Mark Gurman: Apple Exploring iPads With Larger Displays

[ajfahey]

My 12.9” iPad Pro is just a tad big for my current use case. 11.0 would be a bit small. Anything over 13” would require a different use case profile. I am open to seeing one evolve but, right now, I can’t see how it would work successfully.

 

[Alan Wynn]

Sounds like a personal problem because you are unwilling to take the time to research and defend your position.
With 16GB of Ram, a cellular connection, 2TB of storage, magic keyboard and a pencil, yes, the iPad is $2700

Actually, it is $2,748, and with AppleCare it is ~$2,900.

 

[Premium1]

The iPad Pro may not be for everyone…but sales don’t lie. People are buying iPads.

Never said they aren't selling, but still doesn't change the fact that the OS is the bottle neck for devices, doesn't even have to be the pro ones.

 

[cupcakes2000]

Here is a point that you will almost certainly ignore

As is frequently the case in threads like this! Well said.

 

[falainber]

Yes it can. The old 12.9” was pretty close to a 15“ with the smaller bezels, and it was fine handheld.

Nope. A 15” - 17“ laptop would be much bigger, heavier, have a keyboard and trackpad that just add weight and are unneeded for my primary application.

Are you going to ask your wife to hold it to be used hand-held? Because you definitely can't hold and use such a heavy device and use it at the same time.

 

[Alan Wynn]

And I also work with lots of creative pros who dont prefer this situation.

One of two things is true: Most (or even a large enough percentage to make it worth addressing that market segment) iPad users (and/or potential users), agree with you, Apple knows this, but has refused to address this market for some unfathomable reason. Or, Apple’s frequent surveys and user testing say people like what they offer and want improvements on the margin without changing the fundamental character of the product.

I have my thoughts which it is.

 

[cupcakes2000]

Are you going to ask your wife to hold it to be used hand-held? Because you definitely can't hold and use such a heavy device and use it at the same time.

Such an amount of weird and strange assumptions in one post.

 

[AlexESP]

The great idea of some MacRumors members, using a desktop OS in a touch-based device, has been/it’s being tried in the market, and it has resulted in a huge fiasco. And they still can’t figure out why Apple doesn’t do it. I could understand this debate in 2011, but today?

 

[Alan Wynn]

there is no market for a high-end iPad as long as it is gimped with iPad OS. makes it a giant iPhone toy

Yup, you must be right. Too bad all those people buying them do not understand they are wrong. You should go and tell them.

 

[One2Grift]

Apple still makes as much or more selling iPads (all versions) as they do selling all macOS systems. A small number of tech reviewers and people on sites like this want something different, but I am pretty sure that the vast majority of iPad owners prefer what they have.

I agree with your overall point but one point of clarity: Mac revenue has been larger than iPad revenue for, I believe, at least the last 3 quarters. Unit shipments (number of the devices shipped) sees iPad as the larger number. However, profit may be bigger on Mac or iPad (I don't know the GP for each sector).

Mac saw something that I think is very unique(??) for a mature product, they saw increased sales in the quarter after the holiday quarter. 8.68 Billion for the holiday quarter, 9.1 Billion for the last quarter (Jan-March). iPad saw a .7 Billion drop (which is normal to see post holiday sales decrease). Hard to say if that's a trend or a unique occurrence given Covid variables.

 

[Alan Wynn]

Are you going to ask your wife to hold it to be used hand-held? Because you definitely can't hold and use such a heavy device and use it at the same time.

I do not have a wife, and I am perfectly capable of using an iPad that size handheld for those things when I would need to do so, but like most of what I do on my iPad, I usually use it on my lap and or sitting on a surface.

 

[Alan Wynn]

Sorry, but it seems like there is. A lot… in fact, much much more than Windows tablets.

Do not argue facts. That is not allowed. 🙃

 

[Alan Wynn]

I'd love to see an Apple coffee table sized display like a Surface (More than likely it'd be a coffee table with a dock mirrored to a giant LCD for the table top.) It'd be a great way to display and "interact" with photos etc or virtual game board arcades.

It would be fun, but it would also cost about $8,000 like that Surface and they would sell about as many (almost none). 🙂

I always laugh when I see CBS TV shows that show a giant touch screen computer and they just fling/slide a photo or file to another screen while discussing a case.

Yup. Hawaii 50 does that all the time and it makes me laugh.

 

[Alan Wynn]

I agree with your overall point but one point of clarity: Mac revenue has been larger than iPad revenue for, I believe, at least the last 3 quarters. Unit shipments (number of the devices shipped) sees iPad as the larger number. However, profit may be bigger on Mac or iPad (I don't know the GP for each sector).

They are quite close and you are correct that since Covid and the Apple Silicon Macintosh systems have been released, the Mac side is up. Overall for the last few years that has not been true.

Mac saw something that I think is very unique(??) for a mature product, they saw increased sales in the quarter after the holiday quarter. 8.68 Billion for the holiday quarter, 9.1 Billion for the last quarter (Jan-March). iPad saw a .7 Billion drop (which is normal to see post holiday sales decrease). Hard to say if that's a trend or a unique occurrence given Covid variables.

I think it will be interesting to see as they add more Apple Silicon systems to their line up, there will be a replacement cycle and maybe a market share increase for the new machines.

 

[One2Grift]

As to your first comment, Apple should be willing to let it do that, and that's exactly my point. The particular frustration points are widely discussed here, and they are fixable.

As to your second comment, I have the iPad Pro with the Apple Smart Keyboard. My MacBook Pro is just about the same size. I open my iPad just like my MacBook Pro, I use a touchpad the same way I do on the MacBook Pro, and many of the apps are similar in overall appearance to those on my MacBook Pro. I don't really think it's that odd or unexpected that I would occasionally reach for the screen of my MacBook Pro, since that's a normal behavior on my iPad Pro.

Apple doesn't need to be willing to to anything of the sort. Apple is going to decide its offerings based on user adoption that produces positive market viability and positive general company performance.
Why would they risk two individual well performing lines (two lines that both show high customer/user favorability)?
If at one time in the future Apple sees converging the two will produce adoption of Mac users + iPad Users + Growth? They then may do it. At the moment it would be a reckless move to risk two separate lines and risk alienating sections of both sectors for an, at best, uncertain market viability.

 

[MacMikePro]

M1 iPad Pro and iPadOS 15 proves that Apple is intentionally limiting iPadOS's power.

It doesn't "prove" anything, the M1 is an A14X, it's literally the chip the next iPad was always gonna get no matter what, they just simply gave it a different name. I do agree that iPadOS 15 disappointed me, but it still doesn't make any sense putting macOS on the iPad.

 

[gene731]

I am all for this. I would love an iPad with a larger display. 14 - 16in I'm all in, I use mine daily for drawing so the bigger the better.

I'm embarrassed to admit that I sometimes try to dismiss pop-ups and dialogs with my finger.

Why? I have had Macs for 15+ years and iPhones since 3GS and one iPad. The ipad
Was iPad 3 and I’ll fire it up from time to time but just not for me. I can say this though never once have I reached for the screen on either of my laptops or desktops I have had over time to get rid of a pop up. That’s what the mouse and or trackpad is for

 

[gene731]

How would you know people won't like to have a Mac touchscreen display if it doesn't exist yet?

Because the poster lives in Realville and knows Apple has no plans for a touchscreen Mac in the foreseeable future. Why would anyone want a touchscreen Mac? To look at fingerprints all day. You have a mouse or trackpad to click on anything your heart desires.

 

[One2Grift]

They are quite close and you are correct that since Covid and the Apple Silicon Macintosh systems have been released, the Mac side is up. Overall for the last few years that has not been true.

I think it will be interesting to see as they add more Apple Silicon systems to their line up, there will be a replacement cycle and maybe a market share increase for the new machines.

Definitely yes and yes.
They are both close in revenue. iPad saw higher holiday Quarterly Year over Year growth than Mac (not by a big amount though). But that increase in the post holiday quarter sales for Mac is definitely interesting. M1 is a stark improvement but does that translate to something for existing Mac base or is it driving new Mac user buyers (of which I am one).

One other a bit off topic items I found interesting. PC/Mac sales in general and why Microsoft probably included Amazon(Android) apps in Windows 11. Microsoft can't like seeing what inexpensive Google Chrome Books are doing to its market share (Chrome Up, Apple up/down but growth at market perform rate, Microsoft share simply down). IMHO adoption away from Microsoft is good for Mac if the price points continue to come down just a bit.


2020 Q1 Q2 Q3 Q4
Windows. 87.5%. 81.7%. 78.9%. 76.7%
ChromeOS 3%. 10.0%. 11.5% 14.4%
MacOS. 8%. 7.6%. 8.4%. 7.7%

 

[gene731]

I skimmed all that and don't know what point you're trying to make. Twenty years ago, it was "hurr durr, Apple is so small and unsuccesful, they don't know what they're doing". Now it's "Apple is so large and successful, they've lost sight of what they're doing". OK.

The iPad Pro doesn't cost $2700. I imagine the median sold iPad Pro is around $1100, maybe less. I'm not even sure how you would configure it to $2700, but I assure you almost nobody does. Yes, if they really need as much internal storage as possible (which, probably not), they might be spending a ton more.

There may be some people arguing "it does what I need", but I don't see that a lot in this thread. I also don't see Tim or Craig making that argument. If they did, why would they keep doing significant changes? They just introduced a major UI change to multitasking three weeks ago! You think that's Apple saying "it's already perfect! Wrap it up, we're done"?

I just spec’d one out. Top of the line iPad Pro 12.9 with top everything you can get including AppleCare. It came to 2538.00 so where I live at its 10% tax so add another 253.80 for taxes and I’m almost at $2800 so it can be done.

 

[Analog Kid]

Weren’t the first Surface demos basically restaurant tables?

 

[I7guy]

Never said they aren't selling, but still doesn't change the fact that the OS is the bottle neck for devices, doesn't even have to be the pro ones.

Well yes. Different strokes for different folks. A bottleneck to you may not be one to someone else.

 

[cupcakes2000]

Would love a larger iPad. 17” would be my choice I reckon. Bigger would be cool! Such a great machine- definitely the future of computing

 

[cardfan]

Would love a larger iPad. 17” would be my choice I reckon. Bigger would be cool! Such a great machine- definitely the future of computing

Trying to imagine one in a 4:3 ratio. If you think the 12.9 is like carrying a cookie sheet. Lol.

Apple may as well create a new category. The monitor. What a concept. It can double as an iPad swiveling it down on desktop like surface studio. The 24” iPad display. Attach a Mac mini with it.

 

[cupcakes2000]

Trying to imagine one in a 4:3 ratio. If you think the 12.9 is like carrying a cookie sheet. Lol.

Apple may as well create a new category. The monitor. What a concept. It can double as an iPad swiveling it down on desktop like surface studio. The 24” iPad display. Attach a Mac mini with it.

Except it’s not just a display is it. It’s an iPad. Nothing says you have to carry it around with you. Once again, it depends what you want to do with it surely. Smaller iPads would still exist.