What would I miss going from Mac back to pc?

[SteveJUAE]

Few little things? Compared to Windows?

Please....

Don't like to burst your bubble but MacOs lost long ago to Windows

No one is denying MacOS does some things better, but if you strip away personal preferences most are in niche areas belonging to a minority group of mainly professional users IMO

They may well be important differecies for some but lets not get carried away, enjoy your Mac

 

[Speechless]

Most likely literally everything.

For me, personally:

• Growing up, I completely screwed up my Dell because every file that made it run smoothly was accessible to delete. Apple's critical files are very hard to screw up accidentally.
• Notifications are so much better. I also love the banners like Now Playing in iTunes.
• The applications in Windows look blurry and odd. ESPECIALLY iTunes.
• macOS is just so freaking beautiful. Favorite feature is definitely PiP
• The updates that come to the OS are exciting and you always can look forward to something. Windows only recently started having some semi-decent updates. I don't know, it always feels like they try to fix their missteps of the previous version. You never know with them.
• Continuity is as simple as it should be
• Developers, especially, make sure their apps looks gorgeous on these machines - which is fun
• Apple Pay and Touch ID. Hello.
• The speakers are phenomenal and shocking
• It is a -seriously- well made machine. You get what you pay for.
• Everything just works. Some people in my apartment have HP's, Dells, exc. and they hate it. I sometimes hear either sighs or angry lid slams as they reach for their phone due to some error message.

The only clear advantage Windows PC's have over Mac's is gaming. I really wish Apple would give it a shot because the gaming catalog on these machines are abysmal. Luckily we have bootcamp .. but you still have to subject your eyes to the sheer ugliness of Windows.

 

[0989383]

Most likely literally everything.

For me, personally:

• Growing up, I completely screwed up my Dell because every file that made it run smoothly was accessible to delete. Apple's critical files are very hard to screw up accidentally.
• Notifications are so much better. I also love the banners like Now Playing in iTunes.
• The applications in Windows look blurry and odd. ESPECIALLY iTunes.
• macOS is just so freaking beautiful. Favorite feature is definitely PiP
• The updates that come to the OS are exciting and you always can look forward to something. Windows only recently started having some semi-decent updates. I don't know, it always feels like they try to fix their missteps of the previous version. You never know with them.
• Continuity is as simple as it should be
• Developers, especially, make sure their apps looks gorgeous on these machines - which is fun
• Apple Pay and Touch ID. Hello.
• The speakers are phenomenal and shocking
• It is a -seriously- well made machine. You get what you pay for.
• Everything just works. Some people in my apartment have HP's, Dells, exc. and they hate it. I sometimes hear either sighs or angry lid slams as they reach for their phone due to some error message.

The only clear advantage Windows PC's have over Mac's is gaming. I really wish Apple would give it a shot because the gaming catalog on these machines are abysmal. Luckily we have bootcamp .. but you still have to subject your eyes to the sheer ugliness of Windows.

This. So true.

 

[Queen6]

Totally depends usage and workflows, I can pretty much guarantee that when on a project all of my Mac's will outright crash sooner rather than later likely due to the throughput, yet Windows 10 has yet to fail. At home a wash with neither OS presenting issue.

macOS presents a simpler interface to the user with a far higher level of continuity for the UI and for some a better user experience. Windows 10 is heading in the right direction although not there yet.

In reality both Windows 10 and macOS can serve the average user with ease, for more complex usage Windows pulls ahead as at this level Mac's users generally require significant knowledge of Terminal and the command line. The whole stability argument for Mac's these day's is moot as Windows 10 has caught up and in some instances overtaken OS X.

Bottom line from my perspective as a longterm professional user of computers is that Apple took a fork in the road some time back alining the desktop OS with it's exceptionally popular mobile OS resulting in the desktop OS being diluted combined with too short a development cycle resulting in buggy releases with a diminishment in overall productivity and stability.

Microsoft after several debacles has now focused on reliability and productivity, now chasing modern and unified UI. Windows 8 was in many respects the defining factor, Microsoft realised that despite significant advancements it had simply alienated a much of it's user base. Windows 10 is the result fast efficient and super stable.

A worthy read Core Rot anyone thinking this was from the hand of a hater is very much mistaken...

Q-6
[doublepost=1497771087][/doublepost]

But yes if I hear one more time how optimised FCP I think I will saw my legs off

LOL Near fell off my chair laughing, sadly it's true as outside of FCPX macOS is optimised for next to nothing including itself...

Q-6

 

[SteveJUAE]

LOL Near fell off my chair laughing, sadly it's true as outside of FCPX macOS is optimised for next to nothing including itself...

Q-6

We aim to please

I tend to ignore these cherry picked advantages used to defend macOS or MBP that largely IRL have little impact for most other than bragging rights and more often than not conflict each other then summed up as a balanced laptop as a final retort to any weaknesses LOL

If your Mac ticks the boxes thats important to you then thats the right tool and the comprimises you have opted for over others

 

[aevan]

We aim to please

I tend to ignore these cherry picked advantages used to defend macOS or MBP that largely IRL have little impact for most other than bragging rights

And I suppose Windows advantages are profound and practical?

Arbitrary statement without any true meaning. I would argue that you don't have the workflow to appreciate all the advantages of the macOS system, so you see real benefits solely as bragging rights, not capable of understanding their value. What one man interprets as silly numbers, the other reads as mathematical formulae. Same with good design.

As for Windows, it is a solid OS that somehow always finds clever ways to get in my way. One of the biggest advantages of macOS, for me at least, is that it doesn't annoy the **** out of me.
[doublepost=1497776997][/doublepost]

Don't like to burst your bubble but MacOs lost long ago to Windows

Since you said it, then it must be true.
[doublepost=1497778284][/doublepost]

A worthy read Core Rot anyone thinking this was from the hand of a hater is very much mistaken...

And I could respond with this. It's a worthy read.

The truth is, both Windows and macOS are full of faults, bugs, legacy, issues, etc. Windows is in a harder position, as it has to serve a larger number of computers, a lot of them very old (32bit) and it's a miracle that thing is as good as it is, really. I have nothing but respect for Microsoft engineers, for that reason.

But, if you're technical, if you're smart - you can disassemble both systems and find so much crap, you could write a book about it. With both companies trying to run a succesful desktop busines in a mobile-first world, with Apple focusing on phones and Microsoft on services - it's a challenge, really. If you think Windows (or PC hardware) is Microsoft's most important product and focus, you're very much mistaken.

The truth is, in the end, it's about your workflow and the things you appreciate. I don't have to look at logs to know Windows is messing with me - the issues I have with it are plain to see. I can go over them if you want, they are very much real, but perhaps we should leave that for a different post. And I'm sure you can do the same for macOS. And you wouldn't be wrong, but that wouldn't change the fact that for me, macOS is a more productive environment, and that is the truth. From the little things (like the way something as screen capture works, or the fact that Windows keyboard language switching makes me want to stab my PC with a kitchen knife) to useful ones (like tags, tabs and great 3rd party utilities) to big ones (like automation) - macOS is simply much better for me. I don't notice these crashes you mention, I don't see the "core rot" or do I feel that Apple is turning a Mac into "an entertainment platform". I do notice that Windows has an unpolished - and sometimes poorely thought out UX in certain places (which is understandable since they tried to change its core principles several times) and several issues that bother me, personally. That may all change in the future, and if it happens, I'll switch to a Surface - it's great that there are solid hardware options on the other side.

So, please, stop pretending that we're all somehow delusional on the Mac side. Criticize Macs and macOS all you want, but don't think that your conclusions apply to everyone.

 

[AFEPPL]

It just makes me giggle when people proclaim how stable macOS is... Guess they never looked to see all the behind the scene crashes. Someone the other day in another thread made the claim that macOS uses less resources... It's amazing to read some of this stuff..

I am not really a macOS hater.. Heck I've said numerous times that I prefer macOS.... The new machines? Errrrrrr.... Ummmm.... NOPE!

But you are correct.. The new machines do excel in a few areas, for sure...

My mac laptops are far less stable than the windows desktop machine that just sits their smiling away to itself without missing a beat.

 

[zzzachi]

Don't know what you base this on. With Macs coming with 18 cores, with modular designs, with external GPU support, good thermals, Apple is cramming fastest I/Os, fastest drives - why do you think they will "cut down the pro". This is just a tale some people like to tell.

the term "pro" is misleading... a graphic designer is pro(fessional) but he doesnt need a fast computer.
i m talking about high end performance workstations. the trashcan from 2013 and the new iMacPro are NOT high end workstations. they are at most at the top end of mid performance. for my work i need a dual core xeon with multiple internal gpu slots! i do that with my mac pro 2012 which is a (nowadays low end) workstation. atm apple does not sell ANY workstations and i doubt that the coming mac pro will be one.

so no, its not a tale! apple makes fast mid range computers but gave up the market for workstations.
just to have that said: you can buy dual 24-core xeon configurations with space for 7 internal gpus on the pc market. that is the top end of high performance!

 

[Queen6]

So, please, stop pretending that we're all somehow delusional on the Mac side. Criticize Macs and macOS all you want, but don't think that your conclusions apply to everyone.

I'm not and use both platforms professionally, the criticism is founded simple as that. I agree nether OS is perfect, both offering positives and negatives.

Your problem is you take any negative comment towards Apple like it was a direct and personal attack, we don't need to start and finish every post with "in my opinion" I've been using OS X and Windows since the early days so my input is valid Apple's desktop OS is becoming ever more unstable and that few appreciate, this is one of the aspects of Core Rot...

First words were "Totally depends usage and workflows" I stand by what I have said; in over six months of multi role professional use my primary Windows 10 notebook has never crashed, never required a forced restart, sadly all three of my Retina Mac's do and will crash with frequency specifically with Apple's own applications, irrespective of clean install's of the OS. Colleagues also using Mac's have similar experience generally needing to reboot the system at the 5-7 day point or risk loss of data and or a locked up system.

The days of Apple's desktop having a significant edge are well and truly over; Windows 10 is very far from perfect, however with every major update it improves ever more. Personally I've never had substantial issue with ether OS X or Windows until more recent years on the Mac. I know exactly how to set up both OS's optimally for my workflows, ensuring both are secure.

As I have stated several times if Apple offered the best solution we would be 100% Mac as I was personally for many years. Transitioning to Window 10 was not taken likely with over a years consideration, as my systems are a function of revenue as are the businesses I am involved in.

I appreciate Apple's design language, equally I don't care for all of Apple's decisions, however when it's a function of business the facts & figures simply dictate the choices with stability being right at the very top of the list.

Core Rot is and remains to be valid, until Apple illustrates differently High Sierra will be the next opportunity to see if Apple has reacted or simply dished out more of the same...

Q-6

 

[zzzachi]

i wouldnt take that "Core Rot" theory so seriously...
i work day by day on macs and i do not have these crashes you describe.
macos is still by far better than windows, the problem is that apple only sells mainstream and prosumer hardware.

 

[Queen6]

We aim to please

I tend to ignore these cherry picked advantages used to defend macOS or MBP that largely IRL have little impact for most other than bragging rights and more often than not conflict each other then summed up as a balanced laptop as a final retort to any weaknesses LOL

If your Mac ticks the boxes thats important to you then thats the right tool and the comprimises you have opted for over others

Ultimately if OS X and the Mac offered significant advantage the world would run on it, fact is it doesn't. The graphic industries benefit the most thx to Apple's unified OS level approach to colour management, yet as you and I know all to well in engineering Mac's are generally nowhere to be seen, same applies to much of the the business world.

By Apple's own admission 85% of the Mac user base is recreational, so it's unsurprising the direction the Mac and the desktop OS is heading with entertainment & emoji's ruling the roost, hence the term Core Rot to me the approach these days is 80% is good enough as by far the vast majority of users will never push their systems and incur major issue, however for some of us with higher demands the days of "it just works" are long gone...

Q-6

 

[raqball]

Ultimately if OS X and the Mac offered significant advantage the world would run on it, fact is it doesn't. The graphic industries benefit the most thx to Apple's unified OS level approach to colour management, yet as you and I know all to well in engineering Mac's are generally nowhere to be seen, same applies to much of the the business world.

By Apple's own admission 85% of the Mac user base is recreational, so it's unsurprising the direction the Mac and the desktop OS is heading with entertainment & emoji's ruling the roost, hence the term Core Rot to me the approach these days is 80% is good enough as by far the vast majority of users will not push their systems and incur major issue, however for some of us with higher demands the days of "it just works" are long gone...

Q-6

This is true and factual..

Apple is more focused on the Starbucks fashion conscious crowd than they are on anything else.. Nothing wrong with that but if people are honest with themselves, they can clearly see the trend..

I do agree the graphic industry does benefit from the machines but even some of them are starting to jump ship. My sister is a pro photographer in NYC.. She does have a 15" rMBP (2015 I think) but she also recently purchased a Surface Studio and last I spoke to her, she loves the Studio...

 

[Winterfibre]

I use windows 10 as my main computer, i gave my macbook pro to my daughter. I like to use linux and mac os just remided me of linux with limitations.

 

[0989383]

Windows is fine when you still own a Mac to use. Because you can put it away, and forget about it's problems until you've got the patience and time to deal with it again. In my personal experience, not owning a Mac anymore and being forced to run Windows til bust is frustrating. So I get that some of you guys 'use both' and extract the best from both, but for many, it's a matter of one or the other. This is when 'better' and 'worse' for peoples situations arises. Not to write off the entire OS choice since it varies by user.

 

[AFEPPL]

I dont have any breaks or problems on windows, i do get them on mac however...
No idea why people try to play down windows, maybe that just the nature of a fan site? But for me it works, is very stable, requires less hardware and has a great UI.

 

[raqball]

I dont have any breaks or problems on windows, i do get them on mac however...
No idea why people try to play down windows, maybe that just the nature of a fan site? But for me it works, is very stable, requires less hardware and has a great UI.

Bingo!

I also think some of it boils down to user inexperience, an unwillingness to learn a new OS and in some instances I think people are still stuck in the past and are comparing Windows 8.. Windows 8 was in fact terrible but Windows 10 is equal to and better than macOS is many, many instances...

I think some of the bashing is from people who have never used Win 10 and are perhaps having flashback comparisons to Win 8....

But as you say, this is a mac forum so the bashing is kind of expected.. I'd hope no matter where you are that people would be fair but we all know that's not about to happen...

My beef is not really with macOS as I think it's fine for the most part and there are many things I prefer with it. My beef is with the new machines. They are fashion statements and nothing more..

 

[0989383]

I dont have any breaks or problems on windows, i do get them on mac however...
No idea why people try to play down windows, maybe that just the nature of a fan site? But for me it works, is very stable, requires less hardware and has a great UI.

The Mac requires less hardware, and still outperforms Windows alternatives.

Hence how in 2009 when all mainstream manufacturers jumped to 4GB ram on most laptops, the white MacBook still had 2GB and could start up, process and generally outperform Windows competitors with 'twice the hardware' on paper.

As for the UI.. I don't know anyone who actually likes Cortana or spying but it's definitely baked well into W10.

 

[raqball]

It takes like 15 seconds to turn off Cortana and about 5 minutes to remove all the things you 'think' are spying on you. Again, failure to understand the OS or wanting to learn is the source of your problems..

Tell the OS what you want it to do and walla, it will comply...

Look ma, no Cortana here!

 

[AFEPPL]

The Mac requires less hardware, and still outperforms Windows alternatives.

Hence how in 2009 when all mainstream manufacturers jumped to 4GB ram on most laptops, the white MacBook still had 2GB and could start up, process and generally outperform Windows competitors with 'twice the hardware' on paper.

As for the UI.. I don't know anyone who actually likes Cortana or spying but it's definitely baked well into W10.

No it doesn't... Mac of late sucks with 4GB, i cant imaging what it would be like on 2GB. The recent replacement MBP device i got is an I7 with 8GB as i didn't want to max out the budget. Big mistake. My older late 14 I5 (edit just looked its actually an I7 3Ghz - my bad) and 16GB performs better. I struggle to run a 4GB VM on the new device if i try to do anything remotely taxing. I have a windows box with 8GB and thats happy as larry on a very happy day running a 4GB VM regardless of what i try to do.

I dont care about the startup time, thats once a day. Mac boots in two stage - mostly after you sign in.
Windows box on an old i5 with actually a smaller SSD (512GB) takes around the same time to boot, but the way windows post loads esp iTunes is a pain.

I don't use curtana or Siri, Siri sucks and i cant stand it and it's not really the UI is it!
My OS is not spying on my be it apple or MS, but you can elect to send the same data to apple if you want...

 

[0989383]

No it doesn't... Mac of late sucks with 4GB, i cant imaging what it would be like on 2GB. The recent replacement MBP device i got is an I7 with 8GB as i didn't want to max out the budget. Big mistake. My older late 14 I5 (edit just looked its actually an I7 3Ghz - my bad) and 16GB performs better. I struggle to run a 4GB VM on the new device if i try to do anything remotely taxing. I have a windows box with 8GB and thats happy as larry on a very happy day running a 4GB VM regardless of what i try to do.

I dont care about the startup time, thats once a day. Mac boots in two stage - mostly after you sign in.
Windows box on an old i5 with actually a smaller SSD (512GB) takes around the same time to boot, but the way windows post loads esp iTunes is a pain.

I don't use curtana or Siri, Siri sucks and i cant stand it and it's not really the UI is it!
My OS is not spying on my be it apple or MS, but you can elect to send the same data to apple if you want...

'User Interface' covers every aspect of the OS which allows the user to interact with the system... Voice assistants are certainly part of it.

 

[Queen6]

Windows is fine when you still own a Mac to use. Because you can put it away, and forget about it's problems until you've got the patience and time to deal with it again. In my personal experience, not owning a Mac anymore and being forced to run Windows til bust is frustrating. So I get that some of you guys 'use both' and extract the best from both, but for many, it's a matter of one or the other. This is when 'better' and 'worse' for peoples situations arises. Not to write off the entire OS choice since it varies by user.

Frankly if I had to drop down to one desktop OS it would be Windows 10. Don't want to come across as being supercilious; there's a learning curve and experience needs to be acquired. As ever very much depends on the usage, if you find your swimming upstream constantly whatever the OS it's likely time for a change....

Personally I just look at which OS is working best for my needs, OS X is/becoming too unstable for my liking since 10.10, yeah maybe High Sierra will be all the difference as per what Apple recommend, equally it may not as Apple has been singing the same tune for some time.

Before anyone gets their "pants" in a knot, it's simply a factor of usage and workflow, I know that, Apple knows that, equally my issues are most definitely not Apple's primary concern, as Apple wants and need to sell more Mac's to the masses not a small number of professionals...

Q-6

 

[AFEPPL]

'User Interface' covers every aspect of the OS which allows the user to interact with the system... Voice assistants are certainly part of it.

No, it [Siri or Courtana] in the context of above is an interface device integrated with the OS in the same way a mouse, or a keyboard is ..! or if you will a digital personal assistant.. UI in my post should really read UX if people want to be pedantic.

 

[0989383]

No, it [Siri or Courtana] in the context of above is an interface device integrated with the OS in the same way a mouse, or a keyboard is ..! or if you will a digital personal assistant.. UI in my post should really read UX if people want to be pedantic.

User inter-face - interactions between the system / user.

Did you mean: GUI (Graphical User Interface) ?

 

[zzzachi]

Frankly if I had to drop down to one desktop OS it would be Windows 10. Don't want to come across as being supercilious; there's a learning curve and experience needs to be acquired. As ever very much depends on the usage, if you find your swimming upstream constantly whatever the OS it's likely time for a change....

Personally I just look at which OS is working best for my needs, OS X is/becoming too unstable for my liking since 10.10, yeah maybe High Sierra will be all the difference as per what Apple recommend, equally it may not as Apple has been singing the same tune for some time.

Before anyone gets their "pants" in a knot, it's simply a factor of usage and workflow, I know that, Apple knows that, equally my issues are most definitely not Apple's primary concern, as Apple wants and need to sell more Mac's to the masses not a small number of professionals...

Q-6

i really wonder what you do on your macos computer Q-6 !
can you elaborate what you do, which apps crash and on what hardware you are running macos?
from my point of view macos is very stable!
if you use some crappy hackintosh... ohhhkkay....

 

[AFEPPL]

User inter-face - interactions between the system / user.

Did you mean: GUI (Graphical User Interface) ?

GUI is a subset of UI. ., lets not drag this out to who can get the last word in!!
Nothings changed.. My windows box is still more stable, i still don't like or use Siri who simply makes up words or changes them even in simple instructions and the UX on windows i prefer.