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MLB Hotstove 08

MacNut said:
The issue was not about money, Torre said he was fine with 5 million but the incentives are what he didn't like. He wanted 2 years guaranteed. If he didn't win the world series the Yankees considered the season a failure and Torre would be out of a job. A Manager that has been to the playoffs 12 straight times is not enough for the Yankees if you don't win anything. That is why Torre turned down the deal. It had nothing to do with money. It was about respect. The Yankees can't give the most respected manager in the game money but they will waste money on Clemans. If the Yankees really wanted Torre to stay they would of made him an offer he would not turn down. This is a team that is known to throw money away.
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Rule of life: Whenever somebody says "it's not the money, it's the principle," it's really about the money. I have never seen it work any other way. If you listen to even what you've said yourself in defense of Torre, you can see it really is about the money. Even without the incentives, he'd still be the highest-paid manager in baseball, by far. He's demanding the full price or nothing. Don't kid yourself, it's about the money.
 
IJ Reilly said:
Rule of life: Whenever somebody says "it's not the money, it's the principle," it's really about the money. I have never seen it work any other way. If you listen to even what you've said yourself in defense of Torre, you can see it really is about the money. Even without the incentives, he'd still be the highest-paid manager in baseball, by far. He's demanding the full price or nothing. Don't kid yourself, it's about the money.
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That fails the common sense test though, because now he's getting nothing.

If it is truly "all about the money" then taking a pay cut that still gives him several million would be just fine.

No one is going to offer him that kind of money to manage elsewhere, and it's pretty obvious that this was a move to say "hey we offered him a deal, he didn't want it."

It was a deal designed to be rejected and the yankees got what they wanted.

But make no mistake, they fired Torre.

They just didn't have the balls to actually come out and say that.

So it's not "all about the money."

It's about the money in the context of the particular offer given.
 
Sobe said:
It's about the money in the context of the particular offer given.
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Now there's a distinction without a difference. Torre thinks he's worth $7 million a year and he won't take less. If he doesn't get it then he won't manage next year. I don't see this as a matter of principle. He demanded a certain price for his services, or he'd walk. He didn't get his price, so he has to walk.

The same thing happened this season with Barry Bonds. He said he wouldn't take less than $16 million to play. He gambled that the Giants would be willing to pay it. Nobody else would. He gambled right. You might as well call that a matter of principle too.
 
IJ Reilly said:
Now there's a distinction without a difference. Torre thinks he's worth $7 million a year and he won't take less. If he doesn't get it then he won't manage next year. I don't see this as a matter of principle. He demanded a certain price for his services, or he'd walk. He didn't get his price, so he has to walk.

The same thing happened this season with Barry Bonds. He said he wouldn't take less than $16 million to play. He gambled that the Giants would be willing to pay it. Nobody else would. He gambled right. You might as well call that a matter of principle too.
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Find me one manager in the major leagues who would have had a string of nine straight division titles on their resume and a playoff appearance in every single year (12) he managed the club, including 4 world series titles in a 5 year span and accept a pay cut.

You won't.

Joe Torre said said:
Money, Torre said, was an issue, but taking a pay cut from a reported $7.5 million was not a big concern. The one-year offer and the playoff bonus system were the decisive factors.
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And that's why Torre walked.
 
Sobe said:
Find me one manager in the major leagues who would have had a string of nine straight division titles on their resume and a playoff appearance in every single year (12) he managed the club, including 4 world series titles in a 5 year span and accept a pay cut.

You won't.
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That's irrelevant, obviously. Nobody will continue paying Torre the kind of money the Yankees have been paying him, including the Yankees.

And that's why Torre walked.
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IOW, it was the money.
 
If that is the case expect the Yankees to go after Lowell hard in the off season.

It will be a dumb move by Arod as no other team will be able to give him that big a contract. Boras is maybe the worst agent ever not putting the best of his players ahead of his own agendas.
 
Teh Don Ditty said:
F**k him.

At least we know he won't go to the Red Sox.... cause he can't handle october.
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I agree completely. It was a worthwhile experiment, and credit for to the Yanks for trying, but I think they're better off without him and with a couple other younger players. Plus, this means their payroll can be adjusted to favor pitching more--perhaps they can make a great offer now for Santana or just run with what they have for a year and continue building their farm system.
 
Naimfan said:
I agree completely. It was a worthwhile experiment, and credit for to the Yanks for trying, but I think they're better off without him and with a couple other younger players. Plus, this means their payroll can be adjusted to favor pitching more--perhaps they can make a great offer now for Santana or just run with what they have for a year and continue building their farm system.
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Santana isn't a FA until next season.... the Yanks would have to give up Joba and Kennedy just to get him. It's not worth it. The Yanks need to rebuild and if that means Jorge and Rivera leave then so be it. I'd rather watch a bunch of youngsters than this current Yankee team. (yes, I do realize that the Yanks might suck... badly, but that's the price you have to pay)
 
Going after Santana will be risky as the Twins will want Hughes in return.

The Yankees should of rebuilt years ago but they wanted the quick championships, interesting to see what the Steinbrenner brothers will do.
 
I remember when Arod wanted to leave texas because he hated not being in the post season. Well he got his wish.

Now he wants to go back to that and leave the Yankees? Well good luck buddy.

Honestly.
 
Koodauw said:
I remember when Arod wanted to leave texas because he hated not being in the post season. Well he got his wish.

Now he wants to go back to that and leave the Yankees? Well good luck buddy.

Honestly.
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Arod wants to be Jeter, only problem is the Yankees already have Jeter, plus Arod can't hit in the clutch in the post season. It was a bad fit to begin with.

Boras wants the Yankees to crawl back and make an offer. I don't see it happening and if Arod really wants to be a Yankee he will have to take a pay cut now. The Yankees are in a great position now.
 
If the Twins want Hughes or Chamberlain the Yanks should say no. I just hope they do! What the Yanks need is a young Paul O'Neill. Maybe they could get Ian Stewart from the Rockies--he's a terrific third baseman--can hit, field, throw, etc.

Don--I agree with you completely. They need to go young and only bring someone in if they're on the upside of their career--not the downside. And they should be able to do it.
 
Naimfan said:
If the Twins want Hughes or Chamberlain the Yanks should say no. I just hope they do! What the Yanks need is a young Paul O'Neill. Maybe they could get Ian Stewart from the Rockies--he's a terrific third baseman--can hit, field, throw, etc.

Don--I agree with you completely. They need to go young and only bring someone in if they're on the upside of their career--not the downside. And they should be able to do it.
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If they got rid of Hughes or Chamberlain, I don't think I'd be able to watch/root for them again. This is a very critical time in Yankeeland, and I think Cashman will stay the course (which he set) and keep the youth instead of trying to buy players.

The sooner Yankee fans (some, not all) and parts of management realize that the Dynasty ended in 2001 after that bloop single by LuGo, the easier this will be.
 
They still need to name a manager, Girardi is the better choice but they also don't want to loose Mattingly.
 
MacNut said:
They still need to name a manager, Girardi is the better choice but they also don't want to loose Mattingly.
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I disagree, Mattingly can go suck it for all I care.

I found this interesting....

Scott Boras on Arod's decision said:
"Alex's decision was one based on not knowing what his closer, his catcher and one of his statured pitchers was going to do," Boras said. "He really didn't want to make any decisions until he knew what they were doing."
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The way I'm reading that, we can say goodbye to Rivera and Posada.
 
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