Its not a laptop event but the 17" unibody version is due. But even still there is no way....NO WAY they will get away with trying to sell a 17" professional laptop with a non-removable battery!
Got a tip for us?
Let us know
Become a MacRumors Supporter for $50/year with no ads, ability to filter front page stories, and private forums.
17" Unibody MacBook Pro with Non-Removable Extended-Life Battery
- Thread starter MacRumors
- Start date
- Sort by reaction score
Its not a laptop event but the 17" unibody version is due. But even still there is no way....NO WAY they will get away with trying to sell a 17" professional laptop with a non-removable battery!
i agree somewhat. i say somewhat as i dont want to drive to an apple store to have them install it
also, some want to keep a spare batt for more power
though i have never done that (keep a spare batt)
Thats not the point. If my battery dies I can buy one off of ebay or something and pop it in my macbook in 2 seconds, you can't do that if this is true.
The Air maybe not that hard, but I bet you need tools to do this and not everyone wants to do this themselves.
I'm also on the Silver-Zinc/Silver-Oxide battery bandwagon as the reason for this change.
The Silver-Zinc batteries supposedly provided by ZPower (funded by Intel, hint hint) have a high, 200Wh/kg rating. Meaning for every kg (2.2 lbs) of weight, it can store 200Wh. How much is 200Wh? Well the current MBs are shipping with 45Wh battery, and the 15" MBPs a 50Wh battery. So in a 1 lb internal battery, the ZPower Silver-Zinc could store just under 100Wh. After you factor in the larger screen, (probably) faster CPU, etc, you'd probably see a 60-75% increase in battery life over the 15" MBP if they were to go this route.
The reason to make it non-removable would be the very high price of the battery, due to the price of silver. By requiring Apple to service the battery when the cycles expire (which is currently unknown, since the use of said batteries is fairly scarce), Apple can recycle the battery and recover the silver, as well as have a "trade-in" policy to recover some of the price of the new, replacement battery.
I could even see this become part of the normal laptop line-up (if they figure out how to use less silver and get the price down) - that the batteries are non-removable because Apple wants to force people to come back into the store to replace the battery when it wont hold a charge anymore, and Apple can recycle the battery and be more "green".
Also, the news of a unibody MB price cut would be great. I dont know if it'll go down to $999, but maybe to $1099 where the old plasti-mac used to be. The $999 model might go to $899 or vanish completely. I'm more interested in seeing the 2.4GHz MB come down $200 or so. I'd jump on that.
The Silver-Zinc batteries supposedly provided by ZPower (funded by Intel, hint hint) have a high, 200Wh/kg rating. Meaning for every kg (2.2 lbs) of weight, it can store 200Wh. How much is 200Wh? Well the current MBs are shipping with 45Wh battery, and the 15" MBPs a 50Wh battery. So in a 1 lb internal battery, the ZPower Silver-Zinc could store just under 100Wh. After you factor in the larger screen, (probably) faster CPU, etc, you'd probably see a 60-75% increase in battery life over the 15" MBP if they were to go this route.
The reason to make it non-removable would be the very high price of the battery, due to the price of silver. By requiring Apple to service the battery when the cycles expire (which is currently unknown, since the use of said batteries is fairly scarce), Apple can recycle the battery and recover the silver, as well as have a "trade-in" policy to recover some of the price of the new, replacement battery.
I could even see this become part of the normal laptop line-up (if they figure out how to use less silver and get the price down) - that the batteries are non-removable because Apple wants to force people to come back into the store to replace the battery when it wont hold a charge anymore, and Apple can recycle the battery and be more "green".
Also, the news of a unibody MB price cut would be great. I dont know if it'll go down to $999, but maybe to $1099 where the old plasti-mac used to be. The $999 model might go to $899 or vanish completely. I'm more interested in seeing the 2.4GHz MB come down $200 or so. I'd jump on that.
I used to use my 17" 2.33Ghz MBP as a makeshift broadcast monitor on video shoots, and having 2 batteries in those instances proved useful on exactly 1-2 occasions.. purely because i had forgotten to charge the main one. Most of the time it just meant one less power outlet to look for, i can't think of many people who truly need to be able to change batteries especially if the battery lasted 5 hours.
I find the Air a great performer when it comes to battery power, and only on the occasional longhaul flight i take would i ever want the need to extend the battery life, but honestly i think the majority of people who do frequent longhaul flights and have macbook airs would be flying business class anyway and battery life will mean the difference between carrying a power brick and a spare battery. If the new 17" has the same performance/battery life ratio as the Air, i would personally be very happy with it, and if it means making it even thinner, then for that reason alone i think its worth it, laptops are meant to portable, not just desktop replacements.
But if the battery life on the 17" is increased by only 50% by being built in, i would personally see that too as reason enough to make it built in, and for the rare person that needs to use their 17" laptop in an environment away from any form of power supply for more than 5-6 hours, then they could always carry something like brianbobcat suggested, an external battery that connected through the magsafe connector. I think the majority of users will prefer having a product that was thinner, lighter and lasted 50% longer rather than having to carry another battery.. (btw am i the only one to cut themselves with the current MBP battery? the corners are like razors!!)
The ONLY real disadvantage i see is when people need to get the battery replaced, i can't imagine there being too many people who's lives will be massively affected by sending their ipod away for 2-3 days to get the battery replaced, but i could imagine it being a fairly big inconvenience for someone to send their laptop away.. but then again those that HAVE to use their laptop away from a power source are usually the kind of people to have more than one laptop/computer anyway, so even in that situation i can't imagine it being too big a hassle.. the iphone, that's a different story.
And i've heard many horror stories about faulty batteries, notably on the previous 15" MBPs, but i haven't heard them for the Air, ipods and iphone, so hopefully that wouldn't be the same for a built in 17" battery.
Thumbs up for Built-in Battery!! i can think of some shortcomings in Apple's software choices (iPhone COPY AND PASTE!!!!), but i can rarely fault their Hardware design, most passionate fanboys i know complain at rumors but when they start to actually use the product, they tend to shut up and start to realise the genius of the design choices.. hence why they (including myself) became fanboys in the first place. Apple design may sometimes eschew practicality, but if it didn't, then there would be nothing unique about Apple's products, Ferrari's are great performers but try go through a mcdonald's drive thru with one, and you'll wish you had an SUV, a car that got you and your kids from A-B, but with far less style and panache... for the people that MUST have removable batteries, i doubt it will be much trouble to get a Dell laptop and Hackintosh it, but for the rest i think this is a good decision, and i doubt Apple's shareholders are going to complain about a design element that causes more foot traffic in the retail stores.
I find the Air a great performer when it comes to battery power, and only on the occasional longhaul flight i take would i ever want the need to extend the battery life, but honestly i think the majority of people who do frequent longhaul flights and have macbook airs would be flying business class anyway and battery life will mean the difference between carrying a power brick and a spare battery. If the new 17" has the same performance/battery life ratio as the Air, i would personally be very happy with it, and if it means making it even thinner, then for that reason alone i think its worth it, laptops are meant to portable, not just desktop replacements.
But if the battery life on the 17" is increased by only 50% by being built in, i would personally see that too as reason enough to make it built in, and for the rare person that needs to use their 17" laptop in an environment away from any form of power supply for more than 5-6 hours, then they could always carry something like brianbobcat suggested, an external battery that connected through the magsafe connector. I think the majority of users will prefer having a product that was thinner, lighter and lasted 50% longer rather than having to carry another battery.. (btw am i the only one to cut themselves with the current MBP battery? the corners are like razors!!)
The ONLY real disadvantage i see is when people need to get the battery replaced, i can't imagine there being too many people who's lives will be massively affected by sending their ipod away for 2-3 days to get the battery replaced, but i could imagine it being a fairly big inconvenience for someone to send their laptop away.. but then again those that HAVE to use their laptop away from a power source are usually the kind of people to have more than one laptop/computer anyway, so even in that situation i can't imagine it being too big a hassle.. the iphone, that's a different story.
And i've heard many horror stories about faulty batteries, notably on the previous 15" MBPs, but i haven't heard them for the Air, ipods and iphone, so hopefully that wouldn't be the same for a built in 17" battery.
Thumbs up for Built-in Battery!! i can think of some shortcomings in Apple's software choices (iPhone COPY AND PASTE!!!!), but i can rarely fault their Hardware design, most passionate fanboys i know complain at rumors but when they start to actually use the product, they tend to shut up and start to realise the genius of the design choices.. hence why they (including myself) became fanboys in the first place. Apple design may sometimes eschew practicality, but if it didn't, then there would be nothing unique about Apple's products, Ferrari's are great performers but try go through a mcdonald's drive thru with one, and you'll wish you had an SUV, a car that got you and your kids from A-B, but with far less style and panache... for the people that MUST have removable batteries, i doubt it will be much trouble to get a Dell laptop and Hackintosh it, but for the rest i think this is a good decision, and i doubt Apple's shareholders are going to complain about a design element that causes more foot traffic in the retail stores.
The MacBooks and MacBook Pros have significantly less ports, and are more expensive, than their Windows counterparts. It's frustrating, but OS X makes up for it.
If they make the notebook battery non-replacable, there is no way I'm buying a Mac. Especially with Windows 7 looking so promising.
OS X can only go so far. I want a computer that can last upwards of 5 years, not a crappy laptop that I'll need to replace in two years when the battery dies.
The laptop will also be useless on long plane and car rides.
If they make the notebook battery non-replacable, there is no way I'm buying a Mac. Especially with Windows 7 looking so promising.
OS X can only go so far. I want a computer that can last upwards of 5 years, not a crappy laptop that I'll need to replace in two years when the battery dies.
The laptop will also be useless on long plane and car rides.
What about college students? Those 2 hour lectures, back to back, relying purely on battery? I wouldn't be able to miss notes for two weeks.
Well ok you geniuses........why didn't they give the regular unibody macbooks non-removable batteries back in October......HMM????? 
I say if Jobs tries to push the 17" uni-body with a non-removable battery we all revolt and storm the castle. So whos with me???????!
I say if Jobs tries to push the 17" uni-body with a non-removable battery we all revolt and storm the castle. So whos with me???????!
This really needs to be taken with a grain of salt. This would certainly be a first for a notebook this large. That doesn't mean Apple won't do it since they are usually the first to take a chance on a new design.
A non-removable battery does have advantages in that the battery can be designed to be more integrated inside the casing. Meaning, you can cram more battery (longer-lasting) into the machine compared to a removable one that has other (space-taking) components and design challenges to consider. An internal battery would also make for a more slimmer/tighter design and lower-cost to make. Not that it would motivate Apple to reduce the price.
I'm curious what Apple will do and their rationale if they do indeed do it. I think a majority of users never purchase additional batteries. It takes 2-3 years (normally IMHO) for battery-life to become an issue and by then, most prefer to purchase a more current machine. I've owned quite a few notebooks and have never purchased an extra battery.
Nonetheless, should Apple go this route, I really hope at the least they make the battery semi-removable in that the backplate can be unscrewed somehow and removed with minimal "surgery".
I personally think this is more rumor than fact. I would not bet money against it though.
A non-removable battery does have advantages in that the battery can be designed to be more integrated inside the casing. Meaning, you can cram more battery (longer-lasting) into the machine compared to a removable one that has other (space-taking) components and design challenges to consider. An internal battery would also make for a more slimmer/tighter design and lower-cost to make. Not that it would motivate Apple to reduce the price.
I'm curious what Apple will do and their rationale if they do indeed do it. I think a majority of users never purchase additional batteries. It takes 2-3 years (normally IMHO) for battery-life to become an issue and by then, most prefer to purchase a more current machine. I've owned quite a few notebooks and have never purchased an extra battery.
Nonetheless, should Apple go this route, I really hope at the least they make the battery semi-removable in that the backplate can be unscrewed somehow and removed with minimal "surgery".
I personally think this is more rumor than fact. I would not bet money against it though.
It really bothered me for about a week. After that, either the edges on my MBA have chamfered a bit or I got used to it. It does not bother me at all.
Still a wonderful design to me. The integrated battery rumor is a non-issue for me if it has 50% more battery life than then removable version.
I'm on board with this one!
"Ross Dueber, the companys chief executive, says a top-tier laptop manufacturer will release the first computer designed to accept silver-zinc batteries in mid-2009. The laptops runtime with silver-zinc will increase from the roughly 5 hours afforded by a typical lithium-ion battery to at least 7 hours, according to Mr. Dueber."
http://greeninc.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/12/02/battery-maker-is-betting-on-silver-zinc-for-laptops/
Wow, what a bunch of whiners!
Apple has made some decisions that don't sit well with the so-called Apple Faithful, but they are bound to upset someone. I don't think they are making "bonehead" moves at all, 2008 was a landmark year for Apple, market share is up and phones/ipods are still selling like hot-cakes. No FW in MacBooks, yep it sucks, Glossy only? Yep, deal with it. No copy/paste still? Go buy a blackberry. Apple has gone nowhere but UP.
I am an IT professional and a musician. I use my lappy for both professions and I see many people daily in both lines of work who use Apple laptops... however I do not know ANYONE who carries 2 batteries. Seriously, outlets are not that hard to find, and I get great battery life out of mine.
It's a non issue with many people, but for a very vocal minority this is the end of the world as we know it. I think the press may pounce on this, competitors may jump on it too, but I don't see this move doing anything but boosting market share.
"If Id asked people what they wanted, they would have said a faster horse"
-Henry Ford
Apple has made some decisions that don't sit well with the so-called Apple Faithful, but they are bound to upset someone. I don't think they are making "bonehead" moves at all, 2008 was a landmark year for Apple, market share is up and phones/ipods are still selling like hot-cakes. No FW in MacBooks, yep it sucks, Glossy only? Yep, deal with it. No copy/paste still? Go buy a blackberry. Apple has gone nowhere but UP.
I am an IT professional and a musician. I use my lappy for both professions and I see many people daily in both lines of work who use Apple laptops... however I do not know ANYONE who carries 2 batteries. Seriously, outlets are not that hard to find, and I get great battery life out of mine.
It's a non issue with many people, but for a very vocal minority this is the end of the world as we know it. I think the press may pounce on this, competitors may jump on it too, but I don't see this move doing anything but boosting market share.
"If Id asked people what they wanted, they would have said a faster horse"
-Henry Ford
Windows counterparts? Which PC notebook has something other than an Intel GMA for a graphics card? Not many. Which has DDR3 memory? Not many. Which PC has a glass screen with a hecka good quality panel? Only HP has the glass thus far. Macs are in fact, cheaper than Windows. That is pure fact. Unless you buy stuff expensive laptops but a cheaper price on eBay.
No Windows PC can last 5 years. I've tried. I've failed. And I know my way through computers, custom and PC vendors. Don't limit yourself to just lithium ions. The current battery will last 2 years only if you assumed it's lithium ion. There are new technologies such as the SCIB or super charge ion battery, and the silver-zinc variety. The SCIB will last 6000 cycles before degrading. If you use 2 cycles a day, that is nearly 8+ years before it craps out.
Nooooooo...
Well, if the 17" is better than the current 15" (like graphics) then I'll accept it.
Plus, with the battery rules on airlines, it pretty much makes it better to have a non-removable battery...as long as it gets relatively twice as much cycle life.
Well, if the 17" is better than the current 15" (like graphics) then I'll accept it.
Plus, with the battery rules on airlines, it pretty much makes it better to have a non-removable battery...as long as it gets relatively twice as much cycle life.
If it ends up being anything like the Air's "non-replaceable" battery, I don't think this is such a bad thing. As long as the run time is good, it's fine by me.
sux
what about the ram and hard drive. These needs to be user upgradeable. If the battery is not, that's fine with me, so long as i can add the ram and hard drive of my choice. It would be awesome if you could option the os in some sort of small ram or flash drive within the laptop body and have the hd's swappable, especially seeing that memory is plummeting in price.
what about the ram and hard drive. These needs to be user upgradeable. If the battery is not, that's fine with me, so long as i can add the ram and hard drive of my choice. It would be awesome if you could option the os in some sort of small ram or flash drive within the laptop body and have the hd's swappable, especially seeing that memory is plummeting in price.
That statement by Henry Ford is so arrogant. I can't believe you actually have bought into it.
Maybe, just maybe, us customers know what we want better than Apple.
If they lower the prices of the Al MacBooks... I will demand some money back! Just like the iPhone.
As I recall Steve Jobs is very fond of that quote... I can't believe you dont see the merit in it. You make it sound like Apple is AGAINST the consumer, just because they don't cater to your individual needs doesn't mean they don't have the greater interest in mind.
And for the record "us" customers is a very broad group. If you surveyed every customer you'd get a very diverse cross section, and you'd end up with a product that tries to please everyone but fails to please anybody.