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Waiting for Haswell MBP Mega Thread

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sonyisawesome said:
I'm not concerned about your problems either or other fanboys, but the difference is that you responded to my post.


And some consumers don't. But apparently, you will have to leave this apple-friendly board in order to find the complains regarding new haswell model's missing d-gpu.
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Seriously, pipe it down. The entire iGPU discussion is pointless. There will be a dGPU in there.
 
mcarling said:
That is complete nonsense. Almost all progress in integrated circuits comes from increased integration of the circuits. I can remember when the FPU was discrete, the memory controller was discrete, the clock circuitry was discrete, etc., etc. Performance has been improved by integrating all of them. Now it is time for graphics performance to be improved by integrating the GPU.

We're just a few years away from the time when no discrete GPU will be able to keep up with the fastest integrated GPUs that will then be available. The reason is simple. On-die communication between the CPU and GPU is faster than inter-chip communication.

As soon as (and perhaps even a bit before) discrete GPUs are completely dead, we'll begin to see the integration of the PCH (formerly South Bridge, more or less) into the CPU -- first as a separate die on the chip, then on-die.

The logical conclusion to the quasi-religious belief that discrete is better than integrated is to give up integrated circuits completely and go back to discrete transistors.
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Dude. Too much clarity and logic here. I.. I don't know where to begin.. :D
 
For the 13 inch I hope the iris 5100 and for the 15 inch I hope a dGPU (gtx 750m or 760m)

I didnt want a 650
 
Waiting for Haswell MBP Mega Thread

sonyisawesome said:
HD5200 integrated is not a dedicated graphics card. No matter hpw much apple wants to twist their tongue. Integrated will never be good as Dedicated graphics card. This is a fact of life.

LMFAO. you wish it was powerful as much as 780m.

Blind fanboysm leads to delusion, I see.
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Never said that. Read before you respond mockingly next time.

I said that if the 5200 was as powerful as a 780m, or any integrated graphics was as powerful or more than the best dgpu, would you still not get it?

Saying that you'll never get a laptop with a high end igpu is simply naive, as at some point they may be better than dgpus

I would much prefer a 750m over an hd5200, but not because one is dedicated and one isn't, but because this time around the 750m is looking better than the hd5200.
 
mcarling said:
We're just a few years away from the time when no discrete GPU will be able to keep up with the fastest integrated GPUs that will then be available. The reason is simple. On-die communication between the CPU and GPU is faster than inter-chip communication.
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Except that doesn't necessarily matter. That's why we have VRAM. Stuff is cached in VRAM so the GPU and CPU don't have to talk.

And even then, VRAM is much faster than RAM. If you did couple a GPU directly to the CPU and main RAM, it could be hobbled by the slow DDR3 speeds (instead of the DDR5 speeds of a dGPU design with dedicated VRAM.) This is why the PS4, with an integrated GPU, has to bump main memory to DDR5, and why the Xbox One is being knocked for sticking with DDR3.

What you said is a drastic over simplification.
 
spybenj said:
Never said that. Read before you respond mockingly next time.

I said that if the 5200 was as powerful as a 780m, or any integrated graphics was as powerful or more than the best dgpu, would you still not get it?

Saying that you'll never get a laptop with a high end igpu is simply naive, as at some point they may be better than dgpus

I would much prefer a 750m over an hd5200, but not because one is dedicated and one isn't, but because this time around the 750m is looking better than the hd5200.
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i'd say because of the stigma Intel have give us this past years.

Since GMA950, nothing good ever come out from Intel iGPU ... until this year,
We'll see how it fares.

But i wouldn't bet so much on the power, the priority of the iGPU is to maximize performance while having a reasonable power consumption ( Performance per Watt ratio )

NVIDIA on the other hand can go as fast as they wanted to, they have cards from low-end to high-end catered towards every market segment.

those i-don't-care-about-battery chips belongs to the gaming laptop market.
 
mcarling said:
The logical conclusion to the quasi-religious belief that discrete is better than integrated is to give up integrated circuits completely and go back to discrete transistors.
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I don't think it's "quasi" if we consider the user's life as discrete from (or integrated with) the machine. Google glasses and Apple iOS are about integration and locking out discrete thought processes... thoughts like, "I don't need this" and "Steve was wrong".
 
devilcm3 said:
those i-don't-care-about-battery chips belongs to the gaming laptop market.
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Yes, but the Iris Pro will consume more power than the HD4600. Meaning that the iGPU + dGPU is the better option for battery life. I'm not saying its going to happen, just pointing it out.

Nevertheless, I'm still hoping for a dGPU this time round. I think by Broadwell the iGPU should have good enough performance to replace the dGPU completely, but we're not quite there yet, IMO.
 
GSPice said:
Honesty curious.. and I may have asked you before.. what's your line of thinking for this?
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I highly doubt people will be fooled into buying a 15" machine with $2k+ cost on it without a dGPU in there. If you do, send some cash over, as your pockets seem to overflow with it.

PDFierro said:
Except I was referring to your vote of 100 percent confidence about the 15-inch having a dGPU.
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See above.
 
jav6454 said:
I highly doubt people will be fooled into buying a 15" machine with $2k+ cost on it without a dGPU in there. If you do, send some cash over, as your pockets seem to overflow with it.
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I highly doubt most MacBook Pro owners know (or care) what a dGPU is. I bet they thoroughly enjoy their laptop anyway.
 
jav6454 said:
I highly doubt people will be fooled into buying a 15" machine with $2k+ cost on it without a dGPU in there. If you do, send some cash over, as your pockets seem to overflow with it.



See above.
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Except that does nothing to explain why you are so sure of it having a dGPU.
 
jav6454 said:
Like I said, Apple has had the 13" MacBook there for a reason on an iGPU. Need only that? There is your answer.
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Yes, that was last year. Things could be wildly different with the refresh, and it won't be based on "well, Apple would never do that, or they wouldn't because..."

I think it's very possible Apple will drop the dGPU.
 
mcarling said:
Performance has been improved by integrating all of them. Now it is time for graphics performance to be improved by integrating the GPU.
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I'm a business major, but I have taken a couple IT classes, and we did learn that performance is always going to be worse the further away from the core you go (the same reason cache is placed right on top of the CPU). So with that concept, it is inevitable that iGPU's will outperform dGPU's after a certain point in time.

Since Intel's graphics were shi*t 3 years ago, I'm willing to put my money on saying that it is people's lack of well-informed opinions that are keeping them from believing iGPU's will become worthy of a high price tag.

Granted, I don't think it is this day. We've already seen Clevo's Zeus Hercules laptop which houses Iris Pro graphics (plus 128mb eDRAM) and that is priced at $1000. So I'd likely shi*t my pants before trying to convince myself I'd be okay with purchasing the rMBP for $2200. I mean people have always justified the design of MBP's for the price tag, but it looks like they're going to have to justify it even more this year.

Team dGPU. But you'll likely see me drift to the other side when Skylake comes out :D
 
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Yeah it's kinda difficult to prove A because Not B, or Not A because Not B..

I'll be happy either way.. but a dGPU would be amazing.

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jav6454 said:
Just because Iris is on par with last years dGPUs? Hardly enough reason.
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What about geekbench?
 
zOlid said:
I'm so glad i live in Sweden so i don't have to bother with apple care.
Only reason for me to get it would be for the extra support.
In Sweden Apple have to leave a 3 year warranty on their products by law.
Just like every other company have to leave with their products.
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But that's "reklamationsret" - not warranty. It's not the same. ;) Here in Denmark we also have that for 2 years.
 
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