The Palm Pre's UI is peerless in its class.

[Kev1000000]

What is Apple keeping away from Developers?
Access to the Calendar database, not allowing true system-wide notifications with interactive content, and background processes. There are other items too, but these are the biggies.

You have proof that all these SDK packages are kept from developers?
SDK packages? You mean API's? Yes, I have full access to the SDK and have written iPhone apps. Check out SurfaceDJ in the app store, that is "my" app (my companies).

Are we talking 3.0, or the current software?
3.0.

What about the tons of new SDK's that are coming with 3.0? Do you have the full list of every single SDK that they have released?
Again, I think you mean API. And yes, I am fully aware of what the iPhone SDK allows and doesnt allow. I am a developer.

Me thinks you don't.
You think wrong.

I think having a server handle the notifications instead of my battery and RAM being eaten up by the program is a better option for IM programs.
The Pre already boasts better battery life, even WITH background processes/apps. WebOS is much lighter on resources than mOSX and the Pre also scales back the processing power when it isnt needed. The result is much battery battery life than you would expect. A lot of people who have had access to a Pre has said that even with 15 apps running, everything felt very smooth and the UI was very responsive. WebOS was designed for multitasking.

[Notifications] will work virtually the same from an end user perspective.
No they wont. WebOS notifications can be interacted with. Push notifications from Apple can not. Plus, you have to have signal to be able to receive push notifications. A HUGE downside. Push notifications will also not work with airplane mode on the iPhone.

Doesn't the iPhone's calendar also handle invites? How do we know an app can't currently, or in 3.0, be programmed to send this magical email?
What? Do you even know what I was saying in regards to having 3rd party apps add events to the personal calendar in WebOS?

On the iPhone, no app can read or write to the calendar database. No app can add its own entries or read entries. With WebOS, 3rd party apps have full access to the calendar.

Again, the Apple SDK doesn't require an app to be running in the background for it to notify you of something.
True, but you do need a signal and the notifications are not interactable.

All this changes with 3.0 and the notification system being implemented.
No it doesnt. Apple's notification system is very hacky and broken. It really is a huge band-aid on a much larger problem.


I can run ANY app on my phone while listening to music. I have yet to find one that won't run while I listen to my iPod.
Go ahead and try to run Pandora while surfing the net on the iPhone. Or writing an email, or... anything. To listen to Pandora on the iPhone, you have to have the Pandora app open. With WebOS, you can have Pandora running while writing emails, surfing the web, playing games, etc. It runs in the background.


Yea. I get the idea. You are pretty clueless as to what the iPhone is currently capable of, let alone what it will be capable of when 3.0 comes out. Pretty much, being able to run apps in the background is all the Pre can do that the iPhone can't.
You obviously do not get the idea. I have had the iPhone since day 1. I am a developer for iPhone. I know it in and out. I also know the Pre very well. 3.0 does not solve ANY of the problems I mentioned. Every single argument I have made is against iPhone's 3.0 OS. Trust me, it solves very little, only what was needed from the beginning (Copy/Paste, MMS, A2DP).

 

[Rat-Boy]

What is Apple keeping away from Developers?
Access to the Calendar database, not allowing true system-wide notifications with interactive content, and background processes. There are other items too, but these are the biggies.

Ok.

Fair enough. That is as of today though.

You have proof that all these SDK packages are kept from developers?
SDK packages? You mean API's? Yes, I have full access to the SDK and have written iPhone apps. Check out SurfaceDJ in the app store, that is "my" app (my companies).

Yes, I mean APIs. Not up on my lingo here. Oracle and PCs are my thing, not cell phones.

I think having a server handle the notifications instead of my battery and RAM being eaten up by the program is a better option for IM programs.
The Pre already boasts better battery life, even WITH background processes/apps. WebOS is much lighter on resources than mOSX and the Pre also scales back the processing power when it isnt needed. The result is much battery battery life than you would expect. A lot of people who have had access to a Pre has said that even with 15 apps running, everything felt very smooth and the UI was very responsive. WebOS was designed for multitasking.

I won't argue about battery life. The battery life on the iPhone is pathetic.

[Notifications] will work virtually the same from an end user perspective.
No they wont. WebOS notifications can be interacted with. Push notifications from Apple can not. Plus, you have to have signal to be able to receive push notifications. A HUGE downside. Push notifications will also not work with airplane mode on the iPhone.

Fair enough but I can't think of what I would want some app to notify me of, other than my calendar.

But I am not a power user either, so maybe I am just not seeing something.

Doesn't the iPhone's calendar also handle invites? How do we know an app can't currently, or in 3.0, be programmed to send this magical email?
What? Do you even know what I was saying in regards to having 3rd party apps add events to the personal calendar in WebOS?

On the iPhone, no app can read or write to the calendar database. No app can add its own entries or read entries. With WebOS, 3rd party apps have full access to the calendar.

Yes.

I know exactly what you meant.

Which is why I mentioned having an app send a calendar invite through email.

Accomplishes the same goal basically.

All this changes with 3.0 and the notification system being implemented.
No it doesnt. Apple's notification system is very hacky and broken. It really is a huge band-aid on a much larger problem.

How so?

I am not a developer so I don't have 3.0 yet.

I can run ANY app on my phone while listening to music. I have yet to find one that won't run while I listen to my iPod.
Go ahead and try to run Pandora while surfing the net on the iPhone. Or writing an email, or... anything. To listen to Pandora on the iPhone, you have to have the Pandora app open. With WebOS, you can have Pandora running while writing emails, surfing the web, playing games, etc. It runs in the background.

Why would I try that?

A) I don't have Pandora.

B) I know you can't do that, which is why I said the iPod.

Yea. I get the idea. You are pretty clueless as to what the iPhone is currently capable of, let alone what it will be capable of when 3.0 comes out. Pretty much, being able to run apps in the background is all the Pre can do that the iPhone can't.
You obviously do not get the idea. I have had the iPhone since day 1. I am a developer for iPhone. I know it in and out. I also know the Pre very well. 3.0 does not solve ANY of the problems I mentioned. Every single argument I have made is against iPhone's 3.0 OS. Trust me, it solves very little, only what was needed from the beginning (Copy/Paste, MMS, A2DP).

Gotcha.

So you swapping it for a Pre or do you already have one since you seem to know so much about it?

 

[dsnort]

Oddly enough, I see a lot of people in this thread "bashing" a phone that hasn't even been released yet.

On the other hand, I see people on here expressing great admiration for a phone that hasn't been released yet!

And yet, no one seems to think, "Hey, I might be an idiot".

Odd.

 

[Rat-Boy]

What is Apple keeping away from Developers?
Access to the Calendar database, not allowing true system-wide notifications with interactive content, and background processes. There are other items too, but these are the biggies.

You have proof that all these SDK packages are kept from developers?
SDK packages? You mean API's? Yes, I have full access to the SDK and have written iPhone apps. Check out SurfaceDJ in the app store, that is "my" app (my companies).

Straight from Boy Genius Report:

yet we can’t help but feel it’s going to be iPhone web apps all over again until Palm releases an SDK that lets everyone (not just special partners) access areas of the OS that are needed to create applications that aren’t just “fluff”.

 

[pavvento]

Oddly enough, I see a lot of people in this thread "bashing" a phone that hasn't even been released yet.

On the other hand, I see people on here expressing great admiration for a phone that hasn't been released yet!

And yet, no one seems to think, "Hey, I might be an idiot".

Odd.

The only thing I know is that I don't know anything.

 

[Kev1000000]

Straight from Boy Genius Report:

yet we can’t help but feel it’s going to be iPhone web apps all over again until Palm releases an SDK that lets everyone (not just special partners) access areas of the OS that are needed to create applications that aren’t just “fluff”.

WebOS apps aren't just "Web apps." They simply use the web development framework to make programming easy and accessible to anyone that can build a website. The apps still install directly on the phone, are run locally, store data locally, and can access a lot of the systems resources.

 

[bks691]

The Pre has already failed! = Cheap plastic phone with microscopic tiny tiny keys! Have fun sending an e-mail by the way, Lol

 

[needthephone]

I was excited about the ore but I think I will be keeping and updating my iPhone for several reasons.

The keyboard looks unconvincing and for me dates the phone. I love being able to interact with the on screen key pad. Having a seperate keyboard detached you from the experience. I find myself trying to type on my iMac screen. I am totally over keyboards.

The so called webos. This is just spin for running on a web browser and is just a total turn off for me. Ok they are easy to write but they will be slow unstable and prone to security issues. I have a websit and use to have a lot of java script applets. They were always crashing and I now have taken most off. I hadn't grasped this is what they meant by webos. Come on who are they trying to kid. Look at how apple was ridiculed when they announced the first web apps. Palm may have a slightly more sophisticated offering but it's still a second rate solution compared to a real sdk.

Palm will be facing a huge patent case so how much of their meager resources can they divert to actually supporting and developing this thing. A huge amount of their time will be spent producing documentation and handing over files.the people who worked on the ui will be ordered to make depositions which can be a lengthy process. I have been involved in a patent case and the other side has the right to see whatever documentation it sees as relevant. It is all consuming and can sap the life out of a company even if it wins the case. Most of palm will be being deposed or in court.

Then their is the hiring of former apple staff who worked on iPhone......

 

[bladehavoc]

Fair enough but I can't think of what I would want some app to notify me of, other than my calendar.

But I am not a power user either, so maybe I am just not seeing something.

IM apps, Email alerts, direct control of media apps through the notification system Palm uses, SMS and MMS, the list goes on and on even for light smartphone users.

Yes.

I know exactly what you meant.

Which is why I mentioned having an app send a calendar invite through email.

Accomplishes the same goal basically.

Bad workaround to something that apple could easily give developers access to, and feels more like that the user is doing more things than the app should be doing - and apps should be condensing and automating user actions.

How so?

I am not a developer so I don't have 3.0 yet.

It's hackish and broken because of a flawed paradigm. The badges quantify qualitative information, and require access to the springboard - only showing numbers and providing no context. Popups draw attention away from the app you're currently using and require user input to dismiss - so if multiple notifications arrive, you miss your backlog of notifications as each popup replaces the other. Both methods are hackish approaches for the flawed and dated paradigm of springboard --> expanded widget.

Why would I try that?

A) I don't have Pandora.

B) I know you can't do that, which is why I said the iPod.

But people want to use Pandora as an alternative. Saying that the Apple-provided solution is a workaround is unacceptable, as by the very nature of that statement, it's admission that the iPhone SDK is limiting.

Even notifications on the iPhone are limiting - popups bring attention from the app you're currently using and fades out the background to bring attention to the foreground. This makes popups explicitly single-tasking, removing access from the application running behind the popup, while webOS's notifications retain control of the background application while still allowing the user to interact with notifications - go to another app, control music playback inside the notification itself, etc.

 

[kas23]

I was excited about the ore but I think I will be keeping and updating my iPhone for several reasons.

The keyboard looks unconvincing and for me dates the phone. I love being able to interact with the on screen key pad. Having a seperate keyboard detached you from the experience. I find myself trying to type on my iMac screen. I am totally over keyboards.

The so called webos. This is just spin for running on a web browser and is just a total turn off for me. Ok they are easy to write but they will be slow unstable and prone to security issues. I have a websit and use to have a lot of java script applets. They were always crashing and I now have taken most off. I hadn't grasped this is what they meant by webos. Come on who are they trying to kid. Look at how apple was ridiculed when they announced the first web apps. Palm may have a slightly more sophisticated offering but it's still a second rate solution compared to a real sdk.

Palm will be facing a huge patent case so how much of their meager resources can they divert to actually supporting and developing this thing. A huge amount of their time will be spent producing documentation and handing over files.the people who worked on the ui will be ordered to make depositions which can be a lengthy process. I have been involved in a patent case and the other side has the right to see whatever documentation it sees as relevant. It is all consuming and can sap the life out of a company even if it wins the case. Most of palm will be being deposed or in court.

Then their is the hiring of former apple staff who worked on iPhone......

So, is it that you really don't like the Pre (which would be shortsighted, unless you've had the chance to use one) or are you just trying to make yourself feel better about your decision to stick with the iPhone for 2 more years?

 

[Rat-Boy]

IM apps, Email alerts, direct control of media apps through the notification system Palm uses, SMS and MMS, the list goes on and on even for light smartphone users.

iPhone can notify you of Emails, SMS and MMS so those are irrelevant.

What I wanted was a real life example of when I would want an application notify me of something while not connected to the network.

I am still not convinced that being able to have an app notify me of something while disconnected from the network is going to be of any use.

Bad workaround to something that apple could easily give developers access to, and feels more like that the user is doing more things than the app should be doing - and apps should be condensing and automating user actions.


It's hackish and broken because of a flawed paradigm. The badges quantify qualitative information, and require access to the springboard - only showing numbers and providing no context. Popups draw attention away from the app you're currently using and require user input to dismiss - so if multiple notifications arrive, you miss your backlog of notifications as each popup replaces the other. Both methods are hackish approaches for the flawed and dated paradigm of springboard --> expanded widget.

Fair enough. I actually agree that I wish Apple would have thought about making the bar at the top non-negotiable in apps so that it would always be there for this purpose.

Even notifications on the iPhone are limiting - popups bring attention from the app you're currently using and fades out the background to bring attention to the foreground. This makes popups explicitly single-tasking, removing access from the application running behind the popup, while webOS's notifications retain control of the background application while still allowing the user to interact with notifications - go to another app, control music playback inside the notification itself, etc.

Just like above, I agree that the notification pop ups are not a good way of doing it.

Personally, when I get 3.0, I will probably be turning off the pop ups and just going with sound and a badge.

And, as I have it now, all apps that can get updates will probably be on my main front page so they will be easy to get to.

I am not arguing that the notification system on the Pre stinks. I think it is better than the iPhone from what I can SEE in the videos.

 

[Night Spring]

What I wanted was a real life example of when I would want an application notify me of something while not connected to the network.

I am still not convinced that being able to have an app notify me of something while disconnected from the network is going to be of any use.

Several pages back, I gave an example of this app I use called Subway Snooze. You enter your starting point and your destination, and it alerts you when you are near your destination. Right now, you can't do anything else with your iPhone while using this app, other than listen to music. But if this app could send a notification from the background, then you could, for instance, read an ebook while on the subway, without the risk of getting so absorbed in your reading you miss your stop. Since there is often no cell signal reception inside subways, sending alerts over the network wouldn't work.

Also, most task managers and calendar apps have all the info they need to send alerts on the phone itself, it just seems very convoluted that they have to send the info to some server, then the server has to send the info back to the phone, in order to get an alert. Plus, if you happen to be somewhere without cell signal (like on a subway!) when the server tries to send an alert, you'd miss the alert, or get it too late.

Finally, iPhones may have pretty much constant network connection, but iPod Touches don't. If Apple would implement an alert system that didn't need a network connection, that would be useful on both Touch and iPhone, but by going with a system that depends on network connectivity, it leaves Touch users with a device that's severly limited in function.

 

[cwwilson]

@OP: That's sexy as hell man. I love my iPhone and am following 3.0 fairly close but if the Pre was on AT&T I'd have to REALLY give it a look. Just wished it had more space...8GB doesn't cut anymore unless you have like NO MEDIA stored on the phone. Especially when the new iPhone is surely to have 32GB. That is my only complaint with the Pre.

 

[pavvento]

After combing through this thread I am amazed by one thing, and that is the amount of you claiming you don't want to run background apps on the iPhone.

If it could be done, without killing the battery, why wouldn't you want it?

 

[Night Spring]

If it could be done, without killing the battery, why wouldn't you want it?

Apart from draining battery faster, running apps in the background could also slow down the system and/or make it unstable, more prone to bugs and crashes.

In my experience with running apps in the background on jailbroken iphone, I feel that any resulting system slowdown, unstability, and effect on battery life is within acceptable levels, considering the benefits I get out of backgrounding. Other people will of course have different standards for what they consider acceptable.

What I find frustrating is that if Apple provided a way to run background apps on the iPhone, then people who find the resulting performance degradation unacceptable could simply not run apps in the background. Seems like that should keep everyone happy. Right? Or are there some potential problems I'm not seeing?

 

[Kev1000000]

Apart from draining battery faster, running apps in the background could also slow down the system and/or make it unstable, more prone to bugs and crashes.

In my experience with running apps in the background on jailbroken iphone, I feel that any resulting system slowdown, unstability, and effect on battery life is within acceptable levels, considering the benefits I get out of backgrounding. Other people will of course have different standards for what they consider acceptable.

What I find frustrating is that if Apple provided a way to run background apps on the iPhone, then people who find the resulting performance degradation unacceptable could simply not run apps in the background. Seems like that should keep everyone happy. Right? Or are there some potential problems I'm not seeing?

Heh, and that right there my friend is Apple's conundrum. The iPhone's OS that every loves and praises is very bloated and needs a lot of resources to run. Thus, multitasking with mOSX is difficult with today's hardware.

WebOS can run with 15 different apps open at a time while still being very responsive and have no crashing. There have been a lot of reports to back this claim up from people who have had access to a Pre. The simple reason for this is that WebOS was designed from the ground up to be a mobile multitasking OS. It's very lightweight, and does not require a lot of processing power or ram itself to run, thus leaving those open resources for running apps.

 

[bladehavoc]

iPhone can notify you of Emails, SMS and MMS so those are irrelevant.

What I wanted was a real life example of when I would want an application notify me of something while not connected to the network.

I am still not convinced that being able to have an app notify me of something while disconnected from the network is going to be of any use.

Just wondering, what exactly do you have against multitasking? You admitted that the iPhone battery life sucked as it is, while the Pre's battery life bested the iPhone's. If battery life is not a concern with multitasking now, as seen with the Pre, who doesn't benefit from having multitasking? It improves app to app transitions, saving whole seconds or tens of seconds, and each app can provide a continuous stream of data to the user while running in the background, including music, IMs, etc while not compromising anything to the user's experience.

Also, apps that don't require to be connected to the internet shouldn't have to rely on the internet to notify you - for example, that app that tells you where you parked. You could be checking your online billing after coming back from the apple store in the mall (haha, poor example, I know.) and walk in the general direction while the parking app notifies you of your close proximity to your car, relying on on-device GPS.

And again, quantifying qualitative data. Pre's notifications provide much more context as to what they're notifying you of, moreso than the iPhone.

Personally, when I get 3.0, I will probably be turning off the pop ups and just going with sound and a badge.

And, as I have it now, all apps that can get updates will probably be on my main front page so they will be easy to get to.

Badges don't cut it, as I've said before. Quantifying qualitative data, and badges can be spread across multiple springboard screens.

I am not arguing that the notification system on the Pre stinks. I think it is better than the iPhone from what I can SEE in the videos.

But the notification system only works through multitasking - to see any of the complexity that palm's notifications have on the iPhone requires background processes to run, especially with music apps and media controls through the notification service.

Also, to those arguing that switching from app to app is the same process on the iPhone than a pre, there is an option on the Pre to switch between apps using the forward or backward gesture in the gesture area, jumping instantly to the adjacent open application. Bam. Saving what could be 10 seconds or higher, for something with long load times such as a complex game. Multitasking has no downsides if battery life wasn't an issue - and it apparently isn't for the pre. So cut the crap, Apple, do something about iPhone's poor multitasking.

 

[Rat-Boy]

Several pages back, I gave an example of this app I use called Subway Snooze. You enter your starting point and your destination, and it alerts you when you are near your destination. Right now, you can't do anything else with your iPhone while using this app, other than listen to music. But if this app could send a notification from the background, then you could, for instance, read an ebook while on the subway, without the risk of getting so absorbed in your reading you miss your stop. Since there is often no cell signal reception inside subways, sending alerts over the network wouldn't work.

Thank you!!

I had forgotten about this example.

And a fine one it is!

But when I use just the GPS, my battery drains pretty quick. In fact, twice when using the GPS, the back of the phone got VERY hot and I stopped using it.

Could be a defective unit but I have had no other problems with it outside of those two instances.

 

[Rat-Boy]

Just wondering, what exactly do you have against multitasking?

I don't have anything against it and I don't recall ever saying so.

I have said more than once in this thread that I would love the iPhone to have it if implemented right.

I have also said that the iPhone has some things in can do that the Pre can't that I find more valuable to ME than being able to run multiple apps at once.

Also, to those arguing that switching from app to app is the same process on the iPhone than a pre, there is an option on the Pre to switch between apps using the forward or backward gesture in the gesture area, jumping instantly to the adjacent open application. Bam. Saving what could be 10 seconds or higher, for something with long load times such as a complex game. Multitasking has no downsides if battery life wasn't an issue - and it apparently isn't for the pre. So cut the crap, Apple, do something about iPhone's poor multitasking.

Are you sure about that? In the demo video I saw, I could have sworn the guy pressed the button first to shrink the card a bit.

At any rate, with regards to the iPhone, I just don't see how they are going to implement it because I see two things with the iPhone that make it hard to implement it the way the Pre has:

1) Full Screen Games. Too many games run full screen. So where are the notifications going to go if not a pop up?

2) The swiping to change apps. Aren't there native Apple apps on this phone where the swiping from side to side does something for the app? Just as one example, when I am flipping through albums on the iPod or photos in a photo album. How does the phone differentiate between me wanting to flip albums, or flip apps?

So I think they are going to have to re-design the OS pretty much if they want it done right.

 

[kdarling]

But if this app could send a notification from the background, then you could, for instance, read an ebook while on the subway, without the risk of getting so absorbed in your reading you miss your stop.

Since there is often no cell signal reception inside subways, sending alerts over the network wouldn't work.

Sending alerts won't work for GPS apps anyway, since a remote server won't know where you are, or when you're near your destination.

Just another example of why remote notifications can't replace multitasking. Fortunately for Apple, most users seem new to smartphones and have no clue what they're missing.

 

[bladehavoc]

Are you sure about that? In the demo video I saw, I could have sworn the guy pressed the button first to shrink the card a bit.

The option is there, just not frequently demoed.

2) The swiping to change apps. Aren't there native Apple apps on this phone where the swiping from side to side does something for the app? Just as one example, when I am flipping through albums on the iPod or photos in a photo album. How does the phone differentiate between me wanting to flip albums, or flip apps?

So I think they are going to have to re-design the OS pretty much if they want it done right.

The swiping to change apps is done through the gesture area below the screen, not on the display itself, so differentiation won't happen with the current iPhone device.

 

[Rat-Boy]

Sending alerts won't work for GPS apps anyway, since a remote server won't know where you are, or when you're near your destination.

That was his point kdarling.

Just another example of why remote notifications can't replace multitasking. Fortunately for Apple, most users seem new to smartphones and have no clue what they're missing.

I am not new to them at all.

I just don't see it as a high priority for what I use my iPhone for.

I mean, my Cingular 8525 could run apps in the back ground and the thing crashed all the time because it would run out of memory and did not have a good way of telling you it had apps running.

But in the end, I guess I am just not what you would call a "power user."

 

[Rat-Boy]

The option is there, just not frequently demoed.

The swiping to change apps is done through the gesture area below the screen, not on the display itself, so differentiation won't happen with the current iPhone device.

Well..

If I were Apple designers, and I wanted to implement this, here is how I would do it.

First, lets pretend we are in la la land and the iPhone can have apps running in the background.

Right now, when you double click the home button while in an app, it takes you to where you have it set to take you.

So here is what I would change while in an application:

1) Single click closes the app.

2) Double click shrinks the app you can see the bar at the top where the clock is and the bottom row of icons. Kind of like what Safari does when you hit the far right button and shrinks its window. I would also have it put a Red Circle with a White X in the upper corner, just like in Safari, which would let you close the app from there.

3) Once you do #2, then you can scroll between open apps.

There, that would take care of the going through multiple apps.

Now, as far as notifications, that is a whole other ball of wax. Since a lot of apps are already programmed in full screen, what I would like to see is:

1) You have an option to turn off the pop ups and only get the sound notifier.

2) Once you hear a notification, while in an app, you can double click the home button to shrink the app.

3) Put the notification at the top temporarily where the clock is and have a little X to close the notification.

There, that takes care of getting notified in full screen apps.

All that is left is allowing apps themselves to notify you directly without having to use a server.

Sounds easy enough to me. LOL...

 

[needthephone]

So, is it that you really don't like the Pre (which would be shortsighted, unless you've had the chance to use one) or are you just trying to make yourself feel better about your decision to stick with the iPhone for 2 more years?

No for the REAL reasons I stated I GENUIENLY do not want a pre. Sorry the keyboard and the lightweight so called 'WebOS' just turn me off. Palm probaly have former 'New Labour' (UK politics) spin doctors working for them. They can spin a victory out of a defeat and hood winked the British people for over a decade... (sorry off topic rant but it makes my point) WebOS is like running Java applets-yuck.

The IP and the former apple Employee Non Disclosure issues are also very real for palm. I do not want to buy something which may not be supported or updated in the future. You may say that it's to justify my iphone contract but honestly it's not.

Anyway my wife will get my 3G and I will buy the new iphone 4G or whatever its called.

I am more than happy with my iphone- I love it to bits so why wold I want something which in my eyes anyway has so many flaws to replace something near perfect (in my opinion)

 

[TuffLuffJimmy]

I hope Apple takes a cue from the Prē and makes the entire face of the iPhone gesturable, not just the screen.