Microsoft Says 'Disappointment' of New MacBook Pro Has More People Switching to Surface Than Ever Before

[Abazigal]

People switch platforms all the time. Sure, some people might have bought a surface computer in place of a Mac, but just how many people did the opposite as well?

It's the same story with iOS and android. I don't think Apple is losing too much sleep over the few customers they couldn't keep (or opted not to keep) over the many new customers they won over to their platform.

 

[GadgetBen]

I'm an avid Apple supporter (iMac, iPhone7, AW2) but I was extremely disappointed with the latest MacBook.

You can write an email to Apple to let them know here: Product Feedback - Apple

As well as having a moan on this forum of course!

 

[diipii]

A computer maker should offer a Windows machine that runs OSX right out of the box.

 

[thekev]

Any UNIX-like operating system is the way forward, I think it's the array of tools available for macOS that gives it the edge... "it just works" ... A guy in my office uses Ubuntu and he still uses Vagrant virtual machines for his LAMP stack.

Something as basic as SSH'ing into a machine requires puTTY and specially converted keys specific for that app.

Yeah I guess that would annoy me too, especially using PuTTY and Vagrant for everything *shudders*. I'm kind of hoping that Apple returns to something like the iris pro and no dGPU in the base model and preferably drops the price back to sane levels. I've had too many problems with Apple's graphics switching.

 

[JGRE]

So, Apple claims the new MBP's are the best-selling MBP's with a silly bar ever, and MS claims there are more switchers ever.

Maybe they are both right and those switchers are the hard-core (or "pro") users getting jettisoned, while kids of Chinese tycoons buy up the MBP's like crazy.

Yes we should could it the "silly bar MBP", that sounds about right.

 

[A-Sign]

Ah, remember Phil Schiller saying about the MacBook Pro 2016:
"We don't design for price - we design for the experience"

Obviously the "experience" at the Apple headquarters is a different one than their customers.

 

[anthorumor]

And this is surprising, why?

 

[Steve121178]

People switch platforms all the time. Sure, some people might have bought a surface computer in place of a Mac, but just how many people did the opposite as well?

It's the same story with iOS and android. I don't think Apple is losing too much sleep over the few customers they couldn't keep (or opted not to keep) over the many new customers they won over to their platform.

When a lot of Mac owners go to refresh their computer in the next 1-2 years and realise it costs up to 50% more than it used to, then you will see a lot more jumping ship.

 

[niploteksi]

Yeah you love Googles Android, and Google loves your data.
Just married...

I would never put my pants down, just to save a few bucks.
And also never use facebook nor whats app, instagram, snapchat & Co.

If someday Apple become like google, I will go fully Linux and ditch mobile devices altogether.
There is no alternative.

I've had all the tower models since the G4 and I had Macs before that. It's hardly about saving "a few bucks" and I couldn't care less about giving Google my data. In my opinion Android is just plain better than iOs on phones. I've paid plenty of "Apple tax" over the years and I struggled through the migrations of cpus and Os yelling whoopy because Apple was always so awesome. But enough is enough. Windows isn't my go to operating system and in no way do I think the Microsoft laptops are all that, but since I'm too lazy to go through the hassles of Hackontishes I'm stuck with Windows and pulling my hair at ASIO drivers and whatnot. As of now Apple doesn't have a decent lineup of computers able to run their OS and there's not really any of the "top" models I'd like to spend my money on.

Have a nice day

 

[Workerbee Redux]

So losing some buyers to the Surface Pro is not going to make any difference.

This is exactly the "We don't care" attitude that led to Apple's fall in the '90s. As the competition in the high-price/high-design segment of laptops/convertibles increases, you cannot just ignore rivals pulling ahead of you - even if it's just in perception. The Surface line was greeted with a wow, but I haven't heard the same about the tbMBP's.

 

[A-Sign]

This is exactly the "We don't care" attitude that led to Apple's fall in the '90s. As the competition in the high-price/high-design segment of laptops/convertibles increases, you cannot just ignore rivals pulling ahead of you - even if it's just in perception. The Surface line was greeted with a wow, but I haven't heard the same about the tbMBP's.

The same thing will happen to Apple again with their remaining computers - there isn't much there: Only 13" and 15" MacBook devices - the entire Desktop line is already dead and of course no Server OS and Hardware.

 

[Stingray454]

As a long time apple fanboy and die-hard OS X user, I have to say.. Good for Microsoft. Apple has neglected the macs for a long time, and the latest update and price bump was honestly largely a disappointment. If MS can produce more innovative solutions, better hardware, matching design for a lower price, they deserve the business. I've looked at both surface pro, razer blade stealth, xps 13/15 and similar myself, but haven't jumped yet. Really really close though. Think I'll have to investigate how well OS X runs virtualized, hard to let go of it for work, but can live with windows for games and such.

 

[happywaiman]

It is probably a "10->100 so call it 10x" style of PR, which basically true only because people buy old MacBook Pro and trade in for discount. Not that much Pro users would dump Apple, considering Surface is incompetent for real world professional task, and Intel didn't actually has a big advance in chip technology.

Unlike Surface, Apple didn't just slap a touch screen from failed tablet OEMs, and a poor GPU circuit design (they drive a 2016 GPU with PCIE 3.0 x4, that essentially equivalent to PCIE 2.0 x8, which is what the first retina MBP is packing) that perform as a 2012 MacBook Pro (with a 15W TDP CPU for professional use, I may add. Apple ship those in Air, Pro series starts at 28W), and tell the marketing team to call it for professional. Apple spends money changing the design of user interface, and if you don't like it, the old one still work better that those professional toys that run like a 2012 laptop for the cheap cheap price of a 2015 MacBook Pro (And before you talk about the stylus, how is that different as the touch bar? With professional, keyboard and trackpad is best for the 80% case, and the 20% case is still good with experience. Not everyone need to draft a musical set on a thick tablet. You can do it on a thin one, or just get a piece of paper like the rest of the world)

On the other hand, with history as indicate, Apple will update the hardware next year, and drop the price once OLED is more available in 2017, with a more sophisticated design. Remember the first Unibody MacBook Pro still use slot battery? Or the first MacBook Air effectively has only one USB? How about the first Retina MacBook Pro is $400 more expensive that previous generation like the current touch bar version, and the price bump got slash in half and we think the remaining is just inflation? MacBook and MacBook Pro has just gone through the first half of the redesign, and they probably will continues till the end of 2017, when wireless and USB-C accessories has catch up with everyone's need.
Those who said this is disappointing, is probably who never spend a minute to look back the history.

(Oh, Mac Pro is disappointing, but it is not like Intel giving early release to Xeon E5 to Apple like Steve is still alive. They discontinued Xserve, so basically their orders are last to ship. )

 

[monty77]

Due to ongoing USB-C issues with my Macbook 12" (affects MBP also it seems) I fired up an old Windows box and installed 10. Been using it as my daily driver for a couple of months now and I'm quite happy. I miss a couple of things about OSX but not nearly as many as I thought. Keeping my eye out for a SP4 deal and the 12 will most likely go ... Apple still have me as a tablet/phone customer but I think I'm ready to jump back to Windows now; Apple aren't the company they once were. Mac user since 2001, sad times.

 

[springsup]

More people are switching from Macs to Surface than ever before.

I never thought I'd see the day when Microsoft is boasting about the number of 'switchers' from the Mac...

 

[A-Sign]

I never thought I'd see the day when Microsoft is boasting about the number of 'switchers' from the Mac...

Apple does a really bad job these days to serve the Mac customers. But what else would you expect if your Mac Desktop Hardware is more than 2 years old and the MacBook Pro gets more and more expensive? It is alienating your customers. Is this the sign of Apple saying "iPad Pro is the future"?

 

[maflynn]

A computer maker should offer a Windows machine that runs OSX right out of the box.

Sorry that will never happen, it nearly bankrupted Apple the last time they licensed their OS to hardware makers. Apple is a hardware company, and licensing the software will then cause people to not buy the hardware. There's no way they'd be making as much money on license fees as they would on sales of Macs.

I never thought I'd see the day when Microsoft is boasting about the number of 'switchers' from the Mac...

Indeed, but I think they switched roles, Apple not the dominant player who seems more interested in protecting its position, rather then innovating and MS losing out on the mobile market sees the need to be more aggressive and take chances

While many people can knock the Surface Book, its a bold design showing that MS is swinging for the fences. The Surface Pro is a win, so much so, Apple decided to copy MS with their iPad Pro.

 

[NachoGrande]

What still uses SD? Most pro cameras use CF, CFast and XQD. Most consumer cameras have migrated to micro-SD.

I've got an SD slot taking space on my MBP, and I still have to carry 2 adapters for my cameras...

I've had 3 cameras repaired due to a bent pin for the CF card reader. My 5D Mark III use SD and CF (which is never used) and my 6D uses SD (solely). Nikon is the same we. They are moving away from CF.

 

[timber]

Sorry that will never happen, it nearly bankrupted Apple the last time they licensed their OS to hardware makers. Apple is a hardware company, and licensing the software will then cause people to not buy the hardware. There's no way they'd be making as much money on license fees as they would on sales of Macs.

I tend to agree with your point of view. The problem these days is that it seems they are not even wanting to sell hardware.

 

[AlexisV]

More people are switching from Macs to Surface than ever before.

No numbers?

Our trade-in program for MacBooks was our best ever,

Meaningless. 1000 trade ins v 1001 trade-ins would be the best ever.

and the combination of excitement for the innovation of Surface coupled with the disappointment of the new MacBook Pro

Microsoft had sold 100,000 Surface Pros. Apple 400,000.

- especially among professionals -

Really? I can't find any evidence professionals are deserting OS X?

is leading more and more people to make the switch to Surface, like this.

The latest marketing spiel - every sale is now described as a 'switch', whether it's toothpaste or computers.

It seems like a new review recommending Surface over MacBook comes out daily.

I had to trawl through 5 on Google before I came to one that said that.

This makes our team so proud, because it means we're doing good work.

Good work or profitable work?

 

[panjandrum]

When a lot of Mac owners go to refresh their computer in the next 1-2 years and realise it costs up to 50% more than it used to, then you will see a lot more jumping ship.

This. Time will tell, but I think the large number of sales we've seen of the new MBPros is a short-term fluke caused (probably) by the most fanboyishly-blind of purchasers. I've only helped make two purchasing decisions since the release, both from reasonably pragmatic Apple users, and both point-blank refused to even consider the new models (one of them laughed when she saw the price). Both still spent their money at Apple in the end, but both ended up with the "old" model (not just because of price, both also own a lot of devices that use so-called "legacy" ports, but price was a huge factor).

The Mac OS ecosystem is still not big enough to handle crashing hardware-sales. We've seen the results before, and we don't want to go through that again. Apple either needs to start building systems people actually want again on both ends of the spectrum, or they need to consider licensing the OS to other hardware manufacturers again. If the Mac portion of the market starts to shrink it will be very bad news for all Mac OS users as that nearly-unbreakable feedback-loop of "fewer users, fewer apps, fewer apps, fewer users" takes hold once-again.

 

[happywaiman]

As a long time apple fanboy and die-hard OS X user, I have to say.. Good for Microsoft. Apple has neglected the macs for a long time, and the latest update and price bump was honestly largely a disappointment. If MS can produce more innovative solutions, better hardware, matching design for a lower price, they deserve the business. I've looked at both surface pro, razer blade stealth, xps 13/15 and similar myself, but haven't jumped yet. Really really close though. Think I'll have to investigate how well OS X runs virtualized, hard to let go of it for work, but can live with windows for games and such.

You do know you are the first three are ultrabooks with 15W Intel CPU, right? You can get that with the cheap 2016 MacBook Pro, and it still works like the MacBook Air it suppose to replace. (The battery life would probably improve once the second gen IGZO Retina P3 is ready)
If you really want Kaby Lake CPU (not Surface, it's the same as the non-TB 2016 MBP), maybe wait until the main supply in Q1 2017? They usually drop the entry price around 6 months of release for 13, and 18 months for 15 anyway.

 

[mkeeley]

People switch platforms all the time. Sure, some people might have bought a surface computer in place of a Mac, but just how many people did the opposite as well?

It's the same story with iOS and android. I don't think Apple is losing too much sleep over the few customers they couldn't keep (or opted not to keep) over the many new customers they won over to their platform.

No they don't switch all the time. Once you're hooked in to one platform it's not a trivial thing to swap unless you just only use web and mail. Not only is they're the learning curve there's the expense. Swap to/from OSX to Windows and think of all the software you'd need to purchase.
[doublepost=1481631517][/doublepost]

No numbers?

Meaningless. 1000 trade ins v 1001 trade-ins would be the best ever.

Microsoft had sold 100,000 Surface Pros. Apple 400,000.

Really? I can't find any evidence professionals are deserting OS X?

The latest marketing spiel - every sale is now described as a 'switch', whether it's toothpaste or computers.

I had to trawl through 5 on Google before I came to one that said that.

Good work or profitable work?

Yet I can imagine you cheering on Apple when they said watches and MBP's are selling like hot cakes without releasing figures either. There's a load of talk about pro's moving over to Windows. Look on here, reddit, anywhere and they're talking about it. Hope apple haven't their head in the sand like you have.

 

[maflynn]

Really? I can't find any evidence professionals are deserting OS X?

Google is your friend, a simple search will show you that people are leaving.
http://petapixel.com/2016/12/03/im-leaving-apple-microsoft-switching-photographer/
http://www.digitaltrends.com/apple/why-i-switched-back-confessions-of-a-former-mac-user/
https://photofocus.com/2013/06/10/about-my-switch-from-mac-to-windows/

 

[Hadron]

A computer maker should offer a Windows machine that runs OSX right out of the box.

That will only happen if Apple license it. And apart a short experiment their policy has been not to do so.

I'm with the people who say that Apple dropped the ball. Regressing on battery life in order to make it thinner was enough to make me postpone any upgrades this year. And the headline innovation, the touch bar, isn't really a selling point to me (I've read Apple's arguments for why it's better than a touchscreen on a laptop, but have enough experience of the latter that I disagree. The Surface's pen is a definite advantage in a tablet-style device).

But the question is, will Apple recognise that they've made mistakes? It's not really in the company's DNA to do so, and if enough people buy it for whatever reason (e.g. people who have been holding off because they didn't want to buy an 18 month old model, or because a new look attracts some people) will they just convince themselves that they got it right?