Thunderbolt 3 Ports on Right Side of 13-Inch MacBook Pro Have Reduced PCI Express Bandwidth

[solipsism]

Not really as Intel doesn't have a significantly faster chip in the pipeline for next year...

Don't you know that Apple is out to screw you over so any ridiculous conspiracy theory said online has to be true or you get attacked for making a reasonable comment?

Exhibit A: without any consideration for which Kaby Lake chips can be used in the MBP:

Kaby Lake is already in production, mate.

 

[diddl14]

Kaby Lake is already in production, mate.

Yes, that's what I meant with a not significantly faster chip.

 

[lysingur]

Don't you know that Apple is out to screw you over so any ridiculous conspiracy theory said online has to be true or you get attacked for making a reasonable comment?

Exhibit A: without any consideration for which Kaby Lake chips can be used in the MBP:

My point is a new chip is already available and I never said which. Again, stop imagining things.

 

[tkatz]

Kaby Lake is already in production, mate.

Can you link to a currently available 4 core Kaby Lake mobile cpu that competes with the chips in the new MBP's?

 

[MacHiavelli]

They could have, and that would have been a decent, short term solution, but I guess you're not familiar with the company called Apple or why they feel it's best to go all-in on certain solutions. Hint: It involves pulling the rest of the industry into the modern age faster. Just imagine if Apple simply kept adding new ports an never getting rid of old ports. You don't realize it, but you're computing experience is better because of hard choices Apple has made, like going all-in with USB-A which forced the hands of all the other OEMs.

Like ditching the headphone jack one month and then reusing it on a new product one month later?

Like going for lightening on one device and UCB C on another?

Like dissing and replacing the function keys on one model of the same device and then reinstating them in another model of the same device?

Like having discordant colours across the MacBook range?

Like having four identical ports that have different functionality?

You're standing on quicksand, holding an enormous anvil.

 

[lysingur]

Yes, that's what I meant with a not significantly faster chip.

And I hope you're not implying that not having a faster chip is MBP 2016's only problem.

 

[KPOM]

Most likely it'll miss their own sales target for the rest of 2016 and the first quarter of 2017. My guess is a new MBP is already in the pipeline with specs that match the price tag.

I doubt we'll see major changes. We might see a price drop. Apple has precedent for that. But apart from adding Kaby Lake in a press release update a year from now I don't see what else Apple would realistically do. They won't go back and add legacy ports and they are waiting for AMD to make major improvements to the dGPU in the 15".

It's already presold through December on the website. We may see some supplies in stores but Q1-17 will be the real test once the supply chain is full.

 

[erzhik]

It seems that Apple really doesn't care about MBP anymore. Not only did they make us wait, they also gave us a half-assed, overpriced product, with an added gimmick just to "wow" 12 year olds. This is a pathetic attempt.

 

[lysingur]

Can you link to a currently available 4 core Kaby Lake mobile cpu that competes with the chips in the new MBP's?

I fail to see your point really. Saying Kaby Lake is in production just means there's already a better chip available. Why "currently" and what does having a "currently available" Kaby Lake have to do with anything?

 

[cdarlington1]

Same for the MacPro. Not surprised.

 

[diddl14]

And I hope you're not implying that not having a faster chip is MBP 2016's only problem.

Hope whatever you want. Just don't expect it to be significantly faster with the next intel chip.

 

[fourthtunz]

Believe me. The voting has already begun. There's a huge slap in the face coming Apple's way. Let's talk in 2 years and see how this MBP 2016 snafu has worked in Apple's favour. If they don't bow to users' will in the next iteration of MBP or try to make amends, 2016 is going to be remembered as a watershed year.

Things are going to be interesting for sure!
Mac sales being at their lowest in years must have something to do
with the lack of change in the mac lineup? and then this kind of milquetoast MacBook pro?
It might be Apple waited on the other macs to see what microsloth was going to do?
I for one bought a 2012 Mac and put an SSD in it..got all the ports and a DVD drive
Yes, I for one believe that the voting has been happening over the last 4 years and we
are going to see more... Apple is not doomed but I don't think Tim and CO get
Macs at all.

 

[cerberusss]

Disappointed no Rose Gold option.

Or even a gold one. Would've loved it!

 

[lysingur]

But apart from adding Kaby Lake in a press release update a year from now I don't see what else Apple would realistically do.

Someone in this thread posted a list of complaints about the MBP 2016. Maybe you should check it out.

 

[tkatz]

I doubt we'll see major changes. We might see a price drop. Apple has precedent for that. But apart from adding Kaby Lake in a press release update a year from now I don't see what else Apple would realistically do. They won't go back and add legacy ports and they are waiting for AMD to make major improvements to the dGPU in the 15".

It's already presold through December on the website. We may see some supplies in stores but Q1-17 will be the real test once the supply chain is full.

My biggest gripe is the ATI graphics. I bought into the OpenCL thing with the 2013 Mac Pro and so far only Apple has really embraced it. Thats good and all but everything else I use either works better or only with CUDA so I'd prefer an nVidia option. I do like my physical row of escape + F keys, so a 15" model without the touchbar would be nice. 32gb option would also be nice (either at the expense of battery life, or with an updated Kaby Lake chipset + DDR4 when the necessary cpus are available).

 

[solipsism]

Like ditching the headphone jack one month and then reusing it on a new product one month later?

I didn't realize there was a space constraint on the MBP that would make the 3.5mm jack greatly affect improving and adding components to the Mac.

Technically, anything that takes up space will have some affect on the design, but you're really stretching to claim that this has had a negative affect on the MBP. And I bet you'd whine even more if they had replaced the 3.5mm jack with a Lighting port for audio on the MBP.

Like going for lightening on one device and UCB C on another?

No idea what that means. Are you saying that the new MBPs should be powered by Lightning cables?

Like dissing and replacing the function keys on one model of the same device and then reinstating them in another model of the same device?

You means the entry-level, budget 13" MBP that is replacing the MBA? You have a problem with that? Come on!

BTW, it only has 2x USB-C port. *gasp*

Like having discordant colours across the MacBook range?

No Rose Gold MBP? The sky is falling!

Like having four identical ports that have different functionality?

If you understand how the controllers work you'd be happy that it comes with 4x USB-C and not only 2.

You're standing on quicksand, holding an enormous anvil.

And soon I'll be holding my brilliant new MBP that will speed up my work performance to a point that it'll pay for itself 10-20x over per annum. Good luck to you.

 

[KPOM]

What's so hard to comprehend? When you're dropping thousands of dollars on a "pro" laptop that ships with substandard hardware just so it can be a little lighter and a litter thinner you should not also be asked to drop even more on dongles so you can use your existing accessories that happen to make use of industry standard ports.

You can not take an iPhone 7 or iPad Pro and connect it to these new machines without a dongle. If that isn't the very definition of stupid I don't know what is.

Apple is out of the laptop and desktop business. They are in the botique computer business. You get to vastly over pay for substandard hardware that looks great and costs an arm and a leg and isn't compatible with most of your industry standard accessories.

Thanks but no thanks. I'll grab a Dell that costs $1000 less with better hardware and industry standard ports.

Apple has jumped the shark. OS X is a better OS but it's not worth an extra $1000.

What is substandard about any of the technology in the 2016 MacBooks? They are using the latest available processors (apart from the 13" without Touch Bar), have the fastest SSDs on the consumer market, have wide gamut displays, and 4 sets of the most advanced I/O port on the market.

You don't need a "dongle" to connect to an iPhone 7 or iPad Pro. First off, those devices connect wirelessly now. Second, there are USB-C to Lightning cables if you want a faster connection.

USB-C IS an industry standard port. It's just the latest version. Apple wants to move the market forward, so just like they did in 1998, they have fully embraced the latest standard and aren't looking back.

People made your arguments when Apple dropped the DVD drive and the Ethernet port from the outgoing MacBook Pro ("A PRO needs optical drives and a physical connection and can lug around a 5.5 lbs notebook. Why is Apple so obsessed with making a thinner MacBook Pro?"). It was an old argument in 2012, and is an old argument in 2016.

 

[ZMacintosh]

why can't they create an actual PRO 13-inch MacBook? with a nice CPU (quad core) and a dedicated GPU?

 

[manu chao]

Kaby Lake is already in production, mate.

Sometimes it is hard to figure out whether this display of ignorance is wilful or real. Take a guess what processor generation the new Surface computers from Microsoft released this week use.

 

[Mac 128]

And where is the dock plugged into?

I stated pretty clearly that they have their own power supplies. I don't charge devices off of my MBP typically, that's the whole point. As I stated, I don't tend to plug in my MBP unless I intend to charge it, and charging my iPhone during that time, only slows down the process. When I do use my MBP in extended use connected to a power supply, I chose not to get in the habit of charging my iPhone off of it, and instead use its separate power cube that I also carry everywhere I go. It's nice to have options, and if I found I ever needed to do that, I'd buy the cable or adapter I needed.

For the time being, I find the Lightning charging cable included with the iPhone 7 far more useful in far more places than the rare exception where I might need to plug it into my MBP, a situation I can't actually imagine for my own use case.

 

[solipsism]

My point is a new chip is already available and I never said which. Again, stop imagining things.

Oh, I know your point, hence my comment.

You pooh-pooh Apple for planning for future product releases with yet unreleased chips without considering the necessary lead time for sourcing, engineering and testing. Even if the next update is simply a spec bump, they need to plan for this before it gets mass produced and comes to market. How you don't understand this is beyond me.

Then you made an erroneous claim that because Intel has certain Kaby Lake products available that they have the exact Kaby Like products with the right power-envelopes for Apple's needs and in high enough quantity for this 2016 MBP release. They don't.

 

[MacHiavelli]

I didn't realize there was a space constraint on the MBP that would make the 3.5mm jack greatly affect improving and adding components to the Mac.

Technically, anything that takes up space will have some affect on the design, but you're really stretching to claim that this has had a negative affect on the MBP. And I bet you'd whine even more if they had replaced the 3.5mm jack with a Lighting port for audio on the MBP.



No idea what that means. Are you saying that the new MBPs should be powered by Lightning cables?



You means the entry-level, budget 13" MBP that is replacing the MBA? You have a problem with that? Come on!

BTW, it only has 2x USB-C port. *gasp*



No Rose Gold MBP? The sky is falling!



If you understand how the controllers work you'd be happy that it comes with 4x USB-C and not only 2.



And soon I'll be holding my brilliant new MBP that will speed up my work performance to a point that it'll pay for itself 10-20x over per annum. Good luck to you.

You contradict yourself repeatedly. Make fallacious and spurious wafflings. But cool. Each to their own.

 

[KPOM]

My biggest gripe is the ATI graphics. I bought into the OpenCL thing with the 2013 Mac Pro and so far only Apple has really embraced it. Thats good and all but everything else I use either works better or only with CUDA so I'd prefer an nVidia option. I do like my physical row of escape + F keys, so a 15" model without the touchbar would be nice. 32gb option would also be nice (either at the expense of battery life, or with an updated Kaby Lake chipset + DDR4 when the necessary cpus are available).

Yes, they made a decision to partner with AMD and that has held them back.

Waiting for Kaby Lake would have pushed the release back at least a quarter, and likely longer. Apple hasn't released the newest Intel chips on the bleeding edge for quite a while now, and I'm guessing that last year's issues with Intel graphics drivers on Skylake chips (remember the crashing issues on the original Surface Book?) will make them wary. Processor upgrades have been minor as of late, so being a few months late to the processor party doesn't hurt them as much.

 

[lysingur]

Oh, I know your point, hence my comment.

You pooh-pooh Apple for planning for future product releases with yet unreleased chips without considering the necessary lead time for sourcing, engineering and testing. Even if the next update is simply a spec bump, they need to plan for this before it gets mass produced and comes to market. How you don't understand this is beyond me.

Then you made an erroneous claim that because Intel has certain Kaby Lake products available that they have the exact Kaby Like products with the right power-envelopes for Apple's needs and in high enough quantity for this 2016 MBP release. They don't.

Again, stop imagining things or putting words in my mouth. Read what I said, then get back to me. Otherwise, enjoy your own monologue.

 

[solipsism]

why can't they create an actual PRO 13-inch MacBook? with a nice CPU (quad core) and a dedicated GPU?

They can, but that would require certain changes to the overall design that Apple doesn't want to do. For instance, I'd bet that it has to be larger for the higher thermals, use a 2nd fan and larger heat sync, and a larger battery to maintain the same duration on a single charge.

My anecdotal experience with users of the 13" MBP are those that aren't crunching a lot of data. I don't know anyone who's using Adobe, Xcode, Final Cut Pro, etc. on a 13" Mac; and most of them would prefer to have a 17" MBP. Hell, the weight and volume is down low enough that I'd finally be in the market for a 17" MBP.

Unfortunately the number of users to fit these "fringe" needs are deemed too low for Apple. We don't have to like it, but we do have to accept it.