Yea, no thanks.

[Shirasaki]

Virtual reality and mental health in older adults: a systematic review - PubMed

Existing evidence offers support for VR as a screening and training tool for cognitive impairment in older adults. VR-based tasks demonstrated validity comparable to some paper-based assessments of cognition, though more work is needed to refine diagnostic specificity. The variety of VR...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Existing evidence offers support for VR as a screening and training tool for cognitive impairment in older adults. VR-based tasks demonstrated validity comparable to some paper-based assessments of cognition, though more work is needed to refine diagnostic specificity. The variety of VR environments used shows a need for standardization before comparisons can be made across VR simulations. Future studies should address key issues such as usability, data privacy, and confidentiality. Since most literature was generated from high-income countries (HICs), it remains unclear how this may be translated to other parts of the world.

as per the conclusion quoted From that link, I think it should go without saying that what you think is promising remains to be seen and need much more tests before any serious conclusions can be drawn at whether VR and AR is effective at providing these specific treatments or not. Also, this research doesn’t focus on the danger of mass VR/AR adoption and the consequence of that. Tech are moving so fast we only now start To realise how bad long term screen time can be to kids and teenagers. VR/AR will suffer the same fat, only worse.

 

[masotime]

That's me. I would in no way buy this thing instead of a high end laptop. Never in a million years.

You’re buying things wrong.

You buy this and a high end laptop.

 

[phenste]

Existing evidence offers support for VR as a screening and training tool for cognitive impairment in older adults. VR-based tasks demonstrated validity comparable to some paper-based assessments of cognition, though more work is needed to refine diagnostic specificity. The variety of VR environments used shows a need for standardization before comparisons can be made across VR simulations. Future studies should address key issues such as usability, data privacy, and confidentiality. Since most literature was generated from high-income countries (HICs), it remains unclear how this may be translated to other parts of the world.

as per the conclusion quoted From that link, I think it should go without saying that what you think is promising remains to be seen and need much more tests before any serious conclusions can be drawn at whether VR and AR is effective at providing these specific treatments or not. Also, this research doesn’t focus on the danger of mass VR/AR adoption and the consequence of that. Tech are moving so fast we only now start To realise how bad long term screen time can be to kids and teenagers. VR/AR will suffer the same fat, only worse.

How virtual reality helps curb social isolation among local senior citizens

Virtual reality is curbing the adverse effects of social isolation for senior citizens.

www.abcactionnews.com

 

[masotime]

Yeah my dad thought it was funny how the company that doesn’t want people working from home also unveil a device with a demo segment dedicated to remote work. They don’t even believe in their own product. Pathetic.

I don't think it's inconsistent? They don't demand a full work from office from what I'm seeing in the news - it's a hybrid work policy.

I like a full remote policy, but to say that they "don't want people working from home" is a bit disingenuous - they just don't want people working from home all the time, so the use case of the Vision Pro for remote work still stands.

Additionally, if the product matures enough with a good ecosystem of apps to support a full simulation of an office, who is to say they wouldn't actually go full remote?

 

[kkee]

Okay, listen, I respect the work that went into this. I can also respect this is a kind of beta hardware for something that might be practical one day in the future. Apple can totally afford to play around with ideas. So, I'm not knocking them for working on this.

However, let's be honest. How many people want to wear this thing on their head instead of watching their 65" OLED TV (or bigger for the price of this thing)? Who wants to take this on a trip instead of a trusty MacBook Pro that has 16 hours of battery life? Who wants to use this thing to write forum posts? Who wants to use this thing to do much of anything? Not me.

In fact there is only one thing I can see this being useful for given the battery life, but they aren't going to market it for that.

I listen to you and so now you listen to me.

I can respect your opinion, which like mine, does not represent everyone's opinion nor do we claim it to be. So far so good? So I will be honest. I will buy this in a heartbeat. I will wear this thing on my head, watching movies, doing some works, replying to this forum and use it to do much of anything. Definitely, 100%. I am supporting the philosophy behind this, making path to the future computational.

Battery life is always improving. And yes, you can always use your power outlet.

 

[The-Real-Deal82]

This is the point where the mainstream Macrumors enthusiast becomes a boomer and technology progresses past them. Clearly not a product for you, but society will move on without you.

It doesn’t matter though and that is the point. There’s people right now who have never used a smartphone or the internet, yet their lives are no worse off than ours. Society doesn’t move on at all, you’re just another part of it.

 

[Surf Monkey]

I love OLED. Hard to look at anything else after you have used a quality OLED display.

I need to try this headset in person before making a decision. Really need to see and experience how good the optics are.

Do you know that you’ll love an OLED that’s the size of a postage stamp?

 

[Surf Monkey]

Such things exist? Or are you joking?

Even if such things exist, in a tiny apartment, every inch counts. Virtual giant screen for small apartments is a definite market.

Makes sense in an economy that excludes most people from being able to afford a house. But they won’t mind. They’ll be isolated behind their AVPs in their tiny apartments with empty bank accounts experiencing “the future.”

 

[pierre_rush]

I upvoted this comment but must note that the incredible lack of vision in evidence in this thread is not about boomers. Most of the plethora of visionless posters here are much younger; the lack of vision is not a function of age.

You're right - I think I was using the term "boomer" as an analogy of someone resisting change but that's totally correct.

 

[Surf Monkey]

You're right - I think I was using the term "boomer" as an analogy of someone resisting change but that's totally correct.

Change is fine if it’s to a purpose and framing people to whom AVP doesn’t appeal as some kind of luddites is just kind of ludicrous on the face of it.

 

[pierre_rush]

Change is fine if it’s to a purpose and framing people to whom AVP doesn’t appeal as some kind of luddites is just kind of ludicrous on the face of it.

It's telling to see so many people in this thread treat AVP like people once treated the iPhone when it came out (as something that didn't offer much value to users compared to Blackberry phones for instance). It's hard not to make a comparison to them or other people resisting a new technology which changes our relationship to things.

 

[Surf Monkey]

It's telling to see so many people in this thread treat AVP like people once treated the iPhone when it came out (as something that didn't offer much value to users compared to Blackberry phones for instance). It's hard not to make a comparison to them or other people resisting a new technology which changes our relationship to things.

Are they? Doesn’t look like it to me. The extreme criticism of the iPhone was obviously unfounded. The criticism I see around the AVP is mainly grounded and compelling.

Besides, it’s an unfair comparison anyway. Everyone already had a PHONE before iPhone came along. It wasn’t a drastic concept that people had to learn how to use. Furthermore the smart phone market was hot at that point. The AR/VR market is not hot at the moment and headsets are not ubiquitous like phones.

 

[pierre_rush]

Are they? Doesn’t look like it to me. The extreme criticism of the iPhone was obviously unfounded. The criticism I see around the AVP is mainly grounded and compelling.

Besides, it’s an unfair comparison anyway. Everyone already had a PHONE before iPhone came along. It wasn’t a drastic concept that people had to learn how to use. Furthermore the smart phone market was hot at that point. The AR/VR market is not hot at the moment and headsets are not ubiquitous like phones.

We'll see, hindsight is always 20/20 and when the iPhone was announced by Steve Jobs many people swore it would fail. I am very curious to see if Apple can create a new AirPods effect with its AVP where in a few years it becomes a commonly used accessory or if it remains a niche like other AR/VR headsets.

To me the jump from an iPhone as your main "access" into the virtual worlds created by smartphone apps isn't that big of a leap when going to an AR headset, you're just more immersed. But people are already deeply imbedded in virtual worlds with smartphones so as long as the AVP offers a more integrated or more convenient experience, people will buy it. Biggest limitation right now is the battery life which makes it a home-based product...

 

[Surf Monkey]

We'll see, hindsight is always 20/20 and when the iPhone was announced by Steve Jobs many people swore it would fail. I am very curious to see if Apple can create a new AirPods effect with its AVP where in a few years it becomes a commonly used accessory or if it remains a niche like other AR/VR headsets.

To me the jump from an iPhone as your main "access" into the virtual worlds created by smartphone apps isn't that big of a leap when going to an AR headset, you're just more immersed. But people are already deeply imbedded in virtual worlds with smartphones so as long as the AVP offers a more integrated or more convenient experience, people will buy it. Biggest limitation right now is the battery life which makes it a home-based product...

They didn’t claim it would fail because it had no compelling use case or inherent reason to buy it. Their criticism came (largely) from the fact that it only allowed Web apps and couldn’t do some basic things like copy/paste.

This is not the case with AVP. In this case we have a product that’s not easy to explain to people, has no compelling mass appeal use case, makes you look weird, isolates you behind a screen…

It just isn’t a valid comparison. iPhone had a compelling reason to purchase it. It was easy to understand and interact with. This has none of that.

 

[pierre_rush]

They didn’t claim it would fail because it had no compelling use case or inherent reason to buy it. Their criticism came (largely) from the fact that it only allowed Web apps and couldn’t do some basic things like copy/paste.

This is not the case with AVP. In this case we have a product that’s not easy to explain to people, has no compelling mass appeal use case, makes you look weird, isolates you behind a screen…

It just isn’t a valid comparison. iPhone had a compelling reason to purchase it. It was easy to understand and interact with. This has none of that.

The product is pretty easy to explain I find, it’s just a deeper integration of your daily-used applications into your perception.

No compelling mass appeal use case? It’s hard to judge for now - it’s still an emerging technology which is why I’m personally curious to see how it evolves. If it becomes easier to use and cheaper, I think it might make physical screens look like a thing from the past.

« Makes you look weird » is not a compelling argument since society normalized staring at a phone screen in public - something previously considered rude, antisocial and uncivilized. AirPods are an easy counter example, too. The fashion industry demonstrates every day how you can turn an object from looking « weird » to being « hip » in short time periods.

And finally most people are already isolated behind a screen. Since COVID it’s gotten even worse, I don’t think AVP really changes much it’s just following a trend. Go in an elevator or a bus and see how everyone is already in their phone’s virtual worlds, completely isolated from the physical world.

 

[Otaviano]

But MacBook Air is limited to just one 15/13 inch screen. Vision Pro gives you multiple screens in any size you want.

You can always attach the MacBook Air to an external screen. I should also point out that none of the apps you use on your MacBook Air are available on the Vision Pro and there is no telling if and when they will be available. Take Photoshop for example where the iPad version to this day remains but a Photoshop Light and hardly a replacement for the real version.

 

[Night Spring]

And finally most people are already isolated behind a screen. Since COVID it’s gotten even worse, I don’t think AVP really changes much it’s just following a trend. Go in an elevator or a bus and see how everyone is already in their phone’s virtual worlds, completely isolated from the physical world.

But it's not like people were chatting with each other in elevators and buses pre-smartphones. Most people would just stare ahead or keep their eyes down, not making eye contact with anyone, keeping their space as best they could in a crowd. Having a smartphone to stare into just makes this process a bit easier.

 

[pierre_rush]

But it's not like people were chatting with each other in elevators and buses pre-smartphones. Most people would just stare ahead or keep their eyes down, not making eye contact with anyone, keeping their space as best they could in a crowd. Having a smartphone to stare into just makes this process a bit easier.

People did talk to each other a bit more in these situations. But I could use a more striking example which would be lunch breaks in schools - with students spending them on their phones instead of what our childhoods were like, or simply couples in their apartments spending more time on their phones than talking to each other on the couch relative to what was a normal experience before phones. Just saying it’s not like people are very connected to physical reality nowadays and AVP will just prolong the trend!

 

[Night Spring]

You can always attach the MacBook Air to an external screen. I should also point out that none of the apps you use on your MacBook Air are available on the Vision Pro and there is no telling if and when they will be available. Take Photoshop for example where the iPad version to this day remains but a Photoshop Light and hardly a replacement for the real version.

I know I can attach monitors to my MacBook, but I can't carry my monitors with me when I go out. The Vision Pro is much more portable than a monitor, so like Apple showed in their presentation, I could take it with me on an airplane and use it in a hotel room. And while Vision Pro doesn't directly run Mac Apps, from what I understand, it does act as an "external monitor" for Macs. So if I'm in a hotel room with a MacBook and a Vision Pro, I can work like I would at home on my 30 inch monitor. That sounds like a pretty good thing to me.

 

[Night Spring]

People did talk to each other a bit more in these situations. But I could use a more striking example which would be lunch breaks in schools - with students spending them on their phones instead of what our childhoods were like, or simply couples in their apartments spending more time on their phones than talking to each other on the couch relative to what was a normal experience before phones. Just saying it’s not like people are very connected to physical reality nowadays and AVP will just prolong the trend!

Okay point taken!

 

[Johnny London]

Does anyone know if projectors have OLED yet or at all ?

Doubt it.

Sorry.

The first gen DLP chips in projectors are 15+ years old and tried to improve the biggest issue with projectors back then: Low contrast. Individual pixels can be shut off, emitting no light onto the projected surface. Sounds familiar? OLED is the same concept only for screens. I am using my third projector now, first one being a DLP and the others LCD. From my experience the classic LCD technology has become so ripe, good contrast as well as natural colors, which DLP used to struggle with and probably still is.

 

[one more]

I am personally freaked out by the sheer size of this thing and cannot imagine myself going out anywhere wearing this on my head.

Imagine walking with this on the street, getting into a public transport, etc. Freaky!

Until the tech evolves and Apple can bring it to the size of normal biggish glasses, it is definitely a pass for me.

 

[CyberDavis]

I think the Vision Pro looks interesting.
Could be quite an immersive experience, I would want to try it before dismissing or considering it.

For me though the price is maybe the most prohibitive thing, especially as I'd need the Zeiss inserts being a glasses wearer.
I also look forward to hearing how much sound leaks to those around you when in use, and whether AirPod Pro/Max can be used in conjunction.

I am sure between now and actual release Apple will try to build compelling use cases, it will be interesting to see what they come up with.
Anyway, as I live in the UK I have plenty of time to look on as others try them and give their real use feedback and reviews.

 

[cupcakes2000]

Makes sense in an economy that excludes most people from being able to afford a house. But they won’t mind. They’ll be isolated behind their AVPs in their tiny apartments with empty bank accounts experiencing “the future.”

How poor do you think people are? How empty would their bank remain even if they did (somewhat stupidly) decide to spend ALL of their money on this item? A month at most? It’s not 50k!! I have no opinion either way on whether or who should buy it, but it’s much more normal to assume they could afford it if they chose to.

Maybe you can’t and that’s fine. Don’t empty your bank account to get it! Likewise, don’t assume that’s what anyone else will do.

 

[Shirasaki]

How virtual reality helps curb social isolation among local senior citizens

Virtual reality is curbing the adverse effects of social isolation for senior citizens.

www.abcactionnews.com

Again, it needs broader research and better understanding rather than saying "this is good" blindly if you haven't got my point already. Companies have been found to advertise product advantages over disclosing disadvantages to boost sales and keep their bottom line afloat. VR/AR headset is not and will never be an all-good no-bad product.