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Nice try.

Many printers require additional drivers under OSX as well. Some HP lasers as well as Dell lasers and others come to mind.

Registry doesnt need cleaning but if you want to go to there, then have fun with repairing permissions and trashing preferences frequently.

Vista has defragmentation which will run at low priority without impacting performance but unlike OSX, at least it comes with one without having to pay for it (if you so choose to manually run it). Seeing that the built in OSX automatic defragmentation doesnt do files > 20MB, I wouldnt call it quite so complete. I'd rather manually run a defrag tool once a month or two and know its handling all the files....

There are many antivirus that are free such as Avast and AVG but for users that are a bit more experienced such as myself, I have gone without AV for a long time without any issues. I have not had antivirus on my machine since 2003. A little common sense goes a long way to keeping one safe. Also OSX is slowly starting to become a target of malware and trojans so its only time before you're in the same boat.


enjoy your antivirus. oh and don't forget to search for that printer driver on the internet. By the way, clean the registry on a weekly basis and use the included defragmenter for your "1TB 7200 drive". :p

Many of those junk off the shelf motherboards are more feature rich than the apple mainboards. Features like hardware raid, built in SAS ports, more USB ports..etx. Also those junk components typically come with longer warranties also at no additional price. Incidientally. Asus and other PC junk parts makers are the ones that produce the parts in the Apple products.

Off the shelf hard drives also come with longer warranties as a result of not having an apple sticker stuck to it. Standard apple warranty for a hard drive that comes with the the system is 1 year. Standard seagate warranty is 3-5 years (as an example).

Memory...well many memory makers give lifetime warranty if you buy it as off the shelf junk. I think I prefer that. I kind of like knowing that my garbage cobbled together machine has a longer warranty than a much more expensive machine. Many power supplies are also available with lifetime warranties.

There are many video options for off the shelf junk that are faster as well. Before you say the GTX285 thats available for teh apple, its just a standard 'junk' EVGA off the shelf item thats got a different firmware. Thats all. Hope you wouldnt throw that off the shelf junk into a Mac.

Anyway I suspect that you might be able to say why you consider the off the shelf parts junk other than just blindness.


Apple doesn't sell junk thrown together with the cheapest off the shelf parts.
 
I bet it weighs half a ton tho....

You mean like a Mac Pro? The heaviest computer that I've ever owned is my Mac Pro...

Apple doesn't sell junk thrown together with the cheapest off the shelf parts.

You really (want to) believe that marketing crap, don't you?

enjoy your antivirus. oh and don't forget to search for that printer driver on the internet. By the way, clean the registry on a weekly basis and use the included defragmenter for your "1TB 7200 drive". :p

My anti-virus works fine and is hardly noticeable. With Windows, at least I have the option to search for drivers on the Internet -- with OS X, your printer might just not work because nobody ever bothered to write a driver for a minority platform. In more than twenty years, I never needed to clean the registry. And with NTFS, I never needed to defragment a hard disk either.

Any more misinformed crap and FUD you can throw at your most hated platform?
 
.


antivirus.jpg



"Any more misinformed crap and FUD you can throw at your most hated platform?"

Oh MAN! I gotz ammo for milez & milez!!!!!! Seriously!!! :D
Like, everytime you buy a MicroSoft product you're killing black babies in Africa! Really! ;)
 
Yes, its sad that Apple's "Mac" has been diluted by crappy intel parts. I'm glad I own a REAL Mac. :)
 
Hello,

This is not a flame post, but wanted to share that I just purchased an HP with 9gig DDR3, i7 920 2.66, 1TB 7200 drive, Blu-Ray, ATI 4850 1gig, Bluetooth, TV tuner for about 1420.00+ tax.

That said, I still miss not owning a mac.

Why can't Apple offer prices like this?

Anyway, I am trying it out and need to decide if I should return it and get a mac pro or mbp.

Thanks

Frank

You have to decide if you want second best. If so keep what you have. If you want the best, you know what they say. You get what you pay for and that is why Mac are more money. You get rid of a ton of Window problems.
 
It's strange now how there are no more clean cut answers to this question...

Sad, too.

Loa
 
Nice try.

Many printers require additional drivers under OSX as well. Some HP lasers as well as Dell lasers and others come to mind.

Registry doesnt need cleaning but if you want to go to there, then have fun with repairing permissions and trashing preferences frequently.

Vista has defragmentation which will run at low priority without impacting performance but unlike OSX, at least it comes with one without having to pay for it (if you so choose to manually run it). Seeing that the built in OSX automatic defragmentation doesnt do files > 20MB, I wouldnt call it quite so complete. I'd rather manually run a defrag tool once a month or two and know its handling all the files....

There are many antivirus that are free such as Avast and AVG but for users that are a bit more experienced such as myself, I have gone without AV for a long time without any issues. I have not had antivirus on my machine since 2003. A little common sense goes a long way to keeping one safe. Also OSX is slowly starting to become a target of malware and trojans so its only time before you're in the same boat.




Many of those junk off the shelf motherboards are more feature rich than the apple mainboards. Features like hardware raid, built in SAS ports, more USB ports..etx. Also those junk components typically come with longer warranties also at no additional price. Incidientally. Asus and other PC junk parts makers are the ones that produce the parts in the Apple products.

Off the shelf hard drives also come with longer warranties as a result of not having an apple sticker stuck to it. Standard apple warranty for a hard drive that comes with the the system is 1 year. Standard seagate warranty is 3-5 years (as an example).

Memory...well many memory makers give lifetime warranty if you buy it as off the shelf junk. I think I prefer that. I kind of like knowing that my garbage cobbled together machine has a longer warranty than a much more expensive machine. Many power supplies are also available with lifetime warranties.

There are many video options for off the shelf junk that are faster as well. Before you say the GTX285 thats available for teh apple, its just a standard 'junk' EVGA off the shelf item thats got a different firmware. Thats all. Hope you wouldnt throw that off the shelf junk into a Mac.

Anyway I suspect that you might be able to say why you consider the off the shelf parts junk other than just blindness.

Lets see...

Printers: your right about that ... no problem there. I can live with downloading specific drivers for printers. I can also live with the performance hit that comes with not having to install my 3d card drivers each month. Thats way more fun too.

Defrag: OSX doesn't require too defrag. YOU CAN defrag it but you just don't have too. end of story. Its like those AV for macs... gets everybody secured in their heads but actually does nothing.

AV`s: Last time i tried AVG it trashed the system. That thing was coded by idiots. Even AV's that where really good (karpensky, nod32) are looking more and more like that ... that.... how would you call norton? Yeah i tought so.

"A little common sense goes a long way to keeping one safe" Your assuming everyone is. OSX doesn't care about it. Your also assuming that OSX is GONNA be the target ... can you predict lottery numbers too? Maybe you will be right in the future or maybe not ... lets keep this with what is IS TODAY please. Your also forgeting about the 4-5 anti-spywares windows requires. Maybe your knowledgable about computer security? Grats but average joe is not and OSX again doesn't care.

Warranties: ... have you tried returning a mb to ASUS? I did.... 2 months and I had to pay shipping .... Bend over and i have to bring the lube too? Some service.. Or maybe you like better to resolve memory compat issues like i did cause my DFI board didn't like my Crucial mem? That was loads of fun.

Features that common people don't require ... hardware raid? Why would my mom require that? She will never use it nor she has a need for it. If you know what hardware raid is ... you will pay for it. And just between you and me ... if i have a need for hardware raid (for work pursposes) i wont trust a no-name off the shelf mb feature.

As for the price difference well ... please come with a price that reflects the reality. If i go on and take some PC parts that are not junk (cause there is some quality pc parts) ... add the cost of the operating system AND the cost of putting the comp togheter (cause remember that even if YOU put the system togheter there is still A cost) .. then the price difference is pretty slim. I won't say that Apple is cheaper but its definitly closer then window avocados pretend.
 
Now this is funny. You need a bigger one for pc's though. Like the one from porkey's movie. That might work. lol



.


antivirus.jpg



"Any more misinformed crap and FUD you can throw at your most hated platform?"

Oh MAN! I gotz ammo for milez & milez!!!!!! Seriously!!! :D
Like, everytime you buy a MicroSoft product you're killing black babies in Africa! Really! ;)
 
I went here to see how Macs fared:

http://www.apple.com/getamac/whymac/

I really enjoyed that page! (Some excerpts and comments)

-We have "brains": OS X is better than Windows. I agree. On the other hand, it's not like we're comparing System 6 with DOS, or System 8 with Windows 3.1. OS X won't let you get work done significantly than XP. (Let's skip Vista for now...)

-We have "beauty": Yep, no real argument there, but, again, it won't let you work any better/faster.

-We don't get PC viruses. Sure. Just let us have a 50% market share and they'll start popping up. Also, as some security cracking competitions showed in the past couple of years, Mac OS X is no more secure (often less) than other OSes.

OS X security cracked in 10 seconds anyone? (http://news.cnet.com/8301-1009_3-10199652-83.html)

Sure the hole has been patched, just as any other OSes will send out security patches.

-Performance: Well, since we're using the same CPUs, RAM, HDs, SSDs and GPUs as most PCs, I don't know how we could expect significant performance differences.

And since some major PC apps like Photoshop get updated to new standards of performance (64 bit) more often/faster...

------------------------
The last four are really pathetic:

-Always up to date because of software update: WHAT? This is really a Mac to PC advantage??? A top 8 advantage??? WTF?

-Born ready, with all the printer, etc.. drivers: They just preinstall them on your Mac, bloating the OS with software that most people will only use 5% of...

First thing I do when I install OS X? I remove all useless languages and drivers.

-Instantly Wireless: Just like most PCs. On the other hand, PCs will allow you to save money if you don't want it. Try saving money by removing your wireless card from an iMac at the AppleStore...

-Conversation Piece: iChat with video conferencing: It's nice, but again PCs can do that too, and videoconferencing with four people is what, a feature that's useful for 1% of the population? At most?

-----------------------------------
Made for Today: That's by far the funniest piece of that page! Four features that are "for today". The first one is a repeat of the wireless "wonder".

The other three are essentially Windows compatibility: Mac and PC networks, Microsoft office, Microsoft Windows.

Windows compatibility to show that Macs are better??? That's one of the best example of failed logic I've ever seen.

-----

In the end, although I do enjoy my Mac, I'm still coming up waaaaay short when I try to convince PC users to switch.

Still waiting for good arguments.

Loa
 
Ad blurbs...

Apple should get political and show just what Bill, His Dad, and his wife are actually doing in the world. If they wanted to destroy MS, that would do it!
 
Ad blurbs...

Sure, but if Apple had anything significantly better, they'd use it. Being forced to use such weak arguments in your ads show that don't have anything else.

Apple should get political and show just what Bill, His Dad, and his wife are actually doing in the world. If they wanted to destroy MS, that would do it!

Again: slandering is the last resource of the weak.

If we had an argument like: at the same price we're 10%-30% faster across the board, we'd use it.

As it stands, I have absolutely no argument when PC friends ask me why they should consider a Mac as their next computer purchase.

Well, no other argument except: "it feels better". sheesh

Loa
 
About the defragging, OSX does require defragging, thats why automatic defragging is part of the OS except that it doesnt defrag files greater than 20GB in size.

As for antivirus, the last 500 times or so I've used AVG on different systems, its been fine. We use it here at work and I use it on the side for my own clients. Kaspersky and NOD32 are fine as well but doing my own tests, I find AVG more capable at finding malware and viruses. Dont like nortons and dont like Mcafee.

Malware - OSX is already becoming a target which is why there has been more incidents of trojans or malware in the last year than all other years combined. There may not be anything too serious yet but its only a matter of time IMO.

I've also warrantied plenty of stuff from Asus, seagate, WD, Samsung, OCZ and Kingston. Never had a single issue. I pay shipping there and they pay it on the way back. I've even had companies cover warranty which is just shortly out of warranty (like a month or so out).

About the raid thing, motherboard level raid could also imply mirroring and stripping. I've used mirroring very often for clients on their data drives since drives are so cheap these days. Even little old granny can benefit becuase her data will be on a mirror set which is safer than on a single drive. Yes you can do software mirroring but why bother if the feature is already availabe in hardware. I've also used motherboard level raid5 for years on my home built server and never a hiccup.

Lastly Apple is not more cost effective unless you want a nitch product. Mac mini? Thats a Nitch product (ultra small mini-ITX sized machine). iMac is an all in one and the Mac Pro is a full out workstation. The majority of machines sold is a small to medium sized tower and none of the above really fit that model. So compared to that type of machine, Apple is expensive. Yes you get nicer aesthetics but not everyone needs that. Many people just tuck the machine under a desk anyway :)



Lets see...

Printers: your right about that ... no problem there. I can live with downloading specific drivers for printers. I can also live with the performance hit that comes with not having to install my 3d card drivers each month. Thats way more fun too.

Defrag: OSX doesn't require too defrag. YOU CAN defrag it but you just don't have too. end of story. Its like those AV for macs... gets everybody secured in their heads but actually does nothing.

AV`s: Last time i tried AVG it trashed the system. That thing was coded by idiots. Even AV's that where really good (karpensky, nod32) are looking more and more like that ... that.... how would you call norton? Yeah i tought so.


"A little common sense goes a long way to keeping one safe" Your assuming everyone is. OSX doesn't care about it. Your also assuming that OSX is GONNA be the target ... can you predict lottery numbers too? Maybe you will be right in the future or maybe not ... lets keep this with what is IS TODAY please. Your also forgeting about the 4-5 anti-spywares windows requires. Maybe your knowledgable about computer security? Grats but average joe is not and OSX again doesn't care.


Warranties: ... have you tried returning a mb to ASUS? I did.... 2 months and I had to pay shipping .... Bend over and i have to bring the lube too? Some service.. Or maybe you like better to resolve memory compat issues like i did cause my DFI board didn't like my Crucial mem? That was loads of fun.


Features that common people don't require ... hardware raid? Why would my mom require that? She will never use it nor she has a need for it. If you know what hardware raid is ... you will pay for it. And just between you and me ... if i have a need for hardware raid (for work pursposes) i wont trust a no-name off the shelf mb feature.


As for the price difference well ... please come with a price that reflects the reality. If i go on and take some PC parts that are not junk (cause there is some quality pc parts) ... add the cost of the operating system AND the cost of putting the comp togheter (cause remember that even if YOU put the system togheter there is still A cost) .. then the price difference is pretty slim. I won't say that Apple is cheaper but its definitly closer then window avocados pretend.
 
Sure, but if Apple had anything significantly better, they'd use it. Being forced to use such weak arguments in your ads show that don't have anything else.

I think that in this case it just means that the ad-man who wrote the web-page didn't know his sh*t. Such is usually the case with things like this.


Again: slandering is the last resource of the weak.

It wouldn't be slander! It's all documented and very real. Slander implies the charges are untrue. This would be more akin to whistle-blowing! ;)
 
How about the MacBook Pros, which of those would you say is over-priced (or most over-priced) and which are good deals (good values).



There are on-line coupons for -$350 making that base machine ~$800. :D

http://images.google.com/images?hl=...HP+Pavilion+Elite+e9150t&sa=N&start=0&ndsp=21

Looks like an "OK" machine. It's HP's desktop tho so historically that means you can't expect to max out it's spec or install additional power hungry cards. It also usually means that the PSU will die in the 1st 1 or 2 years. :p

But for $800 hey... Why not?

To answer the question: Why buy a Macintosh?

For 2009 models the ONLY reason I can come up with is fanboyism or brand loyalty or maybe because you wish to help pay Steve's medical bills or... you wish to pay $2000 for a really cool case. Buying a 2009 Mac Pro == More money than sense IMHO! For 2008, 2007, and 2006 machines the answer is: Because you can't build them cheaper yourself and no other company even compares.

That's my opinion anyway. :D
 
I went here to see how Macs fared:


In the end, although I do enjoy my Mac, I'm still coming up waaaaay short when I try to convince PC users to switch.

Still waiting for good arguments.

Loa

If your friends need an "argument" to decide what to buy, maybe they don't need a Mac. Just use the computers you like and let others use the ones they want. Why try to convince them yours is better?

It's just a computer.
 
Hello,

This is not a flame post, but wanted to share that I just purchased an HP with 9gig DDR3, i7 920 2.66, 1TB 7200 drive, Blu-Ray, ATI 4850 1gig, Bluetooth, TV tuner for about 1420.00+ tax.

So it's cheap. Does it run the software you need? It it can't run Logic and Aperture even if the computer were free I would not want it.

The bottom line is that you buy a computer so you can run software. So first identify the software you want then buy the computer that runs it and fits in the budget. Maybe you are into video games, if so Mac OS X is not the best. But if you work with images and sound it's different
 
So it's cheap. Does it run the software you need? It it can't run Logic and Aperture even if the computer were free I would not want it.

The bottom line is that you buy a computer so you can run software. So first identify the software you want then buy the computer that runs it and fits in the budget. Maybe you are into video games, if so Mac OS X is not the best. But if you work with images and sound it's different

The OP has already explained what he/she misses. But hey, they've got a Blu-Ray player.
 
It is an HP Pavilion Elite e9150t PC

I have not played any Blu-Ray yet.

I was looking at the MBP 17" before this and could not decide on the gloss vs matte screen.

The Mac Pro was the quad for 2499.00 and I was opting for a cheap 24" monitor to cut cost. Aside from the Blu-Ray and extra ram, I think the Mac Pro was built much better, but about 700 dollars more.

I'm with you! If I could get a refurb MacPro for $1599 I'd jump at it, otherwise it's just too expensive. (plus I want Bluray!)

That said these MacPros do hold up very well over time. Our daughter has one of the first MacPros and while I've upgraded my MB to MBP to MBP to MB to MBP to uMBP to uMBP over the past 3 years, she still has the same system and is able to work and play everything other than the latest DirectX game (I guess the ATI4870 would fix that too).

Cheers,
 
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