Samsung Rethinking Galaxy Tab 10.1 After iPad 2 Unveiling

[SchneiderMan]

Even if the new Tab would be cheaper than the iPad, I would never even consider it. Everything is just a sad copy..
I've been using a Tab for over a month now and it's only good at one thing - portability.

 

[CylonGlitch]

This article raised a question for me. Has anyone confirmed whether Apple is selling the iPad at a loss as a licensing device?

I do not think that is the case. There is a breakdown of what the hardware costs for the iPad (1, not the 2) and it leaves room for development costs and still some profit. If Apple was to sell it at cost or below, it would destroy the market ($199 to $299), ouch.

But that's not Apple's style, although if they did, I'd be all over it.

 

[thelonelylimo]

And the 10,000 commercial I see a year is just to educate the consumer.

... yeah, the iPhone 4 commercials taught me how to use FaceTime after I purchased.

 

[marksman]

User experience depends on specs and specs only. Every single aspect of "user experience" is defined by specs. Every design starts with "specs". OS features, GUI features - it's all specs.

Actually user experience has little to do with specs. That is why the iPhone turned the entire smartphone industry upside down. All phone makers had were spec sheets. They did not actually have any functionality to the phone. There is a big difference between saying a device can do something and having it actually be able to do something in a way someone would want to use it.

Ok, why don't you just come out and say "I don't know what I'm talking about."

It'd be a lot more direct than trying to show us again and again.

I am going to have to go with this.

Honestly I would not call the Xoom dead in the water.
I do not think Motorola expect to sell large numbers of Xooms and it is going to be treated more as a developer devices that is sold to consumers. Hell I would not be surpised in the least if Google had a pretty heavy hand in some of the things on it as it most important thing is getting the tablet into the hands of devs.

Also I would say the roomer is at best questionable to begin with as it seems to be more just bashing than much truth behind it.

If they were not expecting to sell large numbers why did they make it? What is a developer device?

Incorrect.

User experience is not based on 'Specs'.

I agree... This is the huge edge Apple has... Apple creates functionality and usability regardless of specs. That is why you can go down a 25 item check list, give every check mark to the other guy and they still have an inferior product. Spec sheets are for paper...

Before the other companies catch up, Apple will already be moving on to the next new product.

Yeah this is a key point. We have competitors freaking out when Apple announces a modest 2nd generation upgrade. Internally Apple is likely working on other devices, but more importantly already have the next couple generations of iPads on their way now. Some company who has not shown much or anything is going to have to be the one to challenge Apple down the road. The current competitors are so far behind they will not likely be able to catch up without spending a ton of money.

 

[whooleytoo]

This article raised a question for me. Has anyone confirmed whether Apple is selling the iPad at a loss as a licensing device? I'm thinking something akin to a gaming unit like the PS3 or Xbox. Microsoft and Sony sold their gaming systems at a loss because they made money licensing games on their system. I'm thinking Apple has pretty much created devices like the iPhone and iPad to sell their Apps. That's where the real money lies.

What do you guys think?

With the sheer numbers Apple are buying now, they must be getting their components at rock-bottom prices. That could give them a huge advantage in having lower prices/higher margins.

 

[cvaldes]

This article raised a question for me. Has anyone confirmed whether Apple is selling the iPad at a loss as a licensing device? I'm thinking something akin to a gaming unit like the PS3 or Xbox. Microsoft and Sony sold their gaming systems at a loss because they made money licensing games on their system. I'm thinking Apple has pretty much created devices like the iPhone and iPad to sell their Apps. That's where the real money lies.

What do you guys think?

Go read Apple's SEC filings. Then use your favorite search engine to find and read the iSuppli BOM estimates of the iPhone, iPad, iPod touch, etc.

Apple does not consider the iTunes Store nor the App Store to be profit-and-loss centers. They are using content to drive sales of its high-margin hardware. That's their business model. This is reiterated every three months in their quarterly conference calls after they announce earnings.

Note that Apple doesn't even list iTunes Store and App Store revenue in their financials. If they were major parts of their business, you better believe they would need to list those as line items. And they would discuss iTunes Store and App Store performance much more in their calls.

The iPhone is their cash cow. The margins on that device are really fat, more than any other product line (including Macs). The margins on the iPad and iPod touch are thinner, but they still make lots of GM on those.

 

[Slurpy2k8]

I have a good book for you to read: Paradox of Choice, why More is Less. Pretty enlightening, especially for those involved with marketing. http://www.amazon.com/Paradox-Choice-Why-More-Less/dp/0060005688

The simple idea is, sometimes too many options causes people to just delay their choice or not make one at all.

90% of techies I see, when presented with a dialog to choose an option onscreen, have no idea what to do. I see it all the time. It makes them nervous. Something its best to make a decision that X is what most people would want, and have that be the default action. Messageboard nerds may believe that infinite options for everything is the best thing ever, but apparently they haven't seen a normal person use a computer. Too many options is often a bad thing, as you need to be educated into what each option means and entails before making a choice. And not many people aren't, and end up either not bothering anymore, or second-guessing every choice they make.

 

[Tones2]

Are you trying to be sarcastic?

If your statement was true, the PS3 and Xbox 360 should have trounced the Wii in the marketplace. Specs matter to the extent that inadequately spec'd hardware can hamper the user experience (sometimes through lack of performance), but having the "top of the line" specs does not guarantee that the product will be usable any more than having less than "top of the line" specs guarantees the product will be unusable.

The old saying sometimes used in less than polite conversation actually applies here:

"It's not the size that matters, it's what you do with it."

Well, the Wii trumped the market at first, but currently the XBox 360 and PS3 FAR outsell the Wii. The Wii had an innovative controller and a low price, certainly two factors that caused their initially success, especially to newcomers to the gaming world and to women and smaller children. But as the market grew tired of low quality graphics and simplistic games caused by the Wii not having the SPECS of the other two devices, the Wii suddenly looked less attractive and the XBOX 360 and PS3 took over the market.

There's always going to be those who prefer simplicity and INITIAL ease of use to those who prefer depth and complexity with more options but a higher entry level in terms of price and ease of use. It's the Mac vs the PC argument all over. It's iOS vs Honeycomb. Heck, it's even Republicans vs Democrocrats.

There's no right or wrong here. It's just preference. Both sides take turns "winning" based on the current market trends.

Tony

 

[notabadname]

The iPad 2 is not perfect, whatever some of you think. I hope this gives Samsung some time to perfect whatever they were working on and bring us something that's a real competitor.

Ultimately, we all lose if Apple dominate the market.

Not true. The difference is, Apple built an excellent product with out competition, in an essentially non-existent market. Other companies, like Samsung, only make their product better to catch Apple. In a vacuum, Apple makes a great product, because quality, craftsmanship and user experience matter, regardless of the competition. Clearly, other companies make a product, and at a price, that they think they can get away with. It is only in comparison to Apple that they go back to the drawing board. (Recall Microsoft's withdrawn table also.)

The original iPad could have been made much more cheaply, and provided identical performance when it was released, but that doesn't go with their design philosophy. To think Apple needs a competitor to maintain high quality is inaccurate, and not in consideration of their historical product releases.

 

[marksman]

Like most major conglom's each individual sector is ran by its own management. Samsung does everything from building Warships, Skyscrapers, almost all of Apples Screens and Memory, Hard Drives, Car engines and parts, etc.

Yeah people give too much weight to Samsung somehow having any synergy.

In Sam's Club. It was reported yesterday (on Engadget and other sources). And yes, it's cheaper than similarly spec-ed iPad 2 (well, similarity actually ends with storage size, many XOOM specs are better).

Wow so price reduction 2 weeks out of the gate for brand new product and it is still more expensive than an iPad. Nice job Motorola!

 

[PsudoPowerPoint]

User experience depends on specs and specs only. Every single aspect of "user experience" is defined by specs. Every design starts with "specs". OS features, GUI features - it's all specs.

Most aspects of a design are difficult to reduce to a handful of numbers. Clock speed and RAM size present such a tiny part of the whole picture. But engineers and marketing people know how to puff up those specs for a minimum cost, and people buy those products and think they are getting a good deal. Even a badly designed device can have a high clock speed and lots of RAM; it doesn't mean it will perform well.

If you are looking for objective and quantifiable metrics to judge a device by, I'd suggest you abandon most of the common specs, and look to benchmarks instead. Benchmark results depend on everything that shows up in the specs sheet, as well as all those other important details that rarely if ever show on the spec sheet. Benchmarks are harder to fake with a bit of marketing puffery.

More importantly, specs fail to capture any aspect of ease of use, or personal satisfaction. I consider both of these as important aspects of my product buying decisions.

 

[Tones2]

90% of techies I see, when presented with a dialog to choose an option onscreen, have no idea what to do. I see it all the time. It makes them nervous. Something its best to make a decision that X is what most people would want, and have that be the default action. Messageboard nerds may believe that infinite options for everything is the best thing ever, but apparently they haven't seen a normal person use a computer. Too many options is often a bad thing, as you need to be educated into what each option means and entails before making a choice. And not many people aren't, and end up either not bothering anymore, or second-guessing every choice they make.

Really? You must know some pretty stupid techies.

Dialog boxes of choices are pretty straight forward, that's their intent. It's just a PRESENTATION OF OPTIONS. If it's confusing then it's the application's fault, not design. The iPad / iPhone have nothing specicial to offer here. The apps themselves can present option that are confusing on iOS as well, whether it be through checklists or tables or whatever.

Tony

 

[0815]

maybe Samsung should visit macrumors.com more often so that they know what's coming up - that way they could plan their copy process a little bit ahead.

 

[marksman]

Why are people so happy with this?! Its frankly embarrassing, "ZOMG ROFL, LOOK AT SAMSUNG LOLOLOL".

I'm HAPPY that Samsung are looking at their product design and spec as it makes my consumer experience much more enjoyable. I'd love to choose between 2, 3 maybe even 4 good tablets. The thought of 95% market share to Apple SHOULD be terrifying for everyone but Apple stockholders (and even then, not in the long run).

The iPad 2 is not perfect, whatever some of you think. I hope this gives Samsung some time to perfect whatever they were working on and bring us something that's a real competitor.

Ultimately, we all lose if Apple dominate the market.

As an IOS user I benefit significantly from the rapid growth of IOS devices and dominant positions in the marketplace. From accessories to apps, I receive a huge benefit from Apple being in the position it is in. It is the hottest platform for developers, period right now. I would like it to stay that way.

With fragmented marketplace the consumers lose out big time to the major content publishers. They use and abuse a fragmented market to their benefit. With a large single base with a strong proponent behind it, the benefits can be enormous.


Not everyone nor every business is lazy and only tries to do well if someone else is competing with them. Some people and companies are capable of pushing themselves just fine.

 

[pkson]

User experience depends on specs and specs only. Every single aspect of "user experience" is defined by specs. Every design starts with "specs". OS features, GUI features - it's all specs.

I beg to differ. Specs really don't matter.
http://pk.funnyseoul.com/2011/03/ipad-2-staying-ahead-of-the-game/

 

[0815]

So, evil expensive Apple that rips the customers with every product they make by overcharging and asking for arm, leg and/or first born is ... too cheap to be matched by copy cats that don't even have to invest in all the research and user studies???? Maybe the Apple Tax should be renamed to "Samsung CopyCat Tax"

 

[pkson]

maybe Samsung should visit macrumors.com more often so that they know what's coming up - that way they could plan their copy process a little bit ahead.

You guys have no idea how much Samsung is conceited in the electronics arena. They are flabbergasted and FLUMMOXED, but they still have their heads so much up their rear ends they don't know what to do.

I live in Korea, I have tons of friends working at Samsung, and I have so much fun waving my iPhone 4 in front of their Galaxy's. (They just don't get it.)

 

[santaliqueur]

Wow, Steve must feel very good about the iPad. Do you remember those post from last year about people complaining how bad the iPad is? It's so funny to read these comments again.

To be fair, when were these comments posted?

I probably agreed with most of those people *before* I ever used an iPad. I bought one on launch day out of curiosity, and I'd never be without one. But when it was announced, I thought to myself "This thing is NEVER gonna sell". Good thing I don't work for Apple.

 

[0815]

User experience depends on specs and specs only. Every single aspect of "user experience" is defined by specs.

You are very wrong - specs mean nothing for the user experience - what matters is how easy and intuitive can you get things done, and that is where Apple rocks. Less features, less 'specs', but do that what it was designed for right. And must 'feel' good to the user - what's exactly inside does not matter (it only matters if it makes things feel 'bad')

 

[Tones2]

Most aspects of a design are difficult to reduce to a handful of numbers. Clock speed and RAM size present such a tiny part of the whole picture. But engineers and marketing people know how to puff up those specs for a minimum cost, and people buy those products and think they are getting a good deal. Even a badly designed device can have a high clock speed and lots of RAM; it doesn't mean it will perform well.

If you are looking for objective and quantifiable metrics to judge a device by, I'd suggest you abandon most of the common specs, and look to benchmarks instead. Benchmark results depend on everything that shows up in the specs sheet, as well as all those other important details that rarely if ever show on the spec sheet. Benchmarks are harder to fake with a bit of marketing puffery.

More importantly, specs fail to capture any aspect of ease of use, or personal satisfaction. I consider both of these as important aspects of my product buying decisions.

Yes, benchmarks tell the FULL story, true. But by and large benchmarks follow specs and specs are the only common ground that can give you a hint and what the benchmarks might look like. Unless there was a neutral 3rd party that consistently and unbiasedly benchmarked products before they came out and that was the criteria for listing performance, the specs are all the manufacturers can list. If Apple came out and said "We have a new iPad 2 that works reall well" I don't think that would fly. Even THEY have to give SOME indication of hardware specs in terms of processor and graphics chip.

Also, specs are not only about performance. RAM may indicate how many programs you can run at once and the level of things like texture complexity available for games. It's not unimportant and something that's hard to benchmark. Also, hardware components like USB, flash memory, microSD, etc are simply FACTS - more is better, it has nothing to do with benchmarks. Even the inclusion of "4G support" tells you something about performance, knowing certainly it's going to be SOME degree faster than 3G.

Bottom line is - stop just repeating what Steve Jobs says! I like Apple products as well, but I want to challenge them to make BETTER products. Certainly, the Ipad 2 should have had a lot more things like 4G, USB, micoSD and the like. These are common features in most other products that are not just "specs" but have real functional uses.

Tony

 

[jonnysods]

Wow, could publicly talking about this help with sales or stock prices for Samsung?

Keep silent on this sort of stuff man! Tell it to your design or management team - no the whole world! Now they just announced that they are copy cats!

 

[Angelchild]

Samsung Galaxy TARD.

In my language (italian) "tardi" means "late". And I think that's "tard" is an appropriate word in english too

 

[ozred]

Setting aside the iPad vs Samsung argument for one brief moment;

Perhaps the most revealing fact of all, is the insecurity and poor self esteem of so many individuals here.

To have the incessant need to attach oneself to a product, then gloat & bash the competition, reveals the sad state of affairs in peoples lives.

To have a burning desire to "be right" and "quote your leader for validation" is a clear indication of insecurity, uncertainty, indecisiveness, failure to trust your own decisions and detachment from ones own life.

To live vicariously through a man you trust, are in awe of, and respect more than yourselves, speaks volumes about who you are.

To become as upset and combative as many are here, is cult like behavior.

Don't look for Steve's approval, think for yourselves. It will do you good.

 

[pkson]

Why are people so happy with this?! Its frankly embarrassing, "ZOMG ROFL, LOOK AT SAMSUNG LOLOLOL".

I'm HAPPY that Samsung are looking at their product design and spec as it makes my consumer experience much more enjoyable. I'd love to choose between 2, 3 maybe even 4 good tablets. The thought of 95% market share to Apple SHOULD be terrifying for everyone but Apple stockholders (and even then, not in the long run).

The iPad 2 is not perfect, whatever some of you think. I hope this gives Samsung some time to perfect whatever they were working on and bring us something that's a real competitor.

Ultimately, we all lose if Apple dominate the market.

Yes, it's good if we have competition.
Problem is, it's Samsung. They can rack their brains out all day, they will still be left in the dust.

 

[0815]

Don't look for Steve's approval, think for yourselves. It will do you good.

Thanks, I just tried that for a minute - it was amazing to think for myself ... the outcome was that I still like the iPad2 better than the Samsung Galaxy Tab. And you are right, it will do me good ... since I will get the iPad2 and will enjoy it.