Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
T-Mobile to Sell iPhone in Germany: November 1st?
- Thread starter ciaw525
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Quite Frankly, I have gone through many mobile phones in my life and I was frustrated at every single one of them. As a software developer, there were/are many tiny things in each one that pissed the hell out of me that I just wanted to smash my head up the nearest wall. I would switch to any operator if you give me a decent phone that makes sense.
True but Apple would have had 3G in the iPhone at it's release if it was that easy. Only time will tell but my prediction is that the T-Mobile Germany iPhone will be EDGE and that you will not see a next gen iPhone with 3G until sometime next year. I'm assuming that like the states, each countries approval process (similar to the FCC) is a public process so you should get a multi month advanced notice before an iPhone is going into a specific country.
Well your government (and those of other southern European countries) are to blame for that.
They resisted a drastic reduction in roaming charges.
If they start releasing the iPhone in Europe in November, the June 2007 US launch will seem like a distant memory. Historically Apple has updated products within a similar time scale. Look at the Apple TV as a very recent example, and the improved graphics card in the original iMac.
However, I'm torn between believing the European version will be 3G or EDGE.
Weighing up the evidence:
EDGE:
Steve Jobs apparently stated that there are no 3G chips that will fit into the case of the iPhone, and current chips drain too much battery.
Asia is more likely to NEED a 3G version, and Apple have stated Asia will get the iPhone in 2008 (not being specific, likely will mean mid to end of 2008).
Product updates from Apple currently seem to be slower than expected (except the hard drive upgrade in the Apple TV). Just look at the long overdue iMac, lack of Blue-Ray, no iLife 07 etc etc.
3G:
Even in Europe 3G makes the most sense. Most networks don't have EDGE (only Orange in the UK), and 3G is well established now. Next generation beyond 3G is already being developed.
More important as wifi access points are scarce in many areas, and free wifi is out of the question (London and a few other big cities may be exceptions...). Paid wifi access is very expensive, only worthwhile for heavy/regular users.
Vodafone doesn't have Edge in the UK, so if they're considering the iPhone they would be nuts to sell an iPhone that can only work at GPRS speeds.
Obviously the iPhone announcement was amazing - and it proves to be far better than I could have imagined an iPhone could be - but other than the iPhone I've been fairly underwhelmed by Apple's updates/annoucements recently. WWDC was a real disappointment, not even any exciting new features in Leopard that hadn't been shown previously. Therefore while I would love to see a 3G version of the iPhone in the UK in November (but only if they don't make it thicker, and it still has good battery life), my money would be on them bringing out the same EDGE model as currently on sale in the US, followed by a 3G version late 2008.
However, I'm torn between believing the European version will be 3G or EDGE.
Weighing up the evidence:
EDGE:
Steve Jobs apparently stated that there are no 3G chips that will fit into the case of the iPhone, and current chips drain too much battery.
Asia is more likely to NEED a 3G version, and Apple have stated Asia will get the iPhone in 2008 (not being specific, likely will mean mid to end of 2008).
Product updates from Apple currently seem to be slower than expected (except the hard drive upgrade in the Apple TV). Just look at the long overdue iMac, lack of Blue-Ray, no iLife 07 etc etc.
3G:
Even in Europe 3G makes the most sense. Most networks don't have EDGE (only Orange in the UK), and 3G is well established now. Next generation beyond 3G is already being developed.
More important as wifi access points are scarce in many areas, and free wifi is out of the question (London and a few other big cities may be exceptions...). Paid wifi access is very expensive, only worthwhile for heavy/regular users.
Vodafone doesn't have Edge in the UK, so if they're considering the iPhone they would be nuts to sell an iPhone that can only work at GPRS speeds.
Obviously the iPhone announcement was amazing - and it proves to be far better than I could have imagined an iPhone could be - but other than the iPhone I've been fairly underwhelmed by Apple's updates/annoucements recently. WWDC was a real disappointment, not even any exciting new features in Leopard that hadn't been shown previously. Therefore while I would love to see a 3G version of the iPhone in the UK in November (but only if they don't make it thicker, and it still has good battery life), my money would be on them bringing out the same EDGE model as currently on sale in the US, followed by a 3G version late 2008.
I completely agree with your prediction. see my posts earlier. Anyway, lets hope for the best, a 3G iphone that is
.
iPhone in Europe and the 3G Mallarcky
Have to say that I'm chomping at the bit on news of an iPhone release in the UK. I have not renewed my contract for now 2 years since the news of an iPhone in development.
As for the 3G question. Most mobile telephones in europe are 3g however the number of people actually using 3g facilites is seriously limited. Personally I don't believe it will make a huge difference, however it gives the iPhone more of an advantage in europe to be 3g than not, people are stupid. They want all the features and tech such as 3g but when it comes to actually using them its a very different story.
The number of people who I know have 3G phones always show me what it can do but don't really use the 3G functions. There is also the cost issue, which is significant.
Edge or 2.5G is fine for me, the spec and the UI is far beyond anything any of the other manufacturers can bring to market. The Prata sorry Prada phone is being show boated as being the same as the iPhone. In recent weeks I've seen some really negative Apple news predominantly from the BBC, check out their technology news and see the phones they are making comparisons with as being touch screen tech in market today. Really, really lame.
Have to say that I'm chomping at the bit on news of an iPhone release in the UK. I have not renewed my contract for now 2 years since the news of an iPhone in development.
As for the 3G question. Most mobile telephones in europe are 3g however the number of people actually using 3g facilites is seriously limited. Personally I don't believe it will make a huge difference, however it gives the iPhone more of an advantage in europe to be 3g than not, people are stupid. They want all the features and tech such as 3g but when it comes to actually using them its a very different story.
The number of people who I know have 3G phones always show me what it can do but don't really use the 3G functions. There is also the cost issue, which is significant.
Edge or 2.5G is fine for me, the spec and the UI is far beyond anything any of the other manufacturers can bring to market. The Prata sorry Prada phone is being show boated as being the same as the iPhone. In recent weeks I've seen some really negative Apple news predominantly from the BBC, check out their technology news and see the phones they are making comparisons with as being touch screen tech in market today. Really, really lame.
Actually maybe. My friend came to visit me out here in germany and brought her T-mobile US Razr v3 that was locked. When I inserted my E-Plus (germany) SIM card it naturally asked for the unlock code, but I was able to get ahold of my neighbors German T-Mobile Sim card and put it in the Razr and it worked just fine. The locked razr was able to use the german t-mobile sim card and actually work. I ended up unlocking her phone afterwards, just so she can use what ever network she wants, but my point is that it worked. So in theory a german iPhone might just work with an american t-mobile SIM card. Heck the phone I'm using right now is a T-mobile phone I bought back in CA. It worked just fine with the T-Mobile SIM card i had in it when I 1st came to germany. I now wish I weren't headed back home in Aug.
I know, the bbc have been terrible. Their iphone 'review' was done by someone who had a go on the display model in the store and even filmed himself doing it! Rubbish reporting.
I agree with you about the 3g thing too. Ive had it 2 years now and all i ever do is download email headers and visit a few webpages. The 3g thing is just a buzz word. Ok so itsfaster but how many people actually use it to its full advantage? I hear people saying all the time about how a phone is rubbish if it doesnt have 3g. A load of tripe if you ask me.
There was an article on MacUser.co.uk stating that a company has managed to crack the network lock, but in doing so, the iPhone doesn't function properly. Syncing with iTunes apparently doesn't work.
Roaming is very different from changing the SIM. Roaming works on an agreement between your operator and operators in the country you're visiting. A phone locked to a particular network reads network information embedded on the SIM. With the iPhone, it seems that if the iPhone doesn't see the embedded network information, the phone simply doesn't work properly.
A GSM quad band phone will work in any country allowing for roaming, but the phone still needs to see that it has the correct network SIM installed. My Vodafone phone works in other countries, and uses the Vodafone network where there is one, but I have to have roaming set-up and pay the roaming charges (thankfully, with Vodafone, that means a small connection charge, then I can use my contract minutes).
It does depend on how the lock is initiated. I would imagine Apple would incorporate a different lock so that they don't brake their agreement with AT&T in America. The lock is software based, reading the SIM. It would be very easy to make it country dependent.
I've used internet browsers on the iMate PDA2K using GPRS and it was unbearably slow. I'm currently using the SE M600i which has 3G and the Opera browser, and it's tolerable but can be a bit unreliable (some pages just never finish loading).
It depends what you want the phone for, but if you plan to use Safari on the iPhone and aren't near (or cannot afford to use) a wifi hotspot then having to use GPRS (which is all the current iPhone would get if on Vodafone in the UK) would make it pretty much unusable.
Mind you, I watched a YouTube video (on my Apple TV!) this evening where someone shows off their iPhone, including playing YouTube videos over EDGE. I'm honestly amazed it works. From my experience of 3G I never imagined that you could get any worthwhile video streaming over EDGE.
well horses for courses
i use 3g and still find it slow - 3.6mbps is now avilable if you're device supports it (which mine does) and its great to get that speed out and about
This blows
Which is exactly why probably in every country _one_ phone company will declare how proud they are to offer you an iPhone, and the other phone companies will desperately try to convince you that they never wanted to sell it in the first place
In the US, before the iPhone came out few people even cared about 3G. Sure, some use it, but how many howels of protests did you hear when the BlackBerry Curve came out on AT&T with only EDGE? Basically none.
Now that Apple has shown the potential of fast networking in a mobile phone, 3G is suddenly critical.
While 3G network providers might not have the iPhone now, they must love all the positive attention they are getting. Now everyone considering a mobile device will ask, "Does it have 3G?" Apple's iPhone has made 3G important.
If it's not 3G, it'll go the way of the Apple TV in Europe (nowhere)
You shouldn't look at 3G from your own perspective. Look at what the networks in Europe paid to get 3G. Their whole strategy is now based on making 3G work for them (they each paid several billion Euros to the governments to get their 3G licenses - it makes the profit on the iPhone seem like small potatoes) but they have been terribly let down by handset manufacturers that have not produced user-friendly devices to take advantage of it. Joe Public has no need for 3G because using it is way too difficult.
What Apple has now released could be the killer device for 3G. Here's a phone that relies heavily on data and is usable by your average person in the street. People are practically addicted to the internet and this is the device that finally makes the internet really portable and usable. I think the networks are engaged in a fierce battle to get the iPhone. All these rumours and talk of the arrogance of Apple are simply part of that battle - or maybe even strategies to influence negotiations.
I predict we will get a 3G iPhone. I think Steve Jobs will tell the US that in the time since they started the first design of the iPhone, the 3G chips have come a long way and this allowed them to update the phone fairly quickly. Like he said to Jonathan Ive in the keynote: "It's been two-and-a-half years..." - and in the end, what's $600 to Apple? You'll have had your fun with the phone for 6 months already. No doubt AT&T will allow you to upgrade the hardware under your contract. They must have foreseen that.
This hardware decision is the only thing that matters. Everything that can be solved in software (like MMS and all the other nitpicks) will eventually be solved, no doubt.
I used to be in PR - I'd announce some major software upgrades to the US phone at or around the same time as the 3G for Europe announcement. If they really fear backlash, they may even announce some step-up program for the 'launch customers'. Or they could allow the 'old' iPhone to be unlocked whenever the new version comes out - so for the latest hardware you need to stay at AT&T and all the switchers will be rewarded for moving to AT&T, but you can sell your old phone to anyone else. It would only increase the market penetration of the iPhone. Just some ideas.
You shouldn't look at 3G from your own perspective. Look at what the networks in Europe paid to get 3G. Their whole strategy is now based on making 3G work for them (they each paid several billion Euros to the governments to get their 3G licenses - it makes the profit on the iPhone seem like small potatoes) but they have been terribly let down by handset manufacturers that have not produced user-friendly devices to take advantage of it. Joe Public has no need for 3G because using it is way too difficult.
What Apple has now released could be the killer device for 3G. Here's a phone that relies heavily on data and is usable by your average person in the street. People are practically addicted to the internet and this is the device that finally makes the internet really portable and usable. I think the networks are engaged in a fierce battle to get the iPhone. All these rumours and talk of the arrogance of Apple are simply part of that battle - or maybe even strategies to influence negotiations.
I predict we will get a 3G iPhone. I think Steve Jobs will tell the US that in the time since they started the first design of the iPhone, the 3G chips have come a long way and this allowed them to update the phone fairly quickly. Like he said to Jonathan Ive in the keynote: "It's been two-and-a-half years..." - and in the end, what's $600 to Apple? You'll have had your fun with the phone for 6 months already. No doubt AT&T will allow you to upgrade the hardware under your contract. They must have foreseen that.
This hardware decision is the only thing that matters. Everything that can be solved in software (like MMS and all the other nitpicks) will eventually be solved, no doubt.
I used to be in PR - I'd announce some major software upgrades to the US phone at or around the same time as the 3G for Europe announcement. If they really fear backlash, they may even announce some step-up program for the 'launch customers'. Or they could allow the 'old' iPhone to be unlocked whenever the new version comes out - so for the latest hardware you need to stay at AT&T and all the switchers will be rewarded for moving to AT&T, but you can sell your old phone to anyone else. It would only increase the market penetration of the iPhone. Just some ideas.
Fake! T-Mobile is not the carrier, says the newspaper "Handelsblatt":
http://www.handelsblatt.com/news/Un...um-deutschen-iphone-vertrieb-geht-weiter.html
Translation:
"The bidder contest around the exclusive selling of the Apple iPhone in Germany is not yet over: The news, T-mobile was chosen after they sweetened their offer [in the last second before some other provider would have been selected by Apple], is false according to Handelsblatt informations."
http://www.handelsblatt.com/news/Un...um-deutschen-iphone-vertrieb-geht-weiter.html
Translation:
"The bidder contest around the exclusive selling of the Apple iPhone in Germany is not yet over: The news, T-mobile was chosen after they sweetened their offer [in the last second before some other provider would have been selected by Apple], is false according to Handelsblatt informations."
Does anybody read before posting? It's already posted several times within the last 1 1/2 hours.
A common refrain I have heard many times (and experienced myself) is that browsing the Internet on mobile devices generally sucks, so speed, while important, was not the sole concerns.
Now that Apple, while not perfecting, has incredibly advanced the enjoyment of browsing the Internet on a mobile device, the lack of speed becomes very important. In other words, if your experience sucked whether you were using WiFi or EDGE, then EDGE wasn't considered an issue. But now that with the iPhone there is a dramatic difference in experience between WiFi and EDGE, EDGE is a big issue.
I agree with those that say this points to the European iPhone not having 3G.
For the UK that would suggest Orange will get it, as they are the only ones to have an EDGE compatible network here:
http://www.orangepartner.com/site/enuk/news/press/p_edge_launch.jsp
For the UK that would suggest Orange will get it, as they are the only ones to have an EDGE compatible network here:
http://www.orangepartner.com/site/enuk/news/press/p_edge_launch.jsp