Waiting for the 2017 MBP (Kaby Lake / Cannonlake / Coffee Lake??)

[navaira]

May 23, 2016
"While long overlooked, the MacBook line is the brightest spot for Apple’s 2016 rollouts. This is particularly true of the two new MacBook Pro models, to be introduced in 4Q16"

October 31, 2016
"Ming Chi Kuo: Demand for new MacBook Pro models tepid due to high prices, disappointing specs"

I don't think those contradict themselves though. Had the Touch Bar 13" been introduced at price of 2015 model, it would definitely be considered great value for the price. I assume here that Kuo refers to "two models" meaning the 13" and 15". He also predicted a retina refresh for Macbook Air, and he was sort of right, because the Escape Edition of rMBP was referred to (by Schiller?) as replacement for Air. So now Apple's entire MacBook line-up is updated: rMB, two rMBPs and Escape Edition Expensive (EEE) Air Replacement. The actual 13" Air and 2015 model are sort of hanging around for no other reason than Apple being able to advertise their portables as starting at $999.

 

[TheralSadurns]

Great thought out points except for one flaw. The buy when you need doesn't apply to you. I run a business, the business makes me money. If I need a laptop today, I buy one today. No matter what advancements that come in technology, the waiting does not outweigh the benefit I get from getting the technology now, when I need it. If I needed an iMac when 5k was looming, the price difference is paltry in what I would earn versus waiting. That's the difference between needing it now and not needing it now.

Likewise if you are in school, work, etc. If you need it now to get your work done, waiting for what's next isn't better as your productivity suffers - and for what? A thousand dollars? The buy when you need is not utter ******** as you call it. Your philosophy is great and applies if you can afford to wait. If you have that luxury, by all means jump in at the "right" time (as you define right relating to technology). To think everyone has that luxury, is a bit unrealistic.

Oh I didn't say anything else... the problem is that "need it" is often confused with "want to". People think "oh my 2012 MBP is getting long in the tooth... I need something new and shiny!" and more often than not is that seen as an actual NEED. If you really actually need one at any given time... you have to buy it... no matter what.

 

[fokmik]

since in 2017 will not be updated with some useful things...like 32 gb ram or increase cpu/gpu...no need to wait. The 2018 will be the year with bto 32 gb ram with some nice improvements in battery and igpu

 

[IndigoDesign]

since in 2017 will not be updated with some useful things...like 32 gb ram or increase cpu/gpu...no need to wait. The 2018 will be the year with bto 32 gb ram with some nice improvements in battery and igpu

Too bad that by that time, every other "PRO" laptop will have moved on to 64 GB Ram and the next batch of NVidia Pascal GPUs. I still can't find the right words for my disappointment after waiting 1,5 years in that epic Skylake-thread.

I know it's windows and all, but if I go and see what's possible in a 13" formfactor... 32 GB Ram, Quadcore Skylake, Nvidia GTX 1060 etc... AND user-upgradeable... I just wanna rip my hair out...
http://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/prod...6IjMyRzI0MDAiLCJQcmljZSI6NDAwLjB9XX1dfQ%3D%3D


(not considering this as a real business option because it looks like a toy, just as a case-study)

 

[fokmik]

windows laptops already have ddr4 32 gb. i know about that alienware...but god that is almost the size and weight of an desktop..so its not really portable
[doublepost=1478161403][/doublepost]i dont know about 1060 but both 1070 and 1080 got burned...both of them...i returned them, and i looked and seems its an general thing

 

[IndigoDesign]

windows laptops already have ddr4 32 gb. i know about that alienware...but god that is almost the size and weight of an desktop..so its not really portable
[doublepost=1478161403][/doublepost]i dont know about 1060 but both 1070 and 1080 got burned...both of them...i returned them, and i looked and seems its an general thing

Again, the Alienware thing is still great value for money, we're both not in the market for such a windows-behemoth I guess. But I've always understood it as the Macbook for entry level mainstream customers, the Air was the no-compromise thin and light for the traveling salesman, writer or journalist and the Macbook Pro was the portable Workstation for the creative professional. That segmentation got totally screwed over. Fine you gotta go with the times, but I still feel like Apple is lacking concept in the product lineup.

Imagine what Apple could do if they would ONCE not go for thinner and lighter but more powerful, more battery and better GPU with the pro Laptops. Heck, they could even make the 13" similar to what it is now (just cheaper) and the 15" 2-3 mm thicker more into the direction of that Alienware.

I'm just rambling. But there is no denying that around 2012 Apple had their systems pretty well locked down and planned out. I still rock my upgradeable Quadcore mac mini, now running 16 GB Ram, 1TB 7200 spinner for storage and 512 GB SSD for system. I love it and as long as it's not deemed obsolete I'll keep it. I just don't see that kind of value anymore in ANY of Apple's current machines. If you can even call them that...

 

[fokmik]

better dgpu i don't want to..because of the heat and battery drains..even with a thicker device, i want a silent, cold mac,the current ones are v ok for me, but 32 gb ram would be nice...the rest doesn't bother me since i go full usb-c from day 1. but again this is just the macbook pro, they need to update the entire line, even the 12" Macbook with kaby lake to take advantage of that built in TB3 !

 

[IndigoDesign]

better dgpu i don't want to..because of the heat and battery drains..even with a thicker device, i want a silent, cold mac,the current ones are v ok for me, but 32 gb ram would be nice...the rest doesn't bother me since i go full usb-c from day 1. but again this is just the macbook pro, they need to update the entire line, even the 12" Macbook with kaby lake to take advantage of that built in TB3 !

I don't want a dGPU either, but the option would be nice. I envisioned a Quadcore 15", Iris Pro 580, 512 GB SSD, 32 GB Ram. Unfortunately I cannot have this. Good. But I don't want to pay for a dGPU when I don't need one, be forced down to 16 GB and to paying for the (for me) useless hipster-bar. I work in Indesign a lot. I use shortcuts on the keyboard, looking away from the screen to look at the hipster-bar to do basic things is no productivity-improvement for me. I work with huge files (catalogues, magazines etc...) therefore I need a good Quadcore CPU and loads of Ram in a mobile package as I often go TO my customers and do the layouting onsite.

Too bad Apple doesn't have anything on offer for me atm.

 

[AfroAbel]

Too bad that by that time, every other "PRO" laptop will have moved on to 64 GB Ram and the next batch of NVidia Pascal GPUs. I still can't find the right words for my disappointment after waiting 1,5 years in that epic Skylake-thread.

I know it's windows and all, but if I go and see what's possible in a 13" formfactor... 32 GB Ram, Quadcore Skylake, Nvidia GTX 1060 etc... AND user-upgradeable... I just wanna rip my hair out...
http://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/productdetails/alienware-13-laptop/dkcwe04h?selectionState=eyJGUHJpY2UiOjIyOTkuOTksIk9DIjoiZGtjd2UwNGgiLCJRdHkiOjEsIk1vZHMiOlt7IklkIjozLCJPcHRzIjpbeyJJZCI6IjMyRzI0MDAiLCJQcmljZSI6NDAwLjB9XX1dfQ%3D%3D


(not considering this as a real business option because it looks like a toy, just as a case-study)

The fact that they don't even mention batterylife on the official product page tells me enough...
My god that thing is ugly.

 

[fokmik]

i think something went wrong with Intel and that iris Pro...and since the other iGPU were too low for a 15", Apple was forced to have dGPU

 

[IndigoDesign]

The fact that they don't even mention batterylife on the official product page tells me enough...
My god that thing is ugly.

Yes it IS ugly.
But the performance... battery life is around 6 hours. Not great. But there are many of us that use it as a desktop replacement. You know, just move it from your wall socket at home to the wall socket at your work.

Again. Not proposing this as an alternative, just a case study what kind of performance would be possible if you're not forcing thin and light. Imagine a MBP 2 mm thicker than the new ones. Maybe 3 mm thicker. 32 GB Ram, more battery for sure.
[doublepost=1478164639][/doublepost]

i think something went wrong with Intel and that iris Pro...and since the other iGPU were too low for a 15", Apple was forced to have dGPU

Looks like it yes. But it seems to do just fine in that Skullcanyon NUC.

 

[Ma2k5]

Just read that the AMD Radeon Pro 460 was released October 2016, is this the reason why the Macbooks were delayed so much? Obviously they could have released the 13" earlier, but maybe, considering the touch bar, they wanted to keep them both in the same announcement.

As for waiting, I don't think there is anything significant to be updated until 2018-2020 - so if you want a Macbook, buy now.

Other Windows options are, Alienware 13, Razerblade Stealth/Razerblade 14 & HP Spectre x360 (Kabylake).

A sigificant gamechanger could be a Q1 update of the XPS 15, which would feature Quad core Kabylake and the 10 series Nvidia.

 

[fokmik]

All 450 455 and 460 were released with the new macbook pros...like nvidia did with 680MX and the imac. And i think the delay was part of this

 

[maflynn]

A sigificant gamechanger could be a Q1 update of the XPS 15, which would feature Quad core Kabylake and the 10 series Nvidia.

I could be wrong, but many PC makers have more or less aligned their release schedule to that of Intel's so they'll have a 6 months jump on Apple in terms of rolling out newer models with the latest chipset.

Word on the street is that the Surface Book is looking at a spring release as well, though I'm all set for computers (both desktop and laptops) for the time being.

 

[iKrivetko]

I know it's windows and all, but if I go and see what's possible in a 13" formfactor... 32 GB Ram, Quadcore Skylake, Nvidia GTX 1060 etc... AND user-upgradeable... I just wanna rip my hair out...
http://www.dell.com/en-us/shop/productdetails/alienware-13-laptop/dkcwe04h?selectionState=eyJGUHJpY2UiOjIyOTkuOTksIk9DIjoiZGtjd2UwNGgiLCJRdHkiOjEsIk1vZHMiOlt7IklkIjozLCJPcHRzIjpbeyJJZCI6IjMyRzI0MDAiLCJQcmljZSI6NDAwLjB9XX1dfQ%3D%3D

Do you realise that it's larger than the 15" MBP?

 

[EnesM]

Do you realise that it's larger than the 15" MBP?

I guess that's the whole point. Apple could have easily made a fatter, real Pro model for the pros.

 

[iKrivetko]

Actually, even scrap that. It's just marginally smaller than the good ole 17" MBP. '13" formfactor' my arse.

 

[Workerbee Redux]

All this wanting to do everything on a laptop is so insane.

Don't stop making excuses for Apple.

 

[mbpmo]

1. Height: 0.92 inch (23.3mm) | 2. Width: 15.35 inches (390mm) | 3. Depth: 10.20 inches (259mm) | Average Weight: 5 lbs (2 kg)

I think Apple could stuff all that and a 15" display in a stretched 13" cMBP case 13" x 9" x .92

 

[iKrivetko]

a stretched 13" cMBP

Yeah, it's called a 17" cMBP case

 

[mbpmo]

Yeah, it's called a 17" cMBP case

What I was saying is that Apple could have stuffed all that was in that Alienware in their (1. Height: 0.92 inch (23.3mm) | 2. Width: 15.35 inches (390mm) | 3. Depth: 10.20 inches (259mm) | Average Weight: 5 lbs (2 kg) ) ... case... in a stretched 13" cMBP and it only has to be 13x9 x .92...granted I'd like to see the old 17" cMBP with it too, but I'd rather use external monitors and have the 13" footprint because I already have monitors at work and home to use and 17" isn't enough but for you yes you could have that and in the 17 you could have dual quad cores and 16 threads!

 

[Ries]

since in 2017 will not be updated with some useful things...like 32 gb ram or increase cpu/gpu...no need to wait. The 2018 will be the year with bto 32 gb ram with some nice improvements in battery and igpu

All those specs in the keynote, even down to RAM frequency, but not a single word on the display resolution.

 

[IndigoDesign]

Just read that the AMD Radeon Pro 460 was released October 2016, is this the reason why the Macbooks were delayed so much? Obviously they could have released the 13" earlier, but maybe, considering the touch bar, they wanted to keep them both in the same announcement.

As for waiting, I don't think there is anything significant to be updated until 2018-2020 - so if you want a Macbook, buy now.

Other Windows options are, Alienware 13, Razerblade Stealth/Razerblade 14 & HP Spectre x360 (Kabylake).

A sigificant gamechanger could be a Q1 update of the XPS 15, which would feature Quad core Kabylake and the 10 series Nvidia.

That's what I'm doing right now, keeping an eye out on the XPS 15 refresh!

 

[koyoot]

From first reviews of Kaby Lake CPUs: Same uarchitecture of the CPUs as Skylake, improved process, 7% higher performance. 3% higher power consumption, no difference in iGPU performance.

 

[navaira]

7% higher performance [...] no difference in iGPU performance

I am so excited now.