Microsoft Says 'Disappointment' of New MacBook Pro Has More People Switching to Surface Than Ever Before

[thekev]

So, Apple claims the new MBP's are the best-selling MBP's with a silly bar ever, and MS claims there are more switchers ever.

Maybe they are both right and those switchers are the hard-core (or "pro") users getting jettisoned, while kids of Chinese tycoons buy up the MBP's like crazy.

Apple's statement sounds borderline ridiculous. Macs had an average selling price of roughly $1175 for Q4 2016. They don't give a figure. I just divided revenue by units sold as given by their data summary. Without discounts applied, the cheapest touchbar model is $1799. I don't expect the next earnings call to deviate too much, as Apple's average hasn't deviated too much from that over the last couple years.

 

[v0lume4]

I have been keeping my eyes open for a real MacBook Pro, the late 2011 17" version, which would suit my needs until Apple maybe decides to make another Pro version of a laptop.

Hear, hear! I'd also love the 17" with a true 4k screen, the same pre-rMBP keyboard (with the excellent long-travel keys) and, if possible, swappable HDD / DVD bay / RAM.

Let's be honest. If Apple ever reintroduced the 17" MBP, it'd just be the same as the 15" model except with SIX USB-C ports. Three on each side.

 

[moxin]

slam OS X on SP4 and i'll buy it

 

[SirRahikkala]

Or end up dying like Nokia. I notice a pattern for tech companies. The time when Apple thrived was like 4 years ago when they still had a strong line up of products (Iphone 6, Macbook Pro, imac, Ipod, etc.). Similar to Microsoft with their Win XP or Nokia with their Series 6 phones. Unless Apple could find someone who has the vision, passion and real courage for innovation, they will follow Nokia's footstep.

What are you on about? Nokia is far from dead. It doesn't mean that the company is dead when they sell one product line away. It's like saying Apple is dead when they stopped selling iPod.

 

[dgdosen]

Take note Apple. It is a nice machine but for the money, it's lacking in legacy connectivity, graphics power and main memory. Also battery life sacrificed for thinness.

For a Pro laptop, thinness is not the first consideration. 32 or 64GB could have been available with a larger battery.

Apple: I've made a huge mistake.

 

[groove-agent]

I too am quite disappointed in Apple lately and to my surprise, being swayed back to the Windows camp. I found the Surface to be a good value combining a laptop with a tablet, plus being like a desktop with the docking unit. The "performance base" I though was a really cool innovative idea - having an add-on GPU with extra battery and it looks like it plays games with some gusto.

This combined with Windows 10 being a competent OS has me definitely having one foot out the door. For now I'm building a hackintosh in addition to my antiglare cMBP for mobile use.

 

[Investor27]

With Apple's profit margins for these new Macs increased substantially, Apple can afford to lose 25% to 40% of sales and still make more profit than on the older Macs. So losing some buyers to the Surface Pro is not going to make any difference.

 

[R2D2 xx]

If a marketing person at Microsoft says it, then it MUST be true.

Then again more people could be switching to the Microsoft Surface because until a few years ago it didn't exist, the lineup is now broader, and early versions were duds.

I've switched to a Surface Book. It's not perfect but it definitely beats the new Macbook Pro. All of Apple's products have some issue now. Tim definitely needs to go.

 

[Michael Scrip]

I've switched to a Surface Book. It's not perfect but it definitely beats the new Macbook Pro. All of Apple's products have some issue now. Tim definitely needs to go.

Beats how? Not in CPU horsepower.

There's a video in this thread that pits a dual-core Surface Book against a quad-core Macbook Pro.

The Macbook Pro spanks it!

 

[R.P.G]

Top Surface Book configuration
13.5" 1TB/Intel Core i7/16GB/dGPU - $3299
MBP
15" 1TB/Intel Core i7/16GB/Radeon Pro 460 with 4GB - $3299

both has maximum 16GB, MBP screen is better (IMHO)

so how come Surface Book is better for professionals?

you forgot Dual core and Quad core difference..

Surface is Dual core...

if i want to buy a windows device at that price, i will buy something from Asu/Dell or Razer.

 

[Uplift]

I switched between 3 different macOS devices the last 2 months and it always took me around 10 minutes to have everything going. Everything installed via terminal, no googling, installer next next next next clicking, etc. To start work simply `git clone` `npm install` and `npm start`.

On Windows it's incredibly painful even to get programs you need before you start the work. Not even mentioning adware/bloatware that sometimes tries to install sh*t in your computer with the actual software (even Skype from Microsoft!!). Everything I used (Vagrant, node, npm, git, php, composer, ...) had it's own issues and bugs specific to Windows. All these things need to be somehow installed via an application and configuring them is weird and painful.

Now MS realized that and they are pushing the Ubuntu subsystem thing for Windows which sounds great and all, but it's far from finished. For example a bug preventing running ANY npm application using networking (pretty much all apps in web dev) from starting was fixed only couple weeks ago and is available only in the Insider Preview versions.

If you have a good workflow and set of reliable tools for windows for web development I would really be interested in that, but I am afraid that nothing can match macOS or Linux in that sense (Linux is also not an option, but that would be for another 1000 letters )

If you work with PHP/frontend languages and modern development tools then Macs are by far the best machines to develop on, this is not an opinion it is a fact. Almost every dev tool or env is designed Mac first. You can literally be up and running in minutes with little to no software to install.

Windows answer to dev tools is MAMP lol.

 

[phrehdd]

Canon 5Ds, Nikon D810. D500, etc. Plenty of pro-level cameras use some form of SD.

and, the latest Hasselblad, the medium format Pentax and the upcoming Fuji G series medium format...

 

[thekev]

If you work with PHP/frontend languages and modern development tools then Macs are by far the best machines to develop on, this is not an opinion it is a fact. Almost every dev tool or env is designed Mac first. You can literally be up and running in minutes with little to no software to install.

Windows answer to dev tools is MAMP lol.

Is it because so many servers run LAMP setups and no one wants to run a Linux desktop? I'm just curious.

 

[xmonkey]

Canon 5Ds, Nikon D810. D500, etc. Plenty of pro-level cameras use some form of SD.

True, however none of those are SD-only. Most photographers I know use the SD slot more as a backup than the main format. CF and XQD are more robust than SD cards and it makes a difference out in the field.

 

[MarsViolet]

slam OS X on SP4 and i'll buy it

Even though there are no touch features in OS X?

 

[wex_storm]

Just out of curiosity: is no one here developing Apps for iOS?
Nearly everyone is complaining about the new MacBook and moving to M$. What is the option for App Developers?
I also bought the new MBP and in general- due to lack of alternatives - will stay with it. I also have those poor battery life issues, problems with external HDDs that crash the whole system and not a so big performance boost compared to my "old" rMBP with similar specs.

 

[Oscarz24]

Microsoft has announced November was its best month ever for consumer Surface sales. In a blog post, the company said more people are switching from Macs to Surface devices than ever before following the "disappointment" of the new MacBook Pro, particularly among professional users.

Shortly after the new MacBook Pro launched, Microsoft launched a trade-in promotion offering MacBook Pro and MacBook Air owners up to $650 credit towards a new Surface Book or Surface Pro 4. Microsoft also unveiled the Surface Studio in October, and the all-in-one desktop has been met with positive reviews.

Microsoft's Surface Book starts at $1,499, the same price as Apple's new 13-inch MacBook Pro with a standard row of function keys. Touch Bar-equipped models start at $1,799 for 13-inch models and $2,399 for 15-inch models.

Article Link: Microsoft Says 'Disappointment' of New MacBook Pro Has More People Switching to Surface Than Ever Before

 

[kis]

Canon 5Ds, Nikon D810. D500, etc. Plenty of pro-level cameras use some form of SD.

Agreed, pretty much every pro camera today uses SD. CF is on its way out and all other formats are pretty much niche products.

 

[robeddie]

There is simply no comparison between the spying of MS/W10 of your personal data, keystrokes, files, and whatever hardware choices Apple makes. Choosing to go all usb-c is in no way a "big brother" move. Annoying prick move perhaps depending on your look at the ports. Big brother, no.
As for "likes" in the forum. Care to guess how much I care for them?

I wasn't suggesting you were going for likes with your comment. Was just observing that the comment would probably have gotten a LOT more of them a few years back.

To me it's just another little bit of evidence how much the mood has changed about Apple in that time.

 

[Bacillus]

Apple should reintroduce the 17" model for Pro users with more ports and more power. I still use my 6+ year-old 17-incher (after swapping out my hard drive for an SSD & maxing out the Ram.)

They keep pushing for portability and being razor thin when I want a powerful desktop replacement. Battery life doesn't really matter to me since I almost always plug in where I'm at.

Grab Phil Schiller by his hand, put him in a coffee shop and talk 24 hours into him to make him do that.
Otherwise he'll drive to office, grab coffee, talk a little about the AppStore, read car magazines (his greatest passion), check his bonus and drive home again.

 

[robeddie]

Let's be honest. If Apple ever reintroduced the 17" MBP, it'd just be the same as the 15" model except with SIX USB-C ports. Three on each side.

Sad but true. And it would overheat as well, because they are convinced fans are evil, and thinness is god.

 

[acuriouslad]

What a time to be alive. Microsoft taking the piss out of Apple.. and being right about it too.

Why do I just picture Apple as Dinesh from Silicon Valley, with his gold chain.. and Jared (Microsoft) makes fun of him... and he's like "Great. Now even ****ing Jared is busting my balls..."

This is a fantastic word picture. Thank you

 

[Uplift]

Is it because so many servers run LAMP setups and no one wants to run a Linux desktop? I'm just curious.

Any UNIX-like operating system is the way forward, I think it's the array of tools available for macOS that gives it the edge... "it just works" ... A guy in my office uses Ubuntu and he still uses Vagrant virtual machines for his LAMP stack.

Something as basic as SSH'ing into a machine requires puTTY and specially converted keys specific for that app.

 

[Viking2]

True, however none of those are SD-only. Most photographers I know use the SD slot more as a backup than the main format. CF and XQD are more robust than SD cards and it makes a difference out in the field.

SD is the number one memory card. CF is dead in the mainstream usage.

I could sit all day and name great cameras using SD.
I love my SD slot on my MBP 15, will miss it on the new MBP I got.
[doublepost=1481618640][/doublepost]I said it before and I say it again. I like Apple Hardware and of course it is more expensive then it should be. Same as my iPhone.

Still main reason I am still using MBP is for the Mac OS (and I don't like that Apple is trying to get to much of IOS in Mac OS). I liked Aperture, Pages, Keynote etc before Apple started to adress the typical IOS user and letting power users down.

If it would be possible to run Mac OS on the Surface I would likely buy Surface.

If Apple don't play the cards right soon there will be a better alternativ for Mac OS.
I don't need thinner MBPS and iPhones. I need more power/battery life/connectors/price-performance/better support etc

 

[AndyJapan]

With Apple's profit margins for these new Macs increased substantially, Apple can afford to lose 25% to 40% of sales and still make more profit than on the older Macs. So losing some buyers to the Surface Pro is not going to make any difference.

Apple might just move into the wrong direction on the price elasticity curve as more customers might think that the new MacBook Pro is bad value for money. Only Apple knows whether losing customers to MS (if that's the case at all) does not hurt their bottom line. They will never publish such data.
On the other hand, Apple will never know how many fence sitters (potential customers considering to switch to MacOS) they have lost by launching an underwhelming MacBook Pro with little innovation. Apple will probably never test the waters of lowering their prices unless they are really feeling the heat.
Therefore, I hope that MS and others will keep innovating and force Apple to come up with something better or cheaper than the current MacBook Pro.