Here's Our First Look at Apple's New 'FineWoven' Apple Watch Bands

[nathansz]

Leather isn't recycled if it's the first use afaik, but it can be repurposed and recycled to extend its usefulness (yes there is still a big environmental cost to it).

I'm on the fence when it comes to it personally, pleather/vegan leather/whatever it's called these days is oil-based and thus far from perfect or cleaner. It's also ironic how much we look into whether leather or synthetics is a cleaer solution when talking about electronic devices - which are really not environment-friendly at all in any way, but we have little alternatives to that.

Recycled nylon/polyester fibers could be an interesting alternative if the production chain is cleaner (aka hopefully it's not just more greenwashing).

I should have said diverted rather than recycled. My mistake

 

[aParkerMusic]

Okay, can we meat eaters please quit perpetuating white lies like this?

I’m not advocating for going vegan. But I’m pretty sure every animal utilized in the food or clothing industry has suffered at some point, or at the very least lived a terrible life, with no access to open spaces, pumped with antibiotics, etc.

The various industries and corporations want as much leather as possible at the lowest possible price, and there’s no time or money to treat animals well.

I get that most people don’t care despite knowing this. We just want the finer things, preferably at a discount.

But can we please stop this kind of “we’re doing the animal a favor by using all of it, we’re really just helping it” kind of reasoning?

The cow was bred to get be processed into meat, leather, gelatin, etc. There’s nothing good about this for the cow, it’s entirely done for human interests with next to no regard for the well-being of the animal while it’s alive or being killed.

But nothing you mentioned has any bearing on the question of the morality of using leather for consumer goods.

You’re talking about the alleged unethical treatment of animals being bred for the human food chain (I only say alleged because practices may not be standard across the board, though I understand there are some very inhumane practices out there, it’s very sad).

But the animals aren’t treated that way BECAUSE Hermes leather bands are being made.

Also, I cannot recall hearing a single person say/right that an animal is “being done a favor” by using its skin for leather. That’s an ad absurdum tactic. What I have seen people write/say (here and elsewhere) is that “the animal is being killed for food anyway, so how is it unethical to use the skin for a purpose?” This to combat the seemingly widespread idea that animals are solely being killed for skin (as if it were the evil elephant tusk industry, within which they actually do just kill the elephant and only take its tusks).

I also just have to call out the whole concept of “open spaces” for animals. I don’t like the idea of an animal being crated or in one of those confined rigs where they can’t even move. But the idea that an animal having open space to move in equating with tranquil peace and comfort is a little naive. The natural world is absolutely brutal and scary, which is why humans have tried so hard to remove ourselves from the brutality of it. Animals aren’t simply running around free and happy in nature. they very often are miserable and scared. That doesn’t justify the way meat industries might treat them, but I think it’s important to note to keep the conversation grounded.

 

[nathansz]

If no one wanted leather goods, animals would still be killed for meat. That will never change in human history. People need to let go of that fantasy. Understanding that, it’s much more moral to use the animal to its full utility, rather than just unceremoniously dump most of it.

It’s funny, a common criticism I’d often heard while growing up about “American culture” vs “Native American culture” is how the latter would honor the animal by using as much of it’s host as possible when killing for food While the former would not be so thoughtful. Maybe that’s no longer a consideration. Let’s just dump the rest of the animal on the side of the road after we feast.

There’s a massive difference between sustenance hunting and the industrial torture and slaughter of animals

 

[jlc1978]

There is a lot of processing required to recycle materials. It’s not like they just heat up old plastic milk jugs and toss in some food coloring.

A majority is never recycled because the cost is higher than what you can get for the recycled material.

 

[coffeemilktea]

I gotta say, that weird pill design on the band (I don't know what else to call that design) looks like something your grandma would pick out for you on Christmas. Like of all the good watch band designs Apple could go with, they picked something that looks like a series of speed bumps on your wrist?

 

[JapanApple]

Came here to say this exactly. I had hopes the finewove would be decent, but wow, it looks terrible. 1970s making a comeback. lol

No, not the 1970s era, please. The time in history was fine at the time, but any remnants of designs or patterns should be reconsidered. Didn't we learn anything from "The Barbie`s DREAM HOUSE RENOVATION" reality show" OMG it was tacky. The fine woven is better when it is with a larger filament that is threaded in larger weaves when woven. If it's tighter woven (it would be thinner filament) not only, is it harder to make, but the cost is much more. This example is real I would never buy.

 

[solq]

Interesting. Plastic that's not waterproof and looks like a combination of cloth and cardboard.

 

[MrENGLISH]

What new problem is it creating?

Depends on how durable it is? If they don't last long, then it will generate more waste.

How biodegradable will they be compared to what they are replacing?

What about people with allergies? I had a bad reaction to the sport bands but no issues with the leather ones.

 

[cmcbhi]

Okay, can we meat eaters please quit perpetuating white lies like this?

I’m not advocating for going vegan. But I’m pretty sure every animal utilized in the food or clothing industry has suffered at some point, or at the very least lived a terrible life, with no access to open spaces, pumped with antibiotics, etc.

The various industries and corporations want as much leather as possible at the lowest possible price, and there’s no time or money to treat animals well.

I get that most people don’t care despite knowing this. We just want the finer things, preferably at a discount.

But can we please stop this kind of “we’re doing the animal a favor by using all of it, we’re really just helping it” kind of reasoning?

The cow was bred to get be processed into meat, leather, gelatin, etc. There’s nothing good about this for the cow, it’s entirely done for human interests with next to no regard for the well-being of the animal while it’s alive or being killed.

I'm sure you have a point. Please make it.

 

[aParkerMusic]

I have the link bracelet that Apple makes. It's not a good match for the darker material on the Ultra though.

All of this is subjective, of course, but I actually think the brushed look of the stainless steel link band matches the soft titanium look of the Ultra far more naturally than the shiny polished look of the stainless steel Watch it was designed to accompany. The colors aren’t an exact match, but light usually hits it in a way where it seems very close.

 

[bluecoast]

Okay, can we meat eaters please quit perpetuating white lies like this?

I’m not advocating for going vegan. But I’m pretty sure every animal utilized in the food or clothing industry has suffered at some point, or at the very least lived a terrible life, with no access to open spaces, pumped with antibiotics, etc.

The various industries and corporations want as much leather as possible at the lowest possible price, and there’s no time or money to treat animals well.

I get that most people don’t care despite knowing this. We just want the finer things, preferably at a discount.

But can we please stop this kind of “we’re doing the animal a favor by using all of it, we’re really just helping it” kind of reasoning?

The cow was bred to get be processed into meat, leather, gelatin, etc. There’s nothing good about this for the cow, it’s entirely done for human interests with next to no regard for the well-being of the animal while it’s alive or being killed.

Thanks for your honest, measured arguments.

It’ll be interesting to see how Apple messages this later & we can have a good discussion around that, definitely my preference.

 

[Rogifan]

Apple needs to bring back the woven nylon strap. I get them from a 3rd party and they’re pretty good but I think the Apple ones were slightly higher quality.

Woven Nylon Apple Watch Band

StrapsCo's woven nylon Apple watch band spells comfort and durability. Suits Apple Watch Series 1 to 8, Apple Watch Nike+. Fast worldwide shipping. Shop now!

strapsco.com

 

[TheJackal]

I really like having a vegan option.
I know, lots of people hate products that are free from animal suffers, but it's great for the rest of us

As has been stated on many occasions, if it's sourced from cow leather then it's usually a byproduct of the meat industry.

In other words, removing leather from the bands won't have a direct effect on the number of animals slaughtered.

 

[Tdude96]

it’s entirely done for human interests with next to no regard for the well-being of the animal while it’s alive or being killed.

There are rules surrounding this in most of the western world, but on this point, if it concerns you a great deal, you might want to consider going direct to farm for meat. I buy from a local rancher with an open door (gate?) policy. I can go visit my beef anytime I want, see how it's being treated, what kind of life it has.

 

[nathansz]

There are rules surrounding this in most of the western world, but on this point, if it concerns you a great deal, you might want to consider going direct to farm for meat. I buy from a local rancher with an open door (gate?) policy. I can go visit my beef anytime I want, see how it's being treated, what kind of life it has.

But it still dies in the end just to satisfy your desires

 

[aParkerMusic]

There’s a massive difference between sustenance hunting and the industrial torture and slaughter of animals

What’s the difference?

Do you want humans living at mere “sustenance” levels? Do you feel that would be more moral than creating an industrial food supply chain whereby humans did not have to worry about having a source of nutritious meat?

I don’t think animals should be tortured. I also doubt we could support the world’s population by just hunting in the woods. Barring no more meat eating (it’s not going to happen, so let go of that for this argument), what is your solution to the meat production problem? Animals don’t like being abused, I’m sure (and they shouldn’t be). They probably also don’t like being killed. Life kind of sucks in that way. Pain exists and death exists. Neither should be inflicted cynically and uselessly, in my opinion.

anyway, to tie it all back to this hideous photo of an alleged FineWoven band, the question of the morality of the meat food chain actually is pretty distinct, although clearly in some ways related, to the question of whether leather goods are ethical Or more or less eco-friendly than plastics and nylon.

 

[nathansz]

What’s the difference?

Do you want humans living at mere “sustenance” levels? Do you feel that would be more moral than creating an industrial food supply chain whereby humans did not have to worry about having a source of nutritious meat?

I don’t think animals should be tortured. I also doubt we could support the world’s population by just hunting in the woods. Barring no more meat eating (it’s not going to happen, so let go of that for this argument), what is your solution to the meat production problem? Animals don’t like being abused, I’m sure (and they shouldn’t be). They probably also don’t like being killed. Life kind of sucks in that way. Pain exists and death exists. Neither should be inflicted cynically and uselessly, in my opinion.

anyway, to tie it all back to this hideous photo of an alleged FineWoven band, the question of the morality of the meat food chain actually is pretty distinct, although clearly in some ways related, to the question of whether leather goods are ethical Or more or less eco-friendly than plastics and nylon.

The thing is, we don’t need meat at all. It’s much more efficient to eat plants then it is to feed the plants to animals on order to eat them.

raising and killing animals in order to eat them is indeed very much inflicting pain and death cynically and uselessly

 

[Mr. Y]

This is pictured on the AW Ultra: What if Apple is not moving away from leather but creating a water/sweat proof alternative to its existing models for the “active wearer”…as the AW Ultra is geared toward?

 

[aParkerMusic]

But it still dies in the end just to satisfy your desires

People are designed to eat meat. We eat meat. You will never overcome that. Animals need to die for a human to eat meat. Animals would gladly kill us for the same reason. Case closed, no further discussion required.

Knowing this, we do not need FineWoven bands like the gross one above to fix a problem. It’s a philosophical problem, thats all.

I hope you like the petroleum-based solutions to leather problems, sincerely. It’s all about trade-offs.

 

[aParkerMusic]

The thing is, we don’t need meat at all. It’s much more efficient to eat plants then it is to feed the plants to animals on order to eat them.

raising and killing animals in order to eat them is indeed very much inflicting pain and death cynically and uselessly

I hope you enjoy eating leaves, etc, and then using supplements (via the oil-based industrial supply chain) to get the nutrients that plants do not efficiently or adequately provide. I mean that genuinely.

Just know, we’ll never stop eating meat. It is the natural order of things. Animals eat meat also. So, it doesn’t really matter that you keep fighting this.

To bring it back to the original topic again, FineWoven doesn’t solve the problem of animal cruelty or meat eating. It just crates a seemingly inferior product based in non-natural materials.

 

[Kar98]

People are designed to eat meat. We eat meat. You will never overcome that. Animals need to die for a human to eat meat. Animals would gladly kill us for the same reason. Case closed, no further discussion required.

Knowing this, we do not need FineWoven bands like the gross one above to fix a problem. It’s a philosophical problem, thats all.

I hope you like the petroleum-based solutions to leather problems, sincerely. It’s all about trade-offs.

People evolved to eat meat...
Other than that, yes.

 

[sparkinstx]

That looks so gross, like material for prosthetics in 1970s East Germany. Something Grandpa the WW2 vet would strap to his stumps.

Did he have hand controls in his Trabant? 🤣

 

[nathansz]

People are designed to eat meat. We eat meat. You will never overcome that. Animals need to die for a human to eat meat. Animals would gladly kill us for the same reason. Case closed, no further discussion required.

Knowing this, we do not need FineWoven bands like the gross one above to fix a problem. It’s a philosophical problem, thats all.

I hope you like the petroleum-based solutions to leather problems, sincerely. It’s all about trade-offs.

Firstly, humans were not “designed” at all.

Secondly, humans do not need to eat meat

It’s that simple. Case closed. No further discussion required

 

[TheYayAreaLiving 🎗️]

What FineWoven meterial reminds me of...

 

[Rogue AI]

And they’ll charge $100 for it.

hard pass.