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Microsoft Says 'Disappointment' of New MacBook Pro Has More People Switching to Surface Than Ever Before

I bought a Surface Book recently and I returned it after 3 days.
  1. The screen has great specs on paper but the calibration was really bad. It was bluish compared to most of my other IPS monitors at home (calibrated or not). I didn't have the chance to calibrate it. Also the panel had this ghosting issue that was really annoying when scrolling text. See this slow motion video when scrolling.
  2. Windows is not ready for hi DPI displays. Even mainstream software such as Steam or Photoshop have issues with scaling.
  3. The pen had decent tracking for quick sketching but I had many issues. See this video and this video. Also it was impossible for me to handwrite.
  4. The tablet experience was less than mediocre compared to iOS or Android. The app ecosystem is very limited and the UI is terrible. As an example you have to actually open Windows settings to be able to adjust brightness properly (auto brightness is not an option).
  5. When detaching the screen from the base I got less than 2 hours of battery if I was using anything besides Edge with screen at about 30% of brightness.
  6. I got some frequent graphics glitches when waking up the device from hibernation.
  7. The headphones jack is in a really awkward place
  8. The trackpad had a nice surface, but it was imprecise on small movements
On the positive side the build quality and design were really good. The keyboard is simply the best chiclet one I have ever used.
 
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furi0usbee said:
Windows 10 is pretty nice. On a clean install, I could live with it.
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Sometimes I think that MS only needs to make Windows UI look good, the new wallpapers are a good start, work on a cleaner file explorer, reduce the stupid amount of alerts and confirmations, restarts due to constant updates and an attractive start menu and bar, good apps will do the rest. Problems with Registry, Win32 exceptions, DLL hells, spyware, viruses etc is something that still exists, but I can´t deny that I haven´t had to install an antivirus on any of my two windows machines for the past years, since the Apple "just works" no longer exists the bar is lower.
 
c0ppo said:
I won't purchase a MBP with touchbar ever again. And if apple doesn't release the 15 without TB, well, I will stick to my 2014 MBP as long as possible :)
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That's a dangerous game to play! That's how I ended up still having my 2007 MBP 3,1 in service. I upgraded with a new, higher-capacity-than-original battery, new power adapter (the old one got yanked out by a dog--screwed up the adapter but saved the laptop thanks to magsafe), maxed out the ram, and added a 1TB ssd. "Just one more revision..."
 
I keep hearing blame thrown at Tim Cook over and over...but how about Jony Ive? I think he wields quite a bit of power, and I think a lot of what we are seeing is coming from his design aesthetic and unwillingness to compromise. There is good in that...but I think right now we are seeing what happens, when it goes wrong and you lose total sight of your customers, needs/wants.
 
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ok, so where are all the people that said that this MBP model is the best thing ever ?
If this is correct(and not just M$ propaganda) then its a very sad day... I hope next gen of this hardware (specifically 15 inch) will learn from current mistakes. Add 1 USB-A port, more RAM, remove the touchbar and I`ll buy it (for a reasonable price, under 2k). But damage might of been already done and Apple might of lost some core audience with this move, which might drop the existing line sales and they will just not spend anymore time and money on it... I really hope this is not the last of MBPs :(
 
I wonder what happens in 6 months when those switchers want to switch back. Not that all will, but in my deeply unscientific observation it will be a majority
 
When Microsoft/Intel duopoly reigned supreme there was no innovation for almost a decade. I would hate to see Microsoft having the level of market share again, but Apple seems to be handing it to them.
No macmini update in 3 years.
No Mac pro update in 3 years.
New macbook pro's overpriced and buggy.
Monitors discontinued.
Wifi routers discontinued.
iOS slow progress.
MacOS slow progress.
AppleTV a missed opportunity.
Apple Watch, actually ok.
iCloud storage stuck at 5gb.
 
Saw the new 13" & 15" MBPs for the very first time last Thursday in Space Grey display models at an "authorised reseller" for Apple. I didn't get any wow factor from my first impressions, I have to say.:(

One "positive" thing I did take away from my viewing was I would definitely choose the 15" screen. Love the compactness of the 13", but would prefer that extra couple of inches screen comfort, so to speak.
 
The new surface book is over $3000 here in Canada. The cheaper one is the last generation from what I can tell. I have seen the surface pro 4 but I haven't been too interested due to its bulk. If you are going to use it as a laptop because its not great as a tablet, then why not just buy a laptop or a convertible like the x360
 
Back in Steve Jobs' day, Apple didn't listen to its customers; but at the same time, Apple was pushing the boundaries, and was truly innovative. I understand that Jobs' felt that Apple was ahead of the market and the customer back then. But as the product category matures, it's important for a company to talk to its customers-- it's easier to drive old customers away than to acquire new ones. Apple never acquired the skill of listening, and the last laptop iteration shows that.
 
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I have switched from OS X -> Win10 (whole household). I recently bought a regular MacBook (non-Pro) thinking that it would be helpful for my occasional x-platform development of software to iOS. I just need to occasionally fire off XCode and make builds, etc. At least I will at some point. BestBuy had a good deal on them during 'Black Friday' so I pulled the trigger.

Going back to OS X was nice in many ways - it is a much 'smoother' OS when it comes to visual animations, etc. Having the Terminal be a full Unix shell is always nice though with Win10 you can now install the Ubuntu subsystem which works for me. But other than that? I don't really miss OS X much at all. I still find it quirky, I think Finder is awful, and I get BeachBalls on the OS quite a bit still. Because of the lack of keyboard shortcuts throughout the OS I find Win10 better suited for me. Window management is still inferior to Windows.

I've had to force shut the machine down once or twice. And because of my familiarity with Win10 on my SurfaceBook, I have tried to touch the screen more than once to do something. I am actually amazed at how natural touching the screen has become!

I like the Macbook, and I was a little afraid that I would miss OS X so much I'd scream, "what have I done?" in going back to Win10. But I didn't, and I won't.

Macbook is much nicer built than SurfaceBook btw. SurfaceBook feels like something the Russians would have built in comparison to the svelte Macbook. Then again, I don't have port management issues, nor do I have finger pains after using the SB keyboard...
 
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I was also a die hard mac user for many years. But when it was time for me to upgrade my 2008 Mac Pro, and I saw the new 2013 MP), I decided to build my own PC. I use Windows 10 Pro and haven't had a single issue since.

Now that it is time to upgrade my wife's MBP, we decided that the new MBP appliance line is not for us. She has been using her current mid-2009 MBP since they first became available. The ability to upgrade the RAM and storage is the only reason that it has lasted this long.

As her computer use case is more of transportable vs portable (ie size and weight are not a concern), we decided to get a Dell Precision 7510. With a UHD display, the ability to upgrade to 64GB of RAM, a PCIE x4 M.2, and room for a 2.5" SATA SSD storage drive, this computer should last for the next 6-7 years.

I still think that iPhone leads in the phone market, I am just not enamored with Apple's move toward computing appliances and planned obsolescence.
 
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cwwilson said:
If this doesn't tell you we need touchscreen Macs now more than ever I don't know what to say.

Yes, touch does not work well on a computer OS but people are convinced that touch is the be-all-end-all and if your computer doesn't have it then it sucks.
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Touch works very well on a laptop as a secondary input. Use it only when needed, like for quickly swiping a notification off the screen without moving the mouse. Or zooming/panning on a photo with more precision than a trackpad. Certainly more useful and more natural than the TouchBar.
 
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Well I don't trust anything anybody from any company says.

So what I do is I consider my money and what I can get. The surface book for me is a way better value.
That hack job they call touch strip is simply laughable lol

Extremely idiotic - when on the opposite end I have an entire touch screen panel with the surface book.
I spent the 2700 on a surface book with the DGPU - I had the MacBook Pro touch for like 2 days.

My 2012 non retina MacBook Pro is still king - ive maxed out that thing and I love the flexibility. For travel ill use
my surface book - and all that gaming power - quantum, gears and Forza one charge during an 8 hour trip to Italy this past weekend - best purchase ever
 
Cook thinks that the iPad Pro will replace notebooks for many users. However it may only be a small % of consumers that are willing to do just that and not the mass switch he was expecting.

The iPad was a hit for Apple. It still generated over 4B in revenue the last quarter. However sales have been on the decline for years. It seems like the iPad mini is the real hit. It seems to fit the bill for many people without breaking the bank.

Eventually I think the Mac notebook and high end iPad line will merge to create a new Apple product. Might not be as soon as some may like but I can't see Apple sticking with the same lineup for the next decade. Keeping touch away from Mac OS.
 
macs4nw said:
Take note Apple. It is a nice machine but for the money, it's lacking in legacy connectivity, graphics power and main memory. Also battery life sacrificed for thinness.

For a Pro laptop, thinness is not the first consideration. 32 or 64GB could have been available with a larger battery.
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Except for the legacy ports, which I've found to really be a non-issue, the new Surface Book has the same exact processors, and graphics/memory limitations of the new MacBook Pros. It further lacks the high speed thunderbolt 3 ports that pros do use, and many of the real world tests of the Surface Book have shown MS is way off on their battery life claims. Still better than most anything else though considering the base and the display are both loaded with battery.

This is nothing more than a publicity stunt on the part of Microsoft... not to mention a $650 credit is nothing to sneeze at. The new MacBook Pro, which I own and love, is still selling as fast as they can build them.
 
TechZeke said:
Cool theory bro, but iPads don't bring much more revenue than Macs. If we're using your criteria, Apple really just a smartphone company, and everything else is just expensive accessories to the iPhone.
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You are correct, of the $32.4 billion in iPhone/iPad latest quarter revenue, iPad only accounts for about $4.2 billion compared to Macintosh products at about $5.7 billion, so yes overall Mac products are a bit more than iPad.

The reason I grouped iPhone/iPad was to think of Apple's revenue grouped by operating system product line, a kind IOS versus Mac O/S comparison. Since almost 70% of Apple's total $46.8 billion of last quarter's revenue came from "IOS products", it feels like Apple is a phone/tablet company, but the funny thing, I never think of Apple as a phone/tablet company, I still think of them as a computer company.

Apple literally dogged a bullet with the Samsung Galaxy Note7 fiasco, but here is the scary part. If a viable Android competitor emerges, I think it's a matter of when not if, and starts to seriously erode Apple's iPhone/iPad market share, it's going to hurt Apple, at least its stock price.

One could argue that Apple has possibly become a "one trick pony".
 
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Martyimac said:
Why should I buy I hub I don't need? None of my stuff is currently running through a hub other than the one on the monitor (non Apple BTW)
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You don't need to plug-in a hub, you can also get USB-C cables that work with any device out there and they work quite well. No dongles or hubs are necessary.

Additionally because the Macbook Pro uses USB-C for charging, you can use many existing powerbanks to power and/or charge the computer.

The reality is this is the future of all computers, Mac and PC, Apple was just brave enough to stand up and make the complete switch first.

For those that are concerned about the lack of a memory card reader, consider this, in the past year alone there have been several advances in SD card readers that have made them faster and more stable. With a built-in reader, upgrading is not readily achievable, but people would continue to use the card reader for convenience, even though it could cause problems and at bare minimum runs slower than the new readers out there. Instead people see there is a new reader that is better out there for about $20, they are far more likely to go out and purchase it if they don't have an internal card reader.
 
Kuzbad said:
That's a dangerous game to play! That's how I ended up still having my 2007 MBP 3,1 in service. I upgraded with a new, higher-capacity-than-original battery, new power adapter (the old one got yanked out by a dog--screwed up the adapter but saved the laptop thanks to magsafe), maxed out the ram, and added a 1TB ssd. "Just one more revision..."
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Dangerous? Not really. I need my laptop for work. I love OSX... macOS, sorry. I really do. And that is the only reason I won't be purchasing some other laptop. If Linux had all the apps I need, I would switch in a heart beat. Windows? Thanks, but no thanks.

But if they continue like this, I will have to reconsider Windows route. I really hope that it will never come to that. I am still very happy with my MBP, and this machine can easily last me 3-4-5 years down the road. After that, who knows... :)
 
Goes against what Apple has claimed, but corresponds to what I've seen. Is a result of Apple going away from its less profitable products towards it's iPhone line. Unfortunately the Mac line has been what gave it publicity. Once they gut the Mac line and the iPhone dies out, Apple may be left with not much to fall back on.
 
USB-C is NOT the 'courageous' futuristic move you might think. It's a way to force people to buy cloud storage and dongles that boost profits, as other product sales fall. That's all.
 
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