What to expect in the second Gen Retina MacBook (Merged)

[ctyrider]

There would be a one-generation transition period where a) the Lightning headphone port is unleashed on the world and b) the 3.5 jack remains for existing headphones. Say, the iPhone 7 and 7S. By the time iPhone 8 rolls around 2 years later, they'd get rid of the 3.5 forever.

I doubt it. As long as 3.5mm port remains - there is no reason for anyone to make a transition to Lightning. Besides, the existing Lightning port already supports digital audio output, and there are a few headphone makers that offer it. Only a complete removal of 3.5mm port will force the transition.

I fully expect Apple to drop 3.5mm port in iPhone 7.

 

[boltjames]

I doubt it. As long as 3.5mm port remains - there is no reason for anyone to make a transition to Lightning. Besides, the existing Lightning port already supports digital audio output, and there are a few headphone makers that offer it. Only a complete removal of 3.5mm port will force the transition.

I fully expect Apple to drop 3.5mm port in iPhone 7.

Headphones aren't something that a small portion of the world own; not only does 100% of the smartphone/notebook population own them but they own multiples, and add in speakers, you're probably looking at a multiple of 3x per household worldwide.

And unlike, say, Dropbox which is more convenient and less expensive than its older USB thumb-drive cousin, all replacement technologies for the 3.5mm port are less convenient and more expensive. Bluetooth or Lightning aren't going to be quickly or easily migrated over, no one is going to be in a rush to replace all of their headphones and speakers for a wireless concept that reduces fidelity, forces expense, forces weight, and adds the inconvenience of recharging time.

The 3.5mm jack is here to stay, at least until Apple starts packing in Lightning ported headphones for a generation or two of the iPhone, it's most popular product. The rest of this talk is just silly. This isn't like USB-C on a RMB. This is something else entirely.

BJ

 

[ctyrider]

Headphones aren't something that a small portion of the world own; not only does 100% of the smartphone/notebook population own them but they own multiples, and add in speakers, you're probably looking at a multiple of 3x per household worldwide. [..]

The 3.5mm jack is here to stay, at least until Apple starts packing in Lightning ported headphones for a generation or two of the iPhone, it's most popular product. The rest of this talk is just silly. This isn't like USB-C on a RMB. This is something else entirely.

I get all that, and it's all been discussed ad nauseum.. However, this is Apple we're talking about.. and if there is anyone who is willing and able to force a transition away from a multi-decade old headphone jack standard - it is them.

I believe what will happen is - iPhone 7 will introduce an an updated Lightning port. The updated port will support high-res (96kHz/24-bit) audio, as well as analog output. The analog output will enable DAC-less headphones using Lightning connector, as well as low-cost Lightning-to-3.5mm adapters to support the transition.

Apple will drop 3.5mm port from iPhone 7, and the bundled earbuds will ship with Lightning connector. Lighting-to-3.5mm adapter will be sold separately for $9.95. There is a small chance they will include the adapter with the first 3.5mm-jack-less iPhone, but I doubt it.

Apple will market Lightning Audio as offering several benefits such as improved sound quality (support for high-res audio), support for headphones with noise cancellation, better durability, and space savings.

Again, just my prediction, but you will see

 

[navaira]

Lighting-to-3.5mm adapter will be sold separately for $9.95.

Come on. Like Apple sells anything for $9.95. $29.95 is more of a possibility.

 

[ctyrider]

Come on. Like Apple sells anything for $9.95. $29.95 is more of a possibility.

They do - MagSafe to MagSafe2 adapter is $9.95. If the adapters are passive, as I predict.. $10 price tag is not unlikely. And it will quell some of the backlash for those who want to use 3.5mm headphones.

 

[navaira]

Fair deal. I didn't know a MagSafe to MagSafe2 adapter existed. I still think though that this one will cost $29.95 and come with a 10-minute interview with Jony Ive about how it is the most beautiful, the most functional and best designed adapter anybody ever created.

Oh, yes, and thinnest.

 

[zhenya]

I get all that, and it's all been discussed ad nauseum.. However, this is Apple we're talking about.. and if there is anyone who is willing and able to force a transition away from a multi-decade old headphone jack standard - it is them.

I believe what will happen is - iPhone 7 will introduce an an updated Lightning port. The updated port will support high-res (96kHz/24-bit) audio, as well as analog output. The analog output will enable DAC-less headphones using Lightning connector, as well as low-cost Lightning-to-3.5mm adapters to support the transition.

Apple will drop 3.5mm port from iPhone 7, and the bundled earbuds will ship with Lightning connector. Lighting-to-3.5mm adapter will be sold separately for $9.95. There is a small chance they will include the adapter with the first 3.5mm-jack-less iPhone, but I doubt it.

Apple will market Lightning Audio as offering several benefits such as improved sound quality (support for high-res audio), support for headphones with noise cancellation, better durability, and space savings.

Again, just my prediction, but you will see

Lightning already supports high resolution connections to external DAC's. You can use a player like the Onkyo HF app, load up high resolution tracks, and connect a compatible DAC for high resolution listening right now. The headphone jack is only limited because Apple has chosen not to offer a compatible DAC inside the phone. I would be very surprised to see them offer analog output from the lightning jack because they didn't bother to do it when they first released lightning when the cost of conversion was the highest (ie. everyone had 30-pin accessories that now needed an expensive lightning to 30-pin adapter that included another DAC just to use them).

Frankly I'm going to be extremely disappointed in Apple if they make this move. I have yet to see a SINGLE compelling argument for why they should do this. It offers NO benefit to the end user and it would speak volumes to me as to the direction of Apple today if they still push this through.

 

[ctyrider]

Lightning already supports high resolution connections to external DAC's. You can use a player like the Onkyo HF app, load up high resolution tracks, and connect a compatible DAC for high resolution listening right now. The headphone jack is only limited because Apple has chosen not to offer a compatible DAC inside the phone.

Yes, but that's how I think Apple will "sweeten the deal" for this transition. Instead of external DACs and specialized apps, you now get fully integrated support for high-res audio.. And new iPhone is now capable of outputting high-res directly to headphones.. via "new and improved" Lightening audio output of course.

I have yet to see a SINGLE compelling argument for why they should do this. It offers NO benefit to the end user and it would speak volumes to me as to the direction of Apple today if they still push this through.

That's a pretty narrow view to be honest.. "Smart" audio port like Lightning can potentially often a number of benefits (other than the obvious space savings which are crucial in smartphones). For instance, the ability to provide small amount of power to "smart headphones" for noise cancellation.. Or bi-directional interface, which will enable headphones interact with the audio apps. There are probably features we can't even think of, as we have been stuck with the decades old analog jack.

 

[boltjames]

I get all that, and it's all been discussed ad nauseum.. However, this is Apple we're talking about.. and if there is anyone who is willing and able to force a transition away from a multi-decade old headphone jack standard - it is them.

I believe what will happen is - iPhone 7 will introduce an an updated Lightning port. The updated port will support high-res (96kHz/24-bit) audio, as well as analog output. The analog output will enable DAC-less headphones using Lightning connector, as well as low-cost Lightning-to-3.5mm adapters to support the transition.

Apple will drop 3.5mm port from iPhone 7, and the bundled earbuds will ship with Lightning connector. Lighting-to-3.5mm adapter will be sold separately for $9.95. There is a small chance they will include the adapter with the first 3.5mm-jack-less iPhone, but I doubt it.

Apple will market Lightning Audio as offering several benefits such as improved sound quality (support for high-res audio), support for headphones with noise cancellation, better durability, and space savings.

Again, just my prediction, but you will see

Your prediction is halfway right- Apple will introduce Lightning headphones, all signs of patents and iTunes HD point to this. But the other half is sheer madness. They'll keep the 3.5mm jack right where it is on the iPhone 7 as Lightning has no traction and is a proprietary standard others won't be quick to embrace. They have very little to gain and an enormous risk of loss doing it your way.

Apple is bigger than Exxon. This isn't some quaint idealistic startup.

BJ

 

[ctyrider]

Your prediction is halfway right- Apple will introduce Lightning headphones, all signs of patents and iTunes HD point to this. But the other half is sheer madness. They'll keep the 3.5mm jack right where it is on the iPhone 7 as Lightning has no traction and is a proprietary standard others won't be quick to embrace. They have very little to gain and an enormous risk of loss doing it your way.

There is almost ZERO chance that Apple will bundle Lightening EarPods AND keep 3.5mm port at the same time. Apple is all about removing ports and squeezing every nanometer of space out of their devices.

Apple could care less if you can't use your 3rd-party headphones with the latest iPhone. As far as they're concerned - they will have solved this problem by including Lightning EarPods. They will also transition the entire Beats product light to Lightning. For everything else - there is Lightning-to-3.5mm adapter they will be happy to sell you for a few bucks.

That's the approach Apple has taken when eliminating every other (what they deem) "legacy" port in the past.. and that's the approach they will take with 3.5mm jack.

 

[zhenya]

That's a pretty narrow view to be honest.. "Smart" audio port like Lightning can potentially often a number of benefits (other than the obvious space savings which are crucial in smartphones). For instance, the ability to provide small amount of power to "smart headphones" for noise cancellation.. Or bi-directional interface, which will enable headphones interact with the audio apps. There are probably features we can't even think of, as we have been stuck with the decades old analog jack.

I'm skeptical. Your phone and its tiny battery is now supposed to power noise canceling headphones that often require a couple of AA's and still don't exactly last that long on those? I hope that Apple is exploring the idea of this but backtracks unless they can offer something truly valuable and compelling in return. So far I'm not seeing it.

 

[boltjames]

There is almost ZERO chance that Apple will bundle Lightening EarPods AND keep 3.5mm port at the same time. Apple is all about removing ports and squeezing every nanometer of space out of their devices.

Apple could care less if you can't use your 3rd-party headphones with the latest iPhone. As far as they're concerned - they will have solved this problem by including Lightning EarPods. They will also transition the entire Beats product light to Lightning. For everything else - there is Lightning-to-3.5mm adapter they will be happy to sell you for a few bucks.

That's the approach Apple has taken when eliminating every other (what they deem) "legacy" port in the past.. and that's the approach they will take with 3.5mm jack.

The iPhone is not the typical Apple niche product. It's the world's best selling consumer electronics product, it's the most important smartphone in the world, it is the lifesblood of Apple's investors, it is the touchstone of their exceedingly tenuous stock price.

Apple could care less if the millions of people with $350 Bose headphones and $200 Beats headphones are suddenly forced to throw them in the trash? LOL. You bet your life they do. My family, we have 6 iPhone's and 8 iPod's and 4 iPad's and maybe 30 headphones floating about the house. When those phones come up from contract and it's time for the iPhone 7 and 7S, I'm not buying each kid another $300 headphone chief.

You are acting like it's 1999 and Apple has some niche decision to make. It's 2015. BMW isn't removing tires from its cars, McDonald's isn't removing cheese from the Big Mac, and Apple isn't killing the headphone jack on the iPhone. Have you ever worked a day in your life? I ask because you're not thinking like a businessman. I've got a 10 year old daughter who still believes in Santa Claus, this conversation is surprisingly familiar.

BJ

 

[ctyrider]

Apple could care less if the millions of people with $350 Bose headphones and $200 Beats headphones are suddenly forced to throw them in the trash? LOL. You bet your life they do. My family, we have 6 iPhone's and 8 iPod's and 4 iPad's and maybe 30 headphones floating about the house. When those phones come up from contract and it's time for the iPhone 7 and 7S, I'm not buying each kid another $300 headphone chief.

Your reaction is a bit hysterical. No one needs to throw their existing $300 headphones in the trash. The issue of backwards compatibility is easily solved via a small Lightning-to-3.5mm adapter.. Which Apple may even include with iPhone 7 as a sign of good will, as I speculated in my previous post. Just like they used to bundle microDVI-VGA adapters with brand new MacBooks, when they first dropped VGA port... Not the end of the world.

Have you ever worked a day in your life? I ask because you're not thinking like a businessman.

You have no idea what I do, and what I have done, so let's just leave it at that, OK? And if Apple was run by "businessmen" as opposed to product purists (like Jobs and Ivy) - your MacBook would still come with CD/DVD drive and VGA ports.

 

[boltjames]

Your reaction is a bit hysterical. No one needs to throw their existing $300 headphones in the trash. The issue of backwards compatibility is easily solved via a small Lightning-to-3.5mm adapter.. Which Apple may even include with iPhone 7 as a sign of good will, as I speculated in my previous post. Just like they used to bundle microDVI-VGA adapters with brand new MacBooks, when they first dropped VGA port... Not the end of the world.

A free Lightning to 3.5mm adapter? LOL. More money that Apple would be spending for no reason. I can see Tim Cook at the board meeting right now, pitching that idea.

MacBooks are less than 8% of the computer market. Apple had the courage to take such bold risks and had to add VGA adapters back in the day just to compete. The iPhone is the world's most popular consumer electronic product, they have sold 822,000,000 units since its inception, all of those legacy consumers re-up their contracts every 2 years, Apple cannot do anything to alienate them at all. It's a beast of a number. One wrong iOS or iPhone move, boom, Apple will cease to exist. It's not 1999. It's 2015. Apple isn't Uber. Apple is Exxon.

You have no idea what I do, and what I have done, so let's just leave it at that, OK? And if Apple was run by "businessmen" as opposed to product purists (like Jobs and Ivy) - your MacBook would still come with CD/DVD drive and VGA ports.

Pay attention to your examples because they answer your questions and end this argument. The CD/DVD drive and the VGA port were both replaced by a readily available non-proprietary technology that was cheaper and far more convenient for consumers. The cost of the notebooks came down, the weight/thickness came down, the thumb drive was infinitely less expensive than spindles of discs, getting a file from Point A to Point B took seconds instead of minutes, etc. To this day HDMI cables are cheaper than VGA cables and the quality took a quantum leap in the process.

Killing the 3.5mm jack and forcing consumers to Bluetooth or Lightning accomplishes nothing for Apple and would anger their fragile and finicky smartphone audience. Unlike the liberating move from CD/DVD to USB, consumers would have headphones that are heavier, require frequent charging, require carrying chargers, require disposable batteries, have pairing issues, have interference issues, are very expensive, and have lesser sound quality than what they used to receive for free as a pack-in.

There is no evidence that the world wants to lose the wires at such a hardship and compromise and, more importantly, there is no business case for Apple that shows this type of dramatic risk would provide any reward. Higher fidelity iTunes files and expensive headphones aren't the things that the world is clamoring for and there isn't any money in its pursuit. When Apple goes after HD audio and Lightning connectivity it will be an addition to the 3.5mm port which is universal and slim and cheap. Let's discuss something more realistic. Like the Easter Bunny.

BJ

 

[ctyrider]

Killing the 3.5mm jack and forcing consumers to Bluetooth or Lightning accomplishes nothing for Apple and would anger their fragile and finicky smartphone audience. Unlike the liberating move from CD/DVD to USB, consumers would have headphones that are heavier, require frequent charging, require carrying chargers, require disposable batteries, have pairing issues, have interference issues, are very expensive, and have lesser sound quality than what they used to receive for free as a pack-in.

We will just have to agree to disagree.

All the issues you raise above are attributable to Bluetooth headsets, which will remain entirely optional. The included Lightning EarPods will function equally or better than the legacy 3.5mm jack EarPods.

Also, it may come as a surprise to you, but majority of iPhone owners don't spend $300 on audiophile-grade headphones to plug into their phones. 9 out of 10 of iPhone owners that I know, and see on the streets every day are using the bundled EarPods. For those people (which represent the mass market) - the transition from 3.5mm to Lightning EarPods will be a non-event.

There will undoubtedly be a vocal minority who will gripe about spending a few bucks on an adapter to make their old headphones work with the brand new iPhone7 (that is if Apple doesn't bundle it). The gripes will go on and die down after a few months, just like with every other change Apple has made (e.g. change from 30-pin to Lightening connector).

At the end of the day - 3.5mm jack has to go. It's an eight of an inch thick, and over half an inch deep (just think about that for a moment!). It's an outdated technology, and it occupies significant amount of precious iPhone chassis space. There is no doubt that Apple is actively devising the ways to drop the 3.5mm jack from their iOS products. So it's not a question of IF 3.5mm jack will disappear, it's only a question of WHEN. I predict it will be September 2016, but time will tell.

 

[kiranmk2]

I think you are maybe over stating the issue. IF (an that's a big if) the next iPhone ditches the 3.5 mm jack, then Apple will ensure it comes with Lightning-based Earpods in the box so every owner will have a set. Those who see the need to spend more on alternative headphones will certainly be able to afford even upto $20/£15 for an adapter to use their existing 3.5 mm headphones.

Personally, I'm wondering if Apple will ditch Lightning and move to USB-C. I know Phil Schiller siad Lightning would be around for 10 years, but USB-C just seems like such a good option - it would add a second port to the rMB, add compatibility between the iOS devices and a whole load more cables and peripherals. I don't think there would be such as fuss as Lightning hasn't taken off in the same way as 30-pin did - things like Bluetooth, Airplay and CarPlay mean there are a lot fewer Lighning docks around.

 

[boltjames]

We will just have to agree to disagree.

All the issues you raise above are attributable to Bluetooth headsets, which will remain entirely optional. The included Lightning EarPods will function equally or better than the legacy 3.5mm jack EarPods.

Also, it may come as a surprise to you, but majority of iPhone owners don't spend $300 on audiophile-grade headphones to plug into their phones. 9 out of 10 of iPhone owners that I know, and see on the streets every day are using the bundled EarPods. For those people (which represent the mass market) - the transition from 3.5mm to Lightning EarPods will be a non-event.

There will undoubtedly be a vocal minority who will gripe about spending a few bucks on an adapter to make their old headphones work with the brand new iPhone7 (that is if Apple doesn't bundle it). The gripes will go on and die down after a few months, just like with every other change Apple has made (e.g. change from 30-pin to Lightening connector).

At the end of the day - 3.5mm jack has to go. It's an eight of an inch thick, and over half an inch deep (just think about that for a moment!). It's an outdated technology, and it occupies significant amount of precious iPhone chassis space. There is no doubt that Apple is actively devising the ways to drop the 3.5mm jack from their iOS products. So it's not a question of IF 3.5mm jack will disappear, it's only a question of WHEN. I predict it will be September 2016, but time will tell.

The iPhone 6 is 6.9mm high, the iPod Nano is 5.4mm high. That's a difference of 28%. The iPhone has a lot of thickness to shed before it has to worry about the height of the 3.5mm headphone jack. Batteries, glass, speakers, cameras, Apple has a whole lot to downsize before they get to the universal headphone connector as an impediment.

The thing you miss (amongst many) is that the 3.5mm jack is the only port on every electronic device that costs nothing, has no royalty. The HDMI people, the USB coalition, the SD consortium, the Blueooth group, they all get a piece of almost every consumer electronic device made today in the neighborhood of 1% to 2%. You want an Apple 30 pin connector or a Lightning connector on your speaker? It's $1 per unit. The 3.5mm jack, no cost, it's free to use. Same for the jack on the headphones. Sure, Apple can create a proprietary Lightning connector protocol, but why would Bose want to pay a royalty for it? What's the benefit? To help Apple sell HD audio files? Are you that into supposed higher quality audio that you're going to lay down another $300 for a supposed 'premium' headphone?

Nothing competes with "free" in an industry with wafer thin margins like consumer electronics. Customers like free earbuds, manufacturers like free plug-in technologies, retailers like products with universal connectivity. Apple will have both a Lightning headphone port and the ubiquitous 3.5mm headphone port. The math says so.

BJ

 

[ctyrider]

Nothing competes with "free" in an industry with wafer thin margins like consumer electronics. Customers like free earbuds, manufacturers like free plug-in technologies, retailers like products with universal connecttivity. Apple will have both a Lightning headphone port and the ubiquitous 3.5mm headphone port.

Your assumption that Apple's top priority lies with preserving backward connectivity with a de-facto universal standard is flawed.. And, in fact, it shows a fundamental lack of understanding how Apple operates and how they make product decisions. Apple's product design priorities have always centered around simplification, removing (what they deem) unnecessary parts, thinning and streamlining the hardware, as well as pushing their own (sometimes proprietary) standards. If "universal standards" align with Apple's own priorities - that's great.. If not, Apple will have zero qualms with dropping those standards and replacing them with their own.

The fact that the 3.5mm jack is license-free changes is completely irrelevant to Apple, and changes nothing in this equation. Once Apple moves audio out to Lightning and starts shipping their own Lightning EarPods - 3.5mm port becomes an appendage that serves no useful purpose and needs to be removed. An extra hole in a beautiful iPhone that doesn't need to be there - making a future iPhone water-proof will play a role here as well.

The argument about the size of 3.5mm jack is equally irrelevant. Whatever amount of space it takes - it's too much for Apple, and they'd rather do something else with this space (whether it's thinness or adding extra battery or some additional sensors that don't exist now). Same reasoning why they've been pushing the carriers all these years to drop hardware SIM, and replace it with a software based equivalemnt.

It also makes no sense for Apple to continue providing backwards compatibility to Bose and other 3rd-party headphones makers ad infinitum. In case you haven't heard - Apple has now owns this little headphone company called Beats. This gives them even more leeway to push ahead with Lightning standard, Bose and Sennheiser be damned. From Apple's perspective - if Bose wants to keep marketing their headphones to iPhone owners - it's up to Bose to include an adapter worth a couple of bucks. Surely, if you're selling a $300 headphones - adding a $3.50 adapter won't break your (or your customers') bank.

You can disagree with this all you want, but that's how Apple operates.. And they WILL be dropping 3.5mm jack the moment Lightning EarPods become a thing.

 

[boltjames]

You can disagree with this all you want, but that's how Apple operates.. And they WILL be dropping 3.5mm jack the moment Lightning EarPods become a thing.

That's how Apple operates back in 1998 and on a niche product line where they have tiny market share. That's what you can't wrap your brain around- when it comes to Smartphones, Apple is Microsoft, Apple is McDonald's. They're not the tiny little 8% MacBook company going up against Goliath. They are Goliath.

Lightning headphones will become a minor thing in 2016, the 3.5mm jack will not be replaced until there has been a critical mass of popularity in Lightning connected headphones or some breakthru in Bluetooth or NFC sound quality and battery life. I'm thinking 2020 at the earliest, and that's if everything breaks right.

Just like Apple won't drop $0.99 cent AAC files for $2.99 HD AAC files outright, both standards for headphone connectivity will coexist until one proves massively more important than another, until some Lightning headphone becomes the must-have accessory that gets kids and adults so excited that they are willing to trash the dozens of cans they have in the closet.

BJ

 

[ctyrider]

That's how Apple operates back in 1998 and on a niche product line where they have tiny market share. That's what you can't wrap your brain around- when it comes to Smartphones, Apple is Microsoft, Apple is McDonald's. They're not the tiny little 8% MacBook company going up against Goliath. They are Goliath.

No. The fact that Apple is a dominant player makes it MORE not LESS likely that they will kick 3.5mm to the curb and push ahead with their own thing. They've done it before with 30-pin and Lightning connectors (as opposed to say microUSB).. they have done it with NanoSIM (and soon software-only SIM).. they will do it with Audio out.

Lightning Audio will be just another thing that will differentiate iPhone from Samsung, LG and the rest.

Lightning headphones will become a minor thing in 2016, the 3.5mm jack will not be replaced until there has been a critical mass of popularity in Lightning connected headphones or some breakthru in Bluetooth or NFC sound quality and battery life. I'm thinking 2020 at the earliest, and that's if everything breaks right.

No. Apple doesn't need "critical mass of popularity" for Lightning Audio before throwing their weight behind it. As I already pointed out - they'll cover their customers on the low end with bundled Lightning EarPods.. and on the high end with Beats. 3rd party headphone makers will get on board, or they won't sell to iPhone customers (which will only mean more Beats sales for Apple).

Just like Apple won't drop $0.99 cent AAC files for $2.99 HD AAC files outright, both standards for headphone connectivity will coexist until one proves massively more important than another

That example makes absolutely no sense in the context of this discussion.. It costs Apple exactly nothing to continue selling low-bitrate and high-bitrate AAC tracks. Continuing to integrate 3.5mm audio outputs in an iPhone carries major drawbacks to Apple, and to future evolution of iPhone design.

 

[boltjames]

They've done it before with 30-pin and Lightning connectors (as opposed to say microUSB)..

The 30 Pin and Lightning connectors are proprietary to Apple on one end and universal to USB on the other end. That's not closely comparable to what you're speculating. One can plug any old iPhone or new iPhone into any notebook, everyone has USB ports on multiple computers in the home. A Lightning headphone can only work on an iPhone and the legacy headphones about the house would become obsolete. Very big difference.

No. Apple doesn't need "critical mass of popularity" for Lightning Audio before throwing their weight behind it. As I already pointed out - they'll cover their customers on the low end with bundled Lightning EarPods.. and on the high end with Beats. 3rd party headphone makers will get on board, or they won't sell to iPhone customers (which will only mean more Beats sales for Apple).

Those who only use Apple's free earbuds wouldn't care about a switch, but the millions of customers with better cans would be needlessly angered. There is no reason for it. Again, there is no gain to thickness by removing the port (it's already 28% thinner than the iPhone itself) and there is no win to battery life or royalty avoidance either. Apple can achieve its (your) goal by simply doing nothing. Lightning already exists on all iPhones, 3.5mm already exists on all iPhones, they will continue to do so forever. Lightning will never make it onto Android or onto Windows notebooks, therefore it will never achieve the mass it needs to replace 3.5mm.

That example makes absolutely no sense in the context of this discussion.. It costs Apple exactly nothing to continue selling low-bitrate and high-bitrate AAC tracks. Continuing to integrate 3.5mm audio outputs in an iPhone carries major drawbacks to Apple.

It makes perfect sense in the context of this discussion. It would be lunacy for Apple to take away the established standard ($0.99 cent songs) for the risky new idea ($2.99 HD songs) when both can co-exist without any negative impact to sales. By creating a niche market for HD audio tracks and HD Lightning headphones, Apple can add a nice new feature for those who want it and maintain a common-sense connection to customers who could care less.

BJ

 

[ctyrider]

The 30 Pin and Lightning connectors are proprietary to Apple on one end and universal to USB on the other end. That's not closely comparable to what you're speculating.

It is exactly comparable. Had Apple gone with microUSB - you would've been able to charge your iPhone with "industry standard" microUSB cables or docks.. or use microUSB chargers in the airport. But now you have to carry a proprietary Lightning to USB cable.. And airports and hotels have to provide Apple-compatible chargers, and then replace 30-pin ones with Lightning. Included Lightning-to-USB cable is analogous to Lightning-to-3.5mm adapter.

there is no gain to thickness by removing the port (it's already 28% thinner than the iPhone itself) and there is no win to battery life

Again, I disagree with your "no benefit" argument.. And apparently so does Apple, if all the recent leaks are true. If there was "no win", they would not be actively pursuing integrating Audio-out into Lightning port. But they are.

 

[boltjames]

Again, I disagree with your "no benefit" argument.. And apparently so does Apple, if all the recent leaks are true. If there was "no win", they would not be actively pursuing integrating Audio-out into Lightning port. But they are.

The 'win' for Apple is an attempt to turn around their downtrending iTunes Music Store and combat Spotify by offering superior sounding songs. They'll release HD versions of AAC's and they'll claim that Lightning carries a bazillion more bits of data, will make fabulous Beats headphones, maybe even bring Quadraphonic or spectacular 5.1 back to life in the home.

But that's all it really needs to be. A next-gen option for audiophiles in an era of $350 premium headphones with the Beats By Apple brand. It's brilliant, actually. It doesn't mean the demise of the 3.5. It just means they're launching a more interesting option for those who care about audio quality.

BJ

 

[ctyrider]

But that's all it really needs to be. A next-gen option for audiophiles in an era of $350 premium headphones with the Beats By Apple brand. It's brilliant, actually. It doesn't mean the demise of the 3.5. It just means they're launching a more interesting option for those who care about audio quality.

I'll be stunned if Apple goes through all this trouble and still keeps the old 3.5mm jack. Especially, if what I speculated comes true - i.e. Apple enabling analog-out via Lightning and being able to offer small, passive and low-cost Lightning-to-3.5mm adapters.

We will know soon enough. It's been a fun debate.

 

[boltjames]

I'll be stunned if Apple goes through all this trouble and still keeps the old 3.5mm jack. Especially, if what I speculated comes true - i.e. Apple enabling analog-out via Lightning and being able to offer small, passive and low-cost Lightning-to-3.5mm adapters.

We will know soon enough. It's been a fun debate.

Agreed, enjoyed it. Have a good evening and a Happy New Year.

BJ