The way Apple handles iOS upgrades is almost criminal.

[elfary]

Spent a couple of hours on an iPhone 4s running 8.2. Oh boy when i recall the way it worked with iOS 6 i can not think that anybody would trade a few new features for all the snappiness and smoothness it has lost.

Since Apple almost forces uses to upgrade i do agree: upgrade policy is criminal.

And i'd wish that judges would force Apple to ALLOW users to downgrade to the software their device was sold with since their purchase consent was based in that level performance. I doubt that i had spent 8oo Euros on an iPhone 4s performing under iOS 8. As a lawyer i think that this EULA is unlawful if it allows Apple to force upgrades.

On a side note, iOS 8 is by far the worst firmware Apple has ever put out. Scrolling stutters even on the lead platform (iPhone 6 running iOS 8.2) on native apps like music (try landscape) or iBooks.

The software side of Apple looks pretty grim to me.

 

[TRDmanAE86]

Yes, we all understand that and agree. I don't think that excuses apple from the method in which they have people upgrade. Average user gets pop up that doesn't say anything whatsoever about it might slow down your device. They think "upgrade? cool."

5 minutes later, their device is much less efficient than if they would've ignored the upgrade request.
correct.

Yes, that Is what I am trying to crack at. Every iOS update slows down a device and, it gets to the point where our devices are so slow, where the consumers go and buy a new device! From a buesness perspective, it's a great idea. Apple does not allow downgrades because, it would prevent them from speeding up their devices, and, this would ensure that its users take longer to speed up their device.

Us as users of iOS deserve more rights. We should not have to resort to jailbreaking to downgrading our firmware or, delete bloatware for apps that are preinstalled and are never used. (example: Tips, iBooks, Apple Watch, Podcasts, Game Center, Weather, just to name a few)

Again, we cannot downgrade due to apple promoting their software and, making more money by bundling useless apps for iOS upgrades (ironically, the iPhone is always the most popular and powerful out of all of the Apple Lineup for that specific year AND, receives the most bloatware too)

 

[Tmelon]

Spent a couple of hours on an iPhone 4s running 8.2. Oh boy when i recall the way it worked with iOS 6 i can not think that anybody would trade a few new features for all the snappiness and smoothness it has lost.

Since Apple almost forces uses to upgrade i do agree: upgrade policy is criminal.

And i'd wish that judges would force Apple to ALLOW users to downgrade to the software their device was sold with since their purchase consent was based in that level performance. I doubt that i had spent 8oo Euros on an iPhone 4s performing under iOS 8. As a lawyer i think that this EULA is unlawful if it allows Apple to force upgrades.

On a side note, iOS 8 is by far the worst firmware Apple has ever put out. Scrolling stutters even on the lead platform (iPhone 6 running iOS 8.2) on native apps like music (try landscape) or iBooks.

The software side of Apple looks pretty grim to me.

The 4s is 3 and a half years old and shipped with iOS 5. From a smartphone perspective, that's ancient. Current software running slow on an old phone is to be expected. People still using old software leave their devices open to multiple security threats and Apple shouldn't be responsible for issuing patches to long outdated iOS versions. Updates require user permission before installing, they aren't forced.

 

[elfary]

The 4s is 3 and a half years old and shipped with iOS 5. From a smartphone perspective, that's ancient. Current software running slow on an old phone is to be expected. People still using old software leave their devices open to multiple security threats and Apple shouldn't be responsible for issuing patches to long outdated iOS versions. Updates require user permission before installing, they aren't forced.

What if i have to restore my iPhone?

BTW my iPhone 6 lags and stutters when scrolling on many apps and it is 3 months old.

Software wise Apple is losing me. Notr ready for prime time iOS releases are common these days.

 

[I7guy]

Yes, that Is what I am trying to crack at. Every iOS update slows down a device and, it gets to the point where our devices are so slow, where the consumers go and buy a new device! From a buesness perspective, it's a great idea. Apple does not allow downgrades because, it would prevent them from speeding up their devices, and, this would ensure that its users take longer to speed up their device.

Us as users of iOS deserve more rights. We should not have to resort to jailbreaking to downgrading our firmware or, delete bloatware for apps that are preinstalled and are never used. (example: Tips, iBooks, Apple Watch, Podcasts, Game Center, Weather, just to name a few)

Again, we cannot downgrade due to apple promoting their software and, making more money by bundling useless apps for iOS upgrades (ironically, the iPhone is always the most popular and powerful out of all of the Apple Lineup for that specific year AND, receives the most bloatware too)

Bloatware depends on your definition. I have used all of the apps you have listed as bloatware.

In my opinion if you want more rights than you have to vote with your wallet and conscientious.

 

[C DM]

The 4s is 3 and a half years old and shipped with iOS 5. From a smartphone perspective, that's ancient. Current software running slow on an old phone is to be expected. People still using old software leave their devices open to multiple security threats and Apple shouldn't be responsible for issuing patches to long outdated iOS versions. Updates require user permission before installing, they aren't forced.

Then Apple shouldn't be releasing as many newer versions for older hardware where the performance isn't going to be good.

As for patches or anything like that, no one is asking Apple to do it if they don't want to, just leave the last major version update signed.

 

[I7guy]

Then Apple shouldn't be releasing as many newer versions for older hardware where the performance isn't going to be good.

As for patches or anything like that, no one is asking Apple to do it if they don't want to, just leave the last major version update signed.

It's not what we think they should do, it's what they do.

 

[Lankyman]

Bloatware depends on your definition. I have used all of the apps you have listed as bloatware.

In my opinion if you want more rights than you have to vote with your wallet and conscientious.

Absolutely, which is why I will be adding to my Android stable from now on not Apple's

----------

The 4s is 3 and a half years old and shipped with iOS 5. From a smartphone perspective, that's ancient. Current software running slow on an old phone is to be expected. People still using old software leave their devices open to multiple security threats and Apple shouldn't be responsible for issuing patches to long outdated iOS versions. Updates require user permission before installing, they aren't forced.

Why have you become an apologist for a company which is blatantly wringing every last penny out of it's loyal customers. Just because they lift your wallet with a smile doesn't make it any more acceptable.

 

[I7guy]

Absolutely, which is why I will be adding to my Android stable from now on not Apple's

----------



Why have you become an apologist for a company which is blatantly wringing every last penny out of it's loyal customers. Just because they lift your wallet with a smile doesn't make it any more acceptable.

It's a no win situation for Apple. Less releases mean the competition walks over Apple. Releases for newer devices only will alienate their user base. Supporting older releases causes their developers more headaches. So I think Apple picked the path of least resistance.

 

[TRDmanAE86]

Bloatware depends on your definition. I have used all of the apps you have listed as bloatware.

In my opinion if you want more rights than you have to vote with your wallet and conscientious.

The apps I consider bloatware are different than the ones you consider.

Even with my multiple devices, I want sometimes different apps on different devices due to capacity, style, and speed of my device.

For example, I would not mind having, Game Center and Podcasts on my iPod. However, If I were to update my 16 gig iPhone, I would not want apps that I do not use on it normally (remember its a 16 gig) like Podcasts, iBooks, Apple Watch and Game Center due to never ever using them.

Finally when it comes to iBooks, I love the old version 3.2.3. It was the last version with the old "Steve Jobs design" and the wooden bookshelf. I did not update that app on purpose even with iOS 7 on my iPad Air. With iOS 8, it comes preinstalled with the new Jony Ives material design.

On top of stripping out the wooden bookshelf UI, it has been dulled down, it glitches even more than the older retired version. And for a App that I use every day on my iPad, I need reliability and design or else, I will not be as efficient working.


That is the main reason I am upset. Some apps I use a lot (on my iPad) but, don't put them on my other devices because of either space restrictions and/or they slow my device down.

 

[fardeenah]

even the calculator app takes an extra sec to open on the 4s compares to 7.1.2. this is criminal! new software updates should perform faster if not the same as previous one

 

[I7guy]

The apps I consider bloatware are different than the ones you consider.

Even with my multiple devices, I want sometimes different apps on different devices due to capacity, style, and speed of my device.

For example, I would not mind having, Game Center and Podcasts on my iPod. However, If I were to update my 16 gig iPhone, I would not want apps that I do not use on it normally (remember its a 16 gig) like Podcasts, iBooks, Apple Watch and Game Center due to never ever using them.

Finally when it comes to iBooks, I love the old version 3.2.3. It was the last version with the old "Steve Jobs design" and the wooden bookshelf. I did not update that app on purpose even with iOS 7 on my iPad Air. With iOS 8, it comes preinstalled with the new Jony Ives material design.

On top of stripping out the wooden bookshelf UI, it has been dulled down, it glitches even more than the older retired version. And for a App that I use every day on my iPad, I need reliability and design or else, I will not be as efficient working.


That is the main reason I am upset. Some apps I use a lot (on my iPad) but, don't put them on my other devices because of either space restrictions and/or they slow my device down.

I agree with you that iPad 2 and iPhone 5s each have a separate universe of apps. I segregate apps based on usage of each device. Given my iPad 2 cpu is not as fast as my 5s cup I'm happy it's as snappy as it is.

As far as iBooks, I disliked the old wooden theme, way too ongepatshket.

 

[Tmelon]

Why have you become an apologist for a company which is blatantly wringing every last penny out of it's loyal customers. Just because they lift your wallet with a smile doesn't make it any more acceptable.

That's a ridiculous exaggeration. Apple either cuts off a device from getting updates and people whine that they "criminally" didn't release it in order to force people to upgrade or they release the update that can't run as well and people still whine that Apple is forcing them to upgrade their phone.

Apple ideally wants 100% of iPhone users to be on the same iOS version for the sake of consistency for developers and avoiding the fragmentation that plagued Android for multiple years.

Apple is a company, not your friend. They aren't stealing your money; you're willingly buying their product knowing exactly what that entails.

 

[C DM]

That's a ridiculous exaggeration. Apple either cuts off a device from getting updates and people whine that they "criminally" didn't release it in order to force people to upgrade or they release the update that can't run as well and people still whine that Apple is forcing them to upgrade their phone.

Apple ideally wants 100% of iPhone users to be on the same iOS version for the sake of consistency for developers and avoiding the fragmentation that plagued Android for multiple years.

Apple is a company, not your friend. They aren't stealing your money; you're willingly buying their product knowing exactly what that entails.

Continuing what they are doing and simply leaving the last update from the previous major version as signed would not noticeably affect any of that or really anything else at all.

 

[sunking101]

Continuing what they are doing and simply leaving the last update from the previous major version as signed would not noticeably affect any of that or really anything else at all.

Exactly. Apple are well aware that all iPhone 4 users out there aren't on iOS8, not to mention 4S, i5 and 5S owners who didn't fancy it.

 

[Lankyman]

That's a ridiculous exaggeration. Apple either cuts off a device from getting updates and people whine that they "criminally" didn't release it in order to force people to upgrade or they release the update that can't run as well and people still whine that Apple is forcing them to upgrade their phone.

Apple ideally wants 100% of iPhone users to be on the same iOS version for the sake of consistency for developers and avoiding the fragmentation that plagued Android for multiple years.

Apple is a company, not your friend. They aren't stealing your money; you're willingly buying their product knowing exactly what that entails.

Your argument might have some merit if users were able to upgrade, then if it doesn't play well on your device downgrade again within a time frame measured in say 3 months not a matter of a few days as Apple are doing presently.

To upgrade then find your device crippled with no possibility of reverting back is not playing fair with the consumer. That is a cynical decision taken by Apple.

 

[I7guy]

Continuing what they are doing and simply leaving the last update from the previous major version as signed would not noticeably affect any of that or really anything else at all.

That statement should be vetted out with apple before offering it up as internet truth to get their side of the story.

 

[TRDmanAE86]

Cat and mouse

Your argument might have some merit if users were able to upgrade, then if it doesn't play well on your device downgrade again within a time frame measured in say 3 months not a matter of a few days as Apple are doing presently.

To upgrade then find your device crippled with no possibility of reverting back is not playing fair with the consumer. That is a cynical decision taken by Apple.

Spot on! Imagine how many people would still be running iOS 7 the second they upgraded to iOS 8? Now, it's a hit or miss and, rely on test subjects to ensure you do not update to a iOS software that cripples your device.

 

[mspman]

That's a ridiculous exaggeration.

Apple ideally wants 100% of iPhone users to be on the same iOS version for the sake of consistency for developers and avoiding the fragmentation that plagued Android for multiple years.

Apple is a company, not your friend. They aren't stealing your money; you're willingly buying their product knowing exactly what that entails.

But it's not, and your second sentence is what's telling my why.

Apple ideally wants 100% of iPhone users to be on the same iOS version for the sake of profits. It has nothing to do with developers or users. As you say in your third paragraph, they are a company, not your friend. Their primary purpose in life is to return value to shareholders. They care about the customers, but only because if they tick them off then they won't be able to return as much money to shareholders. Everything they do, every decision they make, is to that end.

I don't think it's off base to say that Apple, along with other smartphone manufacturers, have set the upgrade cycle for 2 years with their software updates. This drives sales projections, which drives timetables, which drives advertising, etc. The entire business model has become predicated on an upgrade cycle dictated by the manufacturers themselves and maximized for... shareholder value. They don't care that iOS 8 is buggy because it does not impact sales. If sales were being impacted, then they'd fix it.

In fact, they're probably licking their chops at this because iOS 7/8 were so buggy that people will be looking to upgrade sooner than 2yrs.

 

[Tmelon]

But it's not, and your second sentence is what's telling my why.

Apple ideally wants 100% of iPhone users to be on the same iOS version for the sake of profits. It has nothing to do with developers or users. As you say in your third paragraph, they are a company, not your friend. Their primary purpose in life is to return value to shareholders. They care about the customers, but only because if they tick them off then they won't be able to return as much money to shareholders. Everything they do, every decision they make, is to that end.

I don't think it's off base to say that Apple, along with other smartphone manufacturers, have set the upgrade cycle for 2 years with their software updates. This drives sales projections, which drives timetables, which drives advertising, etc. The entire business model has become predicated on an upgrade cycle dictated by the manufacturers themselves and maximized for... shareholder value. They don't care that iOS 8 is buggy because it does not impact sales. If sales were being impacted, then they'd fix it.

In fact, they're probably licking their chops at this because iOS 7/8 were so buggy that people will be looking to upgrade sooner than 2yrs.

I certainly don't think that a purposely buggy OS is anywhere on their business plan, especially when many of the iOS 8 complaints are coming from 6 and 6 plus users who just upgraded. Rumors of iOS 9 say it will involve a huge amount of speed tweaks and bug fixing and just a week ago Apple indirectly acknowledged the growing irritation with bugs when they announced the public beta program.

 

[TRDmanAE86]

I certainly don't think that a purposely buggy OS is anywhere on their business plan, especially when many of the iOS 8 complaints are coming from 6 and 6 plus users who just upgraded. Rumors of iOS 9 say it will involve a huge amount of speed tweaks and bug fixing and just a week ago Apple indirectly acknowledged the growing irritation with bugs when they announced the public beta program.

The beta program is a great idea. Unfortinetly, Apple has yearly updates that are still rushed. It's like the patch and pray concept for fixing bridges. Apple patches the small cracks and, leaves the entire problem unresolved for months at a time!

Finally, why is Apple's sales records so high? its because their phones go quicker than they used to. I believe that people used to upgrade their iPhones every 4-3 years. Now, its every other year due to the issues dated software has. It's like Apple builds its products to expire and, expect its customers to buy another one.

 

[Tmelon]

its because their phones go quicker than they used to. I believe that people used to upgrade their iPhones every 4-3 years. Now, its every other year due to the issues dated software has. It's like Apple builds its products to expire and, expect its customers to buy another one.

I wouldn't say that is just Apple. The entire smartphone industry is that way.

 

[elfary]

So criminal that it will push me out of Apple eventually. Feel mistreated. I do not want to upgrade iPhones every year and a half. If they want me to upgrade just release a jaw dropping iPhone not slow down my old one.

TBH i would be perfectly happy with an iPhone 4s on iOS 6 (Snappy and more reliable that anything on iOS 8 -the iOS that ruined the seamless scrolling-).

 

[alp00]

I find it surprising that simple tasks like opening the settings or phone or notes or photos or typing on the keyboard seem to get slower.
Settings is a fixed screen with options stored in the phone, it should be instant.

Maybe the answer is not to upgrade, I think more people will be cautious in future.

 

[TRDmanAE86]

So criminal that it will push me out of Apple eventually. Feel mistreated. I do not want to upgrade iPhones every year and a half. If they want me to upgrade just release a jaw dropping iPhone not slow down my old one.

Same. The upgrade time is too short. Software development is rushed and, the remaining time is abused. Apple should start software updates 2 years ahead of their release.

With any product , it is wrong to make a half asked product that breaks easily. My previous phone (my first one ever)lasted 4 years before the phone battery was shot. It survived a washer cycle too! eek:) A iPhone, iPad, and iPod Touch would not function after little exposure to rain! It is absurd! (in argument to my 4S, I had to have it replaced with a refirbished one after my father threw my out of the box 4S at the wall and, shot the power button)

Yeah, it's a beauty. I am astounded with the way it works. It may have a shot battery and too small storage slace but, in the end, optimism makes the soul. I'm not complaining about my iPhone but, anything iOS 7 and up. It's at the point now where I don't like the new Apple and refuse to upgrade their products.