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The 2012 MLB Season Thread
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You know, I'm not 100% in love with this move. His ****** off the field attitude aside, replacing even average pitching in this league is very difficult and very expensive. And we're going to end up paying him to pitch for someone else. Outside of a couple spectacularly terrible innings this year, he's pitched decently well and gotten no run support.
Really, this just makes me depressed about the complete and utter FAIL that has been the Red Sox' free agent signings in the last few years - Lackey, Crawford, Matsuzaka, Jenks, etc. And I wanted the Matsuzaka signing to work out as badly as I hated the John Lackey signing.
I just hope whatever they do, it's not a reactionary move and we either get prospects back or get off the hook for his salary. I'm not sure I'd do it, but if they truly believe it would be addition by subtraction or some such inside information I don't have, then fine. But don't get hosed just to get rid of him.
You're right that his pitching actually hasn't been that bad, but his attitude is piss poor, and he has what seems to be a negative effect on the clubhouse. This season is already a loss. If they can't ship him out tomorrow, I really hope they get rid of him before 2013.
It's not just the free agent signings. The upper management of this team has been absolutely piss poor for the past 5 years, but up until recently they kept getting the benefit of the doubt from the fans. That needs to stop. There's a huge list of horrible free agent signings (can anyone name one good one?), stupid trades, bad management of injuries, and just general incompetence.
Unfortunately it seems that the ownership group is now too concerned with other ventures (their soccer team) to care about what's actually going on with the Red Sox as long as they are making money. Lucchino has no clue how to run a baseball team, and it seems that he keeps Cherington on such a short leash he can't do anything either. If Henry & co are serious about putting a championship caliber team on the field, they need to gut the front office and management and start over. Bobby Valentine clearly wasn't the answer, as we saw from Tito spending an hour ********ting with his former team in the clubhouse this past weekend, and the whole Crawford debacle where it seems like nobody in this organization knows what the hell is going on.
We actually have a decent group of guys on the field, but as long as the management is this big of a cluster ****, they are never getting back to the playoffs.
Agreed here too. They need to get some value back for him. This season is already over, but if they can get value back for him (and maybe another player or two), they can put themselves in a much better position for next year. Unfortunately that does absolutely nothing for the mess that is upper management.
Not so sure about how he'll be long term, but he's better than any other option we've shopped so far.
The value they get back for him is going to be in direct proportion to how much of his contract they eat. That seems like it would be the biggest obstacle.
Money aside, I think a change of scenery will do wonders for him. The embarrassing end of the season (with the chicken/beer) and the horrible start to this one is probably too much to overcome.
I'd be scared to see him in Texas. I'd hate to face him in October (not talking about just the Yankees, but any team). There's a big possibility of a Youklis - like resurgence (and I do know he's been much better of late).
I'm rooting for Atlanta.
Yes, his attitude sucks, but if the Red Sox were leading the wild card or in first place, no one would care that he's salty 99% of the time. The fact is he was a salty bastard in 2007, too. The difference is the Red Sox have been ransacked by injuries and certain players have wildly underperformed (Lester, Melancon, Crawford, Bard, etc.) which puts more pressure on the others. It's a cocktail of bad luck that gets compounded in a market like Boston.
Beckett is not my favorite player by a longshot, but when I look at the premium on starting pitching, the fact that he just turned 32 years old, and his overall numbers, I just want to be sure it's an intelligent move and not one driven by sports radio callers and/or panic.
Dumping him when his perceived value is so low is almost always a dumb move, unless he's an absolute clubhouse cancer. While the media villifies him, his teammates seem to love him, so that's not an open and shut case.
zioxide said:
They've gotten the benefit of the doubt because they brought two world championships to the city after an endless drought. However, I think fan sentiment has certainly shifted in the last 2 or 3 seasons.
The free agent record has been absolutely terrible, no one is disputing that, with the exception of the Alfredo Aceves and Cody Ross signings. The trades have been good and bad. Gonzalez was a great trade. Melancon, at the time, was a trade everyone was excited about. I think Saltalamacchia has performed well this season, he's 27 years old, and might be coming in to his own. We acquired him for flotsam and jetsam. Andrew Bailey is to be continued, because he was hurt immediately. Bad luck there. Mike Aviles, another good player for middling prospects. The Red Sox have always been better at finding value guys on the free agent/trade market, not buying superstars.
My point is, I think the fans are pissed because we expected to contend this season, and thus far it has been a huge disappointment. I think the recent huge mistakes in free agency (Lackey, Crawford, Matsuzaka) have made things seem worse than they are, although I am in the minority of thinking Crawford will bounce back and be good once he's healthy.
zioxide said:
Blame the management for the players they field. But this season is as much the fault of injuries and underperformance than anything else. If Lester isn't a 5.00+ ERA pitcher this season, if Kevin Youkilis wasn't batting a cool .230 for the first half of the season, if Mark Melancon wasn't uncharacteristically horrible - even Daniel Bard and his nightmare season. Raise your hand if you thought the once dominant Bard would forget how to pitch completely - in any of the roles.
Yes, the management needs to do better, but going in to this season, people were excited about this roster. It's easy to forget that with how poorly things have turned out.
zioxide said:
If it were my decision, I'd pay his salary and get back a top tier prospect. We pay the highest ticket prices in baseball, so when you eff up, open up the coffers to cover it up, don't make the team suffer.
The value they get back for him is going to be in direct proportion to how much of his contract they eat. That seems like it would be the biggest obstacle.
Money aside, I think a change of scenery will do wonders for him. The embarrassing end of the season (with the chicken/beer) and the horrible start to this one is probably too much to overcome.
I'd be scared to see him in Texas. I'd hate to face him in October (not talking about just the Yankees, but any team). There's a big possibility of a Youklis - like resurgence (and I do know he's been much better of late).
I'm rooting for Atlanta.
I mean, I'm not in the clubhouse, so I don't know what the culture is. But if it's just that he's salty with reporters, I could care less. Keep him. If he's truly a cancer, then fine, but I'd eat his salary and go for a top prospect. He's still a good pitcher, and not an old fart.
In the last five years, he's pitched under 175 innings only one time, 2010. He then bounced back in 2011 and pitched 193 innings with a 2.89 ERA. He started this season a little unevenly, but he's pitched better as of late, and again, he's 32 years old and has shown durability.
At minimum he's a slightly above average pitcher, which is an expensive commodity in this league.
I wouldn't give him away for nothing. When grouped with a healthy Lester and Buchholz, he doesn't have to be an ace.
This is interesting.... The Red Sox were going to include Jacoby Ellsbury in the Beckett trade package. Why would they trade one of their most productive players? Does the front office see him as injury prone with his recent injuries the last few years?
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2012/08/red-sox-rangers-discussed-beckett-ellsbury-shoppach.html
http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2012/08/red-sox-rangers-discussed-beckett-ellsbury-shoppach.html
He's going to be a free agent and there is no way in hell he is going to sign a new contract with them with the current cluster**** state of the team.
This is also true. Even if Boston was the highest he wouldn't sign back here.
Expect him to get an 8-10 year deal in the $175-225 million range.
Looks like several MLB facebook pages were hacked. Posted hilarious posts.
http://techcrunch.com/2012/08/02/ha...messages-from-seven-mlb-teams-facebook-pages/
http://techcrunch.com/2012/08/02/ha...messages-from-seven-mlb-teams-facebook-pages/
Im glad I just picked him up for my fantasy team.
He's pitched well in both starts, but got an unfortunate loss the first time. Both Sheets and Maholm have been great pickups.