying to stop Palm from interacting with WMP as opposed to iTunes, you lot would be screaming for blood instead of putting up a staunch defence.
Damn fanboys and their double standards.
Damn fanboys and their double standards.
DRM free..
The thing is, most songs you buy from iTunes are now DRM free or you have just uploaded your CD collection.
In some ways, why should Apple stop you from using your own library?
I love my Mac and iPhone, but as a matter of principle I would want freedom to manage my own library on any device I like.
The thing is, most songs you buy from iTunes are now DRM free or you have just uploaded your CD collection.
In some ways, why should Apple stop you from using your own library?
I love my Mac and iPhone, but as a matter of principle I would want freedom to manage my own library on any device I like.
Heaven forbid you should have the choice of what portable music player you get to listen to the songs you've paid for on
As Evangelion and skwoytek have pointed out you can use your music in your itunes library with any 3rd party device you like. You just can't sync through itunes. Although inconvenient, it should be pointed out that apple aren't stopping you using other devices per se...
Apple disagree unsurprisingly, more surprisingly is that most people here seem to think that this is just fine
Apple kool-aid is truly powerful stuff.
Surely only a matter of time until a competition commission (EU most likely) give them the slap they need.
iTunes is great, the store is great. The Apple lock in needs to change.
Did Apple try to dock an iPod with Palm Desktop?
Because if they didn't _Apple_ will look very stupid if they complain that it doesn't work.
So Apple is giving us the digital hub. It just must not become too hubby. If we start using it as our "digital hub" and as the centre of all our digital devices, Apple will sue us and/or the people who provide the products we use.
That's convenient.
There are three things I really hate about Apple: their customer service, their use of government powers to defeat competition, and the fact that they never test their software.
Wow, sounds like your super excited for thousands of people to lose their jobs! You must be very close to Apple to be this excited. Actually, I don't think any corporate executive for any competitor is thinking like that. Hmmm, yea they probably have other things to think about and find enjoyment from. I'd suggest the same for you.
But they are not blocking you from syncing with your library. iTunes might not be available to those players, but the library is.
But it doesn't accomplish the same task. It syncs with different device. And what exactly is so hard here? Are you SERIOUSLY going to claim that launching a library-manager and plugging in your device is just plain too hard?
the other app could just be used for syncing. Seriously, it's not that hard. You just launch the other app and sync with that, instead of syncing with iTunes. The difficulty in doing that is about the same as it is with iTunes itself.
Yeah, like THAT is going to be really hard
.... They could stop using iTunes if they wanted to. There are other stores besides ITMS available to them. Songbird has built-in store as well, why not use it and it alone?
And are you seriously going to claim that it's simply too hard to use another app for syncing? That people are utterly incapable of understanding when you tell them that "you can use this app to buy stuff, but if you want them on your device, use this other app here"?
People could always stop using iTunes.
Yes, as their primary one. And they could have another app for secondary use, like syncing to devices that iTunes does not support.
What do you mean by "maintain"? The app doesn't need active maintenance, it's just there.
Go right ahead.
All we are asking from that app is the ability to sync the library to your device, that's all.
If iTunes does not work with your device, then we could safely say that it does NOT work.
And if iTunes does not work with your device?
Like I have repeatedly said: you are free to sync your library to your device by using some other library-manager. expecting that iTunes work with each and every mp3-player out there is just dumb.
And you guys nmake it sound like next to impossible to have two library-managers. Why? What's so hard in it? When you want to sync to iPod, just use iTunes. When you want to use some other device, just launch the other app, and use it to sync. Is that REALLY that hard?
Palm should really come up with their own app that reads ones iTunes library and then syncs it to the Pre... rather than using iTunes itself to sync with the Pre. It really doesn't seem like it would be too hard.
I can see Apple being all over this if these iTunes syncing rumors are true.
I can see Apple being all over this if these iTunes syncing rumors are true.
With regards to the difficulty of having two library-managers: it's not that it's difficult, it's the whole question of why the hell should I?
If iTunes works well, why the hell should I have to move to ZenPlayer or whatever it is?
If I can minimize the number of programs I have to deal with things, I'm happier. This is why I love Amarok (well, pre Amarok 2) so much; I can plug in my generic MP3 player, my friend's iPod, and my iRiver, and it will happily manage any and all of them. It's extremely convenient to have everything in one ****ing place, rather than having to configure several different pieces of software.
It's not that it's hard, but that it's a pain in the ass and a big efficiency sinkhole that's ultimately not so much worth it and creates more schism than should be necessary in a computer system. People avoid this with Apple by going with Apple products; but if there's a way to use the Apple stuff with something that's not Apple, something that's potentially cheaper, you bet your ass people would go to the cheaper third party product that can still be managed with Apple stuff purely on the basis that they don't have to deal with the BS of Yet Another Program to Eat Hard Drive Space and be Rarely Used.
Simple as that.
If iTunes works well, why the hell should I have to move to ZenPlayer or whatever it is?
If I can minimize the number of programs I have to deal with things, I'm happier. This is why I love Amarok (well, pre Amarok 2) so much; I can plug in my generic MP3 player, my friend's iPod, and my iRiver, and it will happily manage any and all of them. It's extremely convenient to have everything in one ****ing place, rather than having to configure several different pieces of software.
It's not that it's hard, but that it's a pain in the ass and a big efficiency sinkhole that's ultimately not so much worth it and creates more schism than should be necessary in a computer system. People avoid this with Apple by going with Apple products; but if there's a way to use the Apple stuff with something that's not Apple, something that's potentially cheaper, you bet your ass people would go to the cheaper third party product that can still be managed with Apple stuff purely on the basis that they don't have to deal with the BS of Yet Another Program to Eat Hard Drive Space and be Rarely Used.
Simple as that.
This is why you people aren't running apple inc. You have no logic sense in wanting apple to stop pre syncing with iTunes. There are a lot of reasons why apple might stop them doing so.
Argument - Pre is using multitouch that apple probably has patents for.
Reason - The people with a pre are the ones without an iPhone. Like it or not they are not going to have 2 smartphones (maybe a smartphone and a normal phone, but not 2 smart phones, that's just stupid.). The people who own a pre probably also own an ipod. They paid for their music, they should have the right to use it on any device as jobs wished it when he pleaded for DRM free music. New music stores are popping up every day, there has to be a way to keep them coming back to one store, for it is a MAJOR part of apple's revenue with or without the ipod or iphone or mac. freely distributing itunes and safari can in no way have apple losing money. It's a free form of advertising the apple brand.
Apple may be forcing palm to use itunes as the suncing program, as an out of court settlement for pre alegedly using apple technology.
There are Mac fans and there are total hopeless noobs who follow apple blindly without a thought. they, and people who follow micro$oft blindly are one and the same to me. I hate you both. wake up to yourselves, there is no competition here as to who is the biggest mac no0b of all. If you are that stupid, at least keep it to yourself. i'm slowly becoming disgusted at associating myself with such dumbasses. Chill out a little.
Argument - Pre is using multitouch that apple probably has patents for.
Reason - The people with a pre are the ones without an iPhone. Like it or not they are not going to have 2 smartphones (maybe a smartphone and a normal phone, but not 2 smart phones, that's just stupid.). The people who own a pre probably also own an ipod. They paid for their music, they should have the right to use it on any device as jobs wished it when he pleaded for DRM free music. New music stores are popping up every day, there has to be a way to keep them coming back to one store, for it is a MAJOR part of apple's revenue with or without the ipod or iphone or mac. freely distributing itunes and safari can in no way have apple losing money. It's a free form of advertising the apple brand.
Apple may be forcing palm to use itunes as the suncing program, as an out of court settlement for pre alegedly using apple technology.
There are Mac fans and there are total hopeless noobs who follow apple blindly without a thought. they, and people who follow micro$oft blindly are one and the same to me. I hate you both. wake up to yourselves, there is no competition here as to who is the biggest mac no0b of all. If you are that stupid, at least keep it to yourself. i'm slowly becoming disgusted at associating myself with such dumbasses. Chill out a little.
As nice as that would be, I just can't see Apple letting this go. I personally wouldn't mind if iTunes could sync with the Pre, but I know for sure Apple will, that's just the way they are.
As far as a second app that takes care of syncing, what's wrong with that? It could be better optimized for the Pre and be very simple. As simple as, plugging in the Pre, app automatically launching as it recognizes the Pre, and the option to "Sync an iTunes Library" with the Pre. It could even offer other things like photo management and address book and app back-ups. To me this seems like the best route for both the consumer, and for Palm to keep Apple off their backs.
Um, because your player does not work with iTunes?
Because
a) if iTunes does not work with your device, it's not really "working well", now is it?
b) You are not expected to "move" to another app, reather, you would be using the side-by-side.
If Amarok works for you, then use it and it alone. Why would you want to use iTunes then?
I don't think anyone has challenged whether it makes good business sense for apple to block synching with other music players have they
?People are arguing from the point of view of consumers (which they are) to whom the ability to use a iTunes to manage all their media with the devices they chose would be the most convenient option.
Sounds like nonsense to me.
I'm sure the pictures in the previous thread shown the pre syncing as a standard 'device' not iPod'.
There has always been an open standard used for sync support that was available for any company to make use of. Unfortunatly a majority of companies either chose to support only limited formats (mp3 or wma and nothing else) or even worse, designed their own half-assed syncing software, sony are terrible for this.
DRM syncing isn't much of an issue now because it has all been removed from the store. I think this guy has the wrong idea as there is no reason whatsoever to 'trick' itunes when device compatibility is already there. As i said in the other thread i can see other companies finally dropping their own crap and adding support with new devices/firmware updates.
I do find it funny reading all the comments for people blaming apple for other devices not syncing with itunes when it was the creators of those devices who decided to not add such support.
I'm sure the pictures in the previous thread shown the pre syncing as a standard 'device' not iPod'.
There has always been an open standard used for sync support that was available for any company to make use of. Unfortunatly a majority of companies either chose to support only limited formats (mp3 or wma and nothing else) or even worse, designed their own half-assed syncing software, sony are terrible for this.
DRM syncing isn't much of an issue now because it has all been removed from the store. I think this guy has the wrong idea as there is no reason whatsoever to 'trick' itunes when device compatibility is already there. As i said in the other thread i can see other companies finally dropping their own crap and adding support with new devices/firmware updates.
I do find it funny reading all the comments for people blaming apple for other devices not syncing with itunes when it was the creators of those devices who decided to not add such support.
Marketing
This can't be much more than low-brow PR.
Palm are obviously hoping to attract iPhone users away from their contracts, and I'm sure there's enough non-savvy users out there who'll completely mis-interpret this news as meaning more than it does.
And iTunes is hardly the best playlist manager on the block, especially for Windows users (yes don't forget not everyone is a Mac user).
This can't be much more than low-brow PR.
Palm are obviously hoping to attract iPhone users away from their contracts, and I'm sure there's enough non-savvy users out there who'll completely mis-interpret this news as meaning more than it does.
And iTunes is hardly the best playlist manager on the block, especially for Windows users (yes don't forget not everyone is a Mac user).
there gonna stop it because its patent infringement most likely.. and because the pre is a huge competition to the iphone.. You dont let competition use your stuff to make there product better..
thats like buying a verizon phone and at&t letting verizon use there towers in the spots where verizon doesnt have towers and at&t does.. so why would you buy a at&t phone then?? yea think a little there
The awesomeness about this is that Palm has patents that apple infringes on, and apple has patents that palm infringes on. That fancy Auto-Brightness on the iphone and apple keyboards, palm owns the IP for that. So... really this could turn out to be an interesting battle.
Just by calling it Exclusive syncing you invalidated you whole post. Apple cant do crap about it. And Honestly it is about time that we are able to do this. Why the hell am I not Allow to Move MY Music to my non apple mp3 player?
Let me start by saying I'm all in favor of the Pre syncing. However, this argument does not hold up, because Apple is not preventing you from moving your music onto another mp3 player. It is just not letting you sync using iTunes.
I think of it like a math problem. Some math teachers let the students come up with the answer whichever way they think is right, as long as they show work and get the right answer, as opposed to making them do it a certain way.
You have the ability to transfer your music using a variety of methods, just not iTunes.
It's a bit more complicated than you're making out here.
http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/news/2009/05/itunes-on-the-mac-plays-nice-with-palm-prefor-now.ars
ArsTechnica said:
For all you people getting moist because you think apple has legal grounds to stop pre from syncing with itunes I tell you, GET A CLUE.
The only thing apple can do is just not support it. They will not come out and sue Palm for this, neither will they officially say that they will break this on purpose.
I love how you Fan boys are drooling all over this as if you have a victory here. Well let me tell you something the consumer is the loser and last time I checked unless you where part of team apple then you are the consumer.
God this is what I Hate about the mac world, the snobby "I am better tha you because I use a mac fanboys"
The only thing apple can do is just not support it. They will not come out and sue Palm for this, neither will they officially say that they will break this on purpose.
I love how you Fan boys are drooling all over this as if you have a victory here. Well let me tell you something the consumer is the loser and last time I checked unless you where part of team apple then you are the consumer.
God this is what I Hate about the mac world, the snobby "I am better tha you because I use a mac fanboys"
Wirelessly posted (iPod touch 32GB: Mozilla/5.0 (iPhone; U; CPU iPhone OS 3_0 like Mac OS X; en-us) AppleWebKit/528.18 (KHTML, like Gecko) Version/4.0 Mobile/7A312g Safari/528.16)
I honestly don't know what the fuss is about: the reason I use an iPod / iPhone isn't because of iTunes. I didn't think OMG, iTunes is so awesome I must buy a device to use with it.
Instead, I use apple devices because of the device and iTunes is simply the way I manage content on them. So what if another device can also use iTunes: it isn't going to make me want to go out and buy it just because of that!
If it's a better device and that leads to Apple losing sales, they should (and IMO would) be more concerned about improving their devices than creating an artificial lock in...
And one final point: OS X uses SAMBA (which is a reverse engineered / reengineered version of SMB) to masquerade as Windows machines so they can "play nice" and integrate into a Windows network. How is that any different?
I honestly don't know what the fuss is about: the reason I use an iPod / iPhone isn't because of iTunes. I didn't think OMG, iTunes is so awesome I must buy a device to use with it.
Instead, I use apple devices because of the device and iTunes is simply the way I manage content on them. So what if another device can also use iTunes: it isn't going to make me want to go out and buy it just because of that!
If it's a better device and that leads to Apple losing sales, they should (and IMO would) be more concerned about improving their devices than creating an artificial lock in...
And one final point: OS X uses SAMBA (which is a reverse engineered / reengineered version of SMB) to masquerade as Windows machines so they can "play nice" and integrate into a Windows network. How is that any different?
I don't use iTunes, and I don't like "syncing", I've always preferred to drag'n'drop honestly. I don't see this as the end of the world for Apple though.
People using iTunes:
-More likely to own / consider Mac Hardware in future.
-More likely to buy an iPod as MP3 Player (Pre only has 8gb, Eos has 4gb).
-More likely to use iTunes Store rather than AmazonMP3 (Available ON the Pre), even if Apple only makes small amounts on Music sales it helps them keep Marketshare.
I'd like a phone with webOS but I use a 900/2100 network (I don't have an iPhone either).
Why would you think that? They haven't BLOCKED any other media players, they just haven't gone out of their way to support them. AT THIS POINT IN TIME, DUN DUN DUN...
You can, what's the problem? Oh right using more that one program is TOO HARD I hope you're using Opera, it has e-Mail, IRC & BitTorrent built-in.
People using iTunes:
-More likely to own / consider Mac Hardware in future.
-More likely to buy an iPod as MP3 Player (Pre only has 8gb, Eos has 4gb).
-More likely to use iTunes Store rather than AmazonMP3 (Available ON the Pre), even if Apple only makes small amounts on Music sales it helps them keep Marketshare.
I'd like a phone with webOS but I use a 900/2100 network (I don't have an iPhone either).
Why would you think that? They haven't BLOCKED any other media players, they just haven't gone out of their way to support them. AT THIS POINT IN TIME, DUN DUN DUN...
You can, what's the problem? Oh right using more that one program is TOO HARD
I hope you're using Opera, it has e-Mail, IRC & BitTorrent built-in. 
I like this. Let Palm do it, but the device must appear as itself. Then have a new tiered pricing system for non iPods due to the complexity of Apple having to allow this.
Say, $1.99 for older stuff. $2.49 for new songs?