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Blu-Ray Support at Macworld? Mac Pros Soon?

snahrl said:
Apples and oranges. One is a standard format, the other is highly customizable and entirely dependent on separate OS's.

Apparently you can't figure out that distinction. :rolleyes:
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Oh, then next time do a favor and don't capitalize something if it is not relevant. You made it sound like the higher sales was the most important factor. When pointed out that, that was irrelevant.. you defend yourself by claiming something entirely different.
 
kingtj said:
The problem I'm starting to see (for Apple at least) is that the new iMacs are starting to look like awfully good alternatives to spending $3000+ for a Mac Pro tower.

The performance gap has been narrowing with new iMac refreshes and updates, while the Mac Pro has been completely stagnant.

I have a Mac Pro and one of the new 20" iMacs, and for most things I do, the speed difference is negligible, really. The Mac Pro can handle concurrent tasks without slowing down as much as the iMac. But in some situations, the iMac actually completes a given job FASTER than the Mac Pro does - when you're only running the one application on both machines.

Unless you spend most of your time in one of a few specialized "pro apps", or you tend to do a lot of background rendering/processing while expecting another app in the foreground to run as though nothing else was happening, the Mac Pro is hard to cost-justify right now. (Sure, I realize it has a bigger memory capacity, much more hard drive expandability, and you can pair it with whatever display(s) you like -- and it has the better video card options to make 3D gaming enjoyable. But ultimately, that amounts to paying a BIG premium for more slots and bays on the motherboard, you know?)

Blu-Ray included in some/all of the new Mac Pros is a good move for the future -- but it's strictly an "incremental change" in the grand scheme of things. The Mac Pro needs a new generation of motherboard/Xeon CPU inside it to be a "worthy upgrade", PLUS get some new video card offerings for the thing!
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Ahem... Of course if you are running Firefox or Word you are not going to notice any difference. :) But seriously, the Imac runs laptop parts.. 800mhz bus, 533/667mhz ram, laptop processors, 5400rpm drives, etc.
If you are running any type of compute-intensive apps ( rendering, video production, audio production, data visualization, numerical analysis, physics simulations, other scientific apps, heavy photoshop, etc) there is just no comparison.
 
Feverish Flux said:
I really don't think the Mac Pro is a MWSF item... never has been. Notebooks are Apple's big consumer thing and this is a consumer show...

Q1 yes, MWSF no.
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The MacPro can debut whenever it wants to. Apple should just debut the MacPro, 2008's fastest Mac, and then the stupid Ultra Portable, 2008's thinnest Mac. The MacPro will come this month, you wait and see.
 
zedsdead said:
The only real question to ask is whether or not Apple will continue to support both with some type of hybrid player, of simply give people a choice of burner.
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My guess would be Apple will offer a hybrid Blu-Ray/HD-DVD player (that can record plain DVD) and a Blu-Ray burner. No HD-DVD burner option from the factory.

That way, they support both formats for playback and Blu-Ray for burning because that is the format backed by Disney-Pixar.
 
darthraige said:
The MacPro can debut whenever it wants to. Apple should just debut the MacPro, 2008's fastest Mac, and then the stupid Ultra Portable, 2008's thinnest Mac. The MacPro will come this month, you wait and see.
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Sounds good to me.

9 years since the SuperDrive...
 
Not to beat this to death but another disadvantage of Blu-ray is more error in playback and more glass master rejections at manufacture. I'd rather have two more reliable HD-DVD discs than 1 overstuffed Blu-Ray. That being said I own two of each (and a third HD-DVD coming tomorrow from Amazon) and both are DOA. Downloadable content is king. Unless you are a pro I would not recommend either format!@
 
CWallace said:
My guess would be Apple will offer a hybrid Blu-Ray/HD-DVD player (that can record plain DVD) and a Blu-Ray burner. No HD-DVD burner option from the factory.
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I certainly hope something like this is the case...hybrid player standard, with BRD and HD-DVD burners as BTO options. I mean, "The Big Lebowski" is HD-DVD, while "Big Trouble in Little China" will hit BRD.

I need a hybrid player, man. You gotta feed the monkey.
 
Abercrombieboy said:
You do realize that the HD DVD version of Transformers was rated as one of the best sounding soundtracks of the year. I own the HD DVD version of Transformers and it has outstanding video and audio quality. Lossy soundtracks using Dolby Digital Plus will sound as good as lossless True HD soundtracks if they are properly encoded and Transformers is the proof of that. The only people that might be able to hear a slight difference is people with high end $$$ audio equipment.
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so the people with high end audio equipment should suffer at the expense of consumers who settle for sub par audio? I honestly do not understand why you do not realize that it would be better with lossless audio, and hence better on blu-ray. its not just me who realizes this.

Abercrombieboy said:
I will continue to support Toshiba and HD DVD as long as it is available. If it doesn't win the war I will buy a Blu-ray player once prices go under $200 for full profile 2.0 and web support. I love the idea of backwards compatible HD DVD's that I can play on my HD DVD player and also play on my standard drive in my laptop.
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combo discs? how many combo discs do you actually have and are expected to be released in 2008? this is already been stated by others in the thread, but you are just a very short minded value shopper who buys and justifies the cheapest option even though its always the one thats needs to be fixed/repaired/upgraded the fastest. and this is again the case. you will end up paying more than me when you are forced to buy a blu-ray player, and I make more than you so its funny how that works out (not insulting, just pointing out the downsides of your value theory)



Abercrombieboy said:
As far as data is concerned it would be nice to be able to back up 50GB on a disk, but how slow is the burn time going to be? How expensive is the blank BR-R disks going to be? I just bought a 250GB Seagate external HDD for $50 that is much faster and can be moved and plugged into any computer. It seems like that is the best way for most people to go.

Last, I am very fearful for the consumer once Sony gets their hands on the entire distribution channel from the studio to the consumers home. They would love nothing more then to buy more studios and have total control. This only means more region coding, more DRM, and higher prices. Last I have seen NO effort made to make affordable fully compliant, upgradable Blu-ray players. Sony expects everyone to buy a PS3 to get a decent Blu-ray player. I have no use for a PS3 as millions of other people don't. I already own the #1 gaming console which is the Wii and I am not a hardcore gamer. If I was a hardcore gamer I would buy an xBox 360 because it has a lot more gaming titles available then the PS3.

If the price comes down and the format finally gets finalized then I might be interested. Sony is concerned most about their bottom line and I can promise if Warner did go Blu-ray only, you can forget about prices coming down for a long time. Sony will squeeze the consumer for every penny.

As far as burning Blu-rays for data I am much happier with an external HDD right now. I can use it on any computer and it is much faster.
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a HDD is a completely different solution than discs. I have an unlimited potential of space with blu-rays- which will be much more portable and accessible than hard drives. it might work for you, but I will enjoy burning/ripping/and backing up data on my blu ray drive.

the wii is a great video game system, but I could never only play wii games...a fun time for 15 minutes or watching the kiddies play. thats about it. the ps3 is an amazing gaming system and although you have no need for it, it is a much greater value than the hd-dvd player you got. it will be all the things you are looking for in a blu-ray player (you will eventually upgrade) plus it has wi-fi and internet browsing, a gaming system that matches and in some cases beats the xbox360, a fully compliant blu-ray player, and much much more. you are in big denial, sucks you wasted the less money you have on a less valuable product.


megfilmworks said:
This may be the most accurate statement on this thread.
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if you want to bring up PORN :D

Digital playground was the company who went hd-dvd exclusive which caused all the shockwaves across the internet that hd-dvd would win. if you read the story, you noticed they've since switched and released a "gangbuster" on blu-ray. I personally think everyone can get their porn online for free, but if it has any effect on the format war it looks like advantage blu. FYI: girls gone wild has also been announced for blu ray
 
overcast said:
1. The bluray specs are constantly changing.
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So are the HD-DVD specs (Tri layer you keep being so proud to tout). What is your point?

overcast said:
2. Inferior according to who, you?
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To most people that understand the technology? The larger aperture provides for closer spaced tracks on BD compared to HD-DVD. Closer spaced tracks allow for greater storage and higher bit rates on BD compared to HD-DVD.

Thinner surface provides more room for expansion in layers. More layers provide additional spaces to store data. This is, of course, where HD-DVD gets its one (and only one) advantage. Price. Since HD-DVD is based on the old technology of DVD, it is cheaper to make the blanks.

That advantage, however, will be gone within a year and HD-DVD will be left with nothing to help it technically (if you include $$$ as a technical advantage).


overcast said:
3. There are just as many people who could give a **** about extras, seriously, give it a rest. How many times do you watch them, honestly. Does it REALLY matter if it's all on a separate disc?
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The answer to that is simple. YES. It lowers that cost thing you are so amazingly concerned with. Or do you not understand that?
 
yeroen said:
I'm wary of the inevitable Blu-Ray support. With it will come a whole new layer of resource-hogging DRM enforcement .

Vista can properly be called the OS that DRM built

http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.html

has a good breakdown of what this entails for Vista, and from that you can infer what it will mean for Leopard.
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That article again? It's been debunked so many times.

Yes, there is built in DRM support for HD/BD discs in Vista and will also be in OSX if they launch with players.
The ONLY time the DRM is active is if you are playing one of these discs and it calls for it. If you never play a DRM protected disc you will never see the difference.
The DRM on the discs also affects your set top player and your TV. It's no different than the PC/mac.

snahrl said:
So much FUD, it's incredible.

1. Sony has implemented interactive features with the BD 1.1 profile. HD-DVD no longer has an advantage here.

2. Transformers suffers from inferior sound. While most Blu-Ray movies have uncompressed lossless audio, most HD-DVDs do not because of space/bitrate limitations.

3. The space that Blu-Ray allows for (50 GB as opposed to 30 GB for HD-DVD) means less discs, more content, and better content. Harry Potter on Blu-Ray has all the bonus features in high def, HD-DVD's bonus features are in SD. For longer movies (think LOTR) or TV series, the space issues makes a huge difference.
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In terms of movies the space doesn't matter. There is not a single HD movie out there that can even attempt to fill up 30gb of space. I have tons ripped to my hard drive. They aren't that big, even with extras, blue ray included.

Audio is better on HD-DVD for the simple fact that more formats are required while on blue ray they are merely optional.
Take a look at phantom of the opera, it's available for both formats but is lacking in audio on blue ray.
 
archer75 said:
In terms of movies the space doesn't matter. There is not a single HD movie out there that can even attempt to fill up 30gb of space. I have tons ripped to my hard drive. They aren't that big, even with extras, blue ray included.

Audio is better on HD-DVD for the simple fact that more formats are required while on blue ray they are merely optional.
Take a look at phantom of the opera, it's available for both formats but is lacking in audio on blue ray.
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hmmm....you obviously have no experience ripping BLU-RAY movies seeing most are well over 30 GB of space. I bet you have like a bajillion "blue-rays" on your 100 GB harddrive :cool: ohhhh sweet... did you rip the phantom of the opera in HD DUD or blue-ray? :p
 
Eidorian said:
You don't tell me what I already know. :rolleyes:
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Ok, I get it.

You said "9 years" when the DVR-103 actually came out 7 years ago, because you don't expect the Mac Pro to be updated until MacWorld SF 2010 !!

You may be right, but I wouldn't bet against MacWorld SF 2009.
 
AidenShaw said:
Ok, I get it.

You said "9 years" when the DVR-103 actually came out 7 years ago, because you don't expect the Mac Pro to be updated until MacWorld SF 2010 !!

You may be right, but I wouldn't bet against MacWorld SF 2009.
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The Power Mac G3 Blue & White is 9 years old but it never had a SuperDrive.
 
hjelmn said:
2. There is nothing wrong with MPEG-2 with the exception that more bits are needed to encode with the same quality as VC-1 and AVC. MPEG-2 with 50 GB can produce a perfect HD picture.
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That's not true. MPEG-2 creates artifacts that don't appear in VC-1 or H.264.
 
monkeytap said:
hmmm....you obviously have no experience ripping BLU-RAY movies seeing most are well over 30 GB of space. I bet you have like a bajillion "blue-rays" on your 100 GB harddrive :cool: ohhhh sweet... did you rip the phantom of the opera in HD DUD or blue-ray? :p
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You mean on my server box with 8 hard drives? I have a large collection of HD movies I stream to my HTPC and display on my panasonic projector. But what would I know.
 
monkeytap said:
hmmm....you obviously have no experience ripping BLU-RAY movies seeing most are well over 30 GB of space. I bet you have like a bajillion "blue-rays" on your 100 GB harddrive :cool: ohhhh sweet... did you rip the phantom of the opera in HD DUD or blue-ray? :p
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He ripped them into VCD quality, obviously.

I've never been able to watch a DivX clip without shuddering at the compression artifacts...gross.

Eidorian said:
The Power Mac G3 Blue & White is 9 years old but it never had a SuperDrive.
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What does this have to do with your statement "9 years since the SuperDrive..." ?? And with the "Power Macintosh G4 (Digital Audio)" in January 2001 which was the first with the DVR-103 option? Which my 64-bit calculator says is 7 years....

I have no idea what this argument is about now ;)
 
archer75 said:
You mean on my server box with 8 hard drives? I have a large collection of HD movies I stream to my HTPC and display on my panasonic projector. But what would I know.
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well if you've ever bought a drive capable of ripping blu-rays, im sure you would have at some point noticed its not spelled "blue-ray"

you don't know very much apparently.
 
monkeytap said:
well if you've ever bought a drive capable of ripping blu-rays, im sure you would have at some point noticed its not spelled "blue-ray"

you don't know very much apparently.
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Is that all you got? Resorting to bitching about spelling mistakes? You're a real winner. Why post at all? It's clear you have nothing to contribute, at least nothing intelligent.
 
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