Tile Adds Undetectable Anti-Theft Mode to Tracking Devices, With $1 Million Fine If Used for Stalking

[MobiusStrip]

It's just asinine to think something's "junk" because you want to use it in a way that it was not intended and it doesn't work.

Ah yes, the old "you're holding it wrong" excuse. A favorite of apologists everywhere; especially Apple ones.

He's right, and you know it. Not to mention that AirTags stupidly make noise even when I'm traveling WITH them. I have one hidden in my vehicle, and every time I leave home IN the vehicle with my iPhone, it starts chirping right behind me. Now I'm going to break it open and disable the noisemaker. But WTF, talk about dumb.

 

[Phil108]

Here’s an idea. Go ahead and enable this mode, but only after a week of no movement at all. So you put it in a storage box or in with your valuables in your house, but the tracking doesn’t begin for a week of non-movement. This should make it impractical for stalking.

Not sure if this was trolling, but for a few seconds I thought "wow, yea, that's the solution"

 

[Phil108]

Many issues with this...

1. A vindictive ex gets a hold of your anti-theft Tile and claims they "found" it and accuses you of stalking.

Oh boy, yes this is gonna happen...

 

[yellowbunny]

Time to replace the AirTag in my ebike!

 

[TechnoMonk]

A quick google search is more relevant than Netflix

One case among millions of stalking victims. The real tragedy here is marketing it as solution to serious problem.

Forget google just use DOJ or FBI or official police stats.

Stalking Victimization, 2019

bjs.ojp.gov

https://www.justice.gov/sites/default/files/ovw/legacy/2012/08/15/bjs-stalking-rpt.pdf

Most states in US don’t classify stalking as felony, on first or second offense. Look at page 3 and 9 of the report in second link. Less than 8% of reported cases result in an arrest, and far less conviction rate. Most states require showing harm to victim.
The stalking has been a problem well before AirTags, look at official stats, biggest tracking device for stalking is video/social media. Less than 10% of monitoring was done with GPS trackers. It’s hard to put people in prison or deny bail when the offense isn’t even considered felony.

 

[steve09090]

Ah yes, the old "you're holding it wrong" excuse. A favorite of apologists everywhere; especially Apple ones.

He's right, and you know it. Not to mention that AirTags stupidly make noise even when I'm traveling WITH them. I have one hidden in my vehicle, and every time I leave home IN the vehicle with my iPhone, it starts chirping right behind me. Now I'm going to break it open and disable the noisemaker. But WTF, talk about dumb.

User error? Never had that as an issue. Did you following the instructions in setting it up?

Other than being black, has anyone mentioned that they more or less copied Apple’ visual design?

 

[Danfango]

I’m not sure why I would buy a product with a $1 million dollar lawsuit mentioned in the T&C.

 

[d686546s]

Ah yes, the old "you're holding it wrong" excuse. A favorite of apologists everywhere; especially Apple ones.

"You're holding it wrong" usually denounces problems people have with a product while using it for its intended purpose in a pretty regular way.

But Apple never claimed that AirTags would be a good way to keep track of stolen property. In fact you're running into safeguards that were put there very deliberately to prevent people tracking other people without their knowledge and consent.

If not undermines the ability to find your lost or misplaced stuff, now that's an entirely different conversation.

 

[cicalinarrot]

They may have talked with some random policemen, with marketing experts, with lawyers… don’t think they talked with associations that actually deal with stalking.
I can hardly picture anyone carefully reading terms and conditions and thinking “oh no! I don’t have a million bucks, my plan to throw acid on my ex’s face is ruined!”

 

[d686546s]

They may have talked with some random policemen, with marketing experts, with lawyers… don’t think they talked with associations that actually deal with stalking.
I can hardly picture anyone carefully reading terms and conditions and thinking “oh no! I don’t have a million bucks, my plan to throw acid on my ex’s face is ruined!”

Nothing will ever deter every motivated criminal or whatever state of mind people are in who want to stalk someone.

I agree with those here who think that the very clear ties to your real identity should act as a deterrent to some, but I also think there's plenty of room to try to abuse the system and harm someone by falsely claiming to being tracked (the vindictive partner example above). How prevalent this will actually be in practice -- or how convincing these cases are -- is anyone's guess.

 

[Quu]

This is great and will definitely work because Stalkers are incredibly logical people who always adhere to all social norms, contracts and laws.

 

[Reggaenald]

Definitely a scare tactic because being caught at this point is up to how well one hides it.

I’d guess you don’t need to hide it, because it’s already hidden. You just shouldn’t draw suspicion onto yourself. Like always. LE might just check your tile locations because you’re possibly connected to some thing. And then you’re done.

 

[fhall1]

Just more time in jail waiting for trial then. People are still getting arrested for all kinds of things. Police aren't taking a vacation until the trial queue goes down.

Except in bail reform states. No one goes to jail anymore, they get an appearance ticket.

 

[RickDEGH]

What if somebody steals my Tile and uses it to “stalk” someone? How could they possibly prove that it wasn’t stolen from me and planted on someone without my knowledge? Ridiculous.

If someone steals your Tile, track them before they use it to “stalk someone”! That shouldn’t take weeks or months.

 

[RalfTheDog]

What they’re doing doesn’t even sound legal.

What if somebody steals my Tile and uses it to “stalk” someone? How could they possibly prove that it wasn’t stolen from me and planted on someone without my knowledge? Ridiculous.

If it was stolen, you would see it going around town without you and you would report it stolen.

LOL, this is like saying carrying guns is illegal and expecting all criminals to leave theirs at home. Not gonna happen.

I don’t think it would be difficult for Tile to demonstrate harm to their brand and a revenue loss based on the publicity that goes along with this sort of thing. Add in that the bad guy separately and beyond the standard TOS entered into an agreement to not use their product nefariously, I don’t think it’s as laughable as you think.

This is all hype designed to beat air tags. I’d like to see them try and enforce that million dollar fine.

It seems teh stalker needs to be convicted before tile will “fine” you.
As above, Tile would have to sue for reputational damages. Which will be like getting blood from a stone.
Also, the magistrate will end up taking into account that Tile will be going to the culprit in a “the process is the punishment” way, and seek to adjust penalty accordingly. Because the magistrate cares for the crim.

To all of the above comments and many more, it's not actually a fine. It is a contract violation. When you put the device in "Stalker mode" you are effectively signing a contract saying that if you do use it to stalk, you owe the money. In reality, most people convicted will just be forced into bankruptcy or wind up paying small payments for life.

 

[unregbaron]

Tile will never receive $1m from anyone convicted of staking with this device.

 

[leman]

To all of the above comments and many more, it's not actually a fine. It is a contract violation. When you put the device in "Stalker mode" you are effectively signing a contract saying that if you do use it to stalk, you owe the money. In reality, most people convicted will just be forced into bankruptcy or wind up paying small payments for life.

In most civilised countries arbitrary contract provisions are not enforceable. Just because you signed something doesn't mean that it has any legal power, especially in an asymmetric business relationship.

 

[baryon]

I'm sure people would love to potentially get sued for 1 million dollars should this thing get misplaced or accidentally end up in someone's trunk or bag by accident.

 

[NightFox]

What if somebody steals my Tile and uses it to “stalk” someone? How could they possibly prove that it wasn’t stolen from me and planted on someone without my knowledge? Ridiculous.

They would also have needed to have access to your account (via 2-factor authentication) to track it though - that would shift the balance of probability in a civil action.

 

[NightFox]

This just goes to highlight how limiting Airtags are. They're only good for findling lost items, but are worthless for something that is stolen.

One example if an item is moved when it has been sitting still and away from the linked phone, it beeps. Completely the wrong approach. If a theif moves the item wtih an AirTag on it, the AirTag literally lets them know where the AirTag is hidden. Instead it should give a silent alert to the associated phone so th owner knows something has been moved. How dumb can Apple be?

Then there is the well know feature that alerts someone if an AirTag is moving with them that is not their AirTag. Great for anyone concerned about stalking, but then it cannot be used at all to help recover lost items from a thief.

Therefore after initally buying a three pack of Air Tags, I won't but them again. They are mostly junk.

But from the outset Apple were clear in their marketing material that AirTags were not intended as an anti-theft device. Yet people just bought them blind and still complain to this day.

 

[Solomani]

I’m not sure why I would buy a product with a $1 million dollar lawsuit mentioned in the T&C.

Exactly. The 1 million dollar fine thing is a stupid PR marketing stunt for Tile.

 

[7149041]

In other News, Glock will now fine you $1.000.000.000.000.000.000.000 if you use their gun to shoot up a school.

 

[GraXXoR]

Can I just “tag” a $1,000,000 clause on to my non returned hardware policy? So if a customer does not return one of my laptops by Monday at 8:53 (those last 7 minutes will sure earn me a few extra bucks) I can fine them $1,000,000?

 

[willyx]

Tile's location range is crap for stalking anyway, 400 feet max

 

[dentontay]

To everyone who says 'this is not enforceable', it will cost you to defend. A lot. If you are a higher net worth individual, maybe retired or well off with assets, all Tile has to do is get a judgement against you in court, and your assets can be seized and liens put against your property. I haven't read that the money will go to victims, either. Tile just gets to keep the money? Brilliant corporate strategy. It's no longer worth the risk to own any Tile product. I hope no one signs up for this crap.

What's next, a computer company asking you to pay a million dollar fine if you download anything illegal?