macOS 10.14 Mojave Drops Support for Many Older Machines

[geromi912]

You are right. On windows/Linux the machines are not underpowered. But they don't run MacOS. This is the problem. Especially for us that we have bought software for MacOS...

My problem is what's next if we cannot run Mojave. Xcode will be outdated, safari will be outdated etc... I am trying to find what will replace my old mac mini 2011 and I cannot find anything.

Apparently Xcode will still run on high Sierra? And your best bet is a tower Mac Pro with upgraded gpu, since that should be supported for longer as long as you put in a recent gpu. Or wait for the new Mac Pro. Mini is dead most likely.

 

[vasim]

Apparently Xcode will still run on high Sierra? And your best bet is a tower Mac Pro with upgraded gpu, since that should be supported for longer as long as you put in a recent gpu. Or wait for the new Mac Pro. Mini is dead most likely.

haha, the new mac pro will cost 5.000!!! I will stay an my Macbook Air which has alot more upgrades .. Unfortunately my mac mini will go to my daughter to learn computing..

 

[MrUNIMOG]

You are right. On windows/Linux the machines are not underpowered. But they don't run MacOS. This is the problem. Especially for us that we have bought software for MacOS...

My problem is what's next if we cannot run Mojave. Xcode will be outdated, safari will be outdated etc... I am trying to find what will replace my old mac mini 2011 and I cannot find anything.

Safari will be outdated in over 2 years. Xcode and the other Pro Apps I don't know, but I suspect no less than another year.

 

[geromi912]

Safari will be outdated in over 2 years. Xcode and the other Pro Apps I don't know, but I suspect no less than another year.

At least they still support the only good Apple desktop lol (Mac Pro 5,1)

 

[TailsToo]

I know, right? 😛

This wouldn't be nearly as big an issue if Apple actually made computers that were still upgradable. The post-2012 Apple has everything soldered, screwed and secured with nary an upgrade possible unless you want to void your warranty. My trust ol' 2010 MBP has allowed me to upgrade the RAM and HD twice over in the 8 years I've had it. (Plus the optical drive and full set of ports which continue to come in handy.)

I love the Apple ecosystem, but I've got some decisions to make in the next few years. Do I switch to Linux? Do I buy one of Apple's current offerings? Do I switch to Windows?

The ironic thing is, if Apple had continued to make laptops with standard ports and perhaps even optical drives, I would have bought a new one three years ago. I'm holding on to my 2010 model because it's one of the last that aligns with my computing philosophy.

I'm in the exact same boat. My 2011 MBP is about at it's end, but Apple makes nothing that makes sense to buy right now. A very flawed and expensive MBP, and underpowered Air, and a impractically think MacBook.

I bought my machine with 4GB of RAM and a 500GB 5400RPM Drive. I now have 8GB and a 1 TB SSD. To ensure a new Mac will last, I would have to spend around $3k to future proof a MBP 15", and that's with the ticking time bomb of a keyboard.

I admit, I'm tempted to buy a used Mid 2012 MPB to get me buy the next year or two in the hopes that Apple can figure out who they are, and what their customers want.

 

[geromi912]

I'm in the exact same boat. My 2011 MBP is about at it's end, but Apple makes nothing that makes sense to buy right now. A very flawed and expensive MBP, and underpowered Air, and a impractically think MacBook.

I bought my machine with 4GB of RAM and a 500GB 5400RPM Drive. I now have 8GB and a 1 TB SSD. To ensure a new Mac will last, I would have to spend around $3k to future proof a MBP 15", and that's with the ticking time bomb of a keyboard.

I admit, I'm tempted to buy a used Mid 2012 MPB to get me buy the next year or two in the hopes that Apple can figure out who they are, and what their customers want.

Buying a 6 year old laptop? Battery life gonna be trash lmao

 

[alexgowers]

I'm hoping my late 2013 MacBook Pro will be supported for a long time as it was a leap in performance, retina and other things that should protect it from being left out. Newer machines are barely any faster in most tasks too. Here's me crossing fingers I got a keeper.

 

[Macyourdayy]

My 2011 MBP which runs High Sierra just as fast as most newer macs because I upgraded to an SSD. I had a feeling they were going to drop support after these machines were moved to vintage status earlier. The logic board would probably blow up again with 10.14. We need those 2018 MBPs anytime now.

Yeah, because that wasn't a problem with the last revisions. Who needs ports anyway? They just mess up the lines of the device. And only the one SSD? Not 4TB raid 0?
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Buying a 6 year old laptop? Battery life gonna be trash lmao

You do realise those batteries can be replaced no? So, you're buying the new disposable machines then are you? How many in a packet?
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I'm in the exact same boat. My 2011 MBP is about at it's end, but Apple makes nothing that makes sense to buy right now. A very flawed and expensive MBP, and underpowered Air, and a impractically think MacBook.

I bought my machine with 4GB of RAM and a 500GB 5400RPM Drive. I now have 8GB and a 1 TB SSD. To ensure a new Mac will last, I would have to spend around $3k to future proof a MBP 15", and that's with the ticking time bomb of a keyboard.

I admit, I'm tempted to buy a used Mid 2012 MPB to get me buy the next year or two in the hopes that Apple can figure out who they are, and what their customers want.

Difficult choices. If you can cope with the fairly ordinary display on the 2012 15"s, then it should be a fairly cheap option seeing you can move your new parts over, never mind the option of raiding SSDs. Why didn't you get 16GB of ram though? My late 2011 17" is great with 16GB, although I just bought a 2.8GHz dual graphics 2015 from the refurb store when they reappeared recently as the hardware directions they've chosen over the last few years don't seem promising.

 

[BaltimoreMediaBlog]

What is good metal supported GPU for MacPro 5,1?

I think this is a good list. Although later Nvidia GPUs are not mentioned, so I assume that means if Nvidia produces a driver or not.

• Intel HD 5000- and 6000-series GPUs (Haswell and Broadwell integrated GPUs, used in 2013-2015).

• Nvidia GeForce 600- and 700-series GPUs ( these were common in 2012 and 2013-era Macs).

• AMD Radeon 5000-, 6000-, R9 200, and R9 300-series GPUs (common in 2010-2011-era and 2014-2015-era Macs).

• AMD FirePro D300, D500, and D700 GPUs (2013 Mac Pro).

I assume that also means the Radeon 7950, although it's not specifically mentioned.

 

[MrUNIMOG]

I think this is a good list. Although later Nvidia GPUs are not mentioned, so I assume that means if Nvidia produces a driver or not.

• Intel HD 5000- and 6000-series GPUs (Haswell and Broadwell integrated GPUs, used in 2013-2015).

• Nvidia GeForce 600- and 700-series GPUs ( these were common in 2012 and 2013-era Macs).

• AMD Radeon 5000-, 6000-, R9 200, and R9 300-series GPUs (common in 2010-2011-era and 2014-2015-era Macs).

• AMD FirePro D300, D500, and D700 GPUs (2013 Mac Pro).

I assume that also means the Radeon 7950, although it's not specifically mentioned.

I'm pretty sure Metal only supports AMD GCN chips, so Radeon 5000 or 6000 series won't work. That's why 2010/2011 Macs aren't supported by either Metal or Mojave.

Radeon 7590 is GCN though and should work with Metal.

 

[BaltimoreMediaBlog]

I'm pretty sure Metal only supports AMD GCN chips, so Radeon 5000 or 6000 series won't work. That's why 2010/2011 Macs aren't supported by either Metal or Mojave.

Radeon 7590 is GCN though and should work with Metal.

I took that list from another website, but I think you are correct, AMD Radeon 7000 or better seems to be the limit. None of the grey Apple Mac Pro's sold shipped with Metal capable cards, but the 7950 was available as an option. So, I think I think I might have one of the oldest Macs to run Mohave being 2009 Nehalem.

Now if only I could figure out how to get Continuity and Handoff to work. 😀

 

[MrUNIMOG]

I took that list from another website, but I think you are correct, AMD Radeon 7000 or better seems to be the limit. None of the grey Apple Mac Pro's sold shipped with Metal capable cards, but the 7950 was available as an option. So, I think I think I might have one of the oldest Macs to run Mohave being 2009 Nehalem.

Now if only I could figure out how to get Continuity and Handoff to work. 😀

Continuity and Handoff might in theory be possible with a newer Bluetooth 4.0 dongle. Nothing officially supported though, probably won't work that well.

Also not every Radeon 7000 series GPU is GCN, the lower end ones were still TeraScale. The 7950 though is GCN and should support Metal.

 

[BaltimoreMediaBlog]

Continuity and Handoff might in theory be possible with a newer Bluetooth 4.0 dongle. Nothing officially supported though, probably won't work that well.

Also not every Radeon 7000 series GPU is GCN, the lower end ones were still TeraScale. The 7950 though is GCN and should support Metal.

True, AMD has officially labeled Radeon 7600 and lower as legacy products as they are not GCN as well as the 8400 and lower, but of course none of these were ever really released for the Mac so officially that means the 7950 is the minimum, although I'm pretty sure some 7800 series are working on Macs. 😀

 

[nathansz]

Buying a 6 year old laptop? Battery life gonna be trash lmao

I just bought a used 2012 MacBook Pro.

Turns out it was manufactured in April 2015 so it's really only three years old and was lightly used at that.
The battery has 346 cycles and charges to 85% original capacity.

 

[31 Flavas]

Obviously, but at least they offer the option instead of arbitrarily deciding when a computer should go to the dump.

It isn’t abritrary, though. The Mojave UI is apparently written to use Metal and so Mojave depends Metal support. Others have pointed out the lines have been drawn and its at GPU support of Metal.

That said, High Sierra and Sierra will still receive safari and security updates.

 

[ThunderSkunk]

Its interesting that Apple wants the current version of iOS installed on every device possible, to the extent that they won't even let you downgrade back to a better working version if need be, and boasts about iOS's adoption rate versus that of Android. When you mention on here that you're not going to upgrade, you get responses insisting that you must, because a phone or iPad not updated is a huge security & malware risk, and all the familiar hand-wringing.

...but then on the Mac, its completely the opposite.

 

[MrUNIMOG]

Its interesting that Apple wants the current version of iOS installed on every device possible, to the extent that they won't even let you downgrade back to a better working version if need be, and boasts about iOS's adoption rate versus that of Android. When you mention on here that you're not going to upgrade, you get responses insisting that you must, because a phone or iPad not updated is a huge security & malware risk.

...but then on the Mac, its completely the opposite.

That isn't true at all. Except that you have the freedom of installing older versions on the Mac, which is a good thing, since Macs have different use cases.

 

[geromi912]

I just bought a used 2012 MacBook Pro.

Turns out it was manufactured in April 2015 so it's really only three years old and was lightly used at that.
The battery has 346 cycles and charges to 85% original capacity.

That’s kind bad tbh, my iPhone 6 has 1,300 cycles (yes, not joking, ibackupbot confirms) and charges to 87%
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True, AMD has officially labeled Radeon 7600 and lower as legacy products as they are not GCN as well as the 8400 and lower, but of course none of these were ever really released for the Mac so officially that means the 7950 is the minimum, although I'm pretty sure some 7800 series are working on Macs. 😀

I’m sure the 7770 and 7870 work? I mean, these are basically the D300 and D500 in the current, state-of-the-art, top-of-the-line Mac Pro.

 

[MrUNIMOG]

That’s kind bad tbh, my iPhone 6 has 1,300 cycles (yes, not joking, ibackupbot confirms) and charges to 87%
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I’m sure the 7770 and 7870 work? I mean, these are basically the D300 and D500 in the current, state-of-the-art, top-of-the-line Mac Pro.

Then you either had incredible luck with your battery or were extremely gentle with it. Probably both. iPhone batteries are made to retain 80 % charge capacity after 500 cycles, and with normal use it usually ends up being that.

As for the GPUs, if those indeed have the same chips as the D300 and D500, they're GCN so they should work.

 

[gnasher729]

How about using an External drive. Like normal people. Your internal drive should not be treated as a backup drive.

You are quite insulting there, which shows you are not thinking anywhere near hard enough before you start typing. It's a laptop. Normal people don't want to carry a laptop with an external drive. But plenty of people want a huge hard drive without paying a fortune. A 2 TB drive with a few GB of SSD cache fits nicely into a 2011 MacBook and costs just over £100. How much is 2 TB on a brand new MacBook?

 

[Macyourdayy]

?

There is no macOS & iOS integration going on, the only thing they announced was developer ability to port iOS apps into macOS apps coming in 2019. ...If you saw the keynote, he said macOS and iOS will continue to be separate entities.

You wonder what people hear, never mind that porting iOS apps practically refers to porting apps built for iPads. An iPhone app ported to Mac is even more ridiculous than running it on a pad.
Yes, I know Apple ported phone apps that weren't even on the pad, but they look like ipad versions, if they'd ever bothered in the first place.

This really, really, really sucks for me. I use a lot of storage, and I'm completely priced out of buying any Mac laptop with an equivalent amount of storage. A machine with 1TB would cost close to $3000 Canadian.

I wish they'd make them a couple of mm thicker to allow for M.2 SSDs.

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How about using an External drive. Like normal people. Your internal drive should not be treated as a backup drive.

What? How is the extremely high cost of Apple compatible SSDs unclear to you? I could RAID 4TB of SSDs in my 2011 MBP for about $1100. A maximum of 2TB in a current MBP is $5300 in our refurb store (you know, the ones with the soldered on "drives") and they're barely 30% faster than the 2011 i7 and that's before thermal throttling kicks in. The 2011 can continue to get drive upgrades as well.
Using an external drive is feasible at a desk, but then you might as well have a desktop, which is considerably less portable.
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So unfortunate. The mid 2011 iMac probably is the last really "upgradable" iMac. I upgraded the internal drive to an SSD, changed the AirPort card to get 80211ac and Bluetooth LE. This iMac still runs so well. I don't want to buy another Mac yet, I'll just wait until this one dies or something… LOL

I believe most iMacs are still upgradeable to some extent (drives and cpu), so long as you've got one with a fusion drive. The 2011 is a great machine though, especially with the i7, but there's no usb3 upgrade option like with 2011 17" mbp. You could even run an eGPU off the thunderbolt port and swap out the cd drive for more SSD options.

 

[GregoryN]

RIP my 2012 Mac Pro...

 

[old-wiz]

Hmm... I still have a 2008 iMac with a nice screen and a DVD drive. It runs fine for what I use it for - Internet stuff. It has been on 24/7 for close to 10 years and never had a hardware problem. And systems that are currently running will still run - it is not like all of a sudden they will croak and disintegrate. They will still run what you have been doing for how many years.

 

[MisterAndrew]

RIP my 2012 Mac Pro...

It’s supported with a Metal-capable GPU (Nvidia Kepler and AMD GCN 1 & up).

 

[Jacoblee23]

If I were to buy a 11" 2014 or 2015 MacBook Air how long should I expect to have software support for it until it gets cut off?