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Waiting for the 2018 MBP

Appleaker said:
Yes, the first 4 have been announced but remember that it's not the entire lineup, there are more 15W models not to mention the 28W models. 28W will also be KBL-R. Personally I wouldn't mind either way because Apple could implement a 15W dGPU.
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There apparently will be some 8th gen at 10 nm, and CFL 14nm++ is said to be more efficient than first CNL 10nm.
I don't know if these U-Series KBL-R are still 14nm+ but supposing they are, I'm not sure if 14nm++ will be enough to make 15W 4C/8T chips with GT3e.
Now of course, we can also imagine (!) Apple dropping a bomb with home-brewed low-power dGPU next year, but I don't think their work on the GPU field will be used for anything that's not an iOS-based device.
 
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chleuasme said:
There apparently will be some 8th gen at 10 nm, and CFL 14nm++ is said to be more efficient than first CNL 10nm.
I don't know if these U-Series KBL-R are still 14nm+ but supposing they are, I'm not sure if 14nm++ will be enough to make 15W 4C/8T chips with GT3e.
Now of course, we can also imagine (!) Apple dropping a bomb with home-brewed low-power dGPU next year, but I don't think their work on the GPU field will be used for anything that's not an iOS-based device.
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Yeah, I believe it's just the 5W chips at 10nm. The whole lineups a bit confusing right now so hopefully we get more clarity later today. I agree, they're more likely to use an offering from AMD or (hopefully Nvidia). Nvidia has the better performance per watt across the line I believe, and they're MX150 can be lowered to a 15W TDP so I am hopeful that happens. Even so that'd be a higher end model so it remains to be seen what they'll do with GT3e in quad-core U chips. However I did read somewhere that there will be quad-cores with GT3e, perhaps they are 28W only. In which case Apple could take either path, I am hoping for the lower TDP an dGPU.
 
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I recall that over 17 years ago, when Intel announced new chips, manufacturers such as Apple and IBM Thinkpad released new laptops around the same time. So, manufacturers these days do not do this anymore?
 
hajime said:
I recall that over 17 years ago, when Intel announced new chips, manufacturers such as Apple and IBM Thinkpad released new laptops around the same time. So, manufacturers these days do not do this anymore?
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Some do, some don't. Apple haven't recently. But, this is the first cpu in years with a big performance increase so who knows what will happen.
 
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chleuasme said:
So the first four 8th generation 15W models called Kaby Lake-R will be the i5-8250U, i5-8350U, i7-8550U, and i7-8650U, ranging from 1.6/3.4 GHz to 1.9/4.2GHz, and with only a GT2 HD 620 iGPU:
https://www.notebookcheck.net/Intel...by-Lake-R-series-launches-today.241768.0.html

These KBL-R chips aren't going in a rMBP13. Still waiting to see what will be done with the 28W 8th gen models.
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The non touch bar models use 15W chips, so it will probably be one of those.
 
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Mr. Dee said:
I wonder if Apple might take the plunge and slip in a refresh calling it the Late 2017.

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/201...essors-are-just-updated-7th-generation-chips/
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Doubt it, neither should we even expect them given they just refreshed them in June.

I think Apple is waiting for CFL with GT3e graphics and LPDDR4 ram, neither of which is available yet. I think by mid next year is when we'll see these new MBPs and I think Cannonlake will be reserved for the MacBooks, not Pros.
 
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I'm curious how much thermal throttling you'd see with a quad core / iris 28w chip on a 13" macbook. Might be difficult to maintain. (almost wondering if the thermal window will end up with 4 slow cores which could be slower than 2 fast ones)
 
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B3yondL said:
Doubt it, neither should we even expect them given they just refreshed them in June.

I think Apple is waiting for CFL with GT3e graphics and LPDDR4 ram, neither of which is available yet. I think by mid next year is when we'll see these new MBPs and I think Cannonlake will be reserved for the MacBooks, not Pros.
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Kaby Lake was launched in January and Apple refreshed their line up in June. So, 6 month wait could mean a likely refresh for January. But its the launch of Cannon Lake that concerns me. Would Apple skip KB Refresh or just take them as they come?
 
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Mr. Dee said:
Kaby Lake was launched in January and Apple refreshed their line up in June. So, 6 month wait could mean a likely refresh for January. But its the launch of Cannon Lake that concerns me. Would Apple skip KB Refresh or just take them as they come?
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I don't know the timelines but I know Kaby Lake was launched prior to January 2017. It's just that the appropriate chips weren't available then. Like the case now, the appropriate CFL chips aren't available (lacking lpddr4/gt3e).

My guess is CFL MBPs would come either in spring event or WWDC of next year, depending on when the appropriate CFL chips are out.
 
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If you look back at when quad core became a thing in MacBook Pro 15", about seven years ago, the amount of heat it had to dispatch of was high, and the laptop was very hot. I had one of the first Sandy Bridge 17", and the fan was almost always on, especially when webpages got filled with js, video and other components that ramped up demand for power. The 2016-2017 Sandy Bridge and Kaby Lake is first relatively cool and silent quad core machines with a dGPU out from Apple ever. I think it will take a few generations for quad core to reach the same levels of low thermal and less throttling within the range of 15-28 watt and to get future CPU generations to comfortable perform in a smaller chassis like the 13".

If it took mobile quad core CPUs half a decade to operate inaudible and cool, it will probably take a few years until the step feels complete with the 13" MacBook Pro.
 
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Mr. Dee said:
Kaby Lake was launched in January and Apple refreshed their line up in June. So, 6 month wait could mean a likely refresh for January. But its the launch of Cannon Lake that concerns me. Would Apple skip KB Refresh or just take them as they come?
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My prediction is a somewhat quite spec bump tot he 13"'s in Stepember or October. Why ? Apple simply can't ignore other manufacturers starting to ship 13" quad cores. Also the just released 13" is in the refurb store and the 15" is not.
 
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doitdada said:
If you look back at when quad core became a thing in MacBook Pro 15", about seven years ago, the amount of heat it had to dispatch of was high, and the laptop was very hot. I had one of the first Sandy Bridge 17", and the fan was almost always on, especially when webpages got filled with js, video and other components that ramped up demand for power. The 2016-2017 Sandy Bridge and Kaby Lake is first relatively cool and silent quad core machines with a dGPU out from Apple ever. I think it will take a few generations for quad core to reach the same levels of low thermal and less throttling within the range of 15-28 watt and to get future CPU generations to comfortable perform in a smaller chassis like the 13".

If it took mobile quad core CPUs half a decade to operate inaudible and cool, it will probably take a few years until the step feels complete with the 13" MacBook Pro.
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This is my biggest fear. I'm so sick and tired of loud fans on laptops.
 
The Mercurian said:
My prediction is a somewhat quite spec bump tot he 13"'s in Stepember or October. Why ? Apple simply can't ignore other manufacturers starting to ship 13" quad cores. Also the just released 13" is in the refurb store and the 15" is not.
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It really would look bad to see DELL, HP, Lenovo's obliterating Apple's gen 1 KB's using KB-R's in speed test. Not to mention, a lot of users switch platform on a whim; I'm sure Apple wants to keep users who just want faster CPUs happy.
 
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Mr. Dee said:
It really would look bad to see DELL, HP, Lenovo's obliterating Apple's gen 1 KB's using KB-R's in speed test. Not to mention, a lot of users switch platform on a whim; I'm sure Apple wants to keep users who just want faster CPUs happy.
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I really doubt Apple will downgrade to an Intel UHD 620 in the 13” MacBook Pro.

Do you think that is a barrier?
 
NathanD said:
I also doubt Apple will put an Intel UHD + dGPU (like Geforce MX150) on a 13" MBP, so I think they'll wait for Coffee Lake CPUs with Iris.
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I tend to agree... who knows what they will do, but regardless of thermals, I wonder if they could even fit an MX150 into the current 13" design. The CPU is sandwiched right between the fans in the touch bar model.
 
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B3yondL said:
Doubt it, neither should we even expect them given they just refreshed them in June.

I think Apple is waiting for CFL with GT3e graphics and LPDDR4 ram, neither of which is available yet. I think by mid next year is when we'll see these new MBPs and I think Cannonlake will be reserved for the MacBooks, not Pros.
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Yeah, and I honestly am not in the 32GB of (Apple) RAM camp. I mean sure if they "allowed" us to throw in some 3rd party RAM of our own, that's would be AWESOME!, but er? that AIN'T GONNA happen, those days are long gone! I honestly can afford:

$500 every year (Watch)
$2500 every 2 years (MacBook Pro)
$3000 every 4 years (Mac Pro)
$1000 every 5 years (iPad Pro)
$1000 every 2 years? for 16GB of RAM? a NAH!!!

(500+1250+750+200) = $2700 per YEAR APPLE BUDGET
+$500 is like a new 2TB SSD? every year,
I'd rather get that then +256GB to the internal SSD
and +16GB to RAM (making it 32GB)

We'll see what happens when RAM is GONE!
 
hajime said:
How likely will Nvidia GPU be used in 2018 models?
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It is all but certain that Apple will stick with AMD. Radeon Pro (Polaris 11) in the MacBook Pros and new iMacs, Radeon Vega in the upcoming iMac Pro, FCPX is highly optimized for AMD cards, etc...

It is a virtual certainty that the 15" 2018 MacBook Pros will use AMD chips. I'm hoping for a mobile version of Radeon Vega.
 
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ls1dreams said:
I'm curious how much thermal throttling you'd see with a quad core / iris 28w chip on a 13" macbook. Might be difficult to maintain. (almost wondering if the thermal window will end up with 4 slow cores which could be slower than 2 fast ones)
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I'm guessing if Intel has decided to go for it then it's because they have tested and 4 cores running more slowly are more powerful than two running faster, even taking throttling into account. Maybe if only one or two cores are being utilised it will be able to ramp up higher than if all 4 are active?
 
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