Freedom of speech, yes, but as others have pointed out this does not include painting someone else windows. The judges, however, seemed not to refer to the window incident whatsoever... Are they not aware of it?
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Apple Denied Request to Ban Tax Protestors From Its Stores in France
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Freedom of speech, yes, but as others have pointed out this does not include painting someone else windows. The judges, however, seemed not to refer to the window incident whatsoever... Are they not aware of it?
And wouldn't I be able to conclude by the same standards that you are also a paid stooge? (Meaning, just because I think you are a paid stooge, I should be allowed to state that you definitely are a paid stooge?)
A lot of loopholes might not have been explicitly established by lawmakers but rather have been an unforeseen consequence of legislation that had other purposes.
Which costs time and money, so it's vandalising. And you are assuming that they used paint that is easily washed off.
Good I’m glad they can protest outside the stores, serves Apple right, pay your taxes and you won’t be targeted.. fairly simple really.
I’m sure the brigade will come along pronouncing how Apple should not pay taxes as it’s duty is to the share holders first, not the infrastructure it uses... nah just let everyone else pay for that!
Don’t forget people, everything Apple does is for the customer and NOT the share holders or profits as proclaimed by Cook this week....
It is just propaganda you know. Apple is target because is big. This thing could be applied to 90% of non EU companies
Laws against things like Holocaust denial in Germany. Laws against slander in the UK. Laws against the incitement to violence in a number of countries. Though very few of them are really 'EU' laws, they are laws of the individual countries that differ from country to country. Only a few things are based on EU regulations, like the right to be forgotten based on EU data protection rules.
While one might not agree with all of them, saying that there is no free speech in the EU is just blatantly lying to justify one's world view.
I'm all for freedom of speech, but did you look at the photo? They vandalised the storefront....
Unanticipated consequences are still legal loopholes. Legislatures can always plug them up if desired, if the will is there. I give you the AMT, which itself has had disastrous unanticipated consequences for many taxpayers caught up in it. Unanticipated consequences can also work against taxpayers. But companies and individuals have zero authority to unilaterally set or "fix" tax policy. All they can do is abide by the letter of the law.
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If the law was clear that Apple has to pay more taxes, then Apple would get a higher tax bill, and Apple would pay more taxes.
Companies, large companies in particular, have a lot of freedom in as how many shell corporations they set up and where they set them up. Saying they had no choice is a bit disingenuous.
Actually, the court said that Apple can't tell these people to stay away from Apple's stores. Once they are there, they have to obey the laws. They are allowed to come to Apple stores, but not allowed to break the laws. Apple would also be allowed to remove them from their stores (because that's something any store can do for any reason that isn't illegal discrimination), and the shopping center would be allowed to ban them from the shopping center.
To be honest, I think most of them are just trolling.
For about £20,000 you can book a cruise that takes you once around the world. Probably the nicest way to convince yourself the earth is round. Now that leaves the possibility that the earth is a cylinder and you fall off once you reach the North Pole or the South Pole... That's the real danger of global warming. If the ice at the poles melts away, then the oceans will empty themselves and we are all in real deep ****...
This is just too grand!! A socially left wing corporation being protested by left wingers. I love seeing leftists become victims of the causes they champion. You can't make leftists happy, ever! They will always find another social injustice or cause to protest about.
Apple says they have no problem with them protesting, because they have to say that. Guess what, they are lying. Apple does not want them in front of their businesses. Even if they were 100% peaceful and not doing anything wrong. It's an eyesore and bad for business.
I do however agree with this group that Apple is an evil corporate empire. Apple puts up quite the facade, and most can't see through it.
Apple says they have no problem with them protesting, because they have to say that. Guess what, they are lying. Apple does not want them in front of their businesses. Even if they were 100% peaceful and not doing anything wrong. It's an eyesore and bad for business.
I do however agree with this group that Apple is an evil corporate empire. Apple puts up quite the facade, and most can't see through it.
Except it does. Ireland didn't have the right to establish this deal, and thus, EU said they had to collect the money as they should have.
Just because the cashier said you could get something for free doesn't mean his boss can't tell him to charge you.
Besides, Apple, with all their lawyers who penned out the deal with Ireland, most likely supposed that wasn't fair. You don't decide as a mulitibillionaire corporation to open a subsidiary somewhere without studying very carefuly the law of that place.
Freedom of Speech is all well and good but defacing of property whoever it owned by is unacceptable.
I agree that most people will try to pay the less taxes possible. That's normal. I even agree that Apple is even more expected to do so since they have some sort of responsibility toward their shareholder.
Now :
- Apple declared the equivalent of ~65k phones sold in France in 2017. That's a ridiculous amount and simply can't be true considering their benefits ;
- Whatever deal they had with Ireland was found to be illegal by EU laws, and are expected to pay their taxes ;
- Apple resists the ruling of one of the highest body of the Europen Union ;
- Apple plays holier-than-thou company at every turn.
Put into a context of economic crisis and debt through the roof for most countries across the world (not only EU), one can legitimately feel offended by the fact they pay their fair share of taxes while Apple does not. And that other companies have to pay the standard rate for corporate taxation (which is roughly 33% in France) while they get a nice deal of under 1%.
So yes, people are protesting for actual reasons. In part to show Apple are just like everybody else, in part to vent their frustration over the fact it's not fair, and in part because Frenchmen LOVE complaining
Almost a sport here.I didn't say that it was legal. I said that Apple allowed it so the legality has nothing to do with it.
There is an argument that lobbying of governments by these companies makes these convenient loopholes possible. Our (uk) policitians aren't blind to the fact tax havens exist and most of the current ones in power use similar arrangements to avoid tax.
I used to pay myself in a way to lower my tax bill when I was an IT contractor so it's not just government - there was nothing illegal about it, however as a number of IT people were doing the same thing the Government decided to change the rules so we would pay more tax. So they do close loopholes, but only for us little people.
No, that's just you trying to justify your hatred for companies. Of course companies have the freedom to plan their tax strategies within the law. Those shell companies are perfectly legal -- again, a loophole that the legislature could plug if it wanted to and had the will. OTOH companies could not create them if they were explicitly or implicitly prohibited by law. So your premise is faulty. Companies have no more freedom to set tax policy than the law allows it to have.
No, we mean the Ireland that agreed to join the free open market of the EU and agreed to play by the rules that come with that commitment. The EU courts ruled that Apple was not avoiding taxes but simply did not pay them. So, they must pay them. End of story. We don’t have to feel sorry for Apple, they can take it.