What would I miss going from Mac back to pc?

[zzzachi]

Erm, the new Mac Pro is much more expandable than the old one, they just moved to the external expandability as opposed to internal one. I have a legacy server running an old MP and a new one running the can and the new one is much more flexible.

well seems your definition of expandable is to plug in 10 devices and have a cable mess on your table.

my definition of expandable is to open my mac pro 2012 and have 1 ssd, 4 hard drives, 2 gpus. everything standard and upgradable to the state of the art for a good price.
i updated the xeons to the fastest possible model and upped my ram to 64gb.
my 2012 machine is probably way faster than yours now.
and hey, if i want cables for fun i can still plug in some stuff.

 

[BarracksSi]

well seems your definition of expandable is to plug in 10 devices and have a cable mess on your table.

Doesn't matter as much when the computer setup sits in one place all the time.

Should be easier to swap drives, etc., since you don't have to drag out a big chassis from under the table (unless you enjoy having a two-foot-square computer on top of your desk).

 

[leman]

well seems your definition of expandable is to plug in 10 devices and have a cable mess on your table

I am currently running over 80 Gb of storage from a cylinder MP, using multiple RAID units. I can't afford the downtime to open up the machine and tinker with it. Good for you if your setup is not mission critical, mine is. In an event if a hardware failure I can hot-swap drives or entire raid units or the server unit itself in seconds. All that you can't do with the old machine. Hence its less flexible. You can argue all you want about the convenience or inconvenience of having modular setups (and extra cables that come with them) but the fact is that the new machine can simply do more.

 

[zzzachi]

Doesn't matter as much when the computer setup sits in one place all the time.

Should be easier to swap drives, etc., since you don't have to drag out a big chassis from under the table (unless you enjoy having a two-foot-square computer on top of your desk).

well, it seems some enjoy to pay more and get less just if it it shiny and apple tells them how great it is.
but there are people who actually need to work with the hardware and they enjoy for example to have 16tb
of harddrives in a computer without any visible cables, and this for 650$ only.

@leman: if you need 80gb you use a nas, and and that is another topic.

nothing against you guys, but by luck you fit into the range of users that is happy with the shiny can.
i wonder how you react when apple cuts down the pro and there is just no (macos based) computer anymore that fits your need. the old pro did work for almost every profession, the new one just for a fraction.

 

[therealseebs]

I think the revelation that Apple's no longer got a separate macOS team at all tells us a lot about the prospective future of the platform.

 

[0989383]

This is what you'd miss:

You know that feeling when you turn on your Mac, launch some programmes to do something and then you're done?

That.

Problem free, seamless experiences. Replaced by .. Windows.

 

[zzzachi]

This is what you'd miss:

You know that feeling when you turn on your Mac, launch some programmes to do something and then you're done?

That.

Problem free, seamless experiences. Replaced by .. Windows.

well, that depends on if you can do on a Mac what you want to do.
or if you can afford to give your Mac way more time than a similar priced PC would take.
i'm a big Mac fan, but in the pro sector the disadvantage grew a lot since 2013...

 

[0989383]

well, that depends on if you can do on a Mac what you want to do.
or if you can afford to give your Mac way more time than a similar priced PC would take.
i'm a big Mac fan, but in the pro sector the disadvantage grew a lot since 2013...

Yeah, time's not a problem. A 2015 rMBP with older gen Intel processors can outperform a 2017 Kaby Lake i5 at the same export task.. Apple's optimisation is superb and definitely translates into the real world

 

[AFEPPL]

I run both and think you'd miss nothing tbh..
Just buy decent hardware like the surface.

 

[deany]

Really depends what programs you are using.
If your not using professional / heavy duty PC programs I would recommend a rMBP and Parallels.

I have the 2015 13" rMBP and use Parallels a lot for Legacy software (not gaming) on W10, W7 and XP and it really works well.

Best of both worlds.

 

[zzzachi]

Yeah, time's not a problem. A 2015 rMBP with older gen Intel processors can outperform a 2017 Kaby Lake i5 at the same export task.. Apple's optimisation is superb and definitely translates into the real world

well, good for you...
i want to render 3d vizualisations and since 2012 there is no mac that can compete with windows pcs anymore. so if 2018 doesnt bring a tower which is upgradeable with multiple standard (ati & nvidia) gpus, drives and memory, i'll switch to windows.

and from what i've seen from apple the last 3 years, i sadly doubt that they will release a proper workstation. i bet that they will release some odd, non standard modular system. basically a small box, most likely with a proprietary gpu thinking that offering egpu support will satisfy the people needing multiple gpus and cuda/nvidia.

 

[aevan]

well, it seems some enjoy to pay more and get less just if it it shiny and apple tells them how great it is.
but there are people who actually need to work with the hardware and they enjoy for example to have 16tb
of harddrives in a computer without any visible cables, and this for 650$ only.

@leman: if you need 80gb you use a nas, and and that is another topic.

nothing against you guys, but by luck you fit into the range of users that is happy with the shiny can.
i wonder how you react when apple cuts down the pro and there is just no (macos based) computer anymore that fits your need. the old pro did work for almost every profession, the new one just for a fraction.

Don't know what you base this on. With Macs coming with 18 cores, with modular designs, with external GPU support, good thermals, Apple is cramming fastest I/Os, fastest drives - why do you think they will "cut down the pro". This is just a tale some people like to tell.

 

[Queen6]

well, good for you...
i want to render 3d vizualisations and since 2012 there is no mac that can compete with windows pcs anymore. so if 2018 doesnt bring a tower which is upgradeable with multiple standard (ati & nvidia) gpus, drives and memory, i'll switch to windows.

and from what i've seen from apple the last 3 years, i sadly doubt that they will release a proper workstation. i bet that they will release some odd, non standard modular system. basically a small box, most likely with a proprietary gpu thinking that offering egpu support will satisfy the people needing multiple gpus and cuda/nvidia.

Think the same the best MP design was the Cheese Grater, next iteration may well be modular, equally very far from an open system, likely being locked down.

iMac Pro is a step in the right direction, equally yet another closed system. My own opinion is people are using high end iMac's in professional roles due to the expensive Trashcan Joke, not because they want an all in one and a sealed system.

Honestly don't get Apple, it's not like the consumer masses will be flocking to purchase a more open platform Mac Pro given the pricing, Apple should stop trying to confine and control at every single instance...

Q-6

 

[0002378]

I would miss shell scripting / Terminal. You can get cygwin for Windows, but it's not the same.

 

[0989383]

well, good for you...
i want to render 3d vizualisations and since 2012 there is no mac that can compete with windows pcs anymore. so if 2018 doesnt bring a tower which is upgradeable with multiple standard (ati & nvidia) gpus, drives and memory, i'll switch to windows.

and from what i've seen from apple the last 3 years, i sadly doubt that they will release a proper workstation. i bet that they will release some odd, non standard modular system. basically a small box, most likely with a proprietary gpu thinking that offering egpu support will satisfy the people needing multiple gpus and cuda/nvidia.

iMac Pro.

 

[HiRez]

1. Smooth scrolling, Windows can never get that right.
Trackpad + Gesture, that has always been macOS exclusive.
Its just amazing how Windows or Android could never get the damn scrolling feature right, is the algorithm really that hard?

So true, I've used so many Windows boxes at every price point and from every manufacturer and the trackpad and scrolling is always terrible. ALWAYS. Slow, laggy, stuttery, and the Win8+ UI doesn't help with all the goofy gestures near the sides of the screen always triggering stuff at bad times. Go to a coffee shop anywhere and look at the people with Macs and look at the people with Windows. Almost invariably, the Windows people with have a big ass mouse attached, even to ultraportables. And we know why. This alone keeps me from moving to Windows. There are other reasons but I can't get past that. Every version we're told it's better now, no this time we really mean it, but it's never true.

Android has gotten better, but it's still not as good as iOS.

 

[0989383]

So true, I've used so many Windows boxes at every price point and from every manufacturer and the trackpad and scrolling is always terrible. ALWAYS. Slow, laggy, stuttery, and the Win8+ UI doesn't help with all the goofy gestures near the sides of the screen always triggering stuff at bad times. Go to a coffee shop anywhere and look at the people with Macs and look at the people with Windows. Almost invariably, the Windows people with have a big ass mouse attached, even to ultraportables. And we know why. This alone keeps me from moving to Windows. There are other reasons but I can't get past that. Every version we're told it's better now, no this time we really mean it, but it's never true.

Android has gotten better, but it's still not as good as iOS.

Sure, Android is packed with features but it lacks stability, compatibility and long term support. Even on the high end phones. At least Windows fully works on every PC.. even if it performs like a POS.

 

[pika2000]

I'm using both Windows and OS X on daily basis. Things that immediately annoy me when going to Windows:
- awful tiny trackpad. And yes, I am using the Surface Pro 4. Its trackpad is "better" than most other Windows laptops out there, but it's no comparison to the trackpads on Macs.
- the need to use a mouse. Because of the awful trackpad experience, a mouse is a requirement for Windows. I stopped using a mouse on my Mac from way back when. This adds other annoying things like making sure the mouse has battery and/or attaching the dongle.
- the annoying notifications. For some reason, the way Microsoft pushes notifications for updates and such always come at the busy times. Really annoying, at least for me. Worst if you have a device from the other OEMs who push their own notifications for registering with them and updating their useless bloat ware.
- slower loading apps. Mostly because Apple tend to use faster SSD than the typical Windows laptop.

Having said that, there is one thing I want Apple to copy from Windows. Ever since Windows 8, Microsoft made it ultra simple to "reformat" a Windows machine by simply resetting the device. Just like how it is easy to reset an iOS device to factory setting. Why can't Apple do the same for OS X?

 

[0989383]

I'm using both Windows and OS X on daily basis. Things that immediately annoy me when going to Windows:
- awful tiny trackpad. And yes, I am using the Surface Pro 4. Its trackpad is "better" than most other Windows laptops out there, but it's no comparison to the trackpads on Macs.
- the need to use a mouse. Because of the awful trackpad experience, a mouse is a requirement for Windows. I stopped using a mouse on my Mac from way back when. This adds other annoying things like making sure the mouse has battery and/or attaching the dongle.
- the annoying notifications. For some reason, the way Microsoft pushes notifications for updates and such always come at the busy times. Really annoying, at least for me. Worst if you have a device from the other OEMs who push their own notifications for registering with them and updating their useless bloat ware.
- slower loading apps. Mostly because Apple tend to use faster SSD than the typical Windows laptop.

Having said that, there is one thing I want Apple to copy from Windows. Ever since Windows 8, Microsoft made it ultra simple to "reformat" a Windows machine by simply resetting the device. Just like how it is easy to reset an iOS device to factory setting. Why can't Apple do the same for OS X?

Ah, those delightful moments when we wait for a lecture to start and just as they await the logon screen to appear and we see that beautiful 'Windows is installing updates... Please wait' screen! Extra 10 minutes wooh!

 

[raqball]

What you'll gladly miss by going to Windows 10:

The spinning beach ball
App and program crashes ALL the time (doubters, take a look at your logs)
That crappy new MacBook KB

That's just a few...

 

[SteveJUAE]

What you'll gladly miss by going to Windows 10:

The spinning beach ball
App and program crashes ALL the time (doubters, take a look at your logs)
That crappy new MacBook KB

That's just a few...

Now now no need to be too hard on these posters

They can't help clutching at straws on the few little things that they can do better which only applies to a very limited minority group that can use these advantages

They are welcome to these minor bragging points, if its applicable, given all the other limitations

At the end of the day Mac's remain a nice premium device and some of the best trackpads for general use where a mouse and/or pen will aways have greater advantages when used in more demanding situations

 

[raqball]

Now now no need to be too hard on these posters

They can't help clutching at straws on the few little things that they can do better which only applies to a very limited minority group that can use these advantages

They are welcome to these minor bragging points, if its applicable, given all the other limitations

It just makes me giggle when people proclaim how stable macOS is... Guess they never looked to see all the behind the scene crashes. Someone the other day in another thread made the claim that macOS uses less resources... It's amazing to read some of this stuff..

I am not really a macOS hater.. Heck I've said numerous times that I prefer macOS.... The new machines? Errrrrrr.... Ummmm.... NOPE!

But you are correct.. The new machines do excel in a few areas, for sure...

 

[zzzachi]

Think the same the best MP design was the Cheese Grater, next iteration may well be modular, equally very far from an open system, likely being locked down.

iMac Pro is a step in the right direction, equally yet another closed system. My own opinion is people are using high end iMac's in professional roles due to the expensive Trashcan Joke, not because they want an all in one and a sealed system.

Honestly don't get Apple, it's not like the consumer masses will be flocking to purchase a more open platform Mac Pro given the pricing, Apple should stop trying to confine and control at every single instance...

Q-6

agreed!
the word "modular" already shows that apple will again try to re-invent the wheel while everybody just wants an upgrade of what we had in 2012. a true pro workstation is an open and upgradeable system, big enough to host multiple drives and gpus. the imacpro is maybe ok for some, but a single cpu machine is not feasable for high end computing. cuda/nvidia is no option there. you cant upgrade/change anything which is a hidden cost factor.

i cant understand apple either. the cheese grater was really a modular computer. it was a fit for a lot of people from mid to high end needs. the trashcan had only mediocre power, same for the new imacpro, but hopefully for a better price.

in a way, buying a real high end computer from apple is like buying a car for $50'000 where you cant change a tire when it is worn down. so after 2yrs you'll need to invest another 50k. good for apple. not so good for you. in this sense apple is just not a partner for professionals needing high end performance anymore. if the new, coming mac pro changes that... we'll see.

 

[SteveJUAE]

It just makes me giggle when people proclaim how stable macOS is... Guess they never looked to see all the behind the scene crashes. Someone the other day in another thread made the claim that macOS uses less resources... It's amazing to read some of this stuff..

I am not really a macOS hater.. Heck I've said numerous times that I prefer macOS.... The new machines? Errrrrrr.... Ummmm.... NOPE!

But you are correct.. The new machines do excel in a few areas, for sure...

Excel maybe a bad choice of words as MacOs does not excel with Excel LOL

But yes if I hear one more time how optimised FCP I think I will saw my legs off

 

[aevan]

Now now no need to be too hard on these posters

They can't help clutching at straws on the few little things that they can do better which only applies to a very limited minority group that can use these advantages

Few little things? Compared to Windows?

Please....