Steve Jobs Posts 'Thoughts on Flash' Open Letter

[Dead Panda]

I agree, a new standard that is used by EVERYONE and makes me access MOSTLY websites, videos and games should be the ultimate goal.

However as long this is the case (which will be for maybe 1 or 2 more years), denying your customers the option to use Flash is a slap in your face.

Apple is trying to do to Flash the same thing they did with the Floppy Drive. They got rid of it so that the industry could move on. Now, we've got an old format that is a resource hog and Apple is trying to make Adobe realize that their format isn't the best.

Everyone needs to adopt a new standard that's up to date and friendly to the computer. Flash is horrible.

I'll be glad when it finally dies.

By the way, I don't think Flash was originally meant for video. It was originally meant for vector animations on the web, but somehow moved to embedding raster video frames into a Flash movie.

 

[pubwvj]

While not the CEO of adobe, i believe a certain blogger has already responded with a "go screw yourself Apple"

Yes, Adobe backs that blogger and he is sooo mature. Not.

Fact is, Flash is for Glitz. Not interested.

 

[Apple Corps]

Seems the Reality Distortion Field is fully operational once more, because I didn't see any gaping logical holes or counter arguments crying out to be made.

I did sense a little bit of 'don't dumb down our apps to be the same on android' competition in his tone, but pretty easily justified by suggesting it's for the benefit of Apple, developers and consumers.

I wonder what's the best way to hear an informed counter-argument. Might go back to slashdot after a 5 year break to see what the haters have to say

Then maybe it is not a distortion at all. The Reality Distortion Field comment is oft used to discredit what may be a very accurate perspective from Steve.

 

[Sai Zelion]

It's all on you bro...

I own an iPad, yes i knew it didn't support flash when i bought it. That does not mean I wasn't disappointed when the rubber met the road and I found out how many sites are not supported with the iPad. There were A LOT. I will list them all if you bashers want to go to war.

Here is my take:

Jobs points 1,2,3,4,6 are complete, mostly nerd-based or pure propaganda BS. They are meaningless issues to me and my family. MEANINGLESS.

1. Open - Who cares, i don't know what it means and I don't care, i have been on open or unopened computers for the past 25 years of my life, never knowing or caring about the difference.

2. Full web:

Jobs argument is there are many, many sites that work on the iPad. Well i have many that don't, its just a BS sales pitch. Pure BS.

3. Reliability, security and performance:

Like my apple never crashes, and I suppose that every flash site should be avoided. Give me a break. Again just FUD. As for performance, give me a nice switch called 'No Flash'

4. Battery life - Again give me a switch called 'No flash', 90% of the time I don't need 10 hours anyway. SOOO MUCH BS. Its like the government deciding that they know whats good for me and will force me into compliance with their world view. Makes me sick.

5. Touch compatibility - The only legitimate issue on the list. But guess WHAT!!!! Figure out how to support roll over!!!! Its not Flash's fault that touch is limited in its features. Guess What again!!!! I like the feature-rich mouse and cursor. Are you saying the iPad will never support similar features. Guess what again!!! If i try and use flash that requires roll over, i will learn it doesn't work very well on the Ipad and stop doing it. Guess what again!!! Most flash sites I frequent don't care about roll over, and neither do I!!!

6. Third party run amok - FUD to the extreme. Yeah third parties mucking up the experience is less than ideal. Oh but wait, that has been our lives for 25 years, so it must not be that bad. Give me a break. Only the purity of Apple governed software development is fit for my consumption????? Apple, the great filter of our time. If Apple has Christened Thee then Thou are HOLY!!!!

Ahhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!! I am starting to think that my Apple Dollars have only fed the ego of the Holy one. I would not be surprised if all Apple products start being shipped with an image of the almighty enlightened CEO etched on the back of every device, etched on my ear buds, etched in the glass of my iPhone, etched in a hologram inside of every white apple.

Before I ever make a decision in life, I will ask Siri, wwsjd, what would steve jobs do?????

Can I get a gold statue of Jobs placed in my house above my fireplace??????

Reading that tripe made me sick to my stomach.

1. Open or not, you should care. You don't have to be a programmer to see the benefits of Open vs Close systems or software. Don't be so quick to bask in your ignorance.

2. Yes, many sites don't work with the iPad, yet. Let's use common business sense here; The iPhone introduced a new platform of which at least 48.5 Million iphones were sold, and already over 500,000 iPads are sold. Companies are not stupid. When they see those numbers, they will definitely develop iPad compatible/optimized version of their website. But it takes time bro. Not every company is as swift as the companies who are already on the list.

3. Re-read the letter, Jobs never said or insinuated that Macs NEVER crash. He plainly stated "FLASH IS THE #1 REASON Macs CRASH." The point is to illustrate poor OS stability caused by flash on both desktops and Mobile OS's. The letter is focused on flash and it's poor performance, not an argument that Macs never crash outside of flash.

4. Giving you a NO FLASH SWITCH is your way of narrowing down your argument to battery life. You forget about stability (and much more). So what happens when you have the FLASH SWITCHED ON?- CRASHES, SYSTEM RESPONSIVENESS TAKES A HIT, AND MUCH MORE. This is not just about battery life. the letter itemized more than 1 symptom caused by Flash.

5. Actually, you're BASS ACKWARDS on this one as well. Apple has developed the iPhone OS. The iPhone OS is much more stable than Flash and the record proves it. So why should Apple have to adapt to a sub-standard plugin? It should be the other way around. Adobe Flash, whom has a history of instability, security liabilities, and other issues should adapt their product to the operating system it will be used on. If that's the case, Adobe should just sign over Flash to Apple since Adobe has failed to improve it.

6. This is the most hilarious point of your argument. It's so funny how soon we forget things. I remember owning PPC phones from sprint that ran on win mobile. Win mobile was notorious for allowing 3rd party developers to do practically whatever they want and as a result, I was rebooting my PPC at least 6 times a day. Sure I could download a multitude of 3rd party crap, but at what expense, how about stability, security issues and insufficient system resource management (i.e. battery usage, cpu usage etc). And i admit, i don't have these problems on the iPhone OS- no where near in the same scope, ball park or universe for that matter as I did when I owned a Win Mobile device. Oh, how soon do we forget.

 

[Crackbone]

The amount of raging here is hilarious.

Like or hate the position, Apple is going to have a serious effect on where the future of the web is headed.

I'd say by the points laid out in the open letter, it's a future without Flash.

Don't believe me? I picked up an iPad on day 1. I haven't purchased an Apple product in years, and was generally concerned with the amount of content I was going to miss out on.

The speed in which the web is already bending to the will of Apple is pretty staggering. I've visited a couple of sites that were still Flash only, but all in all, I haven't missed out on a damn thing. This trend is only going to accelerate.

 

[MorphingDragon]

In all honesty, with the lack of incentive on the Mac hardware side, I'll more than likely be spending my computer budget on a new computer desk, U2410, and a new video card instead of a MacBook.

Lucky bastard. You get to have a desk. I have this stupid inbuilt thing that once I put my powerboard on it, alarm clock, printer, eMac (I had to give the Mac Mini Back ) keyboard/mouse, backup HDD. I have no room to actually do any work on my desk!

 

[supercaliber]

Blinded by your bias

Rollover support isn't just something that they haven't "figured out," it's something that can't be possible given the way you interact with the device. Please think about this hard and get back to us.

Matthew, sadly your bias has blinded you. The solution is so simple it is laughable. Bluetooth mouse gets you a cursor.

If you are using your $800 computer on your lap on the couch, no cursor. If you need to create a document or play a flash game, sit at a desk with your bluetooth mouse and keyboard.

Touch is a gimic on any real computing device, only for geriatrics, couch potatoes, and children. If you want to be productive and use modern software, you better have a mouse and a keyboard plugged in.

Apple wants the iPad to be a serious device, else they wouldn't have ported their word processing software to the device.

One other point, don't think that just because they haven't figured out how to support roll over with touch that it would be impossible. You may not have any creative ideas, but if Apple were to ask me for some ways to do it, I have plenty of suggestions.

 

[macUser2007]

More talking points for the ignorant fanboys...

All lies, of course, to hide the fact, that Flash and Java compete with the closed nature of the iEcosystem.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

If it is available, most people will use it, even those who hate it. If people use Flash, others will develop sites with Flash. The only way to kill Flash off is to remove it from the most popular platforms. If a web developer knows many people will not be able to use his or her site if it is running Flash, that web developer will not use Flash. When Web developers stop using Flash, it will be dead.

So since there are >100K apps, "most people" are using them... because they are available.

I can't deny your logic in that last line, but it is asking a lot of Web developers who code for all internet-connected devices to dump Flash for the tiny percentage (relative) of iDevice web users. But more importantly, even if all web developers are giving serious thought about the issue now (a big leap IMO, as it's not just a matter of embracing HTML5 + H.264 + javascript because that stuff doesn't work on all platforms and in all browsers now), it still doesn't yield a death of Flash overnight, in 6 months, in a couple of years, etc. And as long as some internet-device user is trying to access some Flash content on their internet-connected device, wouldn't it be nicer to at least support the option for them to do so, rather than arbitrarily locking them out?

Those who abhor Flash wouldn't be forced to use it, so things would stay "as is" for them. Those that desire Flash on these devices would at least have a way to get it. And assuming the superiority of HTML5+ H.264 + javascript, the qualities of the latter should simply lead to the migration there anyway. Locking Flash out of a few devices that Apple controls doesn't significantly accelerate the migration that much, unless many of the other players in the industry also get on board.

 

[Eidorian]

Lucky bastard. You get to have a desk. I have this stupid inbuilt thing that once I put my powerboard on it, alarm clock, printer, eMac (I had to give the Mac Mini Back ) keyboard/mouse, backup HDD. I have no room to actually do any work on my desk!

I've been taking measurements and I've been looking at plenty of woodworking books from the local public library. I plan on building a simple wooden desk compared to the overpriced particle board solutions. We have all the tools since the house is constantly under repairs and improvements given the age.

Apple is just becoming increasingly irrelevant to me.

 

[Bytor65]

I'm not surprised that an old man is clueless about video games. Imagine if Roger Ebert ran Apple. He wouldn't care about game development either.

Really? Steve Jobs who has likely been in the computer industry longer than you have been alive and is a notorious control freak about every aspect of product development is clueless? This looks more like a case of the pot calling the snow black.

Anyone with even peripheral knowledge about software development knows that nearly everything uses some form of middleware to aid platform development. It is certain that Jobs knows this.

The regulations were aimed directly at things like Flash which completely replace the platform. Flash is not middle-ware aid, flash is direct platform replacement and it makes perfect sense to fight that tooth and nail.

It remains to be seen how much useful middle-ware actually gets caught in the crossfire. But anyone who isn't clueless should realize the real target are platform replacements for completely obvious reasons.

 

[Wordslinger29]

Steve Jobs is the Obama of tech CEO's.

 

[Stately]

What the heck are you talking about? Did Apple stop selling the Macbook?

No? It's still there?

Hm, look at that. They sell a product taht does all the things you need...how is that "mind-melding the masses?" Did you try to buy a Macbook and they "mind-melded" you out of it?

Sometimes it just makes no sense to argue. I just posted the comment above and sure enough, I'm reading the one you are responding to now and my point has already been made, wow. Some people just need things to complain about. Apple does things thoroughly, but even if it didn't it is a company (Albeit like no other. Uh-oh, is that my elitism coming out? LOL) and if you don't like their products why get on a blog and complain and complain to friends and or people who enjoy the product? It's silly, but it goes to show you that Apple is doing things properly instead of just doing them to make money. When things are good, here come the haters . .

 

[i.mac]

.... Interesting points, but I still wish we could use Flash, even if it made battery life half an hour.

1. you still have a choice: get a google.phone or google.pad (soon) with 'optimized' flash and changeable battery.

2. some of us like the choice of a phone/pad with good battery life based on good engineering at both the hardware and software level, i.e. not a google.phone/pad.

Choices are good...

 

[MacFly123]

Amen?

Idiot, get a life.

Why is someone an idiot because they have a different POV than yours?

It's not about his position.

It's about seeing this thing religious... if he says Amen to the words of Steve Jobs he has a serious problem.

Because they have a different POV?

He didn't say ANYTHING about the guy's opinion. He only quoted a single word from his post and it was not the opinion part of the post.

Yeah but the use the word AMEN was taken out of context. There are various ways you can use the word. For example when my friend who is late to dinner all the time. Finally Shows up on time and i say "AMEN Brother" it doesn't mean i worship him.

Amen: "Used to express agreement or assent : amen to that!" -Oxford Dictionary!

I think it is QUITE apparent who has issues! Anything else you have to say Bachi85?

 

[Mac21ND]

Well, I was going to stay out of commenting...

...and was just going to do work while listening to Pandora in Safari...

...UNTIL THE FLASH PLUGIN CRASHED! No more music.

 

[Buschmaster]

Matthew, sadly your bias has blinded you. The solution is so simple it is laughable. Bluetooth mouse gets you a cursor.

If you are using your $800 computer on your lap on the couch, no cursor. If you need to create a document or play a flash game, sit at a desk with your bluetooth mouse and keyboard.

Touch is a gimic on any real computing device, only for geriatrics, couch potatoes, and children. If you want to be productive and use modern software, you better have a mouse and a keyboard plugged in.

Apple wants the iPad to be a serious device, else they wouldn't have ported their word processing software to the device.

One other point, don't think that just because they haven't figured out how to support roll over with touch that it would be impossible. You may not have any creative ideas, but if Apple were to ask me for some ways to do it, I have plenty of suggestions.

I'm going to plug a keyboard and mouse into my iPhone?!

 

[notjustjay]

It's not about his position.

It's about seeing this thing religious... if he says Amen to the words of Steve Jobs he has a serious problem.

Do you know what the word "amen" means?

Hint: Translated, it means "verily", or "so be it", or, basically, "I agree!"

It's not a religious term, though it's most frequently used in that context.

 

[kironin]

What I get from the letter is that Apple wants control over their platform to make sure all its features are taken full advantage of. Their whole marketing strategy is having a device that just works and does not frustrate you. They aren't aimed at people who want to tweek or customize stuff. They are aimed at people who just want to take it out of the box and use it and not have to worry about that.

That is who they are selling too and I think keeping that in mind and keeping in mind that APple does want full control over their devices in order to make sure the user experience is what Apple wants it to be, this comes off as a smart move.

Yes, they are here to make money. And they have chosen to market to a certain market that they feel having a more controlling environment over what is put on their devices so the device works how they want it to (smoothly with little problems) is more important to their market than allowing people (and developers) choice. (They don't want developers to have it as they don't want them all going to just using Flash to program and not taking advantage of features on the iphone/ipod special to it and therefore losing the experience Apple is trying to give Apple's buyers).

Yes, you could put a disclaimer everytime some one actived Flash. Then have customer support say, "Oh, did you activate flash?" But do you realize that to the kind of people who would call and complain not understanding the disclaimer are the kind who would think that Apple was just trying to weasel their way out of doing anything about the problem. Instead, by just not allowing it, people will choose whether they care that much and either buy it and realize they can't do that and accept it, or go elsewhere. Yes, may lose some sales but the overall experience and word of mouth how well Apple works stays good.

I think some of you don't realize Apple is not marketing towards your general geek. They are marketing towards the general masses and people who don't really care about the details, they just want something that works smoothly and gives a good experience.

Exactly, this is worth repeating.

The business owners who are my clients who use iPhones don't give squat about the flash issue.

 

[paul4339]

Of course it's business driven. Everything is.

Apple's business goal is to profit from creating the best mobile computing platform. And it's working.
It believes that to achieve this, it needs open standards, reliability, etc (as outlined in the 6 points). The points are valid.

Adobe's business goal is to profit by Flash licenses, software sales.
To do this it has to proliferate it's technology. It's worked well for Adobe.
It believes that to achieve this, it needs create good software products (not necessary open).

My take:
- it's easy for a company to justify "openness" etc when it works in it's favour. There was a time when Apple (Sony and many other companies) didn't do so. The spirit of 'openness' is interoperability - their _implementation_ aren't so interoperable (in the past at least). Try using some of the 'standard' adapters, jacks and plugs that these companies make.

- Adobe should adapt and improve their product - start (or continue) creating great software products _that are open_. (Then once you are big enough, then you can bully other companies around just like Apple, MS and Intel do)

P.

 

[MorphingDragon]

I've been taking measurements and I've been looking at plenty of woodworking books from the local public library. I plan on building a simple wooden desk compared to the overpriced particle board solutions. We have all the tools since the house is constantly under repairs and improvements given the age.

Serves me right for not flatting I suppose. :/

Apple is just becoming increasingly irrelevant to me.

I'm not quite sure myself. I like Apple's products and I'm hoping developing iPhone games will help supplement my funds during University. But I'm sort of stuck where I want to go. The University offers very precise specializations but it has no middle ground.

 

[Small White Car]

wouldn't it be nicer to at least support the option for them to do so, rather than arbitrarily locking them out?

Those who abhor Flash wouldn't be forced to use it, so things would stay "as is" for them. Those that desire Flash on these devices would at least have a way to get it.

Well, yeah. If Apple wants to shoot themselves in the foot.

But Steve just made it pretty clearl that he doesn't like doing that, so I don't see how this would ever happen.

 

[Sai Zelion]

Perspective is the key

Will Apple kill the last remaining qualities of the Tech world: Objectivity and Good sense ?

Because I can kill in a debate any ignorant or simply dumb Apple iSheep who dares to say Flash is dead:
1. Some good sense facts: - About 90% of video game, 70% of videos and millions of websites are in Flash
- Flash is known standard (even if not open) while HTML5 is only fully compatible with Safari and Chrome = Only 8% of browsers and users can use it...
- Every other mobile device and PCs are compatible with Flash and I've haven't heard about major and repeated issues
- You can't do half what you can do on Flash with HTML5 and the W3C has not even made it a ready standard.

2. Some perspective: - Safari made my Macbook crash twice this morning.
- Iphone is not compatible with Flash, it's battery sucks. Android or HTC are compatible with Flash and have better batteries
- Flash has made a lot of improvement on compatibility such as Blu-ray. Macs with Blu-ray players do not exists.
- Apple has obviously the more proprietary and the less open standards that exists.

So here is the truth, dare to say the contrary especially on facts. But I sense that the utopic tech world, where it was all about logic, pragmatism and facts has become so full of stupid iSheep who buy any marketing technic, that you say bye bye to high innovation pace...

Those stats are widely known. Saying Flash is dead is not relative to the stats of it's current usage and penetration, it's relative to new technology, HTML-5 which is imminent. It's like saying the CD is dead on the day iTunes was launched. Sure Best Buy, Wal-Mart, Circuit City, Sam Good, FYI music etc all were still the kings at that time, but the technology that was being introduced was clearly better suited to take the torch.

Just keep in mind that all of this HTML-5 talk is the real deal. Take the time out to read up on it if you haven't.

 

[Stately]

Do you know what the word "amen" means?

Hint: Translated, it means "verily", or "so be it", or, basically, "I agree!"

It's not a religious term, though it's most frequently used in that context.

Haha, exactly. Ahem . . Selah.

 

[i.mac]

The reason is that if the flash coding is wrong and slows down my machine, I (the user) should be one choosing what I want for my machine (iPad or iPhone), not Steve.
...

... but wait... you have a choice after all: there is google.phone and soon a google pad with optimized flash... is this not a choice? By some accounts, the google.phone may be better than the iphone, and therefore, it seems like a win win choice.

you have a choice of device that is, and since you know all the 'limitations', then why purchase this one particular idevice?

the fact is that every one has a choice, but some make the wrong choice...