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bill-p

macrumors 68020
Jul 23, 2011
2,412
894
The overheating issue is the longest thread both here and on the official Apple forums for a reason. The issue is annoying as hell! And Apple isn't exactly being great with their customer service by just denying it's an issue.

They are not denying anything.

If you read carefully or if you have had the chance to interact with them directly, the correct wording is "it is expected".

So they do expect this to be a problem. They just won't do anything about existing machines. That's the difference.

I can live with my 16" in clamshell and I find the 16" a perfect machine elsewhere so... I'm good. It seems those of you who absolutely cannot work with just one monitor will need to pay for an eGPU or an upgrade to the new 5600M card.

So what else do you want? Apple has never publicly acknowledged any issue at all. Not even the butterfly keys that had much higher failure rate than this external monitor situation.
 
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Artemis777

macrumors newbie
Dec 26, 2019
28
18
has anyone ever had success running this laptop with lid open without having the GPU hit 18watts instantly? Or is it possible ONLY with the lid closed + single monitor?
 
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Jaunte

macrumors newbie
Jun 21, 2020
17
37
Wow, if you read trough this thread one could get the impression that the MBP 16 is the worst MacBook ever.

I can only speak for myself but besides the external monitor issue it's a great machine and actually the best MB (in terms of value) you can buy right now. I would never switch to the 13 inch MBP...

It's really a shame that this great machine struggles with external monitors, but I just don't see Apple fixing this. I think the only ones who can fix it are AMD and I don't think that will happen.
Without external displays it is not as bad... but even without external displays it isn't hard to make it throttle below base clock speed, so I wouldn't call it a great machine either... which is funny as it already has "advanced thermal design" compared to the previous model...
 
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kaans

macrumors regular
Nov 17, 2014
220
54
Today was a bad day for me

1) Realised Pixelmator always forces dGPU no matter what - so it's almost like having an external monitor connected at all times - if there are more apps out there like this, it makes the device always hot - it's sad because I like having Pixelmator always open, as I don't usually save everything I work on

2) Got the Aliexpress 8K - USB-C to DP cable, boom, "unplug the usb accessory using too much power" F'in cable had a short circuit - luckily nothing happened to the device, at least I hope, everything works for now, but my .02 - don't just buy cables that won't solve the problem and at the same time, risk the device - it's an f'in hell wherever we lean onto - wented a bit in more detail here: https://www.reddit.com/r/macbookpro/comments/hjvy4f - I also found another cable that caused the same issue, so be careful about cables :(

Best to just give up I guess, on the bright side, we could be dead because of coronavirus, but we're alive and in comparison this is just a small issue - I'm glad this f'in cable didn't damage the device, and the seller is the regular **** chinese seller, he wants a video to prove the issue :D - Like I'm going to risk using that cable again

Honestly, if we turn this into a support group of sorts, maybe we should all just try to ignore the pain and concentrate on our work, I couldn't do much today either, too demotivated

I read earlier about someone experiencing a crash, this test is a must to eliminate a hardware issue: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/250905859?answerId=250905859021#250905859021 - If it doesn't reboot, you are good
 
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Artemis777

macrumors newbie
Dec 26, 2019
28
18
Today was a bad day for me

1) Realised Pixelmator always forces dGPU no matter what - so it's almost like having an external monitor connected at all times - if there are more apps out there like this, it makes the device always hot - it's sad because I like having Pixelmator always open, as I don't usually save everything I work on

2) Got the Aliexpress 8K - USB-C to DP cable, boom, "unplug the usb accessory using too much power" F'in cable had a short circuit - luckily nothing happened to the device, at least I hope, everything works for now, but my .02 - don't just buy cables that won't solve the problem and at the same time, risk the device - it's an f'in hell wherever we lean onto - wented a bit in more detail here: https://www.reddit.com/r/macbookpro/comments/hjvy4f - I also found another cable that caused the same issue, so be careful about cables :(

Best to just give up I guess, on the bright side, we could be dead because of coronavirus, but we're alive and in comparison this is just a small issue - I'm glad this f'in cable didn't damage the device, and the seller is the regular **** chinese seller, he wants a video to prove the issue :D - Like I'm going to risk using that cable again

Honestly, if we turn this into a support group of sorts, maybe we should all just try to ignore the pain and concentrate on our work, I couldn't do much today either, too demotivated

I read earlier about someone experiencing a crash, this test is a must to eliminate a hardware issue: https://discussions.apple.com/thread/250905859?answerId=250905859021#250905859021 - If it doesn't reboot, you are good
use this on terminal to force the integrated gpu (when disconnected to external monitors)
sudo -i
-a gpuswitch 0



replace the 0 with a 2 to re-enable the dgpu
 
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Artemis777

macrumors newbie
Dec 26, 2019
28
18
BTW I'm currently emailing every tech YouTuber I know (Dave2d, ZoneofTech, MKBHD etc etc) showing them the issue linking this and other threads and asking kindly to put a spotlight on this issue. I encourage you to do the same so we might have higher chances
 
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jaduffy007

macrumors regular
May 23, 2018
121
113
They are not denying anything.

If you read carefully or if you have had the chance to interact with them directly, the correct wording is "it is expected".

So they do expect this to be a problem. They just won't do anything about existing machines. That's the difference.

I can live with my 16" in clamshell and I find the 16" a perfect machine elsewhere so... I'm good. It seems those of you who absolutely cannot work with just one monitor will need to pay for an eGPU or an upgrade to the new 5600M card.

So what else do you want? Apple has never publicly acknowledged any issue at all. Not even the butterfly keys that had much higher failure rate than this external monitor situation.

"Apple has never publicly acknowledged any issue at all. Not even the butterfly keys that had much higher failure rate than this external monitor situation."

Exactly...and you appear to defend this behavior. Apple took a LONG time to acknowledge the keyboard issues. In the beginning, it was, "it works as expected". That's not customer support, it's customer gets screwed over.

What else do I want? I want a machine that works as advertised...that works consistent with the previous 5 MBPs I've owned. I want a machine that is consistent with the other current MBPs Apple makes!! The 5600M doesn't have these issues. The same hardware but via Bootcamp / Windows drivers...doesn't have these issues. Why is that??

That's what I want. Should all of us who don't share your complacent acceptance of Apple denials of FAILED design, simply say, thank you Apple for screwing me over?

And I also know what I don't want...and that is having to read BS drivel from Apple apologist / fanboys such as yourself. It's annoying as F.
 
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Bsye

macrumors newbie
Jul 1, 2020
5
26
BTW I'm currently emailing every tech YouTuber I know (Dave2d, ZoneofTech, MKBHD etc etc) showing them the issue linking this and other threads and asking kindly to put a spotlight on this issue. I encourage you to do the same so we might have higher chances

I already did this, the more emails we send the greater are the chances that they see the message
 
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Alexander William

macrumors 6502
Apr 18, 2020
293
130
You realize all of this is Apples fault, They could have given the option to force toggle the GPU and Igpu. Used the 930HD to drive external displays and save us the pain of heat and thermal issues / fan noise overall - 930HD is good enough to drive this stuff.

They chose to force the Dgpu for all these trivial tasks and therefore it is a engineering issue, as windows and many other devices give you this option.


The 930 can push 4k x3 displays, 2k x3 @60hz aswell.

Apple fooked up the entire DGPU / Igpu use cases and instead of optimizing for stuff like this they took the lazy approach and said fook it Dgpu for everything video out.

If the DGpu was not optimized well for these tasks they should have taken proper advantage of the hardware in our cpus; rather then wasting it. Its a engineering design flaw, as our devices have a Igpu that can handle what we're trying to do, only Apple crippled it and forced us to listen to the Saturn 5 Moon Rocket.

Apple_rocket_liftoff.jpg
 
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ConnorMac

macrumors newbie
Jul 2, 2020
12
36
I solved my problem using SwithResX;

Problem definition: When I use my computer (MacBook Pro 16") with my external monitor (Dell U2713HM) my computer's dedicated GPU (AMD Radeon Pro 5300M 4 GB) consumes a lot of power and fans spin constantly.
I use my computer in clamshell mode and connect to my monitor using a USB-C to DisplayPort cable.

Solution: I realized my computer drives the monitor with a weird hertz (59.88).
When I looked at the EDID info of my monitor using SwitchResX, I realized the hertz value should be 59.951.

Monitor Description blocks:
---------------------------
Descriptor #0 - Timing definition:
Mode = 2560 × 1440 @ 59.951Hz
Pixel Clock............. 241.50 MHz Not Interlaced

Horizontal Vertical
Active.................. 2560 pixels 1440 lines
Front Porch............. 48 pixels 3 lines
Sync Width.............. 32 pixels 5 lines
Back Porch.............. 80 pixels 33 lines
Blanking................ 160 pixels 41 lines
Total................... 2720 pixels 1481 lines
Scan Rate............... 88.787 kHz 59.951 Hz
Image Size.............. 597 mm 336 mm
Border.................. 0 pixels 0 lines




I have created three custom resolutions;

2560x1440@59.951
2560x1440@50
2560x1440@60

When I use 2560x1440@50 or 2560x1440@59.951 the fan only spins under heavy load.
So my problem solved, the issue fixed and I am really happy because It worked without a new cable.


Thanks for pointing me in the right direction! I have also solved the issue with SwitchResX

Had my MBP 16 since Nov 2019 and the fans have always run like jet engines (super hot and loud) when connected to my ext monitor (USB-C to Displayport).... until tonight after implementing the solution suggested above

Radeon High Side would previously sit at 18W in clamshell with ext monitor connected, but now it sits around 5W avg. The MacBook I was ready to sell this morning is now quiet and cool, just like my beloved 2015 MBP 15 was

Hopefully Apple are aware of this thread and will "fix" the issue in a more robust way soon, but in the meantime give this workaround a try
SwitchResX_Settings.png
before and after.png
Radeon GPU 18w to 5w.png
 
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kaans

macrumors regular
Nov 17, 2014
220
54
I totally agree - remove the dGPU from the 16" - maybe slightly improve the IPS panel's response times - and it's a beautiful device - without the dGPU used, I get almost 10 hours of video playback etc. - and honestly, since it's a Macbook, probably most of us don't use the dGPU anyway, it's more of a gaming thing for most
 
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bill-p

macrumors 68020
Jul 23, 2011
2,412
894
"Apple has never publicly acknowledged any issue at all. Not even the butterfly keys that had much higher failure rate than this external monitor situation."

Exactly...and you appear to defend this behavior. Apple took a LONG time to acknowledge the keyboard issues. In the beginning, it was, "it works as expected". That's not customer support, it's customer gets screwed over.

What else do I want? I want a machine that works as advertised...that works consistent with the previous 5 MBPs I've owned. I want a machine that is consistent with the other current MBPs Apple makes!! The 5600M doesn't have these issues. The same hardware but via Bootcamp / Windows drivers...doesn't have these issues. Why is that??

That's what I want. Should all of us who don't share your complacent acceptance of Apple denials of FAILED design, simply say, thank you Apple for screwing me over?

And I also know what I don't want...and that is having to read BS drivel from Apple apologist / fanboys such as yourself. It's annoying as F.

I don't defend the behavior. I'm stating the obvious.

You can cry about this issue all you want. I did this when the butterfly keyboard made me repair all of my past MacBooks. Hell, everybody who owned a butterfly keyboard and had issues cried. We had petitions, we had everything under the sun.

Apple did not give a damn.

So what makes you think calling me a "fanboy" will do anything? We've been there. We've done that. Apple did not listen. Period.
 
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Alexander William

macrumors 6502
Apr 18, 2020
293
130
I don't defend the behavior. I'm stating the obvious.

You can cry about this issue all you want. I did this when the butterfly keyboard made me repair all of my past MacBooks. Hell, everybody who owned a butterfly keyboard and had issues cried. We had petitions, we had everything under the sun.

Apple did not give a damn.

So what makes you think calling me a "fanboy" will do? We've been there. We've done that. Apple did not listen. Period.

Write tim cook a letter per day, hell lets all start mailing Tim that there is obvious engineering issues below apples standards.
[automerge]1593722660[/automerge]
I totally agree - remove the dGPU from the 16" - maybe slightly improve the IPS panel's response times - and it's a beautiful device - without the dGPU used, I get almost 10 hours of video playback etc. - and honestly, since it's a Macbook, probably most of us don't use the dGPU anyway, it's more of a gaming thing for most

Yes, but they should have given us an option to Toggle it off permanently, only tossing it on when need be for power users like us.

Apple for a company so big surely knows how to fook up on the details.
 
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bill-p

macrumors 68020
Jul 23, 2011
2,412
894
Write tim cook a letter per day.

Good luck!

I'd rather try and get work done instead of spending hours a day getting frustrated because Apple refuses to listen to my complaints. I really have tried to do that with the butterfly keys and 4 years later, I've moved on.

And it's not like you don't have options, either. Use an eGPU with your existing setup or buy the 5600M and burn your current 5300M/5500M computer or something.
 
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x3sphere

macrumors member
Apr 17, 2014
54
30
Nope. Get the Razer Core X or Razer Core X Chroma. It has 100W power delivery to prevent battery drain when you're actually using the MBP for any intensive tasks. Almost all other eGPU enclosures only provide 60W or 87W and the 16" MBP ideally wants at least 94W (what Apple provides in the box).

And yes, even with the dGPU using less power because you have an eGPU attached, the machine can give more power to the CPU increasing CPU performance and still hitting that ~94W total system power draw.

See this screenshot, total system power ~110W while compiling an app in Xcode, with Radeon High Side ~7W with eGPU and external display attached.

View attachment 929823

Thanks for the info. I went and ordered the Razer Core X today. Annoying I have to go this route to make the machine usable for me. But at least it's a small expense compared to the overall cost of the laptop, so I'll deal with it.
 
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Alexander William

macrumors 6502
Apr 18, 2020
293
130
Good luck!

I'd rather try and get work done instead of spending hours a day getting frustrated because Apple refuses to listen to my complaints. I really have tried to do that with the butterfly keys and 4 years later, I've moved on.

And it's not like you don't have options, either. Use an eGPU with your existing setup or buy the 5600M and burn your current 5300M/5500M computer or something.

Im going to pay someone in my office to dedicate a week for it.

Its the principal and i honestly think determination to push to the top might be the only way really, if that doesnt work -- I'll start a class action after speaking to my lawyer about this in detail.

I hate when companies try to bend me over and get away with it, atleast give me a reach around or a kiss if you do.
 
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alexfc

macrumors member
Jul 13, 2012
54
35
Im going to pay someone in my office to dedicate a week for it.

Its the principal and i honestly think determination to push to the top might be the only way really, if that doesnt work -- I'll start a class action after speaking to my lawyer about this in detail.

I hate when companies try to bend me over and get away with it, atleast give me a reach around or a kiss if you do.

Yeah, we have to start sending e-mails to Tim Cook and Youtubers to try to bring more attention to this. It’s probably an easy fix on AMD's side. It makes no sense that with 1 monitor the dGPU consumes 5~6W and then when you open the internal display it goes to 18W. This doesn’t happen in any other MacBook with dGPU - the open lid will use 2~3 more W, not 12. It’s clearly a bug. 2018 MacBook Pros and others before that with dGPU don’t have this issue - the open lid will never take an extra 12W, so it’s clear that there is some bug in that. It’s probably a simple fix, but we have to start bringing more attention and we won’t achieve much posting here.
 
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Norbert Mikołajczyk

macrumors regular
May 26, 2016
233
67
Thanks for pointing me in the right direction! I have also solved the issue with SwitchResX

Had my MBP 16 since Nov 2019 and the fans have always run like jet engines (super hot and loud) when connected to my ext monitor (USB-C to Displayport).... until tonight after implementing the solution suggested above

Radeon High Side would previously sit at 18W in clamshell with ext monitor connected, but now it sits around 5W avg. The MacBook I was ready to sell this morning is now quiet and cool, just like my beloved 2015 MBP 15 was

Hopefully Apple are aware of this thread and will "fix" the issue in a more robust way soon, but in the meantime give this workaround a try View attachment 930066 View attachment 930068 View attachment 930070
Great work! You posted two images with Radeon High Side, which one is clamshell and which one is open lid?
 
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jaduffy007

macrumors regular
May 23, 2018
121
113
Im going to pay someone in my office to dedicate a week for it.

Its the principal and i honestly think determination to push to the top might be the only way really, if that doesnt work -- I'll start a class action after speaking to my lawyer about this in detail.

I hate when companies try to bend me over and get away with it, at least give me a reach around or a kiss if you do.

Principle indeed...I could not agree more. Please tell me how to join the lawsuit.

And yeah, at least buy me dinner before you f me.
 
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kerembaydogan

macrumors newbie
Jul 2, 2020
6
13
Thanks for pointing me in the right direction! I have also solved the issue with SwitchResX

Had my MBP 16 since Nov 2019 and the fans have always run like jet engines (super hot and loud) when connected to my ext monitor (USB-C to Displayport).... until tonight after implementing the solution suggested above

Radeon High Side would previously sit at 18W in clamshell with ext monitor connected, but now it sits around 5W avg. The MacBook I was ready to sell this morning is now quiet and cool, just like my beloved 2015 MBP 15 was

Hopefully Apple are aware of this thread and will "fix" the issue in a more robust way soon, but in the meantime give this workaround a try View attachment 930066 View attachment 930068 View attachment 930070
GLAD IT WORKED. THIS IS WHY I SHARED MY SOLUTION :)
 
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Shustr

macrumors newbie
Apr 2, 2010
13
5
Thanks for pointing me in the right direction! I have also solved the issue with SwitchResX

Had my MBP 16 since Nov 2019 and the fans have always run like jet engines (super hot and loud) when connected to my ext monitor (USB-C to Displayport).... until tonight after implementing the solution suggested above

Radeon High Side would previously sit at 18W in clamshell with ext monitor connected, but now it sits around 5W avg. The MacBook I was ready to sell this morning is now quiet and cool, just like my beloved 2015 MBP 15 was

Hopefully Apple are aware of this thread and will "fix" the issue in a more robust way soon, but in the meantime give this workaround a try View attachment 930066 View attachment 930068 View attachment 930070

МАN!!! You made my day! Managed to go for 50Ghz for Apple Thunderbolt Display with this hack!!! Now Radeon High Side is ~4W only! No heat, no fans! Need to try get maybe 59Ghz or near. By Default its not working, get only banding and stripes over screen with GTF and 59.951 Hz (naitive).
 
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kerembaydogan

macrumors newbie
Jul 2, 2020
6
13
Glad It also worked for you, Two of my colleagues solved their problem after I tell them this SwitchResX method. ConnorMac also solved and now you.

I think now I can call it a FIX. At least for some of us.
 
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mrmachine79

macrumors regular
Mar 31, 2020
134
163
After struggling with this issue for month (and not getting any real help from the support just the usual nothing...), today I went in to an Apple Store, explained the issue, and they were very helpful, and I got a refund in a few minutes.
It was an unexpected but very positive experience.
This is always worth a shot. I have also had Apple Store (physical) agree to a full refund on a 9-month-old machine because I couldn't wait 2 weeks for repair after they tested the machine and reported it had no issues, but I was still having issues, even though purchased from Apple Store (online).

It has been my experience that in-store managers are much more reasonable and able to use their discretion than online support who usually have to defer to someone else behind the scenes for approval, where it is much easier for them to deny your request without even speaking to you directly about the issue.
 
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