South Korea Passes Bill Banning Apple From Requiring Developers to Use App Store In-App Purchase System

[jlc1978]

Once I download an app to my phone is it still part of Apple’s store?

You as a customer are.

And if this is about access to customer base why does it only apply to digital goods?

Probably because it is a lot easier and Apple wanted apps from Amazon et.al. ratehr than using the web.

Is Apple not providing Uber and Lyft it’s customer base?

Apple has differentiated tangible goods such as a car ride from most digital ones.

Developers already pay for access to the App Store via their annual Developer membership fee.
So no, they're not using it for free.

$99 is a lot less than what it would cost to go it alone.

What people miss is Apple will now be forced to compete with 3rd party payments for subscriptions.

3rd party providers are at 3%, not 30/15% like Apple. (Honestly, most people don't likely keep their subscriptions on things for over a year, so 15% is a "mythological creature")

Find one that charges 35 and provides all the services Apple does.

Its well known that people will trust Apple or Google more to be a single point of payment. I guarantee you if Apple now has to compete against 3%, if they offered their in-app processing rate at 10%, most developers would stick with them. But 30%? Many developers will chose the 3% route or to offer subscriptions at two prices, one through Apple and one direct.

Apple will just raise the costs of services they currently provide for $99 under the existing model; hurting small developers.

The relationship between customer and app developer should be direct once the app is purchased/downloaded. Apple has nothing to do with my interactions with the App at that point, so buzz off. If they made bad business decisions by allowing free apps, then charge for the bandwidth/storage. Most app developers wouldn't mind, they either are so important that they wouldn't owe much of anything - or are successful and then it won't be a problem anyways. But, seeing how massively profitable Apple is, its hard to say hosting free apps is bleeding them dry.

Fine, but if the revenue stream from IAP is cut off Apple will find other ways to recoup the money. This isn't about developers vs. Apple it's about a few big ones that want free access to Apple's customers at the expense of smaller ones who will find it a lot harder to cover the higher costs out of pocket upfront.

Personally, I think Apple should charge per download, and look at the data and see where the big vs. smaller developers fall and exempt the smaller ones by the # of free downloads.

Does Apple take commissions on in-app purchases from Amazon, eBay, etc?

Not for tangible goods.

The US already has a bill very similar to the one that South Korea just passed.

http://govtrack.us/congress/bills/117/s2710

With virtually no chance of passing, fortunately.

 

[ksec]

Apple should listen to MacRumors comments, pull out of South Korea!. Stop buying OLED from Samsung, NAND and DRAM from SK Hynix, Battery from LG. And they should run to White House to complain. /s

 

[frenchcamp49er]

error

 

[frenchcamp49er]

Apple should listen to MacRumors comments, pull out of South Korea!. Stop buying OLED from Samsung, NAND and DRAM from SK Hynix, Battery from LG. And they should run to White House to complain. /s

or charge those developers the total cost of app hosting, up loads and down loads, any interaction with the app now gets a fee

 

[frenchcamp49er]

You as a customer are.



Probably because it is a lot easier and Apple wanted apps from Amazon et.al. ratehr than using the web.


Apple has differentiated tangible goods such as a car ride from most digital ones.


$99 is a lot less than what it would cost to go it alone.

Find one that charges 35 and provides all the services Apple does.



Apple will just raise the costs of services they currently provide for $99 under the existing model; hurting small developers.


Fine, but if the revenue stream from IAP is cut off Apple will find other ways to recoup the money. This isn't about developers vs. Apple it's about a few big ones that want free access to Apple's customers at the expense of smaller ones who will find it a lot harder to cover the higher costs out of pocket upfront.

Personally, I think Apple should charge per download, and look at the data and see where the big vs. smaller developers fall and exempt the smaller ones by the # of free downloads.



Not for tangible goods.



With virtually no chance of passing, fortunately.

I think Apple will no change the pricing structure for Apps. You probably will not see a 99¢ app in the near future

 

[DoubleJ2119]

Deleted.

 

[gunsnmangoes]

Bye-bye, South Korea.
Now this virus has been released, let's see if other countries catch it.
As a customer, I don't want a hundred shops and pay-systems, I need one that has everything.
I never had a problem to be "forced" to Apple's in-App-System.
More chaos forced by lawmakers, silly.

Wow so much hate everywhere...

As a South Korean citizen online payment services through Korean tech companies such as Naver and Kakao are already widespread, and iOS users don't have a reason to be left out of that. Korea doesn't even have NFC terminals, hence the lack of Apple Pay services.

Before you even talk about how stupid the lack of NFC terminals are, yes, I already know that it's stupid. The Korean financial corporations fought against it and kept their MST terminals which is a lot less secure and preventive of future developments. It was to stop paying commission fees for other companies.

The lack of a selected few payment system has also made a excessive amount of payment methods. Foreigners of Korea hate the fact that they can't just simply pay through Visa and Mastercard services. But that's a separate issue. My point is, with the current state of Korea, it's more of a necessary requirement than other countries where Apple Pay is widespread.

Yes, I have used Apple Pay when I was in Canada before and it sucks that I can't use it here with a double tap, but with what's being provided here right now, I think it's the right move. Especially considering that major Korean tech companies who are established in the financial industry can keep their position. You can't force them out of their steady profit.

 

[DoubleJ2119]

Deleted.

 

[Abazigal]

That way they will soon have to ban USA, whole EU, AU, UK and many more countries...
Where do you think Apple intent to sell their next iPhones? Tonga Bonga Island?

Apple better start developing for offering sideloading, alternative payment and open NFC, the deadline will be tight.

Apple addressed this scenario before, I believe.

Tim Cook says Apple would still collect commission on alternative App Store payments

During the course of his testimony yesterday Tim Cook stated that if developers on iOS were offered the chance to use alternative payment methods to charge for digital services that Apple would still

www.imore.com

"Also, we would have to come up with an alternate way of collecting our commission. We would then have to figure out how to track what's going on and invoice it and then chase the developers, it seems like a process that doesn't need to exist".

Apple is not going down without a fight.

 

[riclf]

This is good for consumers. More choice is good for consumers.

This is good for virus and ransomware makers! No vetting, poison the platform!

 

[bobenhaus]

Apple should listen to MacRumors comments, pull out of South Korea!. Stop buying OLED from Samsung, NAND and DRAM from SK Hynix, Battery from LG. And they should run to White House to complain. /s

You forgot safe rooms, bunny rabbits and $pple the best thing since sliced bread.

 

[Kierkegaarden]

What makes you think Touch ID / Face ID is locked to Apple’s payments?

Even WhatsApp chats can use Touch ID / Face ID; there’s few restrictions of what it can be used for.

Apple can certainly make up fake restrictions, but usually anti-trust judgements force “reasonable access to first-party APIs”.

Apple has had a decade to find its legal footing. It clearly failed.

Does WhatsApp use Touch ID or Face ID for payments? No. Why would Apple be obligated to open this up for third party payment options?

As Google stated, they offer the tools for free. Many apps offer their app for free and have in-app purchases. So these developers want access to free tools and at the same time want to use third party payments?

Apple and Google are not fools — they have to see a return from what they provide. This is business — not a charity. I would expect this legislation will only raise the barrier for developers and you will see less free apps. We’ll see what happens. Just know this — these companies didn’t get where they are by working for nothing.

 

[Kierkegaarden]

Here’s a interesting scenario — What if Google and Apple decide the new law is unfair and don’t want to abide by it? What happens then? Does the country ban every iOS and Android phone?

 

[q64ceo]

Oh puhleeze. You're not an Apple user, you're just an Android troll with a MacRumors account. 🙄

I've been using macOS for a very, very long time. Like many others on these forums I began with the old fashion Macs that everyone in school played Oregon Trail on. Ive owned a Mac Classic (the model Mac Classic). My first experience on Mac OS X was with Panther. Ive used every single version of Mac OS X from Panther to when it changed its designation to OS X and then to macOS. I have owned a few iPhones over the years.My first iPhone was the iPhone 3G (Ive also owned an iPhone 4, iPhone 5, and an iPhone 6s). Jailbreaking it allowed me to modify it my way. But jailbreaking has become quite difficult as Apple fixes the security holes and the modern tools to do so uses shady tools released by Chinese hacking groups.

Ive owned the iPad 2, the iPad 5, and now the iPad 7.

Id rather use an iPhone. But the lack of freedom on the platform is intolerable.

 

[Aoligei]

Apple addressed this scenario before, I believe.

Tim Cook says Apple would still collect commission on alternative App Store payments

During the course of his testimony yesterday Tim Cook stated that if developers on iOS were offered the chance to use alternative payment methods to charge for digital services that Apple would still

www.imore.com

Apple is not going down without a fight.

How the hell does Apple charge commission fee for alternative store? I mean, if I am able to sideload the alternative store and install from there. How the hell does Apple know? Unless Apple wants to scan my phone to alternatively installed app.

 

[Aoligei]

This is good for virus and ransomware makers! No vetting, poison the platform!

Why it is default that alternative App Store will be infested with virus and ransomware?

 

[Abazigal]

How the hell does Apple charge commission fee for alternative store? I mean, if I am able to sideload the alternative store and install from there. How the hell does Apple know? Unless Apple wants to scan my phone to alternatively installed app.

The statement was made with regards to alternate payments, not apps purchased via third party app stores.

My guess is requiring app developers to self-report how much revenue they earn via alternative payments, regular audits to ensure the accuracy of these declarations, then charging developers a commission based on this amount.

It would be a far more onerous process than simply sticking with iTunes billing, which may end up resulting in developers sticking with Apple payments and not offering alternative payments in the first place.

This saga is far from over.

 

[Aoligei]

The statement was made with regards to alternate payments, not apps purchased via third party app stores.

My guess is requiring app developers to self-report how much revenue they earn via alternative payments, regular audits to ensure the accuracy of these declarations, then charging developers a commission based on this amount.

It would be a far more onerous process than simply sticking with iTunes billing, which may end up resulting in developers sticking with Apple payments and not offering alternative payments in the first place.

This saga is far from over.

How the hell Apple even able to enforce this? Is Apple suddenly require app developers sending their tax return? I would see this would be huge uproar from App Developer. It is not like applying mortgage where income verification is justified.

 

[DoubleJ2119]

Deleted.

 

[wschutz]

That is the sole reason a for profit company exists - to make money for its owners.

That's a fallacy.

A for profit company does not exist to make money for its owners. A for profit company exists to carry out a mission, fulfill a goal, etc and the profit the company makes can be used in many things and nothing at all but certainly it is not exclusively to make money for its owners nor it is necessary.

 

[Aoligei]

A revenue share section in their license agreements for access to Apple's copyrighted and patented intellectual property (developer tools and Software Development Kit). Epic Games, for example, has a revenue share agreement as part of their license for the use of their Unreal Engine. Any game that uses Unreal Engine under license from Epic owes Epic a commission on the game's revenue.

This makes no sense. Apple is already charging developer 99 dollars for access Apple’s copyrighted and patented material. So is Apple going to double dipping developers now?

 

[mikethemartian]

That's a fallacy.

A for profit company does not exist to make money for its owners. A for profit company exists to carry out a mission, fulfill a goal, etc and the profit the company makes can be used in many things and nothing at all but certainly it is not exclusively to make money for its owners nor it is necessary.

You really should check out the first chapter of the textbook for the Finance 101 class taught at your local college/university.

 

[ender78]

Why would you?
On my Android I have four stores I frequent. All use Google Pay as an option.
Why not have Apple Pay as a payment option?

How do you chose which store to buy from ? How do you know which store has the app?

 

[DoubleJ2119]

Deleted.

 

[CarlJ]

This makes no sense. Apple is already charging developer 99 dollars for access Apple’s copyrighted and patented material. So is Apple going to double dipping developers now?

No. That $99 fee is predicated on Apple also receiving a 30% (or 15%) cut on app sale prices and IAPs. The $99 number isn't some naturally occurring mathematical constant, it was chosen by Apple to go in concert with the other fees. If you take away the 30% cut on app sales and IAPs, expect to see the yearly developer fee go way up and/or additional fees added, to the developer, for things like listing the apps in the store.

Personally, I think Apple ought to charge something more in the neighborhood of 10-15%, but that's up to Apple to decide.

Don't make the mistake of thinking that, because you weren't charged separately for Xcode and such, that it's a "free" program. Apple's copyrighted and patented material is worth what Apple decides to charge for it (unless and until the market abandons them).

The crowd that thinks that the App Store will switch to running on a gross income of $99 per year per developer, leading to massively reduced prices, are sadly mistaken. Apple will still get what they need. Big developers may save a bit. Small developers will likely be hurt some, to satisfy the interests of the big developers like Epic.