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Out of stock in NYC. Lots of disappointment in lines today when employees announced that no deliveries came in and folks should call back in 2-3 weeks.

So did they get any additional deliveries at all this week, or just the initial one that quickly sold out on Monday morning?

If the latter, then I got to the Apple Store just in the nick of time! With the lead time, I wonder why they didn't have more in stock, and I also wonder why they haven't established a formal reservation system. It's possible they underestimated demand, but at the same time they didn't have any Double Tours or Cuffs at the UES store, even though those were the only watches they had available for try-ons. They also didn't have many colors (just the Etain for the Double Tour, and obviously just Fauve for the Cuff). It would have been nice to see Noir in person, as well as Capucine and Bleu Jean.

Apple still has things to learn about selling luxury goods. They can require an in-store visit to make a reservation and limit purchases to avoid the reseller issue, but they should take down names and contacts, and instead of just telling people to call back in 2-3 weeks to wait in another first-come first-served line, they should hold the watches and call people when they are ready to be picked up.

They also should start selling the Edition bands separately. The same woman who was looking at the Double Tour might also have walked out with a Rose Gray Edition if it were possible to get the matching sport band (and no, the regular white Sport band with the steel pin wasn't going to cut it - luxury goods buyers can be fickle).
 
Sure, changing a connector every so often, where one has to replace a few cables, and maybe get a couple of adapters, is a pain, but replacing multiple straps at hundreds of dollars is a bit different.

It depends how much Apple wants to "reference" classic watch design. If they want to do something along the same lines as Swiss watch companies, they may make something that looks pretty similar to the current watch for a long time, with other models eventually added to the mix. They may even design future models with the current attachment system in mind.

Changing the physical design of things like phones and computers every couple of years is one thing, but, with wearables, it's probably a good idea to maintain some design consistency to get traction and create history, rather than throwing things against a wall to see what sticks, like Android Wear. Even some current G-Shock watches look similar to their 25 year old originals. That's probably why Apple took their time to come up with a design that they'd be happy with for the future. Chuck Taylor, Rayban Wayfarers, Levi 501, Rolex Sub...Apple Watch?? I don't know, probably wishful thinking. :)

I don't agree. I mean with Apple they could do anything, but in general I would argue that with wearables, fashion is going to dictate far more what Apple does with the watch than for an iPhone. Not only are they going to update the technology which may dictate design parameters, but they are going to at least try to address fashion trends, and variety of choice for the fashion customer. The Hermes branding is just the tip of the iceberg. And I think it's clear from that, as well as they myriad of case finishes Apple has introduced (with more likely to come), that Apple intends to allow multiple device pairing at some point, allowing customers to have multiple watches. And while they could just rely on customers to buy a gold one this year, and a stainless next year, they would better guarantee additional purchases if they offer something completely different. Maybe thinner, maybe a round option (I don't want to get into a which is better debate so lets just all agree its strictly a fashion choice), maybe chunkier. Just looking at the array of current wrist wear, Apple could go anywhere with it. They could also get into custom case design for specific partnerships -- one of my biggest criticisms of the Hermes co-brand is that they contributed nothing to the case design on which their name is prominently engraved.

The point is, with all of the fashion considerations dictated by customer choice, Apple has never been one to cling onto old designs just to please a customer who has already bought their product! And the fashion world is hardly pragmatic. Some people buy $1,000 dresses they are only going to wear once. Others buy hundreds if not thousands of dollars worth of accessories to match whatever color combination is in fashion this season, and then throw it all out and buy it all over again to get matching ensembles for next years seasons. Heck, as Apple releases new watch bands stylings every few months, someone may not even want to wear the band they originally chose with their watch, or any of the bands bought afterwards. There's also wear an tear -- I used to replace my leather bands every year or two anyway because they would get disgusting with sweat. With respect to the former, I don't see Apple being that fickle with their designs, but I don't see them being overly concerned about making sure this year's Watch customer can re-use their bands on next-years model, if they need to make a change.

And there's any reason they may need to, chief among the tech reasons is if they redesign the diagnostic port for use with smart bands. From a purely fashion perspective they may want to slim the appearance of the watch, and the current band thickness where it joins the housing may look too bulky with a slimmer case, perhaps they will taper the ends. I won't be surprised if Apple doesn't change a thing, but I certainly wouldn't spend hundreds of dollars on watch bands for this years model expecting them to work with next years. I learned long ago that every Apple purchase should be made strictly for the time it is needed, and not second guess the ability to upgrade when next years model is introduced -- some times it works out, other times not so much. I'm still waiting for someone to create an add-on 30-pin camera for my original iPad, which I logically hoped, and in hindsight foolishly, someone would offer up by gen 2. At least they hold their value for resale. And with respect to the original watch, someone will have not only a watch, but a complete set of bands to enhance the value for a potential buyer, to offset the cost of buying a brand new watch and co-ordinating bands.
 
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I don't agree. I mean with Apple they could do anything, but in general I would argue that with wearables, fashion is going to dictate far more what Apple does with the watch than for an iPhone. Not only are they going to update the technology which may dictate design parameters, but they are going to at least try to address fashion trends, and variety of choice for the fashion customer. The Hermes branding is just the tip of the iceberg. And I think it's clear from that, as well as they myriad of case finishes Apple has introduced (with more likely to come), that Apple intends to allow multiple device pairing at some point, allowing customers to have multiple watches. And while they could just rely on customers to buy a gold one this year, and a stainless next year, they would better guarantee additional purchases if they offer something completely different. Maybe thinner, maybe a round option (I don't want to get into a which is better debate so lets just all agree its strictly a fashion choice), maybe chunkier. Just looking at the array of current wrist wear, Apple could go anywhere with it. They could also get into custom case design for specific partnerships -- one of my biggest criticisms of the Hermes co-brand is that they contributed nothing to the case design on which their name is prominently engraved.

The point is, with all of the fashion considerations dictated by customer choice, Apple has never been one to cling onto old designs just to please a customer who has already bought their product! And the fashion world is hardly pragmatic. Some people buy $1,000 dresses they are only going to wear once. Others buy hundreds if not thousands of dollars worth of accessories to match whatever color combination is in fashion this season, and then throw it all out and buy it all over again to get matching ensembles for next years seasons. Heck, as Apple releases new watch bands stylings every few months, someone may not even want to wear the band they originally chose with their watch, or any of the bands bought afterwards. There's also wear an tear -- I used to replace my leather bands every year or two anyway because they would get disgusting with sweat. With respect to the former, I don't see Apple being that fickle with their designs, but I don't see them being overly concerned about making sure this year's Watch customer can re-use their bands on next-years model, if they need to make a change.

And there's any reason they may need to, chief among the tech reasons is if they redesign the diagnostic port for use with smart bands. From a purely fashion perspective they may want to slim the appearance of the watch, and the current band thickness where it joins the housing may look too bulky with a slimmer case, perhaps they will taper the ends. I won't be surprised if Apple doesn't change a thing, but I certainly wouldn't spend hundreds of dollars on watch bands for this years model expecting them to work with next years. I learned long ago that every Apple purchase should be made strictly for the time it is needed, and not second guess the ability to upgrade when next years model is introduced -- some times it works out, other times not so much. I'm still waiting for someone to create an add-on 30-pin camera for my original iPad, which I logically hoped, and in hindsight foolishly, someone would offer up by gen 2. At least they hold their value for resale. And with respect to the original watch, someone will have not only a watch, but a complete set of bands to enhance the value for a potential buyer, to offset the cost of buying a brand new watch and co-ordinating bands.

It'll be interesting to see which direction Apple goes. Do they use the same case for years? Do they give it small styling updates over time, but stick with one basic design? Do they introduce more than one case design at a time? Do they drastically change the case every year or two? I'm not sure, but I wouldn't necessarily use Apple's past as an indicator, because wearables is a new space with new expectations. As a "watch guy," I'd hope Apple introduces new models along side the Watch Classic, or whatever. I like the idea of buying the same watch for many years, in terms of looks, with updated internals.

That being said, I certainly didn't buy any of my straps with the expectation of them being future proof. I would think, though, that Apple's stock of SO many different strap skus would interest them in using the same connector for a while.

One difference between tech and fashion is the idea of getting smaller and smaller is the only direction to go. "Wrist presence" is desirable to many who buy watches, and the current 38mm Watch wears very similarly to a DateJust, which is considered a smallish watch these days, so I don't think the Watch has to be thinner. I'd rather just see performance and battery improvements fit into the same size case.
 
I don't think the Watch has to be thinner.


I'm wondering if a thinner watch could make it possible for me to wear a larger screen watch. Right now, the 42 just is too big for me, as in the watch body is wider than my wrist. But maybe if it were thinner, it wouldn't matter that it's too wide? Or is that wishful thinking?
 
I'm wondering if a thinner watch could make it possible for me to wear a larger screen watch. Right now, the 42 just is too big for me, as in the watch body is wider than my wrist. But maybe if it were thinner, it wouldn't matter that it's too wide? Or is that wishful thinking?

If the 42mm already looks too big on you, thinning it out by a millimeter or two likely wouldn't make much difference.

I love the 38mm size. It fits like a classic Rolex, and doesn't read as much like a big digital screen on the wrist from a distance.
 
If the 42mm already looks too big on you, thinning it out by a millimeter or two likely wouldn't make much difference.

I love the 38mm size. It fits like a classic Rolex, and doesn't read as much like a big digital screen on the wrist from a distance.

It's not how it looks, it's so large it doesn't sit right on my wrist. I have bad eyesight, so I don't care how the watch looks on my wrist -- I'd love to be able to wear a larger watch so I can read the text. Unfortunately, you are probably right that a few millimeters thinner won't make a difference. :(
 
I love the look of my apple watch, but I didn't buy it as piece of jewelry. I'm not knocking those who did, or those who want this model. I think it looks nice but given the price point and how I use watches, its not a good fit for me.

Show me your sense of style Mr Flynn.
 
It'll be interesting to see which direction Apple goes. Do they use the same case for years? Do they give it small styling updates over time, but stick with one basic design? Do they introduce more than one case design at a time? Do they drastically change the case every year or two? I'm not sure, but I wouldn't necessarily use Apple's past as an indicator, because wearables is a new space with new expectations. As a "watch guy," I'd hope Apple introduces new models along side the Watch Classic, or whatever. I like the idea of buying the same watch for many years, in terms of looks, with updated internals.

That being said, I certainly didn't buy any of my straps with the expectation of them being future proof. I would think, though, that Apple's stock of SO many different strap skus would interest them in using the same connector for a while.

One difference between tech and fashion is the idea of getting smaller and smaller is the only direction to go. "Wrist presence" is desirable to many who buy watches, and the current 38mm Watch wears very similarly to a DateJust, which is considered a smallish watch these days, so I don't think the Watch has to be thinner. I'd rather just see performance and battery improvements fit into the same size case.

I'm with you on seeing how this all plays out. I do think Apple made the wise choice in choosing to go rectangular to facilitate the software and developers, before they possibly attempt to introduce a round UI. And in doing so with their iconic round-rect designs, they have created a product that is instantly recognizable as Apple. And I could easily see this becoming something of a staple that Apple offers every year, updating the internals only, but leaving the case unchanged. Just like there are Rolex models that have been unchanged for decades. But Apple can't just offer one watch and stay relevant in the fashion world. I personally think the original watch will drop in price to make it more affordable to new customers next year when the gen 2 watch comes out, and the new watch will definitely need something to set it apart, besides technology.

Here's the thing about the watch band SKUs. I went in to look at the new gold/Midnight Blue Sport, and realized I wanted it for my silver Sport. But the only way to get the band is with the purchase of a new watch, and Apple will swap it out for you. You can't buy it separately. You also can't buy any other Sport bands with gray pins, besides the black. Nor gold, nor rose gold. So Apple is coming out with designs that are exclusive to a particular watch case, and don't seem to have any interest in supporting a wide array of options for matching other color combinations. And that to me speaks volumes for whether Apple cares whether a customer collects a bunch of bands they can reuse on future models -- they're likely not going to match the watch you bought it for anyway. If this were truly a big concern, I think we'd see every band released in every color combination. Apple certainly has the expertise to manage supply and demand for it.

While the Watch doesn't have to be anything, I think Apple will address the customer desire for variety of choice, and if only to motivate the purchase of a new watch will offer different designs. After all, status is important to some, and the success of the Rose gold surely has something to do with the fact it makes it clear you have the latest Apple product. So there's only so many different case materials and colors they can introduce to set a particular design apart from another from year to year, especially if they are going to depreciate last years model. Even if only to introduce much more variety into what could easily become a sea of identical square black faced wrist straps. Now I've owned several "thin" watches, and I think there's definitely a market for them, they look very elegant on. But I would agree that there's much more interest in daily watches that have some heft to them. Again, I think Apple ultimately needs to address them all in the same way the watch industry has for decades.
 
Here's the thing about the watch band SKUs. I went in to look at the new gold/Midnight Blue Sport, and realized I wanted it for my silver Sport. But the only way to get the band is with the purchase of a new watch, and Apple will swap it out for you. You can't buy it separately.

Not sure what you mean. You can indeed buy the midnight blue sport band separately for your silver Sport and it'll have the silver pin.
 
Ahhhhh... I am LOVING these Hermes watches... and if I didn't already have a gorgeous SS AW with the Milanese Loop, I would be sorely tempted for the Hermes double tour. Oh well... maybe next gen?! ;)

PS Question, please: is the Hermes watch CASE identical in size to the regular AW SS case? Why am I thinking the Hermes case is shaped just a little differently (a little longer) than the other AWs?
 
PS Question, please: is the Hermes watch CASE identical in size to the regular AW SS case? Why am I thinking the Hermes case is shaped just a little differently (a little longer) than the other AWs?

Probably an optical illusion because of how it looks with the Hermes bands. When I was trying on the watch at Hermes, I too thought that the watch size looked different. But then I held up my Sports watch next to the Hermes watch, and they were the same size, all right.
 
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Probably an optical illusion because of how it looks with the Hermes bands. When I was trying on the watch at Hermes, I too thought that the watch size looked different. But then I held up my Sports watch next to the Hermes watch, and they were the same size, all right.

Night Spring,
THANK YOU so much for your reply. I have really been wondering about that. It really is a peculiar optical illusion! (I have only seen the Hermes in photos, though... never in person, unfortunately!)
 
I'm with you on seeing how this all plays out. I do think Apple made the wise choice in choosing to go rectangular to facilitate the software and developers, before they possibly attempt to introduce a round UI. And in doing so with their iconic round-rect designs, they have created a product that is instantly recognizable as Apple. And I could easily see this becoming something of a staple that Apple offers every year, updating the internals only, but leaving the case unchanged. Just like there are Rolex models that have been unchanged for decades. But Apple can't just offer one watch and stay relevant in the fashion world. I personally think the original watch will drop in price to make it more affordable to new customers next year when the gen 2 watch comes out, and the new watch will definitely need something to set it apart, besides technology.

Here's the thing about the watch band SKUs. I went in to look at the new gold/Midnight Blue Sport, and realized I wanted it for my silver Sport. But the only way to get the band is with the purchase of a new watch, and Apple will swap it out for you. You can't buy it separately. You also can't buy any other Sport bands with gray pins, besides the black. Nor gold, nor rose gold. So Apple is coming out with designs that are exclusive to a particular watch case, and don't seem to have any interest in supporting a wide array of options for matching other color combinations. And that to me speaks volumes for whether Apple cares whether a customer collects a bunch of bands they can reuse on future models -- they're likely not going to match the watch you bought it for anyway. If this were truly a big concern, I think we'd see every band released in every color combination. Apple certainly has the expertise to manage supply and demand for it.

While the Watch doesn't have to be anything, I think Apple will address the customer desire for variety of choice, and if only to motivate the purchase of a new watch will offer different designs. After all, status is important to some, and the success of the Rose gold surely has something to do with the fact it makes it clear you have the latest Apple product. So there's only so many different case materials and colors they can introduce to set a particular design apart from another from year to year, especially if they are going to depreciate last years model. Even if only to introduce much more variety into what could easily become a sea of identical square black faced wrist straps. Now I've owned several "thin" watches, and I think there's definitely a market for them, they look very elegant on. But I would agree that there's much more interest in daily watches that have some heft to them. Again, I think Apple ultimately needs to address them all in the same way the watch industry has for decades.

Yeah, don't get me wrong, I wouldn't mind a thinner Watch, as far as form factor is concerned. I just think I'd probably rather see battery power or computing power improved, instead.

As far as bands are concerned, I'm not sure what they told you at the store, but you can order 15 colors of sport band on the Apple website with the steel pin.
 
Probably an optical illusion because of how it looks with the Hermes bands. When I was trying on the watch at Hermes, I too thought that the watch size looked different. But then I held up my Sports watch next to the Hermes watch, and they were the same size, all right.

The extended lugs of the Hermes band, Classic Buckle band and Modern Buckle band do make the Watch look a little larger. I have a leather band with lugs, but I actually prefer the look and fit of the integrated bracelets, like the link bracelet, Sport band, leather loop, etc.
 
So did they get any additional deliveries at all this week, or just the initial one that quickly sold out on Monday morning?

If the latter, then I got to the Apple Store just in the nick of time! With the lead time, I wonder why they didn't have more in stock, and I also wonder why they haven't established a formal reservation system. It's possible they underestimated demand, but at the same time they didn't have any Double Tours or Cuffs at the UES store, even though those were the only watches they had available for try-ons. They also didn't have many colors (just the Etain for the Double Tour, and obviously just Fauve for the Cuff). It would have been nice to see Noir in person, as well as Capucine and Bleu Jean.

Apple still has things to learn about selling luxury goods. They can require an in-store visit to make a reservation and limit purchases to avoid the reseller issue, but they should take down names and contacts, and instead of just telling people to call back in 2-3 weeks to wait in another first-come first-served line, they should hold the watches and call people when they are ready to be picked up.

Hermes in NY received a shipment on Friday. Most, if not all, of the watches were reserved for regular Hermes clients. I know that there were several cuffs in the shipment but customers who walked in off the street were told no cuffs were available for sale.

Hermes has a "reservation system". It's called a wait list. It allows them to take down your name and politely inform you that they will be in touch when the particular item is available. This is how they have managed demand for some of their more popular products over the years. A particular person's position on the wait list will depend on the popularity of the item, the length of that person's relationship with Hermes and the value of that relationship to Hermes. Clients with significant relationships are unlikely to have to wait (or wait long). These clients also don't wait in line. That's why calls were made this week to clients who wanted a watch, telling them that their watch was being held and they should see their sales person at the store. It's not a democratic system but it has served them well and I don't expect they would change it just for Apple.
 
@NYer I'm well aware of the waiting lists for the Kelly bags, etc. I'm a bit surprised Apple didn't implement some form of it for their own stores. I.e. wait in line in a store to try it in, but then get on a reservation list. Apple needs to be more "democratic" than Hermès but they can still make some accommodations.
 
@NYer I'm well aware of the waiting lists for the Kelly bags, etc. I'm a bit surprised Apple didn't implement some form of it for their own stores. I.e. wait in line in a store to try it in, but then get on a reservation list. Apple needs to be more "democratic" than Hermès but they can still make some accommodations.

Apple Stores just aren't set up for something like this. When you take reservations, somebody needs to check the list against the shipments every time they get in a new shipment, then call/email the people on the reservation list. Hermes stores are used to doing this, it's part of the employees' routine. At an Apple Store, since this isn't part of their regular routine, somebody gets stuck with the extra duty. Who do you pick for this, and how do you ensure it gets done? You don't want a situation where it's like, "I thought it was her turn to do it!" "No, it was your turn!"

Not that it can't get done if they are determined to get it done, but it's not as simple as somebody at headquarters saying, "ok, we are taking reservations for the Hermes watch," and it immediately gets implemented at every store.
 
Apple Stores just aren't set up for something like this. When you take reservations, somebody needs to check the list against the shipments every time they get in a new shipment, then call/email the people on the reservation list. Hermes stores are used to doing this, it's part of the employees' routine. At an Apple Store, since this isn't part of their regular routine, somebody gets stuck with the extra duty. Who do you pick for this, and how do you ensure it gets done? You don't want a situation where it's like, "I thought it was her turn to do it!" "No, it was your turn!"

Not that it can't get done if they are determined to get it done, but it's not as simple as somebody at headquarters saying, "ok, we are taking reservations for the Hermes watch," and it immediately gets implemented at every store.

Yeah, I don't expect Apple to do anything special for AW Hermes customers as they're in the same price range as the top of the line SS models. They most certainly won't get the same preferential treatment as the $10,000-17,000 Edition customers.
 
Yeah, I don't expect Apple to do anything special for AW Hermes customers as they're in the same price range as the top of the line SS models. They most certainly won't get the same preferential treatment as the $10,000-17,000 Edition customers.

It's a bit ironic, because Apple does have an online reservation/order -- in-store pickup system that works very well. But since they aren't taking online orders for the Hermes watch, presumably to make it more "exclusive," people trying to get the Hermes watch from Apple stores get a poorer experience.
 
Here's a fun pic. Rained out at JaxToberfest!

image.jpeg
 
Not that it can't get done if they are determined to get it done, but it's not as simple as somebody at headquarters saying, "ok, we are taking reservations for the Hermes watch," and it immediately gets implemented at every store.

But they have them only in a handful of stores. No, it isn't feasible to do this in 400 stores, but I think they could do this for the few stores that carry them. Just don't allow online reservations. Make people come in and put themselves on a waiting list.
 
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