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MP All Models SOLVED: 8k Displays Running on Mac Pro? Any? What Video cards would work that support 8k HDMI 2.1/Displayport 1.4/2.0 displays on Mac Pro? YES you can

Pressure said:
I received the Mac Studio yesterday and unfortunately things aren't going smooth with the Dell UP3218K.

While it will recognise both inputs at 3840x4320 pixels the extended display appears to have timing issues and the main display is even mirrored behind it.

I was really hoping the M1 Pro / Max would solve that issue but alas.

Code: 
dispext0:
dispext1:
    640x480@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(16 64 80 -)  v(3 4 13 +)   (virtual)
    800x600@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(32 80 112 -)  v(3 4 17 +)   (virtual)
    1024x768@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(48 104 152 -)  v(3 4 23 +)   (virtual)
    1280x720@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(64 128 192 -)  v(3 5 20 +)   (virtual)
    1280x768@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(64 128 192 -)  v(3 7 20 +)   (virtual)
    1280x1024@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(80 136 216 -)  v(3 7 29 +)   (virtual)
    1400x1050@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(88 144 232 -)  v(3 4 32 +)   (virtual)
    1680x1050@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(104 176 280 -)  v(3 6 30 +)   (virtual)
    1600x1200@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(112 168 280 -)  v(3 4 38 +)   (virtual)
    1920x1080@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(128 200 328 -)  v(3 5 32 +)   (virtual)
    1920x1200@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(136 200 336 -)  v(3 6 36 +)   (virtual)
    2048x1536@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(152 224 376 -)  v(3 4 49 +)   (virtual)
    2560x1440@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(192 272 464 -)  v(3 5 45 +)   (virtual)
    2560x1600@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(192 280 472 -)  v(3 6 49 +)   (virtual)
    3840x2160@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(312 424 736 -)  v(3 5 69 +)   (virtual)
    4096x2160@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(8 32 40 +)  v(48 8 6 -)   (virtual)
    5120x2160@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(8 32 40 +)  v(48 8 6 -)   (virtual)
    5120x2880@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(48 32 80 +)  v(3 5 74 -)   (virtual)
    800x600@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(40 128 88 +)  v(1 4 23 +)  
    640x480@75.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(16 64 120 -)  v(1 3 16 -)  
    640x480@60.000Hz 31.500kHz 25.20MHz  h(16 96 48 -)  v(10 2 33 -)  
    1280x1024@75.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(16 144 248 +)  v(1 3 38 +)  
    1024x768@75.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(16 96 176 +)  v(1 3 28 +)  
    1024x768@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(24 136 160 -)  v(3 6 29 -)  
    800x600@75.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(16 80 160 +)  v(1 3 21 +)  
    1280x800@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(48 32 80 +)  v(3 6 14 -)  
    1680x1050@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(48 32 80 +)  v(3 6 21 -)  
    1920x1200@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(48 32 80 +)  v(3 6 26 -)  
    1600x1200@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(64 192 304 +)  v(1 3 46 +)  
    1280x1024@60.000Hz 0.000kHz 0.00MHz  h(48 112 248 +)  v(1 3 38 +)  
    1920x1080@60.000Hz 67.500kHz 148.50MHz  h(88 44 148 +)  v(4 5 36 +)   (preferred)
    3840x2160@59.997Hz 133.312kHz 533.25MHz  h(48 32 80 +)  v(3 5 54 -)   (preferred)
    1920x1080@59.940Hz 67.433kHz 148.35MHz  h(88 44 148 +)  v(4 5 36 +)   (preferred)
    1920x1080@50.000Hz 56.250kHz 148.50MHz  h(528 44 148 +)  v(4 5 36 +)   (promoted)
    1920x1080@23.976Hz 26.973kHz 74.18MHz  h(638 44 148 +)  v(4 5 36 +)   (promoted)
    1920x1080@24.000Hz 27.000kHz 74.25MHz  h(638 44 148 +)  v(4 5 36 +)   (promoted)
    1280x720@59.940Hz 44.955kHz 74.18MHz  h(110 40 220 +)  v(5 5 20 +)   (promoted)
    1280x720@60.000Hz 45.000kHz 74.25MHz  h(110 40 220 +)  v(5 5 20 +)   (promoted)
    1280x720@50.000Hz 37.500kHz 74.25MHz  h(440 40 220 +)  v(5 5 20 +)  
    720x576@50.000Hz 31.250kHz 27.00MHz  h(12 64 68 -)  v(5 5 39 -)  
    720x480@59.940Hz 31.469kHz 27.00MHz  h(16 62 60 -)  v(9 6 30 -)   (promoted)
    720x480@60.000Hz 31.500kHz 27.03MHz  h(16 62 60 -)  v(9 6 30 -)   (promoted)
    640x480@59.940Hz 31.469kHz 25.17MHz  h(16 96 48 -)  v(10 2 33 -)  
    3840x2160@29.981Hz 65.688kHz 262.75MHz  h(48 32 80 +)  v(3 5 23 -)   (promoted)
    2560x1440@59.951Hz 88.787kHz 241.50MHz  h(48 32 80 +)  v(3 5 33 -)  
    2048x1080@59.990Hz 66.649kHz 147.16MHz  h(48 32 80 +)  v(3 10 18 -)  
    2048x1080@23.902Hz 26.268kHz 58.00MHz  h(48 32 80 +)  v(3 10 6 -)  
    3840x4320@48.000Hz 212.062kHz 856.73MHz  h(48 32 120 +)  v(3 10 85 -)  
 -> 3840x4320@60.000Hz 262.079kHz 1058.80MHz  h(48 32 120 +)  v(3 10 35 -)
Click to expand...
That is some strange behaviour. Also, it's not showing a 7680x4320@30Hz mode. On an Intel Mac, the Apple provided EDID override removes the 8K30 mode but I don't think M1 Macs use the EDID overrides? In that case, it's choosing not to support 8K just because of the resolution. Maybe Apple will fix this one day or we'll have the ability to do patches on Apple Silicon like Lilu/WhateverGreen can do on Intel Macs (but that might be too difficult because of extra protections on Apple Silicon?)

Did you try 3840x4320@48 Hz? Do any picture-by-picture modes work? It seems only the 3840x4320 has the correct 8:9 aspect ratio though.
 
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Still working on my mount. This thing is SO BIG, jeez. Anyway, hoping it's done by Monday. In the mean time I found this in the manual, thought it might be useful/interesting regarding the QN900A:

1647746889639.png






1647746916330.png

1647746936791.png

1647746955386.png
 
joevt said:
That is some strange behaviour. Also, it's not showing a 7680x4320@30Hz mode. On an Intel Mac, the Apple provided EDID override removes the 8K30 mode but I don't think M1 Macs use the EDID overrides? In that case, it's choosing not to support 8K just because of the resolution. Maybe Apple will fix this one day or we'll have the ability to do patches on Apple Silicon like Lilu/WhateverGreen can do on Intel Macs (but that might be too difficult because of extra protections on Apple Silicon?)

Did you try 3840x4320@48 Hz? Do any picture-by-picture modes work? It seems only the 3840x4320 has the correct 8:9 aspect ratio though.
Click to expand...
Tried 60Hz and 48Hz at 3840x4320 as well as their accompanying HiDPI resolutions 1920x2160. Sometimes the Extended Display will nearly line up but shifted 70 pixels or so leaving the menu bar out of screen, with dancing green lines at the bottom 70 pixels the Extended Display is shifted.

I could try some other cables or an USB-C to DP converter to use with the original DP-to-DP cables but both cables can individually run the 3840x4320 resolution.
 
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Pressure said:
Tried 60Hz and 48Hz at 3840x4320 as well as their accompanying HiDPI resolutions 1920x2160. Sometimes the Extended Display will nearly line up but shifted 70 pixels or so leaving the menu bar out of screen, with dancing green lines at the bottom 70 pixels the Extended Display is shifted.
Click to expand...

I wonder if SwitchResX's Applescript support would provide some solution to the alignment issue - you can set the absolute pixel coordinates etc.
 
OK, the 8k "monitor" is mounted at my desk. I'm down from 6 30" Cinema displays to "only" 3 30" cinema displays and one 8k 85" display at my desk. Technology has come so far. The amazing cable management complexity of the cinema displays has been so alleviated. It's great.

So, the 8k still works GREAT! Colors are bit too crazy saturated, I'll tone them down. I have brightness setting down to 10 on the Samsung. I swear I could get a sun tan with this thing at the desk.

So I'm sitting about 27" away from the screen. Everything is really nice and clear. The effective "working" area of the screen is about 55" of it. Beyond that 55" at the lower center, the screen is still really great, but the angle and distance makes it tough to read. But that area is great for putting my many project "work piles" so I can get to them later. Also it’s easy to stretch documents to 200% their size at the edges of the monitor and then it’s super easy to read them even at that distance!

I need to get a utility that lets me get to the menu bar from my cursor as the menu bar at the top of the screen is laughably tough to read. Physically it's got to be like 5' away from me too! Speakers are nice for a "monitor".

The sheer expanse of screen real estate, is a bit overwhelming. I'm sure I'll get used to it, but righ tnow im jsut trying to figure out optimal place meant of 'regular' apps.

The physical size of an 8.5" by 11" document on the 85" is almost the exact same size as it is on the 30" cinema displays. It's a tiny tiny bit smaller on the 85" display. If the screen were around 86" it would probably be the exact same size.

The magnetic webcam for the Apple XDR monitor magnetically mounts to the top of the Samsung QN900A just great, so that's a nice bonus! Although it's nearing 4' above my desk, so it's like my webcam calls are from a drone hovering overhead!

I have the display set to 8k@60hz and probably still the 420 color settings. But now that it's my main display, I can hopefully get back to testing things next week. Right now my work area is a disaster from the 'renovation' of gutting wiring/mounts for the old screens and putting in this new one. So I likely won't get back to testing to later on in the week.

But man am I enjoying this. What's crazy is when I watch a YouTube video at full resolution, YouTube tries to upscale. I'm guessing to 4k. But it looks really stunning.

Ok, more to come....
 
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ZombiePhysicist said:
I need to get a utility that lets me get to the menu bar from my cursor as the menu bar at the top of the screen is laughably tough to read. Physically it's got to be like 5' away from me too! Speakers are nice for a "monitor".
Click to expand...

For reference of anyone in this situation, the app you're looking for is Menuwhere from Many Tricks. As well as placing the menu as a palette under the cursor, it also lets you set its own scaling, independent of the system menubar scaling.
 
mattspace said:
For reference of anyone in this situation, the app you're looking for is Menuwhere from Many Tricks. As well as placing the menu as a palette under the cursor, it also lets you set its own scaling, independent of the system menubar scaling.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the suggestion! So that one is nice. It has a feature that lets you see all your open apps menus as one top menu. However, it uses a hotkey to trigger. I wanted to be able to do a 4 finger tap on my trackpad to bring it up. And so BetterTouchTool lets you set up almost any touch trigger (including the 4 finger tap) and will bring up the menu of the current app (or so many other crazy things).

It works well.

I also moved the menu bar down to my lower display. Otherwise it's so high and far I cannot see my iStat menus or anything else. That combo works REALLY well.

What might also be nice if you like the Menuwhere feature where you get all app menus in one top level menu is, you can set a keyboard trigger there, and then use BetterTouchTool for 4 finger tap (or some other gesture) to trigger that hot key and use both together.
 
ZombiePhysicist said:
What might also be nice if you like the Menuwhere feature where you get all app menus in one top level menu is, you can set a keyboard trigger there, and then use BetterTouchTool for 4 finger tap (or some other gesture) to trigger that hot key and use both together.
Click to expand...

Menuwhere combined with Steermouse provides the ability to trigger different forms of Menuwhere, eg all apps, vs current app only, based on chords with mouse buttons.
 
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ZombiePhysicist said:
I have the display set to 8k@60hz and probably still the 420 color settings. But now that it's my main display, I can hopefully get back to testing things next week. Right now my work area is a disaster from the 'renovation' of gutting wiring/mounts for the old screens and putting in this new one. So I likely won't get back to testing to later on in the week.
Click to expand...

Impressive setup indeed!

I’ve tried to replicate your setup with similar GPU (AMD Radeon RX 6800XT) and Samsung 8k TV, but I don’t get real 8K without the downscaling to 4K through the DisplayPort to HDMI connection. I also have the same adapter CableMatters DP 1.4 to HDMI 2.1.

Have you find an easier, i.e. more predictable way to set up a custom resolution with SwitchResX than the method you describe earlier in this thread? (You mentioned, if I understand it right, you have to set up a different “fake” custom resolution than the one you want, and toggle between different resolutions ad hoc, for then the correct one to appear like magic. It is this step that is difficult to replicate.)
 
Arvine said:
Impressive setup indeed!

I’ve tried to replicate your setup with similar GPU (AMD Radeon RX 6800XT) and Samsung 8k TV, but I don’t get real 8K without the downscaling to 4K through the DisplayPort to HDMI connection. I also have the same adapter CableMatters DP 1.4 to HDMI 2.1.

Have you find an easier, i.e. more predictable way to set up a custom resolution with SwitchResX than the method you describe earlier in this thread? (You mentioned, if I understand it right, you have to set up a different “fake” custom resolution than the one you want, and toggle between different resolutions ad hoc, for then the correct one to appear like magic. It is this step that is difficult to replicate.)
Click to expand...

Sadly it's weirdly finicky interplay. Like today, I turned the machine on, everything working, and then BAM, the 8k screen goes out. Why? I flip some settings, and even plug in and unplug the cable. NOTHING.

So, I came up with this Rube Goldberg process that seems to "unstick" the montior from being stubborn.

Step 1: Make sure monitor is in Game Mode. Force it to that. If game mode lets you get Game Mode Plus settings, the TV had some kind of brain fart. You shouldn't be able to get into those settings, and I dont know what randomly flips that. But whenever I see that become available, likely the Mac is sending out some funky signal. I don't even know what that means, but I notice some correlation to trouble. As such, I switch out and back into game mode and hope that resets things.

Step 2: Go into Settings/Displays/Display Settings/SamsungTV and toggle from "scaled" to "Default for Display" like 2 times. That seems to do some kind of reset, and after you see the Mac come up on the Samsung, you can then go to step 3

Step 3: Go to SwitchResX/Q900A/Current Resolutions tab/8k@60hz setting.

Step 4: Go to SwitchResX/Q900A/Current Resolutions tab/8k@30hz setting, wait few seconds than back to 8k@60hz setting.

Usually I just go between steps 2, 3 and 4, and that dance tends to 'unstick' the set up.

Hope that helps.
 
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It could be my USB-C to DisplayPort cables that are iffy.

I tried replugging them in many different ways this morning and suddenly this happened.

I've ordered some USB-C to DisplayPort adapters from Cable Matters so I can use the original cables that Dell supplied for this UP3218K.

IMG_4182 copy.jpg
 
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Regarding the Dell UP3218K,
macOS 12.3 has a new .mtdd override file ( /System/Library/Displays/Contents/Resources/Overrides/DisplayVendorID-10ac/DisplayProductID-4147.mtdd ) for the UP3218K. Does it work? You may need to remove any existing overrides you've created.
It has two tiled modes. One for 48Hz and another for 60Hz. 48Hz is needed for 10bpc. And there's also the 30Hz 8bpc and 24Hz 10bpc modes (not tiled).
 
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joevt said:
Regarding the Dell UP3218K,
macOS 12.3 has a new .mtdd override file ( /System/Library/Displays/Contents/Resources/Overrides/DisplayVendorID-10ac/DisplayProductID-4147.mtdd ) for the UP3218K. Does it work? You may need to remove any existing overrides you've created.
It has two tiled modes. One for 48Hz and another for 60Hz. 48Hz is needed for 10bpc. And there's also the 30Hz 8bpc and 24Hz 10bpc modes (not tiled).
Click to expand...
Very interesting! Does this mean that with the proper .mtdd override file, one could also get 8K 60hz on a TV to work?
 
frisbfreek said:
Very interesting! Does this mean that with the proper .mtdd override file, one could also get 8K 60hz on a TV to work?
Click to expand...
.mtdd files are for displays that have multiple tiles (like the XDR, LG UltraFine 5K, or Dell UP2715K). Maybe .mtdd means "multi tile display description" or something? They are undocumented. TVs don't use multiple tiles.

The Dell UP3218K has a few 8K modes:
- 8K 24Hz 10bpc single tile (requires one DisplayPort 1.4 HBR3 connection)
- 8K 30Hz 8bpc single tile (ditto)
- 8K 48Hz 10bpc dual tile (requires two DisplayPort 1.4 HBR3 connections - doesn't use DSC)
- 8K 60Hz 8bpc dual tile (ditto)
Plus it supports scaling lower resolution modes (4K, 1440p, 1080p). And it supports picture by picture modes (3840x4320).

Recent overrides changes between 11.6 and 12.3 are these changes:
- adds .mtdd for Dell UP3218K
- adds head mounted displays (is-hmd) 22d3:aa03, 22d3:aa04 (previous recent versions of macOS added many other head mounted displays)
- adds Apple (610) display dimensions to 9220
- adds Apple displays (display dimensions) 9221,9232
- adds Apple displays (scale resolutions, refresh rate policy) a04e,a04f,a050,a051, (M1 MacBook Pros)
- adds Apple Studio Display (scaled resolutions, display-rotation-policy, display-contrast, mtdd, denylist) ae3a,ae3b,ae3e,ae3f
- add displays for vendor d33 (Cisco?) (DisplayIsTV is true for all of them)
 
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joevt said:
Regarding the Dell UP3218K,
macOS 12.3 has a new .mtdd override file ( /System/Library/Displays/Contents/Resources/Overrides/DisplayVendorID-10ac/DisplayProductID-4147.mtdd ) for the UP3218K. Does it work? You may need to remove any existing overrides you've created.
It has two tiled modes. One for 48Hz and another for 60Hz. 48Hz is needed for 10bpc. And there's also the 30Hz 8bpc and 24Hz 10bpc modes (not tiled).
Click to expand...
I just did a clean install and the new override file does nothing out of the box.

The screen is detected as two separate 3840x2160 displays.

However upon installing SwitchResX I can see both 3840x4320@60Hz and 3840x4320@48Hz without modifying anything. No resolutions wider than 3840 pixels exposed though and disabling csrutil and adding 7680x4320 as a scaled resolution doesn't do anything.
 
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Pressure said:
I just did a clean install and the new override file does nothing out of the box.

The screen is detected as two separate 3840x2160 displays.

However upon installing SwitchResX I can see both 3840x4320@60Hz and 3840x4320@48Hz without modifying anything. No resolutions wider than 3840 pixels exposed though and disabling csrutil and adding 7680x4320 as a scaled resolution doesn't do anything.
Click to expand...
What GPU? Intel Mac or M1 Mac?
 
joevt said:
I've updated the AllRez utility again. It now dumps DisplayPort DPCD info. I added some M1 Mac stuff but haven't added the E-DDC, MCCS, DPCD stuff for them yet.
It seems I can't get DisplayPort Sideband Messages (for communicating with DisplayPort devices that are connected to branch devices - MST hubs) or E-DDC (for getting EDID longer than 256 bytes). For those capabilities, an IOFramebuffer patch is required (using something like Lilu/Whatevergreen).
https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...-on-mac-pro-yes-you-can.2309750/post-30760662
Click to expand...
Moved AllRez to GitHub. https://github.com/joevt/AllRez
 
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I have the Mac Pro 2019 7,1 running Catalina (10.15.17) with an old single slot AMD WX5100 connected to a Dell 8k display and it works just fine to my surprise using only 1x DP cable. The UFO ghost test reports 60Hz and both RDM and web-based tools report 8k. The text and everything is absolutely tiny, since MacOS wasn’t really designed for 8k, but 8k YouTube vids look quite nice.

I think the trick is to have an up to date OS and a GPU with DP1.4. The “about this Mac” screen correctly identifies the Dell 8k monitor but reports it as 4K.

Any other tests to confirm true 8k output?
 
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DrEGPU said:
I have the Mac Pro 2019 7,1 running Catalina (10.15.17) with an old single slot AMD WX5100 connected to a Dell 8k display and it works just fine to my surprise using only 1x DP cable. The UFO ghost test reports 60Hz and both RDM and web-based tools report 8k. The text and everything is absolutely tiny, since MacOS wasn’t really designed for 8k, but 8k YouTube vids look quite nice.

I think the trick is to have an up to date OS and a GPU with DP1.4. The “about this Mac” screen correctly identifies the Dell 8k monitor but reports it as 4K.

Any other tests to confirm true 8k output?
Click to expand...
The Dell UP3218K doesn't support DSC, so it will default to 4K non-retina over a single DP1.4 connection. It can run at 8K@30Hz (4K@30Hz HiDPI) over a single cable but only an Intel based Mac as the Apple Silicon display engine doesn't support an 8K resolution. To enable 8K@30Hz you need to delete the override files for the display on Catalina.

Currently macOS treats both connections as separate screens side-by-side (3840x4320@60Hz / 1920x2160 HiDPI) on both Apple Silicon and Intel.
 
DrEGPU said:
I have the Mac Pro 2019 7,1 running Catalina (10.15.17) with an old single slot AMD WX5100 connected to a Dell 8k display and it works just fine to my surprise using only 1x DP cable. The UFO ghost test reports 60Hz and both RDM and web-based tools report 8k. The text and everything is absolutely tiny, since MacOS wasn’t really designed for 8k, but 8k YouTube vids look quite nice.

I think the trick is to have an up to date OS and a GPU with DP1.4. The “about this Mac” screen correctly identifies the Dell 8k monitor but reports it as 4K.

Any other tests to confirm true 8k output?
Click to expand...

That's why im using an 85" display for my 8k monitor. It has the same dot size as the 30" apple Cinema Display. It's really been an amazing treat!

As for true 8k output, yea, it is solved in this thread here, and I'm using it currently.

One other thing I've learned while using it. I thought I would use the far edges of the screen as work pile areas. Because it's difficult to read the last 16" or so (to the left and right and top of the screen) and it would be useful as such. Well, true. It is useful as that but what I realized is it's still useful for reading and work proper too.

All I do is any documents I need to refer to at the far edges, I just stretch so they are anywhere from 150% to 200% their original size, and it's very legible and usable that way. So I blow up lots of reference documents all along the periphery, and man, it's just wonderful. Works so great.
 
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