mmmm let me think .... where was it again that banks fell over and started the biggest economic crisis since WOII?
That has nothing to do with anything.
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Macbook Update in progress (2.4Ghz)
- Thread starter pdubak
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That has nothing to do with anything.
Uuhm, am i the only one who noticed that the new white macbook has a BACKLIT keyboard now?
Edit: hm, guess i'm wrong. I swear i saw backlit keyboard this morning on the website!
Edit: hm, guess i'm wrong. I swear i saw backlit keyboard this morning on the website!
Prove it.
Nevermind the fact that are are linux distros made specifically for older hardware that would run fast on older hardware.
But different people have different perceptions of whats fast. For instance, Jobs seems to think the GPU in the MacBook is "killer" when, in reality, its one of the most low end GPUs available today.
Software and hardware are equally as important. Software is just as useless on bad hardware as good hardware is running bad software.
And when you take into account that Apple likes to throw more CPU cycles at a problem rather than optimize software, running newer and newer versions of OS X on now 4 year old CPU architecture is just going to make that "good" software experience seem slower and slower and slower.
Oh yeah? You might want to read around this forum a lot more. I'm not the only one sharing this experience. Different types of 1080p video have different hardware requirements. Low bitrate H.264 1080p video will play fine in software on a Core 2 Duo. But take a raw H.264 or VC-1 video stream from a blu-ray disc, not recompressed but the original raw video stream, and you'll see that Core 2 Duo be brought to its knees faster than Safari crashes on a website using Flash.
Good for you. I've been using OS X since Tiger. To me, Tiger was the most stable OS of all 3. Leopard eventually got to Tiger's stability through updates. But Snow Leopard? Not at all. As I said, it was only recently that Apple finally decided to make the wake from sleep feature work properly. In the past, with Leopard, I was able to wake the system with the lid closed so I could use my external display only. It also worked with Tiger on older Macs. Didn't work with Snow Leopard. I could go back to Leopard and it would work. But not 10.6 until the recent .3 update. I still have to plug external speakers in twice to get sound out of them.
Oh, and the reason I have to have the lid closed when I wake it? Because Apple offers no true multi-monitor support or controls. If Apple would join the modern world, the way Windows did back in Windows 98, then I could control everything in software and not have to worry about starting my system up and closing the lid real fast, or waking it up when its closed and raising the temperature substantially.
Prove that people do. Seriously. Do it. Outside of this forum I have NEVER seen people use the iLife suite. Never. I've heard them talk about how they'd love to use Garage Band to make music or iMovie when they finally get a video camera. But it never happens. In the end they always say "wow I never used any of that software like I thought I would".
Yes, software is important. Again, I have said that. But hardware is also equally important. Good software on bad hardware is every bit as useless as good hardware running bad software.
Good for you that you can do that with such limited hardware. Imagine how much more you could do with a modern system
That depends on who you ask and what benchmark you read.
For me personally, Firefox with AdBlockPlus has webpages opening damn near instantly, as soon as I hit Enter on my keyboard. Every other browser has noticeable rendering time.
Considering I've been building computers piece by piece since before Jobs returned to Apple, I think I know my stuff. Have fun trying to edit a 40Mbps H.264 video on a Core 2 Duo with 2GB of RAM
Performance is subjective. Like I said before, Jobs seems to think the GPU in the MacBook is "killer". If you think a Core 2 Duo running Snow Leopard is faster than a true quad core Core i7 with 6-8GB of RAM running Windows 7, then good for you. Thats not reality, but you're free to think what you want.
Windows Vista and Windows 7 run differently than OS X. At first they will run slower. But once you have a pattern down and the OS knows your most frequently used apps and way of using the system, it will adapt and it will be fast.
And then after a year, they realize they need to install Windows on it still to actually get things done and have fun during breaks or off work or out of school. Then after they install Windows they realize that "hey, if I had spent as much on a PC as I did this Mac, I could have gotten something several times better than it or that old PC I bought before!"
Motherboard, not "logic board". Get it right.
Also, if the motherboard failed that quickly out of warranty, the manufacturer would absolutely have taken care of it and fixed it for her.
She bought a Mac on pure ignorance. Simple as that. If she had explored her options she would have seen that she would have been taken care of.
If you want to talk about companies not taking care of their customers, look up all of the iBook G3 and G4 motherboard failure class action lawsuits.
Look at the recent recall of MacBook HDDs.
Hell, look at the MagSafe adapter. It's a fire hazard! Yet Apple does nothing to fix it.
It's pure ignorance to truly believe that Apple builds a better product.
haha, exactly. And Apple doesn't even support that feature on all nvidia GPUs. Theres no reason the GeForce 8 series can't be supported. Yet they choose not to. My friend with a MacBook Pro and GeForce 8600M GT (that he's trying to sell because he wants to switch back to PC). He can't get hardware accelerated video decoding under OS X. But if he switches over to Windows 7 he has no problem.
Thankfully, that didn't happen to me on my recent repair. Apple didn't image my HDD, but they did scratch my bottom case up very good. Had to drive an hour to the closest Apple store for them to fix it.
First of all, your prices are WAY off. $300 motherboard for Core i7? $70 for a 640GB HDD? $85 for a GeForce GT 120?
You can get a damn good Core i7 motherboard for less than $150.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136517 theres an 800GB 5400RPM HDD for $59.99
You can find a GPU thats as low-end as that GT 120 on newegg for around $40-$50.
You do realize that the only difference between that single Xeon and a Core i7 is that the Xeon can use ECC memory, right? It's stupid to use that anyway because it adds latency and slows things down. Your chances of having RAM error out on you is about the same as you getting struck by lightning this very second as you read this.
Theres absolutely no way the PSU in the Mac Pro is worth $100.
The "sweet case" is actually extremely ugly and they've been using it for what? Seven years now? If the price on that thing is anything more than $30 they're getting ripped off.
It's kind of funny that Apple is now against using Intel graphics when they were still charging $1500+ for Intel graphics not even 2 full years ago..
But if Apple can't fit a dedicated GPU in their 13.3" system they're doing something wrong. Theres plenty of other 12-14" systems out there with dedicated GPUs.
What type of HD video? What quality? Quality plays a huge role. I can take an hour long 720p H.264 video and run it through a CUDA encoder in Windows and get the whole thing transcoded to a lower bitrate in a matter of minutes. But if I run it through the newest x264 encode with quality settings being used, it takes HOURS. Thats on a 2GHz Core 2 Duo.
Different people have different expectations of speed. It's 2010. Taking hours to re-encode HD video is no longer considered "tearing through" when a PC running a Core i7 can encode blu-ray quality 1080p faster than real-time.
Thanks for making me laugh out loud! I needed it!
There is no way at all your Core 2 Duo will outperform a system running a Core i5 or Core i7 performing the same task. No way. Not at all. That is a flat out lie.
And cooler? Absolutely NOT. I have two computers at the moment. A MacBook with a 2GHz Core 2 Duo (Penryn, 25w TDP model) and an HP with a dedicated GPU, a Core 2 Duo 2GHz (Merom, 35w TDP). Guess which one runs cooler? The HP.
I was recently encoding some high bitrate H.264 on both of them. Same source video. I wanted to see which would do it faster. The MacBook's CPU temp got up to 80c while encoding. The HP peaked at 55c. If I put the HP on a cooling pad with dual fans, it will drop the CPU temp down to about 50c. The Mac will drop to about 77c.
So don't lie. You say things like that and its clear as day to anyone that you're just making things up.
mosx, it seems that every dollar in Apple's bank account hurts you just a little bit. 40 billion little hurts. Poor you.
Lemme see. It seems you are protesting too much. You know exactly why your next computer will be a Mac again
Lemme see. It seems you are protesting too much. You know exactly why your next computer will be a Mac again
Prove it.
But different people have different perceptions of whats fast. For instance, Jobs seems to think the GPU in the MacBook is "killer" when, in reality, its one of the most low end GPUs available today.
And when you take into account that Apple likes to throw more CPU cycles at a problem rather than optimize software, running newer and newer versions of OS X on now 4 year old CPU architecture is just going to make that "good" software experience seem slower and slower and slower.
Prove that people do. Seriously. Do it. Outside of this forum I have NEVER seen people use the iLife suite. Never. I've heard them talk about how they'd love to use Garage Band to make music or iMovie when they finally get a video camera. But it never happens. In the end they always say "wow I never used any of that software like I thought I would".
Considering I've been building computers piece by piece since before Jobs returned to Apple, I think I know my stuff. Have fun trying to edit a 40Mbps H.264 video on a Core 2 Duo with 2GB of RAM
Windows Vista and Windows 7 run differently than OS X. At first they will run slower. But once you have a pattern down and the OS knows your most frequently used apps and way of using the system, it will adapt and it will be fast.
Motherboard, not "logic board". Get it right.
1. The GPU (320m) in the Macbook and 13'' MBP is a pretty darn good GPU for a mobile computer. Most still come with either Intel 4500, Intel HD or some low-end ATi option like a 4570 or 4330, both of which are weaker than the 320m. Is it a GTX 480 ? Of course not, but it puts most of the consumer Laptop market GPU's to shame.
2. Just because it is 4 years old, is pretty damn irrelevant. A 2.4 Ghz C2D will perform almost as well as an i3, and an i5 isn't vastly superior. Just because it is old, doesn't mean it can't run an OS perfectly well. I mean for God's sake, a lot of Wintel ultraportables are running with CULV 1.3Ghz CPU's.
3. If you want evidence of people using iMovie, go to youtube. I guarantee at least 50% of the top content on that site is created using Apple Hardware and software.
4. If you're trying to edit a 40Mbps video on a 2.4Ghz C2D, you are using the wrong piece of hardware in the first place, so that is the idiocy of the buyer, not the hardware. The Macbook and arguably the 13'' MBP are CONSUMER LEVEL devices, not made for hardcore encoding.
5. Windows devices will not magically get faster, and have you ever heard of Winrot ?
6. Logic board was a term coined in the 1980's, it is simply the word used by Intel to describe their equivalent of laptop motherboards. Calling that wrong is like saying that the word 'Hyperthreading' is incorrect and should be called Multithreading.
Millions upon millions of people are buying Macbooks. Look on youtube and you will find tons of videos of music heads using Garageband and other users using iLife software [PROOF]. You have to realize that with so many people buying Macbooks, there's only a tiny percentage of people like you who are absolutely crazy (no offense, but look at your posts and tell me that you aren't raging) and demand every single feature that they want to be implemented. Everyone else, a large percentage of the consumer base, is happy
I'm not motivated enough to hackintosh a notebook and I don't want yet another Core 2.Lemme see. It seems you are protesting too much. You know exactly why your next computer will be a Mac again
Apple is absolutely no longer the company that delivers top quality and top performance computers. a 2.4 dual core with 2gb RAM for 1000Euro's lol you could easily buy a system with twice the power for "easily" half the money. Only thing good about the machine is the OS and a nice looking design...
Apple is fooling everybody giving them outdated hardware in so called updated machines. but hey atleast you have a machine that looks good
Apple has become one big joke as far as computers and pricing...they should just stick to ipads, ipods and iphones.
Apple is fooling everybody giving them outdated hardware in so called updated machines. but hey atleast you have a machine that looks good
Apple has become one big joke as far as computers and pricing...they should just stick to ipads, ipods and iphones.
I ordered a MacBook with 4GB of RAM on Saturday 15th and now three days later they have updated it!
Any views appreciated
Just checked my order online and Apple have cancelled my 2.26GHz MacBook and Replaced it with a 2.4Ghz New MacBook! For the same price.
Customer service at it's best!
Apple is absolutely no longer the company that delivers top quality and top performance computers. a 2.4 dual core with 2gb RAM for 1000Euro's lol you could easily buy a system with twice the power for "easily" half the money. Only thing good about the machine is the OS and a nice looking design...
Apple is fooling everybody giving them outdated hardware in so called updated machines. but hey atleast you have a machine that looks good
Find a Laptop with the performance of a Macbook which is rated for 10 hours of battery and has a build quality which is as good, and i will suck your ****.
Whenever there is any new Apple product release, hordes of whiners emerge from their dark, little, musty caves and do what they do best, whine!
The new white Macbook doesn't have USB 3, boohoohoo, I must have USB 3 or my life is not complete, even though I don't personally own any USB 3 devices!
The new white Macbook doesn't have Blu-ray, boohoohoo! Based on their past history as a company, I was totally expecting Apple to put Blu-ray in their cheapest laptop and now I am totally crushed!
The new white Macbook is only slightly cheaper than the MBP 13" now, boohoohoo, now I'm all confused and don't know which one to get!
The new white Macbook costs $100 more in my country, boohoohoo, because my country's currency has been sliding downhill for the entire year now! Why is Apple so mean? And why don't they release the exact machine that I have been waiting for with the exact specs that I demand at the exact price that I determine? Boohoohoo.
boohoohoo, i pay double the price for an outdated system but atleast i can brag about how it looks.
It doesn't make sense for students to buy this machine. The MB is $949 (save $50) in the education store while the low end MBP is $1099 (save $100). Add a 4GB kit to the MB and it is $1040 (Through Apple it is cheaper to upgrade at $90 than buying a separate kit for $100.)
On top of the RAM difference you also get the aluminum with lighter body, the SD, backlit keyboard, and firewire.
Anyone know if the displays are different?
On top of the RAM difference you also get the aluminum with lighter body, the SD, backlit keyboard, and firewire.
Anyone know if the displays are different?
None of which actually matters to me.
- It's always plugged in
- I rarely use an optical drive (like once every year or so)
- Looking like a business laptop is a plus
- 310M should be pretty much identical to the 320m except for having it's own RAM instead of sharing the main RAM. I don't know where you get 'considerably worse' from. It doesn't bother me either way since I'm a web designer/programmer, not a gamer.
For business users, it's got a next day on site warranty.
Anyhoo, the point was more that the MacBook is overpriced in general rather than to score point by point. There's plenty of spec points in favour of a Dell or an Acer including the major one, price.
Personally I think the price is s***, but the fact that it runs OS X means I'll go with Apple.
Though not too sure if this update is for me, I do want to update the 43 month old Macbook (2ghzC2D, 2gb, 250, GMA950) - but as it's working fine at the moment I could justify it. It might be a little low spec now, but it works fine for me.
That said if Lightroom 3 kills it, then I'll be spending
Though not too sure if this update is for me, I do want to update the 43 month old Macbook (2ghzC2D, 2gb, 250, GMA950) - but as it's working fine at the moment I could justify it. It might be a little low spec now, but it works fine for me.
That said if Lightroom 3 kills it, then I'll be spending
I wasn't arguing that the Vostro was a bad laptop, quite the opposite, and great, none of that matters to you, but it does to some people.
Looking like a business laptop is a plus for some, and not for others, but the unibody construction is better quality regardless.
The 310m is nowhere near the 320m, it gets 3500 points in 3D mark06, while the 320m gets 4700. Yes, it's just a synthetic benchmark, but when the score is almost 25% more, you can't deny that it is most likely considerably better.
You don't have to hate other laptops to like Macbooks, you just have to be able to understand that many people want the extra features that other laptops don't offer in one package, and that is how they justify the price premium.
If there were several examples of laptops which had everything that a Macbook did for less (OS X withstanding) then i would quite happily call Macbooks redundant, but that simply isn't the case.
BTW, i've been a life long Wintel user, incase anybody feels like calling me a fanboy for defending apple
"You are not alone"
When Apple released the first unibodies, for several hours on their site, the 2GHz version was stated as featuring the backlit keyboard. When I went to my local Apple Store in Southampton several months later, the shop assistants and those 'Genius' guys still didn't know that the basic version didn't have the backlit keys.
When Apple released the first unibodies, for several hours on their site, the 2GHz version was stated as featuring the backlit keyboard. When I went to my local Apple Store in Southampton several months later, the shop assistants and those 'Genius' guys still didn't know that the basic version didn't have the backlit keys.
a lot of you are complaining that the only difference now between the white and the base level mbp is the firewire and aluminum. But what about the SD card slot AND the illuminated keyboard ;]
What use is an SD[HC] slot? CF would be more useful, though with a more selective appeal.
That makes absolutely no sense. I like Apple products, except for the computers. I own an iPad, iPhone, 5 iPods, and my aluminum 2008 MacBook.
Love the iPad. Have a love/hate relationship with the iPhone because of AT&T's service, and I like my iPods.
It's only Macs I have an issue with.
Lemme see. It seems you are protesting too much. You know exactly why your next computer will be a Mac again
Just telling the truth.
False. Go over to newegg. Roughly half of their 200 notebooks ship with non-Intel GPUs. With the exception of the high end VIAO systems, every single one is less than a Mac. I'm looking at an Asus with a Core i7 (quad core!) 1.6GHz, 15.6 16x9 display, GeForce GTX 260 for $1549. In the sub-$1000 range you have systems with Radeon HD 5650s going for $750 and Core i5.
Theres even a couple of 14" systems with dedicated GPUs faster than the 320M.
Theres even a Lenovo sporting a quad core Core i7 with a GeForce GT 240M, 500GB HDD, and 4GB of RAM. For $899.
Theres even this one: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834114803 More power than the $2,200 MBP.
Theres an Asus 13.3" system with a Core i3 and GeForce 310M, so dual GPUs like Apple would have to run. Reviews put it at 7-8 hours of real world battery life. $100 less than the MacBook.
Yeah and those ultraportables tend to be smaller than anything Apple offers. In those cases, the CULV Core 2s are required.
A Core i5 isn't "vastly" superior to a Core 2 Duo? Have you seen the benchmarks? Theres enough of a performance difference to justify an upgrade. And with the prices Apple charges, you could buy multiple quad core Core i7 PCs for the same price as one dual core Core i5 Mac.
Prove it.
As I explained before, all of Apple's computers are "consumer" devices. "Professional" level systems from other manufacturers are so far out of Apple's league it would take them years to catch up at this point.
Not to mention the fact that Apple markets the dual core Core i7 MacBook "Pro" as a "pro" device, yet it doesn't even come close to offering the same speed as consumer level devices that cost less than half as much.
It's just stupid to believe the whole "pro" and "consumer" nonsense Apple tries to brainwash people with.
Yes. And, after two decades of using Windows, I can tell you that its a myth. And the reality is that OS X requires just as much user maintenance as Windows does.
Sorry, you're wrong http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logic_board It's an Apple term, and it makes Apple sound stupid and elitist when they try to use that term instead of motherboard.
Got any links?
10 people on youtube doesn't represent the millions who now own a Mac
And the actual size of that consumer base is insignificant when compared to the size of say HP's annual sales
Build quality? Go over to the MacBook forum here at this forum and read all the threads about how the screen cracks at the hinges. Build quality my ass. Thats why Apple twice replaced my plastic MacBook. Their build quality is junk.
Battery life? When, in the real world, are you going to actually need more than 3 or so hours? I've had 10 hour battery for a couple of years now on a PC and I've never even used half of that.
Give me a system that actually performs like a modern system should, not like something that was mid-range 4 years ago when the Core 2 Duos first came out.
Running cooler is a lie. I've already gone over this. My MacBook with a 25w TDP Core 2 Duo 2GHz runs, on average, 25c hotter than my PC with a 35w TDP Core 2 Duo 2GHz. The aluminum case also gets hot to the touch under load. While the PC's plastic case barely gets warm.
And OS X still has a few more revisions to go before it catches up to Windows 7 as it is today.
Yeah, someone else at this forum tried to use that before. Give me some actual production music please. Also, not from a band that hasn't had a hit since before Mac OS got pre-emptive multi-tasking half a decade after Windows did.
BTW, have you actually read what Oasis did? What they did with Garageband could have been done in Mac OS X, Linux, or Windows using Audacity
HUGE negative. Slot loading optical drives mean non-user replaceable drives. Which means limited stock, which means a freaking DVD writer costs more to replace than a combo BD-ROM/DVD-RW does.
You want to see what $700 gets you in the PC world? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834115763 $749.99. Core i5 2.26GHz, 17.3" display, 4GB, 500GB HDD, ATI Radeon 5650. Look what $899 gets me. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834114803 Core i7 1.6GHz quad core, 4GB RAM, 500GB HDD, GeForce GT 330M.
Why should I buy a MacBook instead of that?
Not put together as well? Hmm, you mean that awesome build quality of the MacBook that causes the display case to crack around the hinges?
Fire hazard. I don't want it.
Because of the awesome construction? https://forums.macrumors.com/posts/9452544/
Again, negative. Not user upgradeable. Not user replaceable. Replacement requires full system surgery. Replacement DVD writer costs more than standard BD-ROM/DVD-RW combo drive.
Apple's screens use the same part numbers and manufacturers as PCs.
As I type this on Snow Leopard, I'd rather have Windows 7.
3DMark doesn't mean anything. A number of things can change your score. Even running the benchmark twice in a row will change your score. Using a different driver version can change your score. Using one driver versus another can alter your score by a 1,000 points easily. Real world performance matters a lot more.
What extra features? A spiffy touchpad and a fire hazard of a power connector? MacBooks and MacBook Pros have had features removed over the years (Firewire, dual audio jacks, ExpressCard) while PC notebooks continue to have features added, such as HDMI being standard for years now, eSATA, the list goes on. Back in 2003, eMachines included a multi-card reader as standard on their notebooks. Apple just FINALLY added an SD card slot in 2009. It took them 6 years to half ass a feature that has been standard on PCs for more than half a decade.
I've posted several links in this post to notebooks that offer more power for significantly less money than Macs. While the iPhone, iPad, and iPod touch are all best in class devices (minus AT&T's service), Apple's computers are no longer the tools they once were. Now they're nothing more than expensive fashion accessories that are a little better at syncing with your iDevices than Windows systems, in large part to Apple not fully supporting iTunes syncing capabilities in Windows.
My HG21, sadly, offers only USB.
Many FireWire devices have chaining ports on them, so only having one isn't so big a deal.
@MOSX
"Got any links?
10 people on youtube doesn't represent the millions who now own a Mac"
You really want me to post links for every iLife youtube video? I said no offense for this before, but you are absolutely out of your mind. It's nice to see that there are patient people who are taking you seriously, much respect to the Macrumors community. But you're so close-minded and stubborn about your OPINIONS. Who are you so angry at? How are you different than a troll?Why are you even using a Mac if you're so against everything that Apple has done? As I'm sure you will rage about anything that doesn't follow your logic, the best thing I can do is copy this line:
"By the way, what have you done that's so great? Do you create anything, or just criticize others work and belittle their motivations?"
"Got any links?
10 people on youtube doesn't represent the millions who now own a Mac"
You really want me to post links for every iLife youtube video? I said no offense for this before, but you are absolutely out of your mind. It's nice to see that there are patient people who are taking you seriously, much respect to the Macrumors community. But you're so close-minded and stubborn about your OPINIONS. Who are you so angry at? How are you different than a troll?Why are you even using a Mac if you're so against everything that Apple has done? As I'm sure you will rage about anything that doesn't follow your logic, the best thing I can do is copy this line:
"By the way, what have you done that's so great? Do you create anything, or just criticize others work and belittle their motivations?"