15 more days...just sayin...can't wait to place my order for my Kaby Lake MBP 15"
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Waiting for the 2017 MBP (Kaby Lake / Cannonlake / Coffee Lake??)
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Agreed. Hope they introduce a 15" without that ridiculous Touch Bar.
Assuming the MBP does get Kaby Lake at WWDC, when can we expect to actually get our hands on the updated machine?
hang on, I will just check the Apple site and check the order times.......... it appears the site hasn't been updated yet with this unannounced product.
nobody knows is the answer. could be immediately, could be 2 weeks, 4 weeks.
That's obviously not what I was asking. I'm asking for an estimate based on Apple's past history of announcement and availability. It is a shame you felt it worth your time to give a smart ass answer to a question you couldn't understand to begin with.
Hopefully someone who has a better pulse on Apple's history of product availability after announcement can chime in.
Historically, Macs have been available both inmediately after the announcement and not up until several weeks later. It's anyone's guess at this stage but if it does happen, I'd say it's unlikely to be anymore than a month.
Refer to my second sentence. It is a reflection of Apples history of product availability after announcement.
Spec bumps of existing MBPs (as in this case) are typically available the day they're announced.
Re-reading all the rumors (Gurman and Kuo)... it seems like the following is taking place.
As per Gurman:
MBP Update at WWDC
My guess to this is... same style MBP with TouchBar etc. as it is still a new design etc. Changes that are likely to happen:
Radeon 4xx → 5xx
Skylake CPU → Kaby Lake
Boxy battery → terraced battery
RAM will STAY at 16GB... as Low Power RAM is not supported beyond that...
As per Kuo:
New MBP Plus (just to give it a different name for now) “the most significantly redesigned product this year" in Q4 2017
with "Desktop class" (guess he means 'normal' no low power) RAM.
16GB → 32GB
As he talks about a redesign... I expect it NOT to have the exact same case as the current models... but probably be a slightly thicker version of it to fit a bigger battery.
Maybe this re-introduces a 17" version? One can only dream/hope.
Maybe this signals a move to AMD Ryzen CPUs?
I really wonder what he means by "most significantly redesigned"... between the rMBP an the TBMBP there is little room for another drastic change in design... now is there?
Plus all of this is only relevant... IF (!!!) Kuo's guess/rumor is correct!!!
If he is wrong... then all this here means nothing...
Discuss
As per Gurman:
MBP Update at WWDC
My guess to this is... same style MBP with TouchBar etc. as it is still a new design etc. Changes that are likely to happen:
Radeon 4xx → 5xx
Skylake CPU → Kaby Lake
Boxy battery → terraced battery
RAM will STAY at 16GB... as Low Power RAM is not supported beyond that...
As per Kuo:
New MBP Plus (just to give it a different name for now) “the most significantly redesigned product this year" in Q4 2017
with "Desktop class" (guess he means 'normal' no low power) RAM.
16GB → 32GB
As he talks about a redesign... I expect it NOT to have the exact same case as the current models... but probably be a slightly thicker version of it to fit a bigger battery.
Maybe this re-introduces a 17" version? One can only dream/hope.
Maybe this signals a move to AMD Ryzen CPUs?
I really wonder what he means by "most significantly redesigned"... between the rMBP an the TBMBP there is little room for another drastic change in design... now is there?
Plus all of this is only relevant... IF (!!!) Kuo's guess/rumor is correct!!!
If he is wrong... then all this here means nothing...
Discuss
Re-reading all the rumors (Gurman and Kuo)... it seems like the following is taking place.
As per Gurman:
MBP Update at WWDC
My guess to this is... same style MBP with TouchBar etc. as it is still a new design etc. Changes that are likely to happen:
Radeon 4xx → 5xx
Skylake CPU → Kaby Lake
Boxy battery → terraced battery
RAM will STAY at 16GB... as Low Power RAM is not supported beyond that...
As per Kuo:
New MBP Plus (just to give it a different name for now) “the most significantly redesigned product this year" in Q4 2017
with "Desktop class" (guess he means 'normal' no low power) RAM.
16GB → 32GB
As he talks about a redesign... I expect it NOT to have the exact same case as the current models... but probably be a slightly thicker version of it to fit a bigger battery.
Maybe this re-introduces a 17" version? One can only dream/hope.
Maybe this signals a move to AMD Ryzen CPUs?
I really wonder what he means by "most significantly redesigned"... between the rMBP an the TBMBP there is little room for another drastic change in design... now is there?
Plus all of this is only relevant... IF (!!!) Kuo's guess/rumor is correct!!!
If he is wrong... then all this here means nothing...
Discuss
I believe Gurman on this one and everything you list is probably reality. I thought it was odd when I read the Kuo rumour of the most significant design of 2017 when it just went through one. Hopefully they are getting it confused with the iMac.....
hard to believe they are going to replace the mbp spot with another mbp plus.Re-reading all the rumors (Gurman and Kuo)... it seems like the following is taking place.
As per Gurman:
MBP Update at WWDC
My guess to this is... same style MBP with TouchBar etc. as it is still a new design etc. Changes that are likely to happen:
Radeon 4xx → 5xx
Skylake CPU → Kaby Lake
Boxy battery → terraced battery
RAM will STAY at 16GB... as Low Power RAM is not supported beyond that...
As per Kuo:
New MBP Plus (just to give it a different name for now) “the most significantly redesigned product this year" in Q4 2017
with "Desktop class" (guess he means 'normal' no low power) RAM.
16GB → 32GB
As he talks about a redesign... I expect it NOT to have the exact same case as the current models... but probably be a slightly thicker version of it to fit a bigger battery.
Maybe this re-introduces a 17" version? One can only dream/hope.
Maybe this signals a move to AMD Ryzen CPUs?
I really wonder what he means by "most significantly redesigned"... between the rMBP an the TBMBP there is little room for another drastic change in design... now is there?
Plus all of this is only relevant... IF (!!!) Kuo's guess/rumor is correct!!!
If he is wrong... then all this here means nothing...
Discuss
quite impossible they are going to migrate from intel to amd for the cpus (in the laptop line, different thing is for the Modular mac pro) if they're going to ditch intel it will be only for apple-produced cpus/gpus.
way more possibile they're going to update the macbook/air with a newer bigger screen option.
not saying/thinking they will replace the MBP or have another update... but rather have another tier.
Like the iPhone SE That came mid-cycle did not replace the 'normal' iPhone. And neither did the 'Plus' Version.
And in the past... the 13", 15", and 17" have quite often not been released together.
What I am suggesting as a possibility is (in order of performance)
12" Macbook - as a consumer-entry-level notebook
13" nonTB MBP - mid to long term MBA replacement
13" TBMBP - consumer to prosumer level
15" TBMBP - prosumer Level
Kuo's MBP with 32GB - pro level
Like the iPhone SE That came mid-cycle did not replace the 'normal' iPhone. And neither did the 'Plus' Version.
And in the past... the 13", 15", and 17" have quite often not been released together.
What I am suggesting as a possibility is (in order of performance)
12" Macbook - as a consumer-entry-level notebook
13" nonTB MBP - mid to long term MBA replacement
13" TBMBP - consumer to prosumer level
15" TBMBP - prosumer Level
Kuo's MBP with 32GB - pro level
It's quite different to introduce a new "lower spec'd" product in an already complete lineup instead adding a new top of the line product after that you sold the MacBook Pro as the perfect product for pro-users.
for apple Pro means "this it the top you can get" or sometimes "the most expensive".
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Radeon pro 450 - 455 - 460 made their first appearance when apple introduced 2016 MacBook pros, didn't even existed before.
We probably can expect the same for the new series since amd Vega mobile is not ready yet, the - eventually - updated mbp could ship with a rebranded model of the pro 4xx series, with higher clock and more vram.
Don't think they will ship with a new architecture GPU, sadly.
Reading between the lines of their recent attempts to sway the press they're still serious about pros, yet also address alleged disappointing reviews and sales of the 2016 MacBook Pros I can see Apple offering both a lower entry price 15", possibly without the touch bar, and a <£2k entry price plus greater, and possibly more affordable configuration options for better processors and graphics to meet the pro end - rather than an actual Pro Plus model
These two may not be in conflict. Look at the context that Apple has set up currently. There are really two sets of MBP 13" and 15" models. One set has function keys ( the 2015 13" 15" ) and one set has touch bar ( tb 13" and 15" ). Like when Apple introduced "Retina" screens they may plan to run these two sets concurrently for 2+ years. Note that currently there wasn't a 2016 model in the function key zone ( only the two port 13" .... which looks more like a MBA in terms of ports than a traditional )
So the Gurman is could be more about bumping the touch bar set. ( to put a firmer foundation under the substantially higher price they could they can do some speed bump upgrades). That may leave the 2015 models untouched ( as in not axed from the line up. Maybe a price cut). The MBP 13" 2016 function key perhaps also uncut ( with perhaps a price cut).
Then in the Fall Apple address the function key models. That could be a new thicker 15" ( and maybe 13" also, 4 ports? ) model with so-DIMM RAM. At that point Apple would drop the 2015 model(s) ( they may keep the 2015 13" the same way stuck the 2012 13" non-retina model as the "comatose, legacy" option parked down at $1099 or so. ). If they add a 4 port, fcn key 13" model then perhaps the 2 port model gets refactored ( dial back screen and few other things) and turned into a MBA upgrade.
There does seem to be a market of folks who use the MBP more so as a "transportable" computer ( desktop replacement that commutes back and forth to work... but 95+% used plugged in and coupled to a dock/stationary peripherals). I don't expect Apple to completely reverse course, but back to 2012-3 weights.
Even if Apple does a pseudo "desktop replacement" move I doubt the 17" comes back. There are still very few "Retina' class display. I doubt Apple is going to go the low DPI 15" or 17" path to keep costs down. Since they would have overlapping 13" and 15' models, 17 just adds more complexity. For folks sitting at a desk most of the day then plugging in a nice 24-27" is just a better option than a 17" display.
Except for the RX 460 ( full stream processor set ) the rest of the Radeon 4xx -> 5xx is simply just a speed bump of a very narrow, slightly improved process technology that allowed AMD to clock the desktop versions higher. Given that the Radeon Pro 450, 455, 460 are just clocked down versions of the desktop versions..... I'm not sure what advantage the process get. On a strict TDP budget that process improvement probably isn't going to do anything.
If this stays the same that isn't really a bad sign. AMD doesn't seem to have anything new in mobile dGPUs for at least another 6 months ( or longer). [ I doubt there would be a switch to Nvidia... First, not a drop in, pin compatible replacement on such a short design cycle. Second, I don't think it is really technical issues at the heart of why Nvidia keeps loosing design bake offs with Apple. The feud appears to have two sides. ]
pretty much ball pin compatible with what is there so why not?
Since the Kaby Lake will give some battery increment ( better 'race to sleep' characteristics) I suspect this is largely a waste of time. Anything that involves Apple industrial design and very quick turn around I think is "fantasy land". There really hasn't been time to do a substantive redesign.
if any structural changes it is to fix something that is exhibiting major problems.
this low power RAM excuse Apple trotted out is a bunch of hooey. The principle root cause is that Apple solders the RAM chips onto the logic board as a purely 2-D , planer solution. To go up to 32GB Apple needs denser RAIM chips. They would need the same number of chips as the 16GB solution uses. They really aren't any. Without denser RAM chips they have to expand the logic board. That would mean cutting into the battery volume. The decreased battery volume is where the root cause power problem would be.
The other easy solution is to back off the thinness slight and go back to so-DIMMs which are a far more efficient use of volume since not purely a 2-D solution. Yeah the so-DIMMs would be DDR4 but since increased the volume for partial stacking the so-DIMM can also crank up the battery to match. There wouldn't necessarily be any net loss in system battery life. It just takes more volume than Apple is self imposed restraints provide.
Some future LPDDR 4 implementations are going to get denser and will un-paint Apple out of the corner.
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alleged disappointing sales by who? Apple has explicitly commented that the 2016 models sold extremely well. There is front page macrumors story today that Apple's laptop sales are holding their own in terms of volume relative to pervious versions at same "time on market" age.
https://www.macrumors.com/2017/05/22/apple-notebook-shipments-increase-year-q1-2017/
They already do offer a lower 15" ... the MBP 2015 which did not disappear. (a bit harder to find. Look in Compare Macs section of website) but still around.
if Apple is going to keep the 2015 around longer (e.g., holding pattern until can replace in the Fall ) they could drop the price a bit ( - $100) and keep it around. Even if want to invent the notion that the 2015 models are vastly propping up the MBP sales ( even as Apple says otherwise) the price drop would just mean they'd continue to do so for at least another quarter or two.
Keeping my fingers crossed for a 32GB option. I have a MBP 15" Late 2013 with LG UltraFine 5K, and I really need a new Macbook Pro. I use it for content creation and the next one I like to keep for another 5-7 years, so I dont want to spend a lot of money for only 16GB memory.
What I have read they are the better choice for gaming, and Apple doesn't do gaming.
AMD is better for FCP performance.
I am really hoping they give the GPU a nice bump. nothing else bothers me personally to be honest, as I never ever reach 100% CPU usage. I may contemplate 32gb RAM if available, depending on price vs benefit .
Really though I honestly don't see Apple changing their model much in terms of line up.
12" MB
13" MBP
15" MBP
2015 models discontinued.
I have no real idea why anyone still buys the Air when the 13"MBP nTB is better, except for savings.
The market for super powered laptops is too small for Apple and they make all round machines, not minority machines.
These are my predictions. Same as usual, no major surprises.
the only big thing I can think of would be the iMac release but most likely that will be October.
there was a job description for someone to write drivers for nvdia mobile and apple- so i'd not be shocked if they show up at some point
What? gaming? Never heard of CUDA?
nVidia GPUs have higher TDP. Their useless race to thinnes forced them into a "thermal corner" and the dumb decision to remove magsafe will not allow more than 100W of power supply.
Also they are pushing OpenCL which is a free standard instead of CUDA which is a nVidia exclusive...
i truly love how people can be so positive and can dream about something "revolutionary" coming from apple every 9 months.
IF something is going to happen at the wwdc it will be just a speed bump pf the current lineup of laptops, maybe they will discontinue the old retina macbook pro (but i don't think is going to happen since they are legacy products very good for volume purchases in businesses).
un updated macbook air would cannibalize the macbook and the 13" MacBook Pro market, so we can expect it to stay or to go, maybe some minor update to the base storage.
something is really missing at the moment is a bigger screen average performance laptop.
something between the macbook 12" and the old 15"macbook pro, with a good screen, i would love to see a 14" macbook with two tb3 ports.
the macbook pro with touch bar is going to stay for a long time (it took them 4 years to admit the design "failure" for the nMP) and is going to be the top of the line product for apple laptops.
i don't think we are going to see nvidia gpus on the macbook pros (unfortunately for me, my workflow will benefit a lot from the introduction of a cuda capable gpu) if we are lucky enough nvidia would be one of the option when the modular Mac Pro will be released.
imho we will se:
10,5 iPad pro and updated 12,9 iPad pro - preview for the ios11 (iPad centric updated maybe, i hope).
updated macbook 12 and maybe if we are lucky enough a new basic product to replace the 13" macbook air
updated macbook pro line with kabylake, new gpus new memory sizes (no ddr4- lpddr4 is not ready yet, they are not going to change the form factor of the mac to fit new thermal needings)
price drop for the classic mbp with retina, updated base storage for all the mac line to 256gb ssd.
updated iMac and mac mini? dunno...
IF something is going to happen at the wwdc it will be just a speed bump pf the current lineup of laptops, maybe they will discontinue the old retina macbook pro (but i don't think is going to happen since they are legacy products very good for volume purchases in businesses).
un updated macbook air would cannibalize the macbook and the 13" MacBook Pro market, so we can expect it to stay or to go, maybe some minor update to the base storage.
something is really missing at the moment is a bigger screen average performance laptop.
something between the macbook 12" and the old 15"macbook pro, with a good screen, i would love to see a 14" macbook with two tb3 ports.
the macbook pro with touch bar is going to stay for a long time (it took them 4 years to admit the design "failure" for the nMP) and is going to be the top of the line product for apple laptops.
i don't think we are going to see nvidia gpus on the macbook pros (unfortunately for me, my workflow will benefit a lot from the introduction of a cuda capable gpu) if we are lucky enough nvidia would be one of the option when the modular Mac Pro will be released.
imho we will se:
10,5 iPad pro and updated 12,9 iPad pro - preview for the ios11 (iPad centric updated maybe, i hope).
updated macbook 12 and maybe if we are lucky enough a new basic product to replace the 13" macbook air
updated macbook pro line with kabylake, new gpus new memory sizes (no ddr4- lpddr4 is not ready yet, they are not going to change the form factor of the mac to fit new thermal needings)
price drop for the classic mbp with retina, updated base storage for all the mac line to 256gb ssd.
updated iMac and mac mini? dunno...
yeah but FCP is better supported by AMD so I doubt we will be seeing Nvidia chips in a Mac anytime soon.
The thinness is fine. In fact the MBP is a great computer for most people. It is just a minority who want Razor specs in a Mac.
I would suggest eGPU support is the right answer, then we can have any card we want, together with a highly portable reasonably powered machine that suits most users, and the power users can add the GPU power they need.
I don't think people are looking for a complete redesign, or something revolutionary at WWDC - at least I'm not. While there are aspects of the MBP that I don't like, I'd be happy if they addressed the fragile keyboard. While the lack of HDMI and the SD card slot is an issue, the show stopper for me is the keyboard. My faith in Apple's quality is shaken.
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