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Waiting for Haswell MBP Mega Thread

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adjeff8 said:
I read so many conflicting things, most of this talk is beyond me anyways. I'll just have to wait for the announcement, release and tear down then have you guys explain it to me. One thing that is for sure, it'll be a world apart from my 2009 15" duo core MBP, which spends most of its time displaying the rainbow circle of death
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integrated graphics will not be as good as current discrete graphics (650M+) for a few years yet. Even Iris Pro will not be close to the 650M. Thereofore, removing the 650M and adding just Iris Pro would result in worse perfomance for the 15", even though up to 100% improvement for the 13".
 
B... said:
integrated graphics will not be as good as current discrete graphics (650M+) for a few years yet. Even Iris Pro will not be close to the 650M. Thereofore, removing the 650M and adding just Iris Pro would result in worse perfomance for the 15", even though up to 100% improvement for the 13".
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I agree completely.

And just to add on to this, we must not forget that the current 650m has 1GB of fast GDDR5 dedicated memory. The Iris Pro on the other hand has only 128MB of dedicated eDRAM and the rest of its graphics memory is made up of the much slower shared system memory.

That just cannot compete with the 650m - It would be madness for Apple to abandon a discreet card in favour of Intels integrated Iris Pro based on the memory situation alone before we start looking at computational performance of the GPU itself.
 
Quu said:
I agree completely.

And just to add on to this, we must not forget that the current 650m has 1GB of fast GDDR5 dedicated memory. The Iris Pro on the other hand has only 128MB of dedicated eDRAM and the rest of its graphics memory is made up of the much slower shared system memory.

That just cannot compete with the 650m - It would be madness for Apple to abandon a discreet card in favour of Intels integrated Iris Pro based on the memory situation alone before we start looking at computational performance of the GPU itself.
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But did I read that there could be two options? A discreet and a intergrated?
 
We believe that e.g. Nvidia Geforce GT 640M will be able to stand its ground fairly well against Intel Iris Pro 5200 in most tests and most likely be the faster of the two in most games. But just the fact that Intel is mentioned in the same sentence as otherwise relatively powerful chips from AMD and Nvidia is a development we could not have imagined a few years back.

So 640M still a bit better than HD 5200, but is nice and praise intel for his graphics ascension in the last 2 years.

So the 650M is safe
 
adjeff8 said:
But did I read that there could be two options? A discreet and a intergrated?
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If you mean are Intel going to offer Iris in both a Dedicated and Integrated processor? Then no.

Iris is just their product branding for their integrated graphics cores that they have put on the Haswell CPU. It comes in a whole bunch of names including HD 5000, HD 5200, Iris and Iris Pro. Only the Iris Pro has the on-board 128MB of eDRAM as an L4 Cache. The rest of the Haswell graphics only share system memory.

Basically while these integrated graphics included with Haswell are great compared to the previous generation Intel HD 4000 graphics they won't compete with the latest generation dedicated chips, Intel's integrated will always be a step behind due to their size and thermal constraints.

I honestly think we will see either a 750m or a 760m in the new 15" Retina MacBook Pro's it just makes sense. But obviously for the 13" rMBP and MacBook Air we will continue to see Intel integrated chips. I'd expect Iris Pro to be used in the 13" MacBook Pro due to that laptop having thermal dissipation well above what's needed to support an Iris Pro equipped Haswell processor.
 
Quu said:
If you mean are Intel going to offer Iris in both a Dedicated and Integrated processor? Then no.

Iris is just their product branding for their integrated graphics cores that they have put on the Haswell CPU. It comes in a whole bunch of names including HD 5000, HD 5200, Iris and Iris Pro. Only the Iris Pro has the on-board 128MB of eDRAM as an L4 Cache. The rest of the Haswell graphics only share system memory.

Basically while these integrated graphics included with Haswell are great compared to the previous generation Intel HD 4000 graphics they won't compete with the latest generation dedicated chips, Intel's integrated will always be a step behind due to their size and thermal constraints.

I honestly think we will see either a 750m or a 760m in the new 15" Retina MacBook Pro's it just makes sense. But obviously for the 13" rMBP and MacBook Air we will continue to see Intel integrated chips. I'd expect Iris Pro to be used in the 13" MacBook Pro due to that laptop having thermal dissipation well above what's needed to support an Iris Pro equipped Haswell processor.
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Lets complement things here

Iris = 5200 possible 5100
Iris Pro = 5200 with the edramm in there, its on the die of the cpu, not in the mobo

The rest of the intel igpu line up is 4400, 4600, 4800, 5000, 5100, 5200, 5200 with gt3e (edramm)

the problem with the 760m is that its gk106, I dont know if they can take the heat, nor if they do, they will be able to boost to maximum efficiency. That crap from nvidia is basically we give you base clocks, if you have something of cooling we boost, oh you have an average cooler, good we boost a little bit more, oh wait you have a good cooling system so we will boost it till the ceiling.
 
adjeff8 said:
But did I read that there could be two options? A discreet and a intergrated?
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Perhaps you where referring to my previous post on how the Retina 15" Macbook Pro uses a combo of the two options to perform automatic graphic switching, ie it uses a Intel HD 4000 and NVIDIA GeForce GT 650m.

I agree with Quu, the most probable outcome for the Retina Macbook Pro 15" would be a Intel HD 5000/5200 combined with with NVIDIA GeForce GT 750m. This is a very conservative speculation, as it is a linear upgrade, but highly likely to say the least.

The Macbook Airs, I think they will house a Intel HD 5000 with no discrete graphics card as previously.

I'm not sure about the Retina 13" Macbook Pros though, I am on the fence here, I guess it matters on the graphics performance of Intel's new chips.
 
Nbapapa said:
Perhaps you where referring to my previous post on how the Retina 15" Macbook Pro uses a combo of the two options to perform automatic graphic switching, ie it uses a Intel HD 4000 and NVIDIA GeForce GT 650m.

I agree with Quu, the most probable outcome for the Retina Macbook Pro 15" would be a Intel HD 5000/5200 combined with with NVIDIA GeForce GT 750m. This is a very conservative speculation, as it is a linear upgrade, but highly likely to say the least.

The Macbook Airs, I think they will house a Intel HD 5000 with no discrete graphics card as previously.

I'm not sure about the Retina 13" Macbook Pros though, I am on the fence here, I guess it matters on the graphics performance of Intel's new chips.
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Perhaps what he means is that Apple could offer the 15" in two "flavors": a cheaper integrated only machine with the Iris Pro, and a more expensive discrete machine with a lower power chip to compensate for the 750/60M.
 
Serban said:
So in macbook air 11 and 13" we will get hd 5000 and for pro 5200?
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Maybe. That seems to make sense: give the pro machines more power. But I don't know why Apple would put the 5200 in the 15", because it already has a more powerful dGPU and there is no need for the 5200 (it's more expensive).

We won't know till June 10.
 
B... said:
Perhaps what he means is that Apple could offer the 15" in two "flavors": a cheaper integrated only machine with the Iris Pro, and a more expensive discrete machine with a lower power chip to compensate for the 750/60M.
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Yeah depends on how you interpret his question :p

If you look at the current Classic 15" Macbook Pro specs, your opinion is somewhat validated. They currently offer 1GB GDDR5 memory for the higher end Processors and a 512MB of GDDR5 for the lower end. So the model you suggest may be adopted more heavily this year! Great feedback :)

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B... said:
We won't know till June 10.
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Until then.... until then.
Less than 3 weeks by the way!
A countdown from MacRumors would be awesome! :D
 
APPLE-FANATIC said:
Im looking forward to Haswell! I currently have an Early 2011 MacBook Pro 15" 2.0 Ghz i7 Core, 8gb Ram, Intel HD Graphics 3000 512 MB. I am planning on purchasing a rMBP 15" once they are released with the Haswell processors.

Can anyone tell me if I will see a dramatic difference in performance from both a CPU and GPU standpoint? I know I will see some improvement, just unsure how much of a "noticeable" increase one would see being that this is a 2nd gen processor compared to Haswell which is a 4th gen processor.
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An upgrade from Early 2011 MacBook Pro 15" 2.0 Ghz i7 Core, 8gb Ram, Intel HD Graphics 3000 512 MB to Haswelll Retina Macbook Pro 15"?

Assuming you have the AMD Radeon HD 6750M as your discrete graphics card.
I would say your Graphics performance would be approximately x2 if they offer NVIDIA GeForce GT 750m in the new laptops.
Your CPU performance relies entirely on which processor you opt for, but it will be a noticeable improvement to say the least.
Overall, you will see a somewhat dramatic improvement in performance, especially if you are using HDD as opposed to a SDD currently.

Nbapapa,
 
Nbapapa said:
An upgrade from Early 2011 MacBook Pro 15" 2.0 Ghz i7 Core, 8gb Ram, Intel HD Graphics 3000 512 MB to Haswelll Retina Macbook Pro 15"?

Assuming you have the AMD Radeon HD 6750M as your discrete graphics card.
I would say your Graphics performance would be approximately x2 if they offer NVIDIA GeForce GT 750m in the new laptops.
Your CPU performance relies entirely on which processor you opt for, but it will be a noticeable improvement to say the least.
Overall, you will see a somewhat dramatic improvement in performance, especially if you are using HDD as opposed to a SDD currently.

Nbapapa,
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It all depends on his uses. For word processing, the difference will be negligible. For HD video editing and encoding, the difference will be very noticeable. The HDD vs. SSD is a good point as well.
 
Will the Haswell rMBPs cost exactly the same as the current generation do? Or will they cost more or cost less? (I'm hoping it's the latter)

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Nbapapa said:
Until then.... until then.
Less than 3 weeks by the way!
A countdown from MacRumors would be awesome! :D
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Will the keynote itself actually be on June 10th then? Will the new Macs be available for order as soon as they're announced or will it be a week or so after?
 
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JarScott said:
Will the Haswell rMBPs cost exactly the same as the current generation do? Or will they cost more or cost less? (I'm hoping it's the latter)

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Will the keynote itself actually be on June 10th then? Will the new Macs be available for order as soon as they're announced or will it be a week or so after?
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I'm guessing that the price will be the same. Perhaps go down by 100 bucks, if they don't increase SSD capacity.

Yes keynote will definitely be on the first day of the WWDC.

So much looking forward to ditching this old crappy Acer laptop and getting a rMBP 13 inch!!! :D
 
sparks9 said:
I'm guessing that the price will be the same. Perhaps go down by 100 bucks, if they don't increase SSD capacity.

Yes keynote will definitely be on the first day of the WWDC.

So much looking forward to ditching this old crappy Acer laptop and getting a rMBP 13 inch!!! :D
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Very much hoping they're slightly cheaper if only by a small margin! Want to bag myself a base model 15" rMBP Haswell! Can't wait for June!
 
B... said:
Perhaps what he means is that Apple could offer the 15" in two "flavors": a cheaper integrated only machine with the Iris Pro, and a more expensive discrete machine with a lower power chip to compensate for the 750/60M.
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Yes. That's what I meant. In which case if that happens I'm not sure what ill do. I have the money set aside for the most expensive, but do I really need it? The answer is no. I do the usual things, surf, watch movies, Word and Excel. I'm in the film business but I'm not an editor. Just Production scheduling software. I play games, but usually on my iPad. I'm not a intensive gamer by any stretch. What's more important is a 512 gig and maxing out my ram for future proofing purposes
 
Nbapapa said:
An upgrade from Early 2011 MacBook Pro 15" 2.0 Ghz i7 Core, 8gb Ram, Intel HD Graphics 3000 512 MB to Haswelll Retina Macbook Pro 15"?

Assuming you have the AMD Radeon HD 6750M as your discrete graphics card.
I would say your Graphics performance would be approximately x2 if they offer NVIDIA GeForce GT 750m in the new laptops.
Your CPU performance relies entirely on which processor you opt for, but it will be a noticeable improvement to say the least.
Overall, you will see a somewhat dramatic improvement in performance, especially if you are using HDD as opposed to a SDD currently.

Nbapapa,
Click to expand...

THANK YOU!! I appreciate your feedback;)

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B... said:
It all depends on his uses. For word processing, the difference will be negligible. For HD video editing and encoding, the difference will be very noticeable. The HDD vs. SSD is a good point as well.
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Yes, great point about HDD vs. SSD. I forgot to mention I installed a samsung 830 256gb SSD last Summer and man that was a great improvement ;)
 
In terms of price.
In regards to rMBP 15", I think the price won't drop by more than $200 on higher-end models, and no more than $100 on the entry models. As mentioned by sparks9, if they do bump up the SSD, then that justifies no price drop.

Furthermore, I believe we won't see dramatic price drops until they phase-out the Classic MBP.

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APPLE-FANATIC said:
THANK YOU!! I appreciate your feedback;)
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No problem!
 
B... said:
Maybe. That seems to make sense: give the pro machines more power. But I don't know why Apple would put the 5200 in the 15", because it already has a more powerful dGPU and there is no need for the 5200 (it's more expensive).

We won't know till June 10.
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How do we know on June 10th? From the clock rates?
 
It's all speculation.
June 10th is the beginning day of Apple's WWDC, which is also the main event of the event.
They have said they will show iOS 7 and OSX 10.9 so far. It is highly unlikely that will just showcase new software so there has to be some hardware shown.
June 3rd is when Intel will release their 4th Gen chip 'Haswell', so every is speculating that Apple will be an early adopter and introduce it in their laptops.
Think about, if they don't do on June 10th, then when will they? They only hold a conference 2-3 times a year where they release new products. Will they really miss out on the market demanding for Haswell?
 
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Hello.

I'm considering buying the current, non-retina MBP...but am concerned about the impending new model rumours going around at the moment. The thing is, I also want to jump in and buy one new (with a 512GB SSD) just in case Apple decides to phase this model out completely (no more disc drive).

Have people had a good experience with Apple's return policy? How late to WWDC should I wait to order mine? I'm happy to keep it sealed in the box when it arrives and then call Apple about a return so I can get the new MBP if it still has a disc drive.

Thanks.
 
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