Apple Says Face ID Didn't Fail Onstage During iPhone X Keynote

[Kabeyun]

I'm sorry but it was a monumental **** up for many reasons:

It's the one new feature that such a big deal was made about on the grand reveal to the world and it failed on the very first try. It doesn't matter what the reason was, it's too late, it was the very first demo of a feature practically being forced on potential users because touch ID couldn't be made to work (we all know this from endless leaks) and this was the chance to allay their concerns. It failed. No-one asked for it or had a problem with touch ID.

It was yet another gift to the competition and usual Android fanboys that will keep giving for years. It's an embarrassment for Apple.

Even if it was because others were inadvertently activating it then that just brings up another concern - that every time you have your phone out in public it's going to be scanning faces endlessly and causing this exact problem.

The whole FaceID thing is a "solution" to a problem Apple created, the iPhone X just seems to have been rushed before everything was ready and initial takers will be guinea pigs that are $/£1000 out of pocket for the privilege, they can't even offer the fast/wireless charging in that price.

I disagree about the magnitude you say it was. It certainly was an inelegant feature reveal but this will amount to nothing. First, the actual tech sounds excellent. Blows Sammy's facial recognition junk out of the water, just as TouchID blows the competition out of the water. If you're looking for true egg on face, wait til they fool it with a photo like they did on a Samsung. That's a problem. Second, how often do you pass around a locked iPhone? Me? Not once. If I'm showing someone something, the phone is unlocked. (I'm almost always the one holding it anyway, but doesn't matter.) I think I still prefer TouchID for a few reasons (including unlocking as I pass it out of my pocket without having to first look at it) but this is a nonissue in the wild.

I agree that many balk as the lack of cross fade to FaceID, myself included. But if it works well on release (and that's obviously the critical part) this whole kerfuffle will die down, just as it did when Apple forced on us no floppy drive and no optical drive, and is already dying down about no 3.5mm headphone jack. I personally want TouchID and a home button, so I'm ordering an 8. But I think the tech will work and this "issue" will blow over.

 

[iapplelove]

Plausible excuse.

So, people were handling the phone that failed, but no one handled the secondary phone?

Still seems like a huge mistake when you’re showing it off for the first time!

Not seems, was.

 

[kdarling]

TouchId is triggered by touching the sensor wakeup ring. It gets FIVE tries before going into passcode mode.

Anybody have any guesses why they chose only TWO attempts as the limit for FaceId?

Perhaps it's so accurate that it doesn't have as many false negatives, so two rejections means it simply isn't you.

But the demo showed that some people might want a higher user settable limit.

 

[itsamacthing]

Why is this even a discussion? Stuff like this happens at presentations all the time

 

[heimo]

It's obvious he was looking at it the wrong way and the new improved Siri went into defense: I'm sorry, Craig. I'm afraid I can't let you do that.

 

[zhenya]

This actually strikes me as a pretty big negative about FaceID. My wife and kids pick up my phone to look at it all day long. More than me when we are at home as it’s usually sitting on the kitchen counter because with my Apple Watch I don’t need to interact with it much. This basically means I’m going to have to use a passcode to unlock most of the time.
[doublepost=1505386187][/doublepost]

How many people lift up your phone? Tho only time I hand my phone to someone is after I’ve unlocked it and want to show them something

Uhhh, if you're going to show your friend a funny text from the lock screen, wouldn't that mean you would have read it first thus unlocking the phone before showing them the screen and ultimately not triggering anything?

In what scenario do you show your friend a text on YOUR device that you haven't even looked at yourself?

Most of these "what if" scenarios are such a reach, I'm sorry.

How often is someone "admiring" your phone?

See my comment above.

 

[Compote]

There goes facegate

 

[Seoras]

September 30th we'll find out.

http://www.businessinsider.com/fran...ne-ipad-may-cause-egyptair-plane-crash-2017-5

Ha ha ha ha.....
Oh yeah right. Let's see, we lose an aircraft plus crew and passengers. Big big payout from "someone".
Fiuck it, lets pin it on someone with plenty of money. There's bound to have been an iPhone or iPad in there somewhere.

 

[manni]

This makes sense and sounds logical and means it wasn't a "failure" as such.

On the other hand I feel this might be an issue in terms of convenience I wonder if it means if one is in a crowded environment, leaves the phone on a desk in a busy office, it's around in a family gathering - will that mean one is endlessly being asked for the pass code?

I would love to know what the people backstage actually did. Did they try to unlock it with Face ID? Or were they simply holding it? If the former, no problem. If the latter that raises a possible issue.

It appears that Apple has really chosen to put security ahead of convenience and that is almost certainly the right choice.

 

[Absrnd]

This actually strikes me as a pretty big negative about FaceID. My wife and kids pick up my phone to look at it all day long. More than me when we are at home as it’s usually sitting on the kitchen counter because with my Apple Watch I don’t need to interact with it much. This basically means I’m going to have to use a passcode to unlock most of the time.
[doublepost=1505386187][/doublepost]

See my comment above.

Then they are registered with with touchiD on your phone ?, or else they also would not be able to do anything with your phone,
just looking at it when it is already unlocked is just the same with FaceID
when it is already unlocked it is not permanently scanning for faces to make sure only you is holding the phone.

I don't see your problem compared with touchID
you can scan multiple faces to use with FaceID

 

[mingravity]

I dont know, there is very high chance that way that it will get locked and forces the user to enter passocode. But how about, instead of FaceID UNLOCK + Swipe Up to get in, make it other way round, Swipe UP ->will activate faceID and u get into home (if authentication passes). Probably that will also save some power as faceID would now be passive for unlocking and i dont have to bother about locking the phone just coz i looked at the notification on the screen

 

[sirdir]

May be. It's not as if I'd think Apple would ever admit if something went wrong.

 

[enzoso]

This actually strikes me as a pretty big negative about FaceID. My wife and kids pick up my phone to look at it all day long. More than me when we are at home as it’s usually sitting on the kitchen counter because with my Apple Watch I don’t need to interact with it much. This basically means I’m going to have to use a passcode to unlock most of the time.
[doublepost=1505386187][/doublepost]





See my comment above.

I do believe that some people have voiced legitimate concerns. My response was to the particular scenario I was responding to. I'm not sure how it would work in your case, I guess we'll have to wait and see.

I wonder if a simple iOS update could fix all these concerns? Maybe a tap to wake/read notifications and a deep press to trigger the facial scan and unlock the phone? Or a hold to unlock feature? Not sure

 

[sirdir]

Then they are registered with with touchiD on your phone ?, or else they also would not be able to do anything with your phone,
just looking at it when it is already unlocked is just the same with FaceID
when it is already unlocked it is not permanently scanning for faces to make sure only you is holding the phone.

I don't see your problem compared with touchID

a) You don't use thouchID by just looking at the phone.
b) you can set up several fingers, but only one face.

 

[fokmik]

This actually strikes me as a pretty big negative about FaceID. My wife and kids pick up my phone to look at it all day long. More than me when we are at home as it’s usually sitting on the kitchen counter because with my Apple Watch I don’t need to interact with it much. This basically means I’m going to have to use a passcode to unlock most of the time.
[doublepost=1505386187][/doublepost]





See my comment above.

Buy an ipad for that. Iphone is a personal device
[doublepost=1505387742][/doublepost]

a) You don't use thouchID by just looking at the phone.
b) you can set up several fingers, but only one face.

A human has 10 fingers, and just 1 face. Why faceId should have multiple faces?!

 

[ACST]

Not surprised at the denial. It was clear Craig had to wipe the stage makeup off his face for it to work.

Fast forward to 0:50 to see his face after wiping off stage makeup.

View attachment 717592

Just because he did that doesn't mean that was necessary or in any way, shape or form the problem. He was in full panic mode after the failed FaceID (obviously because of the bad optics).

 

[imamacperson]

During an iPhone X demo conducted by Craig Federighi in yesterday's keynote, Face ID appeared to fail to recognize his face, leading to doubts about the feature's reliability and accuracy.

There was a lot of speculation about just what went wrong on stage, ranging from a Face ID failure to a passcode lock, and according to Apple, it was the latter issue that caused the device not to work properly on stage. In a statement provided to Yahoo's David Pogue, Apple says the device locked after several people interacted with it ahead of Federighi, causing it to require a passcode to unlock.While Touch ID locks the iPhone and requires users to input a passcode after five failed entry attempts, Face ID only allows for two failed recognition attempts before it locks the iPhone and requires a passcode to access the device, according to developer documentation. There were arguments over how many times Federighi attempted to unlock the iPhone X with Face ID while on stage given that two attempt limitation, but Apple's explanation makes sense. A secondary iPhone X unlocked with no issues during the demonstration.

The ins and outs of Face ID and its reliability will remain largely unknown until the iPhone X launches in November and is in the hands of customers. Members of the media received hands-on time with the device following the event, but reviews were somewhat mixed. Most people were generally impressed with Face ID and saw it work seamlessly, but there was also at least one report of a problems with the feature not working until the display was turned on and off.

Face ID uses infrared scanning techniques to create a mathematical model of a user's face, which is compared to a facial scan stored on the device to authenticate. Because it uses infrared, Face ID works in the dark and in low lighting conditions, and Apple says it also works with hats, glasses, and beards, makeup, and other items that might partially obscure the face.

Article Link: Apple Says Face ID Didn't Fail Onstage During iPhone X Keynote

Here it comes! FACEGATE!

 

[AdonisSMU]

Its secure but there are usability issues.

 

[Jimrod]

I disagree about the magnitude you say it was. It certainly was an inelegant feature reveal but this will amount to nothing. First, the actual tech sounds excellent. Blows Sammy's facial recognition junk out of the water, just as TouchID blows the competition out of the water. If you're looking for true egg on face, wait til they fool it with a photo like they did on a Samsung. That's a problem. Second, how often do you pass around a locked iPhone? Me? Not once. If I'm showing someone something, the phone is unlocked. (I'm almost always the one holding it anyway, but doesn't matter.) I think I still prefer TouchID for a few reasons (including unlocking as I pass it out of my pocket without having to first look at it) but this is a nonissue in the wild.

I agree that many balk as the lack of cross fade to FaceID, myself included. But if it works well on release (and that's obviously the critical part) this whole kerfuffle will die down, just as it did when Apple forced on us no floppy drive and no optical drive, and is already dying down about no 3.5mm headphone jack. I personally want TouchID and a home button, so I'm ordering an 8. But I think the tech will work and this "issue" will blow over.

I agree for the most part, I watched most of the keynote but missed the actual part with the FaceID issue, I only came back here when I started seeing multiple posts on FB etc from multiple sources talking about it (or rather taking the piss out of it) so it's definitely an embarrassment and Apple's refusal to ever admit a problem (antenna's etc) means people need to have confidence in anything new, Apple needed to be slick with this and they sadly weren't.

I think the new watch was actually the most impressive part of the keynote as it's now a viable stand-alone product rather than a notification centre for the phone (or rather at least you'll be able to go out without the phone and use the watch instead).

I'm tempted by the 8, I went from 6 to SE and I may just stay with the SE - the 8 looks decent but it's a shame they still couldn't at least put in the cameras from the plus. The other upgrades all look worthwhile.

 

[imamacperson]

Here it comes! FACEGATE!

 

[JosephAW]

I still believe the second phone was a fake Face ID iPhone. Anyone's face could have unlocked it. A demo iPhone just in case it failed on the real iPhone.
Apple has been known to do parlor tricks. When they first demoed an intel running OS X it was a tricked out multi core P4 running under the table. Not the product they were selling to the public.
If you watch the interview about the first iPhone demo it was all carefully choreographed to make it look like the iOS software actually was working.

 

[Roller]

A few comments on FaceID:

1. Nobody outside Apple, including the guy at Ars Technica who wrote that it is going to (not might) suck, have had the opportunity to test the feature extensively and report on it publicly.
2. Apple could increase the failed try threshold above two at some point.
3. I don't know why Apple limited training to one face per iPhone, but could be related to the process by which the model is retrieved from the secure enclave and compared to the face of the person trying to unlock the device.
4. The failed unlock during the demo was embarrassing for Apple, but people will forget about it if FaceID works reasonably well in practice. That remains to be seen.
5. TouchID wasn't perfect when it came out in 2013. Go back and read the criticisms and concerns here and elsewhere. As I recall, it wasn't that reliable on my iPhone 5S, but improved considerably over the years.

 

[Jaime M Torch]

I just assumed the phone had timed out or it had been activated by the wrong person. My iPhones have done this quite a bit since iOS9. Its not uncommon for them to need the passcode after charging or after overnight (but less than 24hrs). Never an issue with my iPads. I have just lived with it. No one else uses them or tries to use them.

Personally FaceID looks ok but I wish they would have retained TouchID too, perhaps on the back. Firstly it would give reassurance to those worried about loosing trusted tech and thereby boost sales. Secondly it would allow people to choose between the modalities. Thirdly it would improve security for banking, purchases, etc., as you would be using 2 factor in one device. So you could unlock with TouchID or FaceID but a financial transaction could have been set to require both. That would have given greater security, particularly as FaceID has 1/1000000 chance of random activation and TouchID 1/50000. These risks would have been multiplied, i.e. much less chance.

 

[AdonisSMU]

Great! Actually felt better after confirming this.

Now. It would be nice if we could turn of this "locking with 2 trials thing" all the way, and let that lock come only with several passcode trials.

Whats the problem with many trials of Face ID if it's not going to get unlocked anyway? Just let it fail to unlocked the device infinite times without locking it with passcode and that's it!

Or let us decide how many FaceID trials before locking it. But I actually can picture a lot of "more than 2 random faces at reach" scenarios that may occur and I would hate them to lock my device.

Summary: let it not be a device lock when any amount of FACE ID fails occur.

I can see this FaceID being a battery hog. That's probably why it's limited to two tries. Could you imagine it always tracing your eyes and watching you?

 

[Jaime M Torch]

I still believe the second phone was a fake Face ID iPhone. Anyone's face could have unlocked it. A demo iPhone just in case it failed on the real iPhone.
Apple has been known to do parlor tricks. When they first demoed an intel running OS X it was a tricked out multi core P4 running under the table. Not the product they were selling to the public.
If you watch the interview about the first iPhone demo it was all carefully choreographed to make it look like the iOS software actually was working.

Good point! Yes the original iPhone was a great demo set piece but SPJ had to do everything in the exact order as programmed as it wasn't finished. I expect there may be a lot to do before 27th October....white iPhone 4 anyone?