NickName99
macrumors 6502a
This is a pretty good novelty account! I didn’t notice - even though your picture makes it so obvious. It all makes sense now, carry on! #fakenews #nocollusion
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Proposed Tariffs Could Lead to 14% Increase in U.S. iPhone Prices
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This is a pretty good novelty account! I didn’t notice - even though your picture makes it so obvious. It all makes sense now, carry on! #fakenews #nocollusion
stylinexpat
macrumors 68020
Many property values are over $500,000 in California perhaps we should increase property tax to 3-5% 😵what is 3-4% more when home prices are already $500K in California 😉
stylinexpat
macrumors 68020
In the end people will pay buy or upgrade less often is what I reckon. Perhaps skip a couple of cycles and this will show in Apple's quarterly earnings when they report earnings and sales numbers just wait and see. Those that wait 1 year may wait 2 and those that wait 2 may wait 3. When you are in laptop computer price category range 3-4 years is possible before upgrading.
JRobinsonJr
macrumors 6502a
So does ignoring other countries that steal your IP and flood markets with subsidized products. Thank God we have a leader who is willing to stand up to China.
RudySnow
Suspended
Exactly. That’s why we didn’t elect Clinton. If we did, the Chinese would never have an opportunity to reach a deal to stop ripping us off in unfair trade practices.
... I assume that’s what you meant.
NickName99
macrumors 6502a
Here’s a great article that dives deeper into the effects of Trump’s trade war. There really aren’t any upsides. Hopefully the next administration has qualified grownups running things.
https://www.npr.org/2019/05/10/721921317/new-round-of-tariffs-take-a-bigger-bite-of-consumers-budget
https://www.npr.org/2019/05/10/721921317/new-round-of-tariffs-take-a-bigger-bite-of-consumers-budget
JRobinsonJr
macrumors 6502a
What, exactly, does that have to do with this? Having recently been to China I can tell you that they aren't boycotting US products (exactly) as much as they are wanting to be on the BLEEDING EDGE. US-based companies simply don't provide products that meet their needs. Tariff's have little to do with that.
The Chinese do, however, PRODUCE a lot of US-based products... and tariff's have historically resulted in fewer sales... which will mean fewer products produced and a lot of unemployed Chinese workers.
"That dumb guy in the White House" is simply following basic economic principles to establish fair trade between the US and China.
Fozziebear71
macrumors 6502a
I am loving all of the "Due to the political nature of the discussion regarding this topic, the discussion thread is located in our Politics, Religion, Social Issues forum" articles lately.
Nothing entertains me more than watching full blown Trump Derangement Syndrome on display.
Nothing entertains me more than watching full blown Trump Derangement Syndrome on display.
DaveP
macrumors 6502a
It's like pissing into the wind, but a few points.
The days of China just making cheap junk for the dollar store are pretty far in the past. About half of US imports from China are electronics, electronic equipment, etc. Obviously China does still manufacture clothes, toys, etc. much of that has moved to other countries with lower labor costs.
China is also very good at electronic manufacturing. Chinese factories can produce very high quality, high yield products. They can also produce junk. It really depends on how much you want to pay. In my limited manufacturing experience, we actually had one product that a Chinese factory could produce better and more consistently than a US one (in addition to being 40% the cost).
Buying American for many products is simply not possible, at least not for a number of years. US factories for things like cables, electronic components, etc. mostly only exist on a small scale or not at all. To bring these factories back would require massive capital, a number of years, and then not be able to compete with foreign, non-Chinese factories.
Foreign, non-Chinese manufacturing is a possibility. Some companies have been moving manufacturing for quite a while as Chinese labor prices have increased. For more difficult products, like most electronics, there is more risk involved and the company often needs to build the factory and train the workers. Obviously this is only possible for very large companies, takes many years, and is better suited for more mature product lines.
In general, the business community wants to stand up to China in a number of areas and force changes. However, a trade war will be very painful for businesses and US consumers. Similarly, it will also be bad for China and their economy. Many are optimistic that the current tariffs are just part of the negotiating process and will not be long-term. It's like a giant game of chicken and who is going to swerve first.
Of note, China's recent tactic of reversing previously agreed upon points right before finalizing a deal is a common Chinese tactic. Agree to some things right at the beginning, spend time ironing out the final points, and then right at the end go back on something decided early in the process. The goal is to get the other party to just agree because negotiating is annoying and they want to get it finalized.
Oh, and any points about the Chinese citizens being in unity or whatnot are mostly non-sense. I'd be in unity too if the government is going to put me in jail for speaking out.
The days of China just making cheap junk for the dollar store are pretty far in the past. About half of US imports from China are electronics, electronic equipment, etc. Obviously China does still manufacture clothes, toys, etc. much of that has moved to other countries with lower labor costs.
China is also very good at electronic manufacturing. Chinese factories can produce very high quality, high yield products. They can also produce junk. It really depends on how much you want to pay. In my limited manufacturing experience, we actually had one product that a Chinese factory could produce better and more consistently than a US one (in addition to being 40% the cost).
Buying American for many products is simply not possible, at least not for a number of years. US factories for things like cables, electronic components, etc. mostly only exist on a small scale or not at all. To bring these factories back would require massive capital, a number of years, and then not be able to compete with foreign, non-Chinese factories.
Foreign, non-Chinese manufacturing is a possibility. Some companies have been moving manufacturing for quite a while as Chinese labor prices have increased. For more difficult products, like most electronics, there is more risk involved and the company often needs to build the factory and train the workers. Obviously this is only possible for very large companies, takes many years, and is better suited for more mature product lines.
In general, the business community wants to stand up to China in a number of areas and force changes. However, a trade war will be very painful for businesses and US consumers. Similarly, it will also be bad for China and their economy. Many are optimistic that the current tariffs are just part of the negotiating process and will not be long-term. It's like a giant game of chicken and who is going to swerve first.
Of note, China's recent tactic of reversing previously agreed upon points right before finalizing a deal is a common Chinese tactic. Agree to some things right at the beginning, spend time ironing out the final points, and then right at the end go back on something decided early in the process. The goal is to get the other party to just agree because negotiating is annoying and they want to get it finalized.
Oh, and any points about the Chinese citizens being in unity or whatnot are mostly non-sense. I'd be in unity too if the government is going to put me in jail for speaking out.
jonnyb098
macrumors 601
I'm perfectly fine with paying a little more (if we have to) and have the products made in the U.S.A. The problem is that will never happen because of a couple of things.....Americans don't have the same "machine" like mentality and second, not enough Americans want to (for better or worse) do these kinds of jobs. Hence the loads of retail "now hiring" signs I see all over the place (in Michigan).
So yes, the economy is actually doing really well, tons of people are working and there are tons of jobs that simply arent being filled. If no one wants to take $15/hr retail job or $12/hr fast food job they sure as hell aren't going to want to build a damn iPhone for that kind of pay because face it, an American building iPhones is NOT a $20+/hr job by any stretch.
So yes, the economy is actually doing really well, tons of people are working and there are tons of jobs that simply arent being filled. If no one wants to take $15/hr retail job or $12/hr fast food job they sure as hell aren't going to want to build a damn iPhone for that kind of pay because face it, an American building iPhones is NOT a $20+/hr job by any stretch.
Apple Master
Suspended
Justanotherfanboy
Suspended
Unity451
macrumors 65816
TallManNY
macrumors 601
First off, Apple will not raise the price of its current iPhones in the U.S. The phones have already been out for a while and they are entering their slow sales period (slow only for Apple). If a increase happens and consumers view it as potentially a 10% increase to buy a phone now, consumers will hold off. Apple has plenty of ability to squeeze suppliers to pay some of this tax and plenty of margin to forgo to keep sales steady.
Second, while trade wars and tariff battles will hurt both economies, China is vastly more exposed here than the U.S. Trump and his advisers know that eventually China will have to get a resolution that eliminates these tariffs. And China's trade negotiators know this. That is why they were negotiating a deal before their bosses back in Beijing pulled the rug out from under them.
Things that the U.S. is fighting for: there should not be a law in China that allows a government official to come to a U.S. company's office in China and download all the data off the servers whenever they want. The U.S. company knows that that data then gets given over to their China competitors. That should not be allowed and it should not be part of the regular process of doing business in China. The U.S. is right to fight for better trade practices. Our economy is very strong right now and this is probably as good a time as any to have the fight.
Second, while trade wars and tariff battles will hurt both economies, China is vastly more exposed here than the U.S. Trump and his advisers know that eventually China will have to get a resolution that eliminates these tariffs. And China's trade negotiators know this. That is why they were negotiating a deal before their bosses back in Beijing pulled the rug out from under them.
Things that the U.S. is fighting for: there should not be a law in China that allows a government official to come to a U.S. company's office in China and download all the data off the servers whenever they want. The U.S. company knows that that data then gets given over to their China competitors. That should not be allowed and it should not be part of the regular process of doing business in China. The U.S. is right to fight for better trade practices. Our economy is very strong right now and this is probably as good a time as any to have the fight.
Sure, all fake. Why? Because they say what is true? If they only say what you want to hear, continue listening to the real fake news channel FOX. They are truly ruining this country with lies.
RudySnow
Suspended
It’s not a boycott. Apple’s phones are more expensive to buy than Chinese competitors’ offerings, and the iPhone, culturally, doesn’t carry the same social status as in other parts of the world. (The Indian consumer is similar.) Plus, China’s economy sucks, and the Chinese are pushing their “world economic dominance” plan they hope to enact by 2025.
But even if they are “boycotting” in such droves, what will a trade war matter anyway? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Sanlitun
macrumors 6502a
You know who is not buying Apple products? That would be the million men, women and children in detention in Kashgar and other cities in Xinjiang.
The ship has sailed on lawful trade with China for many many reasons. Get over it.
Don’t forget social credit scores, arresting anyone who assembles for religious meetings, offering huge cash rewards for snitching on Christians, arresting anyone who posts anything online that doesn’t fit their agenda, draconian laws (basically you become an organ donor), etc.
Yes, I’ve been there dozens of times.
[doublepost=1557856986][/doublepost]
BUT ORANGE MAN BAD!!
Libs are in for another heartbreaker if they think anyone has a chance of beating trump in 2020. Pocahontas rode a public bus and no one noticed her. Biden is a pedo and all those videos are going to become popular if he wins the primary.
TallManNY
macrumors 601
It is not fake, but it does have one telling nugget:
Kittle has been through this before. Last fall, a 10% tariff took effect. Back then, Kittle and his Chinese suppliers agreed to absorb most of that. The cost to consumers only increased 3%.
This time around, his suppliers can't afford to do that. And neither can Kittle nor other retailers — their profit margins are already so low.
The first part is the fact of what actually happened. Not much increase for consumers. A U.S. company and Chinese suppliers took most of the pain. Doubtful there was much decrease in sales if prices only went up 3%.
The second part is a guess about the future. Who will it hurt? We don't know. But if prices go up, the consumer may pay more. Or the consumer may buy less. Likely it will be a mix. Some customers will just pay more and some customers will just hold off on the purchase. To the extent, the consumer buys less, the U.S. company will suffer, but the U.S. company will also cut their orders from their China suppliers. Their China suppliers are really going to be the ones who suffer.
Tariff fights hurt the economy. The real question is if the U.S. will get concessions from China that make it worth it. I suspect the answer to this is yes. Soybean farmers may disagree. But the U.S. will likely just hand out subsidies for the hardest hit industries to take some of the edge off.
It's puzzling that AAPL's Upper Mgmt wasn't better prepared for this !
the johnmc
macrumors regular
Cables haven't changed since Lightning was introduced in 2012. Before that was the 30 pin cable, which was introduced in 2003. If you're talking about Lightning or USB-C, talk to Intel or the USB IF.
dk001
macrumors demi-god
You do realize this is a crafted one sided argument.
*snip* (from your link)
This latest round of tariffs will add another $500 a year in costs for the average American household, says Katheryn Russ, an economics professor at the University of California at Davis. And that could grow. President Trump has pledged to broaden tariffs even further to all Chinese imports — including big-ticket items. "Once the tariffs go onto cellphones, I mean then you're going to see people scream," she says.
This is assuming that nothing changes. No negotiations. No agreement. (I should say accountable agreement) Companies do not relocate. Tariffs will stay as is. Consumers will not change their buying habits. etc... It is a "Worst Case" scenario opinion proposal.
Mitigations are already in place or being considered. Farmers are switching crops. New markets are being pursued. Companies are relocating. Consumer are looking at who they are buying from (product source). There are countries opening doors as they see this as a win for them.
Articles like this are disingenuous as they are crafted to paint a specific picture.
Kind of like those articles the Chinese took out in the Midwest. (ex: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...nfluence-iowa-in-trade-war-over-trump-tariffs)
rafark
macrumors 68020
Too late now. China is so big and powerful now. They have like 1.6 billion people. If half of the population is middle class, that would make 800 million consumers vs 300 from the US. And you'd still have another 800 million to sell them cheap stuff.