60GB iPods - Not Soon?

[itsa]

GRRR.

Why is it the things most people want will not be around "anytime soon."

For example: the G5 PowerBook... "not anytime soon"
Now the 60GB iPod!

Anyway, I was really really hoping for a 60GB iPod, I guess I'll just have to wait.

Add to that G5 2.5GHz desktops! STILL NOT SHIPPING!!!
now not until the top of next month!
And then another 4 to 6 weeks added from the time you order it!

 

[themacrobaye]

I'm gonna place my bets on Paris for the 60GB iPod... The iMac is great for a product release, but it's not enough for something as big as MacWorld Paris. Also, I think Jos just wants to keep us on our toes. Steve probably ordered the statement, and he knows that he can afford the wait. Most of the people who buy iPods have no where near enough MP3s to fill a 60GB iPod... so sales won't be hurt at all. Hell, I'd like a 60GB drive, but 40GB is enough for me...

And in a few weeks, when the news of the new iPod hits the eBay community and people start to sell their 40GB 3G iPods for like $300, i'll be there. Unless I get a raise and buy the 4G for $100 more

 

[Yvan256]

How do you qualify "most"? I would say less than 50% want a 60G iPod on this forum, and this forum probably has a concentration of such people. I would imagine the general public accounts for a very small portion. After all, the 3G 40G (that's Generation, Gigabyte) iPod wasn't the top iPod seller.

There was a macpoll about "How many songs do you have on your Computer?" The biggest percentages were under 10 000. Only a few people need more than 40GB (less than 10%). And I'm guessing at least half of those are pack-rats who download everything they possibly can.

http://www.macpolls.com/?poll_id=404

With all that being said, and the existence of a 60G drive of the same form factor as the 40G drive, wouldn't it be a reasonable assumtion to do a drive-ectomy on a 40G iPod to give it the extra 20 gigs? My 40G iPod says "37.2 Gigabytes" which implies there's some noodle in the OS responsible for reading the physical drivespace, rather than just being hardcoded. So, why not drop a 60G into the 40G chasis?

Hard disk capacity is calculated with 1kB = 1000 bytes. Most OS use 1KB = 1024 bytes, hence the difference in size.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kilobyte

 

[tny]

Some folks said "most" wouldn't need a 60 GB iPod. One or two said "noone" would need one.

Me, I have 17 GB of music (all of it purchased, none illegal) on my Mac, and a 15 GB iPod. On the other hand, looking at just the stuff I've listened to since January, I could probably get away with an iPod mini: I've only listened to 4.6 GB of stuff once, and 2 GB of stuff more than once.

Still, I'm going to wait on upgrading my iPod until after Paris. Why? Because if a 60 GB is coming out, that's the iPod I want: because I haven't ripped all my CDs yet, and because I'd like a nice 30 GB or so for backup purposes, to keep some video stuff on to shuttle back and forth to work, etc.

 

[Yvan256]

Completely off topic but ...

Every time I read the name Joswiak connected with Apple I end up with this mental vision of some future gestalt combination of Steve Jobs and Steve Wosniak that have come back from the future to re-invigorate apple.

Surely I'm not the only one?

LOL

<slashdot>I, for one, welcome our Joswiak overlord!</slashdot>

 

[ariza910]

No legal way for ripping Digital video? I have an eyeTV with dozens of shows in mpeg2 format. It was perfectly legal and I would love to have a Video iPod to watch the shows on when traveling.

Remember that the iPod came out in 2001! thats two years before LEGAL music downloads where possible. Yeah you could rip from CDs but give me a break, most people got their music from Napster and Kazza.

The iPod was a Niche product when it first came out, why should the video Pod be any different?

This new video pod could have WiFi allowing for limited web browsing, streaming to Airport Express and purchases from the iTunes music store. Dont forget it can also be a Music Player. It could also be used to store and display pictures which would integrate nicely with iPhoto. That sounds like a great little device doesn’t it?

A video iPod will come out, I am willing to bet on it. and it will be sooner than later.

My guess it will be called PowerPod and come in an aluminum case, the Toshiba 60GB HD, Color screen and 802.11G.

I will guarantee that a video iPod is not coming out anytime soon. If apple comes out with a video anything, it certainly will not be called an iPod.

Ripping CDs is legal. Buying iTunes AACs is legal. There is currently NO LEGAL AVENUE FOR RIPPING/BUYING DIGITAL VIDEO ENTERTAINMENT.

and i doube that the apple movie store will be opening any time soon. Heck. Apple got enough flack from the music industry before the apple store opened that they were supporting piracy through the iPod.

The Windows Media player are a niche market at best, and I highly doubt that apple will try to "compete" with them. Apple is going for the sweet spot. What are the hottest iPods now? The Mini. How much memory do they have? FOUR GIGABYTES.

Apple goes for the sweet spot of the market, not the fringes. The media players are at best a fringe product. People who buy the iPod mini are not looking for a portable video player.

 

[Multimedia]

60 GB Is Only 4 hours Of DV Video

Some folks said "most" wouldn't need a 60 GB iPod. One or two said "noone" would need one.

Me, I have 17 GB of music (all of it purchased, none illegal) on my Mac, and a 15 GB iPod. On the other hand, looking at just the stuff I've listened to since January, I could probably get away with an iPod mini: I've only listened to 4.6 GB of stuff once, and 2 GB of stuff more than once.

Still, I'm going to wait on upgrading my iPod until after Paris. Why? Because if a 60 GB is coming out, that's the iPod I want: because I haven't ripped all my CDs yet, and because I'd like a nice 30 GB or so for backup purposes, to keep some video stuff on to shuttle back and forth to work, etc.

60 GB Is Only 4 hours Of DV Video. iPods are used for a lot more than just storing and playing music. My 2G 20 is full and I want a 4G 60. I think the click-wheel is an awesome improvement to the interface. I think the click-wheel is the ultimate interface - end of the line. It simply cannot be improved beyond this interface.

 

[Yvan256]

I have 110GB of music and a 2gen 20GB iPod.... I would gladly fill up a 120GB iPod if they could make one... and yes, I do listen to all of it.

Well, 110GB of music, isn't that nice. However, my question is: how many songs is that? Are most of your files encoded at 128kbps?

You may have 110GB of music, but perhaps at 128kbps it's only 50GB... (and that's the bitrate Apple is using to sell the iPods).

 

[spaceballl]

very few people have 20GB of music, much less 60GB. the extra space would be use for storage.

Many prefer high bitrates.

 

[må¥å]

For the love of Pete there is not going to be a video pod anytime soon, reasons being is that screen too small, processor takes time to render, battery and alot of other down falls.

Looked at the MS media portable player look like crap the video is slow i mean it would bother me after abit sure it has the intial cool factor after that its a piece of junk stamed to it.

The iPod as a music player suffer battery life what makes you so keen on to it supporting video. People have to stop hopeing for an iMac in an iPod package get a laptop and quite crying here.

Better yet sit infront of Apple HQ with posters and cray we want a video pod....that woudl be rather funny.

If I recieve a penny for every video pod cry I would be a billionair. Sad I htink I should start that fund.

 

[ClimbingTheLog]

I don't think it's a bad thing if they focus on other things right now. Things like making iPods avalible for folks with less $. An iPod in every home, hand and pocket is what Apple should be going.

They're pretty close - they can't keep the $249 iPod in stock. And $249 is sweetspot for most consumers, around the price of a cheap TV, an XBox, an amplifier, what VCR's used to cost, what DVD players used to cost, etc.

Quite frankly, you can't get a hard drive of any size for under sixty bucks, not to mention the smallest on the planet, so by time you add on a screen, a couple CPU's, and a LiIon battery you're well over a hundred bucks, so there's a lower limit to what the iPod can cost in its current form factor. Time will help, but you're never going to get an iPod in a Cheerios box. Well not for another 23 years. But you don't have to - anybody who will ever be able to afford an iPod can now. Let's face it - if you can't save up $250 over a year you're not in the market for a luxury item like an iPod.

 

[ClimbingTheLog]

OOOOOO! I was thinking the same thing....in fact....what if they used these in the G5 iMac....not just one.....but 5! Raid 5 in a Imac??? It could happen! I REALLY DOUBT it .....but would that NOT be cool?? Or if not 5 of them, 2 and software mirroring....a geek can dream right?

Gorkon, you only need three disks for RAID-5. Otherwise you're right, there will be three mini sixty gig disks in the new iMac.

 

[Abstract]

There's simply more of a need for people to listen to music while away from home or car than there is to watch video and movies on the move. The portable video market will always be more of a niche market than the portable music market. Its simply less involving.

Does this mean it shouldn't come out? No, of course not. Lots of products are niche products, such as Final Cut Pro. Seriously, not too many people use such programs, and yet they exist. And don't say that lots of people use FCP, because we all know that the geeky people on this board with their 110GB of music and video editing ability aren't the norm. I'd say that I'm pretty much the norm, and even that's stretching it a bit, since most people don't care about the latest tech news, and yet I seem to.
Apple could make a video player using the 60+GB HD's, but then people will complain about their cost and battery life. Imagine storing 4 hours of video on a video device, but having only a 3 hour battery life!

The iPod was a Niche product when it first came out, why should the video Pod be any different?

This new video pod could have WiFi allowing for limited web browsing, streaming to Airport Express and purchases from the iTunes music store. Dont forget it can also be a Music Player. It could also be used to store and display pictures which would integrate nicely with iPhoto. That sounds like a great little device doesn’t it?

 

[ClimbingTheLog]

Tiny drives won't be for the iMac (remember they were set to be released in June but were delayed b/c of IBM). The shipment of the 60GB drives is for the powerbook g5...I'm sure of it (optimism, not prophecy).

We have heard the new Powerbook will be ridiculously thin, so you might be right.

Still, I've used ridiculously thin Vaios, etc, and they don't use the mini drives, so there must be another way. Unless they have an OLED screen, there's half of the bulk anyhow.

 

[buddha]

WiFi is a good bet with Airport Express, especially now that the power factor has been improved - power is always a key issue for portable devices.

I'd just like to point out that Airport Express requires that the computer re-encode the music files into apple's lossless codec, which then is transmitted to the Airport Express. Not an expert on this at all, but I would think that the processor requirements of that would be pretty damn ugly in both the power drainage, and the ability of an ipod processor to even do it.

Eh, my probably ignorant voice in the dark.

 

[psgibbs]

One more thing....

Whatever the 60 GB drives are for, I think they will be used in Jobs' "One more thing ... " announcement. What would be cooler - the new Newton (with actual useable storage) or the new Apple digital camera, whatever it is, guaranteed sweetness.

 

[ArticulatedArm]

For the love of Pete there is not going to be a video pod anytime soon, reasons being is that screen too small, processor takes time to render, battery and alot of other down falls.

Looked at the MS media portable player look like crap the video is slow i mean it would bother me after abit sure it has the intial cool factor after that its a piece of junk stamed to it.

The iPod as a music player suffer battery life what makes you so keen on to it supporting video. People have to stop hopeing for an iMac in an iPod package get a laptop and quite crying here.

Better yet sit infront of Apple HQ with posters and cray we want a video pod....that woudl be rather funny.

If I recieve a penny for every video pod cry I would be a billionair. Sad I htink I should start that fund.

OLEDs could solve all of those problems. Who knows when the perfect OLED will show up? Could be any minute now. Companies have been working on them frantically for years.

 

[notmenotyou]

....Back to what I originally said: It was common knoweldge (assumption) that Apple would do a 60GB iPod. Apple wouldn't have been too upset with Toshiba over that mixup, everyone expected it. HOWEVER: Apple was furious, so says ThinkSecret. Think about it: No matter what they are for, they are not for the iPod. No one knows what they are using them for, but we can assess the following:
1) Its a mass production device, as in really really expected to sell
2) Its very hush hush
3) It needs 60GB of disk space, and we dont have many stand alone applications which do!

could it be for the brand new apple set top box that have a HD recording function? just try to brain storming...

 

[Abstract]

Considering the speed of these tiny HDD's (ie: slower than 4800rpm), and the fact that the industry is moving towards faster drives (5400 and 7200rpm, since they give so much performance gain), how can you still believe that they're going to be using them in Powerbooks? It would be nice, but they're too slow.

And you're right. Since others have done it without using these super small drives, making smaller notebooks will be done another way.

We have heard the new Powerbook will be ridiculously thin, so you might be right.

Still, I've used ridiculously thin Vaios, etc, and they don't use the mini drives, so there must be another way. Unless they have an OLED screen, there's half of the bulk anyhow.

 

[må¥å]

OLEDs could solve all of those problems. Who knows when the perfect OLED will show up? Could be any minute now. Companies have been working on them frantically for years.

I read an article about siny delaying the release of an OLED product due to life of the display its been delayed till 2005 so I am guessing same thing with apple then again OLED will drop the price as everyone here keeps bitching about that issue. Second with OLED it will give a decent 2-3 yrs life then I guess since Apple is in the market to make money they will get some more when people are forced to upgrade they OLED iPods to a newer model oh well can still use it as storage.

 

[sushi]

There is no reason that both could be true. No 60Gb iPod soon, but Apple could have ordered those 60Gb drives for use in something else. I'm not going to speculate what right now but I'm sure other will be shouting vPod (video iPod) or something pretty soon. Hopefully something more interesting than that from my point of view though.

Maybe a smaller laptop like they have here in Japan?

Of course a PDA springs to mind as well.

And a video iPod.

Then again, they could just be for a new iPod and SJ is upset about the announcement by Toshiba and is going to wait a while to announce.

Sushi

 

[ClimbingTheLog]

cue iPhone.org

They didn't buy 350,000+ of these 60GB drives so that they can sell 10,000 60GB iPods. The demand isn't there. They're going to do something else with them. Seriously, there's no way they would sell that many high end iPods, so there's something else in the works. The number of drives Apple is hoarding is enough of a clue towards a new product.

Clearly they're intended for the iPhone/PDA/VidCam/iPod/802.11g/bluetooth device (the iChat CP) running the software defined radio on the ultra-low power PPC that's been backing up the production line in East Fishkill.

edit: forgot to mention Steve demoing iTunes Music Store over 3G wireless with his Name-That-Tune demo of the new ITMS search-by-lyrics feature.

 

[Yvan256]

(Sorry for stealing your "one more thing" moment, Steve - but I can see into the future!)

They have obviously bought way more drives than they would ever sell of a 60GB iPod. So what are they using it for?

Possibly if they make one really really small maybe an Apple digital camera with built in HD, sure would beat those memory stick and CD-ROM cameras. Would it be motion video as well as stills, I dont know.

Thats my bet, Apple has a lot of experience with tiny drives, and they have growing experience with CCD chips (iSight). They may attempt to smack sony pretty hard in the digital camera space.

Presenting: the iCam! Apple's digital video camera, using the same high-quality optics as the iSight. With built-in 60GB hard disk, allowing for 4 hours of DV-quality HD recording!

P.S.: funny how "iCam" is "iMac" backwards.

 

[akw]

Extremely compelling prices?

I find his statement a little off-putting. I mean Jesus, Greg. We're not morons, we can easily see that your new pricing structure is actually a worse deal for us. Let's take a closer look.

I have the 3rd gen 20GB model ($399 - middle tier iPod when I bought it) which shipped with dock, carrying case, and remote. If I want the 4th gen 20GB model I will pay $299. This time, though, I don't get the dock. I don't get the remote. And I don't get the carrying case. So I add them to my iPod order for $39 a piece. That's an extra $16 over the price of last year's 20GB iPod. Roughly the same specs, for $16 more.

Now that's NOT compelling Greg! Nice working shuffling the shells around though.

 

[ClimbingTheLog]

I'd just like to point out that Airport Express requires that the computer re-encode the music files into apple's lossless codec, which then is transmitted to the Airport Express. Not an expert on this at all, but I would think that the processor requirements of that would be pretty damn ugly in both the power drainage, and the ability of an ipod processor to even do it.

Lossless compression is the least CPU-intensive compression you can do; it's typically just a substitution/codebook scheme. Here's an overview:

http://www.data-compression.com/lossless.shtml#lz