Mac Hater Arguments

[Yvan256]

That's not quite valid. The keyboard and mouse only take up one USB port, with a net loss of zero USB ports, as long as you're using a keyboard that has a two-port USB hub in it. Plug the mouse into the keyboard, plug the keyboard into the Mac mini, and you still have two free USB ports.

That's still basically valid. The keyboard takes one USB port, the mouse takes another one. The fact that you can buy a keyboard with a built-in port is the same argument as me saying I already have a 7-port USB hub. Keyboard + mouse does take 2 ports, but there is a way around it.

That doesn't mean there's more than 2 ports on the Mac mini, though.

 

[dsharits]

But it's still not an excuse. Besides, there are PC's out there that only have two USB ports.

Daniel

 

[Yvan256]

Man this computer is stupid!!! There's not even a little blue E to click on!!!

Eh, some people are not even close-minded to computers, but to software as well.

This guy would have a hard time even on my Windows XP computer... There's only a "little red O" to click on.

 

[Mav451]

*shaking head*

Not really. I got my A7N8X is early 2003, and that alone has 4-onboard USB2.0 ports. Additionally, my case AX-01BLD, also form early 2003 has 2 front-panel USB2.0 ports + Firewire connection on the front panel.

That is from the year 2003. The case cost me maybe $60? We are now in the year 2005. If i had a USB Mouse, KB, Gamepad, Thumbdrive, iPod, and of course a printer, I would NOT be comfortable putting all of those into a hub. The iPod and Thumbdrive, already need dedicated connections. Having a non-dedicated connection for your KB may not be a good idea down the line either (if your bandwidth gets saturated >> erratic typing).

 

[Yvan256]

My all time favourite

"If everyone owned a Mac then IT people would be out of a job" and this guy thought this was a vaild argument against Macs.

Well, think about it for a second. He's right.

In fact, I've had a discussion just a few days ago with the owner of a PC store, and one fact they don't like to sell Macs is because the profit margins are too low and (especially) since they're pratically maintenance-free (compared to PCs, anyway).

The big bucks are in the maintenance and tech support fees, not the hardware.

That's why there's so few resellers... No cash to make. Except for Apple, who makes the whole thing (hardware and software).

The only sad thing about this is that most people seem to accept this as the only possible way to do computing. If the same were true with cars, you'd see lots of KIAs or LADAs on the road (no offense intended to KIA or LADA owners).

 

[Yvan256]

"Macs are just toys... besides, they can't even play my favorite game."

Funny, I thought game consoles were the supposed toys. And both my Xbox and Gamecube can't play my favorite game either (World of Warcraft, for now anyway).

 

[Yvan256]

Yea I've heard that one a ton... but is that really a bad thing? I mean all the person is doing is bashing a computer for the fact that its easy to use.

Remember, a lot of PC users are like those folks who keep working and tuning their cars. They're proud of it, and think Macs are lame because you can't tweak it.

Regular people, however, just drive their cars around instead of fiddling with the mechanics. And that's what a car should be.

Those mac bashers simply don't get that you can actually do something with the computers, they're too busy adding neon lights and similar crap.

I laugh at computers with neon lights the same way I laugh at moded cars. They don't look cool, they look stupid.

 

[dsharits]

*shaking head*

Not really. I got my A7N8X is early 2003, and that alone has 4-onboard USB2.0 ports. Additionally, my case AX-01BLD, also form early 2003 has 2 front-panel USB2.0 ports + Firewire connection on the front panel.

That is from the year 2003. The case cost me maybe $60? We are now in the year 2005. If i had a USB Mouse, KB, Gamepad, Thumbdrive, iPod, and of course a printer, I would NOT be comfortable putting all of those into a hub. The iPod and Thumbdrive, already need dedicated connections. Having a non-dedicated connection for your KB may not be a good idea down the line either (if your bandwidth gets saturated >> erratic typing).

I didn't say all, I said some PC's only have two USB ports, but nobody is making a big stink about them, are they? People only make this argument because it's a Mac. If a PC manufacturer made a PC as small and as cool as the Mac Mini, and it only had one USB port, people would still be saying what a great concept it is, and how it is just perfect for the average consumer, blah, blah, blah. Because it's a Mac, you get all of this nit-picking. "Well it only has two USB ports, but my Super Duper Gateway Box-O-Crap has four, and I only paid $399 for it." It's the same thing as the stupid single mouse button argument. People complain endlessly about it, when they can fix the problem with a ten-dollar trip to Best Buy, just as they can with the USB port complaint. Like all PC vs Mac arguments, they can't compare along the same level. If they're talking about price, it ends up being a comparison between a dual 2.5 GHz Power Mac G5 and a junk $299 Dell special. If they're arguing performance, it's always a comparison between a dual AMD processor gaming machine and a Mac Mini. The bottom line is that the Mac Mini runs OS X, and all of those PC's run Windows. That is the single advantage that puts the Mac Mini far above any deal that any PC manufacturer can come up with, bottom line.

Daniel

 

[Mav451]

Nah, but if it had 4 USB2.0 ports, this argument would not even be occuring. Honestly, 2 ports >> maybe 1" by 1" area.

I already know that there's OSX on there (its a given), its just that this is an extra hassle. Joe User would connect his KB and mouse, and suddenly realize he's out of ports already. If he has a Thumbdrive, iPod, Printer, Scanner, Camera >> the list goes on, where does he connect it to?

Sure, forcing Joe User to buy a USB Hub would be good for business, but for Apple customers, I say this is another hassle. The equivalent of a PC user having to buy a Firewire PCI card for his computer from '99.

 

[dsharits]

Remember, a lot of PC users are like those folks who keep working and tuning their cars. They're proud of it, and think Macs are lame because you can't tweak it.

Regular people, however, just drive their cars around instead of fiddling with the mechanics. And that's what a car should be.

Those mac bashers simply don't get that you can actually do something with the computers, they're too busy adding neon lights and similar crap.

I laugh at computers with neon lights the same way I laugh at moded cars. They don't look cool, they look stupid.

In that case, their argument is that Apple products are already too cool to add neon lights and all that stuff. Which is true, by the way. The only appearance modding I have ever done to any Mac is add a blue LED fan to the power supply of my B&W. Even then, it wasn't necessary to look good, I wanted a quieter fan, and it was all that Best Buy had in stock. I can't stand talking to those hardcore PC users, who think that adding lights and crap their Dell is cool and fun.

Daniel

 

[Mav451]

Remember, a lot of PC users are like those folks who keep working and tuning their cars. They're proud of it, and think Macs are lame because you can't tweak it.

Regular people, however, just drive their cars around instead of fiddling with the mechanics. And that's what a car should be.

Those mac bashers simply don't get that you can actually do something with the computers, they're too busy adding neon lights and similar crap.

I laugh at computers with neon lights the same way I laugh at moded cars. They don't look cool, they look stupid.

Well, that's usually the junior high/high school group. I don't think I've seen a single college guy with "neon lights". Now, water-cooling or silent-PC modifications, I've seen alot more of those. Those are useful. W/C >> for the overclockers + those who can't stand the noise of high CFM air-coolers. And silent-PC modders? Those that want to sleep within 10 feet of there machine (dorm room).

 

[Yvan256]

Well, its tough to preach to the non-believers. (hmm...) If they refuses to see our point, telling them otherwise would only make them more defensive and harder to change.

Most of the time I get from other people is that "Macs just look pretty and cost too much and I could get an equivalent of a PC for half the price", some (not really haters) just say "but I don't know how to use a Mac"

There's two kinds of people (on all sides, Microsoft, Apple, Sun, Amiga, etc):
- haters (even if you put proofs in front of them, they'll still hate)
- victims of FUD (if you put proofs in front of them, they can change their minds)

Haters are a hopeless case. Victims of FUD are the ones who are potential switchers.

Apple isn't perfect. But when compared to the alternatives, it might seem that way.

 

[Mav451]

In that case, their argument is that Apple products are already too cool to add neon lights and all that stuff. Which is true, by the way. The only appearance modding I have ever done to any Mac is add a blue LED fan to the power supply of my B&W. Even then, it wasn't necessary to look good, I wanted a quieter fan, and it was all that Best Buy had in stock. I can't stand talking to those hardcore PC users, who think that adding lights and crap their Dell is cool and fun.

Daniel

LOL. Before you continue to throw mud at PC users, you need to realize that not a single Dell computer case has a window.

 

[dejo]

The equivalent of a PC user having to buy a Firewire PCI card for his computer from '99.

Or even his computer from '05! (Not many cheap PCs come with FireWire ports).

 

[dsharits]

Joe User would connect his KB and mouse, and suddenly realize he's out of ports already. If he has a Thumbdrive, iPod, Printer, Scanner, Camera >> the list goes on, where does he connect it to?

Well, it sounds like Joe User needs to wake up and realize that he's not in Micro-land any more, and he can connect his iPod to a FireWire port at least. For the other peripherals, I would just use an Apple Keyboard and mouse, and plug a hub into the other USB port. It would be more convenient than having the USB ports in the back, anyway.

Daniel

 

[dsharits]

LOL. Before you continue to throw mud at PC users, you need to realize that not a single Dell computer case has a window.

Why do you think they add 'em?

Daniel

 

[Yvan256]

Tell the peopl that say that the Ghz=speed. Ghz speed of the cpu has got very very little to do with actual performance. The PowerPC cpu's get more done in each cycle than the x86 once and are actually at lot faster than the P4+ the 2.5 version from mac has a 1.25Ghz FSB wich is a lot higher and they come in Dual configuration not single such as the P4

Even better, stay in x86 land to make your comparisons. Why is my "Athlon XP 2400+" running at "only" 1.92GHz? (according to XP). There's a reason why AMD went this way (rating instead of actual clock speed).

Another exemple: I'm running the World Community Grid client, and the comparison device is a Pentium 4 @ 1.5GHz for a score of 100.

Why is my Athlon XP 1.92GHz getting a score of 192? That's 92% more results for only 33% more clock speed.

After showing him these numbers (WCG client numbers for a x86 processor on Windows XP), then he'll be more aware and more open about the MHz myth. It happens on the very platform he's (probably) currently using.

 

[Yvan256]

not an excuse

You can also connect the mouse to one of the 2 ports on the keyboard, or go bluetooth and use none.

Cheers

It's a good and real-world excuse. Most USB keyboards don't have a built-in hub. And that's if you have a USB keyboard to begin with.

After all, isn't the Mac mini supposed to be targeting potential switchers?

I do agree with the bluetooth options, but considering most PC users are still on PS/2 keyboards (with USB mouses), bluetooth only adds cost to the Mac mini, it doesn't apply for switchers, why is the main goal.

So yes, it's not impossible to connect more than a USB keyboard and mouse on the Mac mini (bluetooth, keyboard with built-in hub, external usb hub, PS/2 adapter that only use one port), but for most people, this is exactly what will happen. Keyboard + mouse = no ports left.

 

[Yvan256]

"1) "You can't use an iPod on a Mac"

LOL, that has to be the funniest anti-Mac argument I've ever seen. Thanks for the quote.

In case it wasn't understood, this is because when he plugged it into his Windows, he set it up for Windows, so in a Mac, it didn't work...

Isn't OS X supposed to read FAT32 drives? Isn't a Windows-formatted iPod supposed to work on a Mac? (unless it was OS 9, in which case I have no idea if it should work).

2) "I already have a Windows and whenever it breaks my neighbor can fix it but he can't fix Macs" - Well... you get the picture...

Indeed. People are so used to Windows, they now expect the computer to be a source of constant problems.

 

[Mav451]

Originally Posted by dotdotdot
"1) "You can't use an iPod on a Mac"

Lol, that is too much. Like the Miller Light "Taste Loss" commercial:

There are no stupid questions regarding taste loss.
"Can I get taste loss from a fooseball table?"
I stand corrected.

 

[Yvan256]

Stop!


By using Adolf Hitler's name you have invoked Godwin's Law.





p.s. It may be poor form to even bring it up. I don't mind breaking this law myself as I frankly, don't give a damn, my dear...

Nope, it was timely and spot-on.

Even made me laugh. Like you almost were waiting for such a comment to show up to be able to shout "stop".

 

[Yvan256]

Wait.... There's other things you can do with your computer???

.... What's this "email" about?

That's the thing you receive your porn with. At work, even.

 

[Yvan256]

Price.

Price.

And oh yeah,

Price.

Many people just think pc's are a better bang for the buck. I'm not saying it's a valid argument, I'm just saying people look blindly and ignorantly at the price vs. features. On paper it looks like they are getting a lot more for their money with a cheap-ass Gateway compared to a comparible (again, on paper) mac.

Of course we all know that's not true, but it can be tough to convince people of that.

Exactly. People only see numbers and never do comparisons. They see high GHz, low price. The only things regular users can compare (and be right) is the RAM, HD size, GPU, VRAM, number of ports, etc. Anything else cannot be directly compared.

If you want one more proof that people only see numbers: most people really believe that USB 2.0 (480mbps) is faster than FireWire (400mbps). All tests and benchmarks show the opposite. And that's not even taking into account the CPU % used up by USB 2.0 compared to FireWire...

 

[Yvan256]

But it's still not an excuse. Besides, there are PC's out there that only have two USB ports.

Daniel

Yes, but PCs with only two USB ports are usually old computers and/or also have PS/2 ports.

 

[dsharits]

I saw a PC a few months ago that had two PS/2 ports and two rear USB ports, and it came with a USB keyboard and mouse.

Daniel