Apple Working on 'Improved' Security System for iPhone 8 That Replaces Touch ID With Facial Recognition

[KeanosMagicHat]

Like I said before, Samsung will make Apple look like a fool for abandoning touch id, when Samsung comes out with a fingerprint sensor built right into the screen next spring.

And Apple will no doubt then be accused of copying when under screen TouchID makes an appearance as a key feature of the XS to allow people the choice to unlock via either method.

This is a business decision as it seems the TouchID tech isn't ready yet and Apple don't want to delay the launch im order to maintain decent 2017 revenues.

That's why you'll see a lot of praise in the business press both before and after launch of the iPhone X.

 

[Packers1958]

i can only imagine the fun Samsung will have next spring with it's commercials showing how quickly it is to unlock their phones with the fp sensor built right into the screen, while an apple user tries to unlock their phone by first taking off their glasses, looking into the screen and hoping it unlocks right away.

 

[ValO]

In order to enter the US, the Passport is required to have an RFID chip built in. They know exactly who and where this person has been. It has a special encyrption key and if it's fake, it's quite obvious.

sorry, but there is facial recognition everywhere. If you don' t want to see that , ok. You said it: there are no fake passports! And you really believe that?

 

[mctrials23]

Why are you all talking like this is actually going to happen. Apple are simply not that stupid. When have they ever made a decision in recent times that is as stupid as removing touchID would be? Exactly. The new iPhones will all have touchID somewhere on the device. Stop having a fit about something that isn't happening.

 

[Packers1958]

And Apple will no doubt then be accused of copying when under screen TouchID makes an appearance as a key feature of the 8S to allow people the choice to unlock via either method.

This is a business decision as it seems the TouchID tech isn't ready yet and Apple don't want to delay the launch im order to maintain decent 2017 revenues.

That's why you'll see a lot of praise in the business press both before and after launch of the iPhone 8.

Touch ID could easily be implemented on the back of the phone without any additional button. All they have to do is incorporate the sensor into the Apple logo. Now you have a choice, without ruining the the appearance of the phone.

 

[KeanosMagicHat]

If apple can' t make facial recog bulletproof , there will be some sort of touchid semsor on the iphone 8/x. You' ll not have to doubt that. They won' t risk their reputation if they are not 100% sure.
[doublepost=1499198456][/doublepost]
Yes, and if the first cases about grand scale fraud are all over the internet , stealing billions of dollars of other people through apple pay, etc. apple will throw billions of dollars at just marketing and commercials to repair damages.
A real plausible scenario.

It's not going to happen, there are too many important people invested in Apple's success.

 

[TallManNY]

If it works near perfectly, then fine. But Touch ID works great and will be hard to beat.

 

[Packers1958]

sorry, but there is facial recognition everywhere. If you don' t want to see that , ok. You said it: there are no fake passports! And you really believe that?

I never said there are no fake passports. Passports with RFID chips are hard to fake. Thats why most terrorists, except the dumb ones, do not use airports. It much easier to cross border via land and sea. BTW, there are not cameras using facial recognition software everywhere. There are cameras everywhere. Big difference. Again, you are watching too many sci fi shows.

 

[KeanosMagicHat]

Touch ID could easily be implemented on the back of the phone without any additional button. All they have to do is incorporate the sensor into the Apple logo. Now you have a choice, without ruining the the appearance of the phone.

It could, but up until it became apparent that under screen may not happen, not too many people, myself included, would've wanted it on the back.

My take is that after ruling out the Back Sensor and Power Button Sensor options at some stage during the design process Apple ran with 2 teams exploring both Under Screen and Facial Recognition. They were probably confident at that time they could make it happen.

It may have become apparent to them now that unless they delay and take the hit on 2017 revenues, the Under Screen option isn't going to be ready.

So they switch to Facial Recognition - it's too late in the day to go back to the other options.

This is of course, just me reading between the lines on the vast number of rumours we've had on the iPhone X, but that is the purpose of this site . . . . . that we can all agree on, right?

You also have to caveat any Apple prediction you make with this - Apple have an obscene amount of cash available so, if they really, really wanted to, they could spend a shedload to make under screen TouchID happen.

 

[ValO]

I never said there are no fake passports. Passports with RFID chips are hard to fake. Thats why most terrorists, except the dumb ones, do not use airports. It much easier to cross border via land and sea. BTW, there are not cameras using facial recognition software everywhere. There are cameras everywhere. Big difference. Again, you are watching too many sci fi shows.

Ok man you win. Sjeez , there are cameras that are in connection with facial recognition in high security areas. What is the difference? I give up. You can fool advanced state of the art facial recognition by using normal ( i emphasize normal) sunglasses or a fake moustache. You are totally right. There is no facial recognition anywhere, it is all just scifi.

 

[Packers1958]

It could, but up until it became apparent that under screen may not happen, not too many people, myself included, would've wanted it on the back.

My take is that after ruling out the Back Sensor and Power Button Sensor options at some stage during the design process Apple ran with 2 teams exploring both Under Screen and Facial Recognition. They were probably confident at that time they could make it happen.

It may have become apparent to them now that unless they delay and take the hit on 2017 revenues, the Under Screen option isn't going to be ready.

So they switch to Facial Recognition - it's too late in the day to go back to the other options.

This is of course, just me reading between the lines on the vast number of rumours we've had on the iPhone 8, but that is the purpose of this site . . . . . that we can all agree on, right?

You also have to caveat any Apple prediction you make with this - Apple have an obscene amount of cash available so, if they really, really wanted to, they could spend a shedload to make under screen TouchID happen.

I agree. Everyone likes to discuss rumors. Without a doubt, some are leaked out by Apple. Others are not. It's the build up hype that Apple wants. We won't know for sure until it's announced in September. And some of the rumors will be true, while the vast majority will not.

 

[ValO]

It's not going to happen, there are too many important people invested in Apple's success.

I was being sarcastic...

 

[Packers1958]

Ok man you win. Sjeez , there are cameras that are in connection with facial recognition in high security areas. What is the difference? I give up. You can fool advanced state of the art facial recognition by using normal ( i emphasize normal) sunglasses or a fake moustache. You are totally right. There is no facial recognition anywhere, it is all just scifi.

We are not going to change each other's view, so lets just agree to disagree and go back to discussing the phone.

 

[ValO]

It could, but up until it became apparent that under screen may not happen, not too many people, myself included, would've wanted it on the back.

My take is that after ruling out the Back Sensor and Power Button Sensor options at some stage during the design process Apple ran with 2 teams exploring both Under Screen and Facial Recognition. They were probably confident at that time they could make it happen.

It may have become apparent to them now that unless they delay and take the hit on 2017 revenues, the Under Screen option isn't going to be ready.

So they switch to Facial Recognition - it's too late in the day to go back to the other options.

This is of course, just me reading between the lines on the vast number of rumours we've had on the iPhone 8, but that is the purpose of this site . . . . . that we can all agree on, right?

You also have to caveat any Apple prediction you make with this - Apple have an obscene amount of cash available so, if they really, really wanted to, they could spend a shedload to make under screen TouchID happen.

They can make it happen, they' ll probably have a working prototype. But it just can' t be massproduced in the quantities and with the yields to have 20 millions units at launch.
They could give a tech demo like qualcomm right now and tell us that it will be in iphones next year.....

 

[Packers1958]

There is also a lot of assumptions that Apple hasn't perfected touch id built into the screen. For all we know, they have. Misdirection is always a great ploy to fool their competitors.

 

[KeanosMagicHat]

Tbey can make it happen, they' ll probably have a working prototype. But it just can' t be massproduced in the quantities and with the yields to have 20 millions units at launch.

If you throw enough cash at something like this, it'll happen. As mentioned in my previous post, it looks like a business decision to wait for the XS instead.

 

[Superhappytree]

I don't think Apple will not include it when the non redesigned iPhone will still have it in the home button. It will make the non premium model look superior if that also includes facial recognition. They will include it somehow, alongside facial recognition. I think they will place more emphasis on the latter though, while keeping Touch ID as a there-if-you-need-it option. Apple will most likely want to push FR forward as the future, just like they did with Touch ID.
[doublepost=1499201574][/doublepost]

And Apple will be made to look like a fool next spring for dropping touch ID, when Samsung comes out with touch ID built into the screen.

The differnece is Apple doesn't care about being "first". Samsung seems to though, hence they have ******** implementations.

 

[Packers1958]

I don't think Apple will not include it when the non redesigned iPhone will still have it in the home button. It will make the non premium model look superior if that also includes facial recognition. They will include it somehow, alongside facial recognition. I think they will place more emphasis on the latter though, while keeping Touch ID as a there-if-you-need-it option. Apple will most likely want to push FR forward as the future, just like they did with Touch ID.
[doublepost=1499201574][/doublepost]

The differnece is Apple doesn't care about being "first". Samsung seems to though, hence they have ******** implementations.

That may be true, but many people don't want to use facial recognition. They prefer touch ID. And in the end, it's all about money. Nothing else. Great ideas are nice, but if you can't make money off of it in the corporate world, it's useless.

 

[flat five]

And Apple will no doubt then be accused of copying when under screen TouchID makes an appearance as a key feature of the 8S to allow people the choice to unlock via either method.

This is a business decision as it seems the TouchID tech isn't ready yet and Apple don't want to delay the launch im order to maintain decent 2017 revenues.

That's why you'll see a lot of praise in the business press both before and after launch of the iPhone 8.

maybe they won't bring it back.
if the implementation of facial recognition (or some other security feature we're likely unaware of) is an improvement over touchID (as the report is stating), then why would they want to re-introduce a sub-par feature?

 

[Packers1958]

maybe they won't bring it back.
if the implementation of facial recognition (or some other security feature we're likely unaware of) is an improvement over touchID (as the report is stating), then why would they want to re-introduce a sub-par feature?

Bringing it back would be to admit failure. It would be like Apple bringing back the headphone jack. Once Apple gets rid of it, they don't bring it back a year or two later.

 

[flat five]

Bringing it back would be to admit failure. It would be like Apple bringing back the headphone jack. Once Apple gets rid of it, they don't bring it back a year or two later.

idk, for me personally, i welcome a better user recognition feature.
i'm a carpenter and often have glue on my fingers.. touchID is no good in that scenario and i'd estimate i use a passcode about 50% of the time (after first trying touchID.. in which i have all 5 IDs assigned to my own fingers )

it's an outside case.. for sure.
but again, just speaking for me personally.. so i'm a little excited about seeing with they come up with.

 

[ppdix]

How is the iris or face recognition going to work in the middle of the night, while you are in bed, half your face stuffed on a pillow or something like that? Touch ID or any tactile sensor is still the best way to unlock your phone.
Apple just needs to make it work when your fingers are wet.
[doublepost=1499203303][/doublepost]Also Touch ID is part of hundreds of Apps already. Sensitive apps like Citibank, Chase, PayPal, App Store all use it for authentication. It would be dumb and backwards to get rid of it. In my case, I love it.

 

[saudade]

What if we use our iPhone in the night and if we have a black skin ? ;(

Yeah what if u have a black like me..

 

[Syk]

There is also a lot of assumptions that Apple hasn't perfected touch id built into the screen. For all we know, they have. Misdirection is always a great ploy to fool their competitors.

I doubt there is very little misdirection going on. I'm going to bet Samsung and Apple both have a good idea of what each is doing.

Isn't Samsung supplying Apple with their OLED screens for the iPhone Edition? I'm going to guess screens would need to be made to certain specifications for whatever Apple has planned for the FP scanner under the screen.
[doublepost=1499205650][/doublepost]

How is the iris or face recognition going to work in the middle of the night, while you are in bed, half your face stuffed on a pillow or something like that? Touch ID or any tactile sensor is still the best way to unlock your phone.
Apple just needs to make it work when your fingers are wet.
[doublepost=1499203303][/doublepost]Also Touch ID is part of hundreds of Apps already. Sensitive apps like Citibank, Chase, PayPal, App Store all use it for authentication. It would be dumb and backwards to get rid of it. In my case, I love it.

Well Iris scan probably use IR so being in the dark doesn't matter and I'm pretty sure facial recognition would be the same way.
As for TouchID and Apps, I doubt it would be hard at all to make the switch. Wouldn't surprise me if the OS says ok this app uses TouchID and is currently used bring up FaceScan ID or whatever it's called.

If Apple includes another sensor to do facial recognition. I wouldn't be surprised if you'd had to scan from one ear to the other ear and the software maps 100's of thousands data points to tell if it's really you.

Still not sure I want Face Scanning but I'll wait to see what they have planned although right now without knowing all the facts I rather have a fingerprint reader, even if it's on the back
[doublepost=1499205729][/doublepost]

Yeah what if u have a black like me..

IR scans won't care if you're black or dark skinned

 

[yep-sure]

Why are you all talking like this is actually going to happen. Apple are simply not that stupid. When have they ever made a decision in recent times that is as stupid as removing touchID would be? Exactly. The new iPhones will all have touchID somewhere on the device. Stop having a fit about something that isn't happening.

If the headphone jack, a feature used my many more customers than TouchID got removed from the iPhone and USB ports got removed from their MacBook Pros, what makes you think they would hold onto TouchID?

Personally I also don't think that Apple will remove it, but the logic above is a little silly.

That's got me thinking...Maybe TouchID will be used via a dongle.