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Steve Jobs Suggests Blu-ray Not Coming to Mac Anytime Soon
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Let me give you a hand friend.
User CP -> Buddy / Ignore Lists -> Ignore List ->*Type in "linux2mac" in Add user to ignore list".
All that's left is to click Save List.
Your graph is a very strong argument for the health of optical media, and the lunacy of Apple not supporting the current standards.
DVD shipments will grow for the next 3-4 years, then decline to current levels in 2018 or 2019.
Your graph actually is a very bleak picture for the near-term future of downloads.
I don't think that many here are saying that the future is not online entertainment.
We're saying that the future is not here. Our networks aren't fast enough for most people, our ISPs put caps on us, the legal downloads completely suck compared to BD discs for quality (video quality, audio quality, extras). (I just bought the 150 GB Avatar set - want to download that?)
I like your graph - it says that in a decade from now downloads will be mainstream. I pretty much agree with that timeline.
Unfortunately, people buying Apples can't watch the current standard, and will need to wait a decade. (Or, until Apple gets a new CEO who actually listens to customers.)
Mac Lands One-Two Punch Against PCs in Profit and Growth
Apparently more and more people prefer the computer that "just works" versus having one that is broken but comes with a BD player.
Mac Lands One-Two Punch Against PCs in Profit and Growth
http://gigaom.com/apple/mac-lands-o...tm_campaign=Feed:+TheAppleBlog+(GigaOM:+Apple)
Apparently more and more people prefer the computer that "just works" versus having one that is broken but comes with a BD player.
Mac Lands One-Two Punch Against PCs in Profit and Growth
http://gigaom.com/apple/mac-lands-o...tm_campaign=Feed:+TheAppleBlog+(GigaOM:+Apple)
Apparently more and more people prefer the computer that "just works" versus having one that is broken but comes with a BD player.
Mac Lands One-Two Punch Against PCs in Profit and Growth
http://gigaom.com/apple/mac-lands-o...tm_campaign=Feed:+TheAppleBlog+(GigaOM:+Apple)
Did anyone mention banning Fox News?
That would be a very Jobsian approach to the problem of "news" commentators spreading hate and lies.
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Anyway, the real reason that your "which is better - Windows or Linux" question and its predecessors are dumb goes back to an earlier post of yours:
Here, you acknowledge that I chose to run Windows servers for some applications, and Linux servers for other applications. Clearly, you acknowledge that I picked Windows as being "better" in some cases, and Linux as "better" in other cases. You can't determine "better" without considering a lot of parameters about the application.
So your false surprise that I suggested Linux is priceless - especially since most everyone realizes that your "requirement" of 100 simultaneous clients was mentioned solely to eliminate Windows clients from the pool.
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10 years from now Apple will still be offering 720p movies compressed at 5mbs, and their computers (now only model being the iPad Air) will move at a blistering 1.5 Ghz. Dual core.
But Apple's previews for their downloads will be up to an amazing 60 seconds by then, so it will all even out.
720p is not (so) bad.
The problem is, that Apple isn't using the high profile with CABAC (*) and other nice features. Also they use probably quicktime for encoding. AFAIK h.264 qt encoder is "Ok" but not good.
Take a look at x264:
"“Professional” tools for Blu-ray video encoding can cost as much as $100,000 and are often utter garbage. [...]With x264′s powerful compression, as demonstrated by the incredibly popular BD-Rebuilder Blu-ray backup software, it’s quite possible to author Blu-ray disks on DVD9s (dual-layer DVDs) or even DVD5s (single-layer DVDs) with a reasonable level of quality. [...] To celebrate this achievement, we are making available for download a demo Blu-ray encoded with x264, containing entirely free content!"
http://x264dev.multimedia.cx/archives/328
(*) http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1431694#post1431694
(*) "However, it [CABAC] is incompatible with the iPod, and makes the AppleTV [1] struggle. So turn it off for those." (Source: Handbrake)
The problem is, that Apple isn't using the high profile with CABAC (*) and other nice features. Also they use probably quicktime for encoding. AFAIK h.264 qt encoder is "Ok" but not good.
Take a look at x264:
"“Professional” tools for Blu-ray video encoding can cost as much as $100,000 and are often utter garbage. [...]With x264′s powerful compression, as demonstrated by the incredibly popular BD-Rebuilder Blu-ray backup software, it’s quite possible to author Blu-ray disks on DVD9s (dual-layer DVDs) or even DVD5s (single-layer DVDs) with a reasonable level of quality. [...] To celebrate this achievement, we are making available for download a demo Blu-ray encoded with x264, containing entirely free content!"
http://x264dev.multimedia.cx/archives/328
(*) http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1431694#post1431694
(*) "However, it [CABAC] is incompatible with the iPod, and makes the AppleTV [1] struggle. So turn it off for those." (Source: Handbrake)
Your graph is a very strong argument for the health of optical media, and the lunacy of Apple not supporting the current standards.
DVD shipments will grow for the next 3-4 years, then decline to current levels in 2018 or 2019.
Your graph actually is a very bleak picture for the near-term future of downloads.
I don't think that many here are saying that the future is not online entertainment.
We're saying that the future is not here. Our networks aren't fast enough for most people, our ISPs put caps on us, the legal downloads completely suck compared to BD discs for quality (video quality, audio quality, extras). (I just bought the 150 GB Avatar set - want to download that?)
I like your graph - it says that in a decade from now downloads will be mainstream. I pretty much agree with that timeline.
Unfortunately, people buying Apples can't watch the current standard, and will need to wait a decade. (Or, until Apple gets a new CEO who actually listens to customers.)
When DVDs came out, I had several hundred VHS movies. I now have several hundred DVDs. At $20 on average, I maintain the lunacy would be replacing my DVDs with BDs when online services show every sign of either matching BD quality in the next few years or coming so close as to make the difference negligible. I cannot in good conscience suggest anyone do the same, even if Apple changes their stance and no matter how much some in this thread would really, really, really like me to.
As for the bleak picture of download services in the near-term, there is little to nothing in the graph for one to glean the growth of download services. One could easily argue that VOD's penetration is independent of BD, as VOD is now being bundled into almost every smart phone (er, sorry Android), tablet, TV, cable box (ex. Comcast cable), gaming console, and even BD player. A graph overlaying the one I cited previously that reflects equal or more more growth is within the realm of possibility even with the forcast from Netflix.
For instance, I have a BD player and three BD movies as a result of purchasing a PS3 in the last 12 months. My BD collection is 300% greater than what it was a year ago. I have probably rented a dozen BD films (Some of which have arrived broken. GRRRR! I thought these things were durable!). In contrast, I have probably watched over a hundred movies via the PS3's Netflix or Comcast OnDemand. Anecdotal? Certainly. Except the more I talk to others about their video consumption, more and more are echoing my behavior, content for now with sub-BD with the exception of the occasional blockbuster film that draws them to the theater.
I don't expect anyone to take my word for it when it comes to my hypotheses. I invite people to interpret the accompanying graphs as they see fit and check out the stories where I found them and others that I find very telling and should cause anyone pause when it comes to backing (ie investing) in BD entertainment in the longterm (10+ years).
http://www.in-stat.com/press.asp?ID=2907&sku=IN1003966MBI
http://paidcontent.org/article/419-new-eye-popping-netflix-growth-stats/
http://www.digital-digest.com/blog/DVDGuy/2010/10/31/weekly-news-roundup-31-october-2010/
http://www.hd-report.com/2010/04/14/hdvideo-on-demand-investment-shows-growth/
http://www.infonetics.com/pr/2010/4Q09-IPTV-and-Video-Market-Highlights.asp
Once again, let me go on the record again by saying that I in no way have ever stated BD and AppleTV are on par as far as sharpness goes. I have actually been accused of stating such nonsense recently (Don't worry. I won't name names. Seriously, ask yourself where this animus emanates from and get some help, compadre.). I'm also no fan of DRM-laden movies, so you won't see me buying movies in iTunes, XBOX Live, or the PS3 store. Wake up, Hollywood. The music industry finally gets it, why don't you?
Let's be civilized and just agree to disagree.
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In a decade, we'll agree.
Until then, I will continue to question why the turtlenecked overlord won't put current technology optical drives into Apples. And I will definitely question the sheep who argue that people who buy Apples shouldn't have the option to choose to buy systems with current technology.
I'm pro-choice.
Oh no! You are so clever by switching out your avatar (that proclaimed banning Fox News) to the cute little kitty cat. You are just too quick for me. LOL! In other words (I am answering your question here) that would be you that mentioned banning Fox News via your former avatar.
This brings to mind an episode of COP's I saw a while back. There was a perpetrator hiding in a back yard under an empty plastic kiddie pool with his upper torso and head underneath the pool with legs sticking out. You could see his white tennis shoes and legs from the helicopter's spotlight and the officers on the ground surrounding him. I guess he figured as long as he didn't see the police they couldn't see him.
You still haven't answered the question. Oh well, then here's another question. How much will a 100 client license cost with Windows Server on the Dell mini equivalent versus Snow Leopard Server and the Mac Mini server? I am just curious since you suggested earlier the Dell would be a better and less expensive choice over the Mac Mini server.
Really?
Check the Dell mini equivalent.
Starting price $299. (Quad core, 6 GiB, 750 GB, discrete 1 GiB graphics and BD is $749 - $50 cheaper than a C2D Mini mac with dual core, 2 GiB, 500 GB, integrated graphics and an optical drive from the last millenium.)
Has two eSATA ports (it's kind of "Flintstoney" not to have these today).
Radeon HD 4250 integrated graphics, or available discrete Radeon HD 5450 MXM graphics with 1 GiB of dedicated VRAM.
Quad core available. BD available. Up to 1 TB hard drive.
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I think that makes your Mini mac look like it came from Bedrock.
And now back to the topic of BD, I believe you misread the Netflix graphs presented earlier that clearly show the decline of physical media and the rise of streaming media over the very near couple of years. DOH!
*Raises hand.*
That must be the group capable of thinking for themselves.
Facts:
- Figures say Blu-Ray isn't dead, or even close.
- Anyone with half decent vision or who even reads the specs know that it's the superior medium for video quality.
- It's newer tech and better than DVD.
What about the people arguing AGAINST blu-ray? Do they make a living off Blu-Ray not being allowed? (eg. all these 'revolutionary' streaming services that people keep saying kill Blu-Ray, yet they are only available in the US - which is of course, the only country in the world.)
It sure would explain a few things. If there was discussion for an eSATA port in Macs, I probably wouldn't use it, but why the hell would I argue against it? Oh noes, not more choice for consumers.
Finally, the battle is Blu-Ray vs DVD, not Blu-Ray vs streaming/online downloads, which are completely different things and will co-exist for a long time (quote me on 5-10 years). As for BD vs DVD, as I keep saying, as long as there's an optical drive in a Mac, it should be recent technology, such as Blu-Ray, which is 7 years old.
As an Apple user and a Blu-ray supporter, I completely agree with you.
I wish Apple would give customers the choice of a custom configuration with Blu-ray. I can't imagine spending $2500+ on a new Mac Pro without a Blu-ray drive. That's ridiculous to me.
But I'm not naive and I understand that Steve doesn't want to cannibalize his sub-par quality iTunes movies.
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One thing to remember though, when u switched from VHS to DVD, u kind of had to replace all ur movies. Players were different, storage cabinets were different, etc. Now, u can buy a bluray Player that will still play ur DVDs and u only need to buy ur new films in the new format.
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My signature still points to "TurnOffFox"
- which does not propose "banning" Fox News.What graph were you looking at? The netflix one showed discs growing over the "very near couple of years." After 5 years, they will begin declining down to the numbers we have now, which is still quite large.
Do you buy your DVDs at Barnes and Noble? My god, man. I shudder to think of spending $20 even on a blu-ray. I get my Blu-rays for $8 on Amazon, or less than $15 if I absolutely cannot wait to get a favorite film. That's less than it costs to see it in the theater in my state! Then I have the added benefit of a good sound system, comfy seats, and no teenagers talking on their cell phone!
What does it take for steve jobs to change his mind?
Pardon me for not reading the entire 150+pages here, but REALLY, what does it take for Steve Jobs to change his mind and make it so we can read/write blue ray...1080p 3D movies are the way things are going and the internet is a long ways from being able to stream these!! I'm not satisfied w/Netflix's "HD" streaming. Plus the best I can get where I live is DSL! Apple is supposed to be the best, so why am I not able to get & use a blue ray optical drive in my Mac?!?!
Steve needs to get a clue and take advantage of the fact that Blue Ray is on the rise, not decline!! THE INTERNET SIMPLY ISN'T FAST ENOUGH YET TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF WHAT'S AVAILABLE NOW IN BLUE RAY TECHNOLOGY, AND IT WILL TAKE YEARS FOR THE INTERNET TO CATCH UP, ESPECIALLY IF YOU DO NOT LIVE IN A BIG CITY!!!
Someone needs to get some kind of petition going, take time to get it big enough to make an impression on Steve & Apple to tell them to get it right!
Pardon me for not reading the entire 150+pages here, but REALLY, what does it take for Steve Jobs to change his mind and make it so we can read/write blue ray...1080p 3D movies are the way things are going and the internet is a long ways from being able to stream these!! I'm not satisfied w/Netflix's "HD" streaming. Plus the best I can get where I live is DSL! Apple is supposed to be the best, so why am I not able to get & use a blue ray optical drive in my Mac?!?!
Steve needs to get a clue and take advantage of the fact that Blue Ray is on the rise, not decline!! THE INTERNET SIMPLY ISN'T FAST ENOUGH YET TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF WHAT'S AVAILABLE NOW IN BLUE RAY TECHNOLOGY, AND IT WILL TAKE YEARS FOR THE INTERNET TO CATCH UP, ESPECIALLY IF YOU DO NOT LIVE IN A BIG CITY!!!
Someone needs to get some kind of petition going, take time to get it big enough to make an impression on Steve & Apple to tell them to get it right!
I don't think he uses it to sarcastically to (fail to) prove points to other people, but to announce products.
Here's a key quote from that.
I have a bridge I'd like to sell you if you continue to call this a "push". Now, if the number in bold began with "199", I'd agree. I'd call this a sign of the collapse of the current world power. 7 years ago was already too late to begin a broadband push, I was already on 256Kb DSL, and that was because I didn't want to pay for higher speeds. I was hardly the first to have DSL.
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My signature still points to "TurnOffFox"
You know, it's really hard to reconcile these 2 attitudes.
I don't think that it's too hard to reconcile them at all.
I would like the choice not to see/hear Fox News. I do not want to prevent you from choosing to watch Fox News.
Just like I would like the choice not to breath air poisoned by tobacco smoke, but that doesn't mean that I would remove your choice to smoke.
</tangent>
My guess is when DVD drives become more expensive and harder to get in volumes than Blu-Ray, Macs will still have DVD drives. When it becomes significantly more expensive (like when Apple have to hire archeologists to dig DVD drive fossils from the ground), then they will switch to Blu-Ray. Bit of a shame as I'd like to buy a new iMac in the next year or so, but I won't without Blu-Ray.
Guys...
...it's really funny to see all of you still beating a dead horse.
So, just for a quick reference, check this Wiki on BROADBAND INTERNET.
According to this, anything upwards >4 MBit/s is considered Broadband. Do you think this is sufficient, when BluRay is specced to use the tenfold of that for video?
I could care less - I am on a 100MBit/s unlimited and uncapped broadband connection here in Germany. Wake me up, when this speed hits the rural areas of every country.
Then we can maybe talk download media. But until then BluRay is the only reasonable choice. Period.
...it's really funny to see all of you still beating a dead horse.
So, just for a quick reference, check this Wiki on BROADBAND INTERNET.
According to this, anything upwards >4 MBit/s is considered Broadband. Do you think this is sufficient, when BluRay is specced to use the tenfold of that for video?
I could care less - I am on a 100MBit/s unlimited and uncapped broadband connection here in Germany. Wake me up, when this speed hits the rural areas of every country.
Then we can maybe talk download media. But until then BluRay is the only reasonable choice. Period.
Lol, in Australia, anything greater than 256kbps (<1/4Mbps) is considered broadband.
I bought 15.5" laptop with bd almost 2 years ago for less than $1k. Same size mac would have been over twice the price without bd.
So it really wasn't just few hundred more.
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