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OS Neutral StarField (Bethesda 2023, Spoilers)

Huntn said:
Clunky is in compared to what? 🤔 I recognize short comings in all of Bethesdas games, but they offer something more than I’ve found in the competition. Oblivion’s first impressed, see that mountain, go climb that mountain without a visible zone load, impressed the heck out of me. Guilds and quests were all fun. Ok, so how about an example of an RPG that you approve of so maybe I can compare?
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Difficult to compare apples to apples, since there are not many games that have the same open world approach together with first-person gameplay.

Some more or less contemporaries of Oblivion of similar genre which I enjoyed a lot were Vampire: The Masquerade (not without flaws and not open world, but great story, RP system, as well as characters), the STALKER series (if one goes fist-person RGP, it only makes sense IMO to reduce the classical RPG elements to a minimum), the GTA series (San Andreas has an incredibly immersive and living open world). More recent examples of IMO excellently executed open world RPGs are the newer Zelda games and Elden Ring (which personally I consider to be a genuine work of art in addition to being a great game).

Huntn said:
Regarding facades, I’ve made similar comments about Cyperpunk 2077, there is one hell of an impressive city simulation, but it is shallow. In other words it’s so good, you expect more, as if you might expect to walk up to anyone on the street and have a conversation, but you can’t. The main quest line is one of the most impressive gaming experiences I’ve ever had, but much of the rest of the game is shallow in comparison. In other words, it’s just beyond today’s text to flesh out the rest of the city as I’d like It to be.
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Yeah, I was very disappointed by Cyberpunk. It was such a missed opportunity, especially considering all the tremendous work that went into it. It could have been a beautiful game if they only kept the awkward RP system to the minimum (gun levels, really?) and went with a less cheesy and dramatic story. I also didn't like The Outer Worlds for a similar reason.

Mixing classical RPG stats with a first-person action game is hard. FromSoft is excellent at this, Nintendo has also found a formula that works great. Others I don't find convincing so far. Bethesda has been trying a particular approach for decades now, and I don't think it works (case in point: pretty much every second Skyrim video seems to be about cheesing the RP system). Borderlands is fine IMO, simply because it goes all in onto this idea of "diablo with guns", but it's just not my cup of tea, and it's an arcade more than an RGP anyway.

For many projects, I believe it makes more sense to drop the stat game entirely and instead focus on combining polished action gameplay with the spirit of traditional roleplaying games and great storytelling. Here, the RPG elements come from equipment and playstyle customisation. A pioneer of this particular genre was the original Deus Ex, a game that holds a special place in my heart. More recent examples of where this formula has been executed very well are the Stalker series and Zelda (BOTW/TOTK).

Ironically, Cyberpunk draws from the spirit of Deus Ex, but chases other popular formulas too much — it kind of attempts to be Deus Ex repackaged as Skyrim+GTA+Borderlands, and in the end it falls short on all accounts.

Sorry for a lengthy answer, trying to collect my thoughts.
 
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Has anyone played Starfield on MacOS using that new tool announced at WWDC? I don't want to buy an entry range laptop or xbox just for Starfield, but I could maybe justify upgrading my MacBook Pro.

If so, which Mac models (MBPs, Minis, and studio) can run the game playable?
 
I'm going to start this by saying it's not a criticism of the game mechanics or anything. I love how it factors in and sort of makes you think about how you can/can't/want to approach a situation.

I hate gravity 😂😂😂 I'm hopping around on a moon with 0.07 gravity...and then go to survey a planet with 1.94 gravity. It's so weird going from "oh yeah, I could jump allllllllll the way up there" to "oh yeah, I can barely leave the ground now" 😂 It definitely poses a fun challenge! It has helped me out of some sticky situations in fights and has also completely screwed me in others!
 
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Komodo Rogue said:
Has anyone played Starfield on MacOS using that new tool announced at WWDC? I don't want to buy an entry range laptop or xbox just for Starfield, but I could maybe justify upgrading my MacBook Pro.

If so, which Mac models (MBPs, Minis, and studio) can run the game playable?
Click to expand...
As of right now it wont launch.
 
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I am curious how well the performance on M2 Pro+ chip. Maybe 30fps most better experiences half resolution render.

Give you some idea of my PC spec running Starfield for 2 days with DLSS mods.

i9-11900k 4700-5300Mhz (stock) (on waterblock) 65-75'c
RTX 3080 FE 1990-2010Mhz (stock) (on waterblock) 60-70'c
Total of 480mm of radiators, system is pulling ~550w during the Starfield. Why not more radiators? It's a Ncase M1 mini ITX build. lol

4K 144Hz monitor
Starfield modded with DLSS
Graphic Setting on Ultra except shadow set down one notch to High.
Resolution scale with DLSS at 66% (~1440p) = DLSS Quality mode
Means 2560x1440 -> 4K upscaling.
In city (New Atlantis) performance with a lot of NPCs, 41-53 FPS.

My GPU is not bottleneck, GPU is running 99% in the entire game and the CPU all cores up 60-70%. I had to adjust the fan curve and water pump speed and cramp down the CPU Current Limit from 256A to 245A. Meaning limiting from shooting over 150w. It was hitting 95'c

Game is GPU and CPU heavy, CPU does a lot of work on NPCs and Physics in this game.
 
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TinyMito said:
I am curious how well the performance on M2 Pro+ chip. Maybe 30fps most better experiences half resolution render.

Give you some idea of my PC spec running Starfield for 2 days with DLSS mods.

i9-11900k 4700-5300Mhz (stock) (on waterblock) 65-75'c
RTX 3080 FE 1990-2010Mhz (stock) (on waterblock) 60-70'c
Total of 480mm of radiators, system is pulling ~550w during the Starfield. Why not more radiators? It's a Ncase M1 mini ITX build. lol

4K 144Hz monitor
Starfield modded with DLSS
Graphic Setting on Ultra except shadow set down one notch to High.
Resolution scale with DLSS at 66% (~1440p) = DLSS Quality mode
Means 2560x1440 -> 4K upscaling.
In city (New Atlantis) performance with a lot of NPCs, 41-53 FPS.

My GPU is not bottleneck, GPU is running 99% in the entire game and the CPU all cores up 60-70%. I had to adjust the fan curve and water pump speed and cramp down the CPU Current Limit from 256A to 245A. Meaning limiting from shooting over 150w. It was hitting 95'c

Game is GPU and CPU heavy, CPU does a lot of work on NPCs and Physics in this game.
Click to expand...
If you play on medium at 1080 do you think the CPU would be stressed the same way?

edit: also what's your opinion on playing star field on medium at 1080? To my eyes, it doesn't seem especially beautiful anyway, do you think lower quality graphics would distract from the experience?
 
leman said:
Difficult to compare apples to apples, since there are not many games that have the same open world approach together with first-person gameplay.

Some more or less contemporaries of Oblivion of similar genre which I enjoyed a lot were Vampire: The Masquerade (not without flaws and not open world, but great story, RP system, as well as characters), the STALKER series (if one goes fist-person RGP, it only makes sense IMO to reduce the classical RPG elements to a minimum), the GTA series (San Andreas has an incredibly immersive and living open world). More recent examples of IMO excellently executed open world RPGs are the newer Zelda games and Elden Ring (which personally I consider to be a genuine work of art in addition to being a great game).



Yeah, I was very disappointed by Cyberpunk. It was such a missed opportunity, especially considering all the tremendous work that went into it. It could have been a beautiful game if they only kept the awkward RP system to the minimum (gun levels, really?) and went with a less cheesy and dramatic story. I also didn't like The Outer Worlds for a similar reason.

Mixing classical RPG stats with a first-person action game is hard. FromSoft is excellent at this, Nintendo has also found a formula that works great. Others I don't find convincing so far. Bethesda has been trying a particular approach for decades now, and I don't think it works (case in point: pretty much every second Skyrim video seems to be about cheesing the RP system). Borderlands is fine IMO, simply because it goes all in onto this idea of "diablo with guns", but it's just not my cup of tea, and it's an arcade more than an RGP anyway.

For many projects, I believe it makes more sense to drop the stat game entirely and instead focus on combining polished action gameplay with the spirit of traditional roleplaying games and great storytelling. Here, the RPG elements come from equipment and playstyle customisation. A pioneer of this particular genre was the original Deus Ex, a game that holds a special place in my heart. More recent examples of where this formula has been executed very well are the Stalker series and Zelda (BOTW/TOTK).

Ironically, Cyberpunk draws from the spirit of Deus Ex, but chases other popular formulas too much — it kind of attempts to be Deus Ex repackaged as Skyrim+GTA+Borderlands, and in the end it falls short on all accounts.

Sorry for a lengthy answer, trying to collect my thoughts.
Click to expand...
Vampire The Masquerade Bloodlines is one of my favorite all time games, even as dated as it is today. :D

D01AD288-ED5D-4B9B-AAA3-1CBDA881EB42.jpeg
 
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Komodo Rogue said:
If you play on medium at 1080 do you think the CPU would be stressed the same way?

edit: also what's your opinion on playing star field on medium at 1080? To my eyes, it doesn't seem especially beautiful anyway, do you think lower quality graphics would distract from the experience?
Click to expand...

Game is beautiful, it's like texture modded on Fallout games out of the box. Much more details than Cyberpunk 2077, resolution is just resolution, maybe you see more bigger pixel on screen vs retina pixels. Means you need anti-aliasing to deal with jaggy edge models.

Not my video but you can youtube for starfield on 1080p for references.


This is my character made during customization screen.

IMG_3979.jpg
 
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leman said:
Difficult to compare apples to apples, since there are not many games that have the same open world approach together with first-person gameplay.

Some more or less contemporaries of Oblivion of similar genre which I enjoyed a lot were Vampire: The Masquerade (not without flaws and not open world, but great story, RP system, as well as characters), the STALKER series (if one goes fist-person RGP, it only makes sense IMO to reduce the classical RPG elements to a minimum), the GTA series (San Andreas has an incredibly immersive and living open world). More recent examples of IMO excellently executed open world RPGs are the newer Zelda games and Elden Ring (which personally I consider to be a genuine work of art in addition to being a great game).

Yeah, I was very disappointed by Cyberpunk. It was such a missed opportunity, especially considering all the tremendous work that went into it. It could have been a beautiful game if they only kept the awkward RP system to the minimum (gun levels, really?) and went with a less cheesy and dramatic story. I also didn't like The Outer Worlds for a similar reason.

Mixing classical RPG stats with a first-person action game is hard. FromSoft is excellent at this, Nintendo has also found a formula that works great. Others I don't find convincing so far. Bethesda has been trying a particular approach for decades now, and I don't think it works (case in point: pretty much every second Skyrim video seems to be about cheesing the RP system). Borderlands is fine IMO, simply because it goes all in onto this idea of "diablo with guns", but it's just not my cup of tea, and it's an arcade more than an RGP anyway.

For many projects, I believe it makes more sense to drop the stat game entirely and instead focus on combining polished action gameplay with the spirit of traditional roleplaying games and great storytelling. Here, the RPG elements come from equipment and playstyle customisation. A pioneer of this particular genre was the original Deus Ex, a game that holds a special place in my heart. More recent examples of where this formula has been executed very well are the Stalker series and Zelda (BOTW/TOTK).

Ironically, Cyberpunk draws from the spirit of Deus Ex, but chases other popular formulas too much — it kind of attempts to be Deus Ex repackaged as Skyrim+GTA+Borderlands, and in the end it falls short on all accounts.

Sorry for a lengthy answer, trying to collect my thoughts.
Click to expand...
Radiophobia 3
S.T.A.L.K.E.R. Shadow of Chernobyl like you've never played before! Even the upcoming S.T.A.L.K.E.R. 2 Heart of Chernobyl may very well be given a run for it's money on the gameplay side as Radiophobia 3 is definitively the S.T.A.L.K.E.R. many have sought after all these years...

Another here for Vampire The Masquerade Bloodlines and also into Kingdom Come Deliverance, which has a hard start but one of the best RPG's out there. Witcher 3 which is still CDPR's pinnacle, Cyberpunk 2077 is a joke in comparison. Just a weak looter shooter that would have been better served being classified for a younger audience.

Q-6
 
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Part of me feels like I'm missing out on something big. I just remind myself this is a single player game and all is well, I can be patient. :D

I have much experience with joysticks, I just hope I can play the applicable part of this game with keyboard mouse. What say you? :)
 
Huntn said:
Part of me feels like I'm missing out on something big. I just remind myself this is a single player game and all is well, I can be patient. :D

I have much experience with joysticks, I just hope I can play the applicable part of this game with keyboard mouse. What say you? :)
Click to expand...
Patience is a virtue in today's gaming landscape, one that frequently pays off in more ways than one ;)

Q-6
 
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Queen6 said:
Another here for Vampire The Masquerade Bloodlines and also into Kingdom Come Deliverance, which has a hard start but one of the best RPG's out there.
Click to expand...

Yes, I enjoyed KCD greatly, not without issues, but the amount of love that went into this game really makes it something else! Such a marvel, hoping for a sequel.
 
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leman said:
Yes, I enjoyed KCD greatly, not without issues, but the amount of love that went into this game really makes it something else! Such a marvel, hoping for a sequel.
Click to expand...
Think it's in the works. For a first release KCD was epic and Warhorse kept the game up to date with free audio/video hires add on's and reasonably priced and now fully rolled in DLC's.

As said if feeling S.T.A.L.K.E.R. give Radiophobia 3 a spin you will be a big surprise. A game that I really want to get on the M1 Mac, never say never...:)
This Doom 3 mod runs natively on Apple Silicon Mac's with the recompiled dhewm3 engine, the game has never looked better...

Q-6
 
Queen6 said:
Another here for Vampire The Masquerade Bloodlines and also into Kingdom Come Deliverance, which has a hard start but one of the best RPG's out there.
Click to expand...

Persona 5 has a hard start too, as the first hour has no combat and is mainly just setting up the world you entered since you're going to be roleplaying an entire school year as a Japanese student. And despite that, it's regarded as one of the best JRPGs ever and was nominated for GOTY

www.youtube.com

Persona 5: The First Hour

We're playing right from the start of Persona 5. Enjoy raw gameplay and plenty of burgeoning criminals.SUBSCRIBE for more videos! https://goo.gl/D8prdfLike u...
www.youtube.com www.youtube.com

(I will not rest until everyone in this forum has played Persona 5 Royal)
 
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zakarhino said:
Well, looks like it's finally time to build a new PC.
Click to expand...

Update: I've built a new PC. Everything is installed but I'm missing a single PCI-E cable to power the graphics card, so waiting on that to arrive within a few hours then I will begin playing Starfield tonight!!! My brother has already been playing it and tells me it's fun.

I can't wait to try this game out. I don't game these days but every so often a game comes along that compels me to give it a go. Last time this happened was with RDR2, I bought a PS4 Pro just to play that game and it's been sitting on a shelf ever since. This time it's Starfield, however unlike the PS4 Pro I plan on using this PC for much more in the future (including replaying the RDR2 campaign on PC at above console 30fps since it's been so many years).

This should be fun.... Also my new IEMs came in and they're brilliant so I'm gonna be using them for Starfield tonight too.
 
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zakarhino said:
Update: I've built a new PC. Everything is installed but I'm missing a single PCI-E cable to power the graphics card, so waiting on that to arrive within a few hours then I will begin playing Starfield tonight!!! My brother has already been playing it and tells me it's fun.

I can't wait to try this game out. I don't game these days but every so often a game comes along that compels me to give it a go. Last time this happened was with RDR2, I bought a PS4 Pro just to play that game and it's been sitting on a shelf ever since. This time it's Starfield, however unlike the PS4 Pro I plan on using this PC for much more in the future (including replaying the RDR2 campaign on PC at above console 30fps since it's been so many years).

This should be fun.... Also my new IEMs came in and they're brilliant so I'm gonna be using them for Starfield tonight too.
Click to expand...
Your power supply didn’t come with all the needed power cables?
 
So I started the game, performance is more then adaquate, I set everything to medium, I may try upping the quality but overall I'm happy with the performance. Granted, I'm at the very beginning so its probably not that intensive yet.

The beginning portion started off a lot slower then typical Bethesda games - at least the ones I'm used too. The pacing is a little too slow right now. I'm sure it will pick up as I just got into space. I'm still trying to get to used to the interface and how to interact with everything.

I'm not sure if I'm happy with the character traits but I can live with it. I picked a soldier with only 1 trait - introvert. I don't plan on having any companions, at least this play through. My other Bethesda games I tend to avoid companions so that will be my modus operandi for Starfield
 
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maflynn said:
So I started the game, performance is more then adaquate, I set everything to medium, I may try upping the quality but overall I'm happy with the performance. Granted, I'm at the very beginning so its probably not that intensive yet.

The beginning portion started off a lot slower then typical Bethesda games - at least the ones I'm used too. The pacing is a little too slow right now. I'm sure it will pick up as I just got into space. I'm still trying to get to used to the interface and how to interact with everything.

I'm not sure if I'm happy with the character traits but I can live with it. I picked a soldier with only 1 trait - introvert. I don't plan on having any companions, at least this play through. My other Bethesda games I tend to avoid companions so that will be my modus operandi for Starfield
Click to expand...

I should note that while you can go without companions, it's beneficial to have a companion travel with you as you get a whole bunch of new dialogue with companions chipping in, as well as new dialogue options where you can have your companion speak on your behalf to help get your way. Plus with how low your carrying capacity at the start you're basically encouraged to utilize companions as extra carrying space

Plus Barrett is the best. He's just straight up a classic scifi hero with a thirst for adventure. I love him so much.
 
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Spaceboi Scaphandre said:
I should note that while you can go without companions
Click to expand...
If you have a crew, is that considered companions? The reason why I asked, I gave myself the trait introvert. It uses less oxygen when going solo, and of course the inverse if you have a companion.

I found this spoiler free guide to be decent. I think if you've played a Bethesda game in the past this will come to you anyways but there are some nice things he mentions and it really is beginner stuff. Like fast traveling, you can use fast travel to other planets without going on your ship taking off, etc etc. I'm not there as I just started off but its nice to know

 
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