Touch Bar MacBook Pro Orders Begin Shipping to Customers

[pjwal]

Just got delivery notice to Portland, ordered 1 hour after event.

 

[cult hero]

I too find it curious that Apple haven't even given their customers to try it instore before committing a serious amount of money.
Even more curious are the reported record number of people that have preordered without trying it.
Not something I would do. Hope it meets everyone's expectations!
I'm waiting for some reviews to come in before dropping that much money. I wouldn't buy anything this expensive without being able to have some hands on time with it first

I preordered after I played with the "cheap" model in a store. I got to see and interact with basically everything I cared about: screen, keyboard, trackpad, size, weight, etc. Seeing it next to the 11" MacBook Air was actually rather stunning. It's small.

The touch bar is interesting, but since I work on external keyboards most of the time it had basically zero impact on my decision to buy so demoing didn't matter. The only sorta concern would be the esc key, but since I rebind that to caps lock anyway it doesn't matter. I wanted a smaller laptop and the MacBook's lack of Thunderbolt made it a failure to launch from day one.

Despite the nature of this forum, there are no shortage of people who MUST HAVE the latest and greatest from Apple no matter what.

 

[tjleonard]

That's a really sad indictment of this company lately.

Apple is trying to pass off cost-cutting as forward-thinking. But people are rightfully seeing through it when the alternative solutions aren't as convenient, practical, reliable (as demonstrated here) or even present at all (such as MagSafe and optical audio, both of which I love).

I know it's cliche to say "Steve Jobs would never..." but I honestly believe that MagSafe is one of those things he would've tried to keep. If not as a dedicated port then Apple could've designed a MagSafe charging cable that worked in any of the USB-C ports and bundled that with the computer. But they didn't because that's too much effort or costs too apparently.

The situation with audio is a joke. If Apple really want to push lightning headphones, how hard would it have been to include a lightning port? It's pretty god-damned slim. They moved the headphone jack from a convenient location (closer to the user on the left side) to just about the most inconvenient location possible for headphone use; as far away on the right side as possible as if they're trying to hide it but didn't have the "courage" to drop it yet. Not only that they removed optical audio (which I use and love) for no other reason than (I guess) cost-cutting.

Also, where Apple used to use the best Intel CPUs with Iris Pro graphics in the 15", they've now downgraded to using the Intel HD integrated graphics, which is, you guessed it, cheaper! The list price of the lowest-end 2.2 GHz i7 used in the 2015 model with Iris Pro 5200 (4770HQ) is $434 per tray while the price of the 2.6 GHz i7 with Intel HD 530 (6700HQ) is only $378 per tray. This may mean the computer has to switch to using dedicated graphics more often or the UI may feel more sluggish before it switches. Perhaps the efficiency of the AMD chips means they can get away with the poorer Intel graphics and the user experience is the same or better but I'd want to see performance tests and the graphics switching in practise before making up my mind. One of the great things about the 2015 model is it still "feels" nice and fluid with battery switching enabled and on battery power, while still getting excellent battery life (8-9 hours). It'd be a shame if that end-user experience went backwards because they cheapened out on Intel chips.

What this all seems to suggest is that cost cutting was needed to make up for the shiny new touch bar and Touch ID while still maintaining their very healthy profit margins. There are many savings compared to the previous model. Smaller chassis means less aluminium (an expensive metal), fewer (and smaller) ports means quicker machining. Simpler display (removing glowing logo) should be quicker and easier to manufacture. Much smaller battery is a significant cost saving. There's the cheaper CPU, loss of MagSafe optical digital and likely many other cost savings. This in order to get a touch bar and associated controller chips, Touch ID, bigger trackpad and better screen.

There are positives with the new machines obviously, but cost aside I'm now in the position where I have think long and hard (and make a decision table) to decide if I want or would be happy with this new version in comparison to the former, where previously I wouldn't have had to give it a second thought because the new ones are just always better in every way.

I've more or less convinced myself through the writing of this post that I'm going to stick with my former rMBP for now and that the benefits in the new model don't outweigh the potential disadvantages, especially as they relate to the choice of CPU, the lack of optical audio and the position of the headphone jack.

You actually think they didn't do MagSafe or put the headphone jack where you want it to save money? LOL
[doublepost=1479020149][/doublepost]

I preordered after I played with the "cheap" model in a store. I got to see and interact with basically everything I cared about: screen, keyboard, trackpad, size, weight, etc. Seeing it next to the 11" MacBook Air was actually rather stunning. It's small.

The touch bar is interesting, but since I work on external keyboards most of the time it had basically zero impact on my decision to buy so demoing didn't matter. The only sorta concern would be the esc key, but since I rebind that to caps lock anyway it doesn't matter. I wanted a smaller laptop and the MacBook's lack of Thunderbolt made it a failure to launch from day one.

Despite the nature of this forum, there are no shortage of people who MUST HAVE the latest and greatest from Apple no matter what.

I preordered then went by a store to play with the display. There are like 4-6 in the store here, not sure what the issue with this others guy store is? When I played with it, I know I made the right decision when preordering this machine. Like I said then - all of you haters, order it if you're not sure, try it, return it if you don't line it. The return policy is great.

 

[cerberusss]

I was going to wait one more generation but a close friend was really hoping to buy my old machine.

LOL, he must be a real good friend

 

[Abazigal]

I know it's cliche to say "Steve Jobs would never..." but I honestly believe that MagSafe is one of those things he would've tried to keep. If not as a dedicated port then Apple could've designed a MagSafe charging cable that worked in any of the USB-C ports and bundled that with the computer. But they didn't because that's too much effort or costs too apparently.

The Steve Jobs I know wouldn't have been married to any particular technology. He said it best - you decide on the end user experience you want the consumer to have, then work backwards to determine how best to provide that experience. If Magsafe meets that need, then include it in. If and when Magsafe no longer meets that need, excise it like a malign tumour, regardless of how awesome a piece of tech it may be or how much money has been sunk into developing it.

USB-C simply isn't compatible with Magsafe, so one had to give. You can't say that USB-C is the future and tout its versatility while still setting aside dedicated ports for charging or data transfer.

The situation with audio is a joke. If Apple really want to push lightning headphones, how hard would it have been to include a lightning port?

Apple wants to push wireless headphones, not lightning ones. Save for the puzzling delay in the release of the AirPods, I haven't seen anything that contradicts this stance of theirs.

This may mean the computer has to switch to using dedicated graphics more often or the UI may feel more sluggish before it switches.

We can only wait and see, since the 15" mbps aren't out yet.

What this all seems to suggest is that cost cutting was needed to make up for the shiny new touch bar and Touch ID while still maintaining their very healthy profit margins. There are many savings compared to the previous model. Smaller chassis means less aluminium (an expensive metal), fewer (and smaller) ports means quicker machining. Simpler display (removing glowing logo) should be quicker and easier to manufacture. Much smaller battery is a significant cost saving. There's the cheaper CPU, loss of MagSafe optical digital and likely many other cost savings. This in order to get a touch bar and associated controller chips, Touch ID, bigger trackpad and better screen.

All the points you mentioned are simply a by-product of Apple's relentless pursuit towards making technology more personal and portable, not due to cost-cutting at all costs.

The glowing logo is gone because the screen is too thin. We already saw it with the MacBook.

A smaller chassis, smaller battery and fewer (albeit more versatile) ports are all there to enable a thinner and lighter device, not to shave a few dollars off the final build cost.

If anything, I feel it says a lot that Apple is not afraid to get rid of iconic Apple features (magsafe, startup chime, glowing Apple Logo). Think about it - it would have been so easy to just do nothing, leave them in and avoid all this backlash. Why go through all that effort engineering new alternatives and workarounds and risk angering your current user base if you didn't think there was some merit and benefits to them?

 

[rickeames]

I'm curious how they allocate the machines as I have had people who ordered *after* me with the exact configuration get notices and mine is still sitting in "processing." So it's obviously not in order.

 

[nofear1az]

So I got to play on a Space Grey MacBook Pro (w/o touchbar) and my thoughts on it are that it is very thin and feels extremely well built - no flexing in the casing at all. I like how they reduced the bezel. I loved how it folded up and carrying it felt really solid in the hands. It is a very impressive looking machine.

Things I don't care for #1 is the keyboard - it is very loud, outside of the lack of tactfile feel it was the loudness that bothered me more. I can't imagine being in a conference room with other MacBook users and every one typing away as it would get annoying very quickly - sounds like an antique typewriter to me. #2 - I still feel it needs a couple USB-3 ports. I tend to prefer my own external mouse and keyboard that does require a nub to be plugged in and I still do use a flash drive since for what I do it is consistent and reliable as opposed to issues I've had with OneDrive and my personal fav Google Drive not syncing or slow syncing. #3 - My very little time with it I wondered if I could get used to the jumbo trackpad, not because it was jumbo jet sized but because it lacked much tactile feel or feedback when I pressed down on it for a click. I kept wanting to press down hard on it but realize I only need to press it very lightly and when I did it had even less tactile feedback than when I pressed hard on it.

I change my thoughts on this MacBook Pro since it was released. I believe it is ONE of the BEST put together machines I have ever handled. I think two areas that could affect it's purchase one being it's price increase and two being the keyboard. From what I've read so far, I don't think either of those are slowing down sales of this.

anyway, just my thoughts on this, yours may differ.

 

[Kangastu]

I too find it curious that Apple haven't even given their customers to try it instore before committing a serious amount of money.
Even more curious are the reported record number of people that have preordered without trying it.
Not something I would do. Hope it meets everyone's expectations!
I'm waiting for some reviews to come in before dropping that much money. I wouldn't buy anything this expensive without being able to have some hands on time with it first

They did the same with the first gen retina MacBook Pro. You could see it in the Apple Store window - but you couldn't play with one until it was actually available to buy.

 

[yillbs]

If sales numbers have anything to do with quality then Apple actually made complete crap for nearly all of their existence. See, you can't have it both ways. Do you believe that sales=quality? (In which case why are you making the argument you just made since obviously by your reasoning Microsoft makes the best OS?). It's far too easy to sell crap to the ignorant. Using your argument, just look at the substantial minority of voters that become Trumpholes this election. I expect (or at least hope) that the majority of them were simply duped (because the alternative; that they are truly sexist, racist, hate-mongering people is too horrific to contemplate.)

I have historically been a big fan of Apple (have supported their OS and equipment since the mid/late 80's). I will not now, nor will I ever, be a fanboi however. If their OS and equipment are going to heck, then I refuse to stick my head in the sand and pretend otherwise. And, as I mentioned, I will reserve my final judgement until I get some substantial time with the equipment.

That's failed logic in itself. He said it was one of the worst. Sales do not equal quality but obviously if people are buying it THEY think its not the worst, which is all that matters. Saying they did so bad and they don't listen to feedback... well bro they just outsold every computer combined in five days.... I'm fairly confident while some of US may digress , its obvious the majority doesn't. Clearly whatever they are doing is working , else why would they be selling like this. You can't expect them to change if they get support in overwhelming numbers like they are.

 

[NightwalkerUK]

STOP MOANING!!! Life is short! LIVE IT!

Says the guy replying to a post on a forum.. Living life

 

[radiology]

I too find it curious that Apple haven't even given their customers to try it instore before committing a serious amount of money.
Even more curious are the reported record number of people that have preordered without trying it.
Not something I would do. Hope it meets everyone's expectations!
I'm waiting for some reviews to come in before dropping that much money. I wouldn't buy anything this expensive without being able to have some hands on time with it first

Agree with you post.

I needed up ordering even though there is 80% chance that I will end up returning it. I guess many will do the same. I saw the 13' in store and kind liked it but not sure if I want to spend all that money on this machine.

 

[pjwal]

Agree with you post.

I needed up ordering even though there is 80% chance that I will end up returning it. I guess many will do the same. I saw the 13' in store and kind liked it but not sure if I want to spend all that money on this machine.

Unfortunately, some of us have employees that develop code on MacBook Pros. And can only do it on such. We literally can't afford to keep them on 3 year old computers anymore :-(.

 

[MacBH928]

I am guessing the reviews will not be any different from the current Macbook Pro (Function Keys) since all this has over that is higher specs and touchbar (which does not affect the rest of the computer), or is there more to it?

 

[MH01]

I too find it curious that Apple haven't even given their customers to try it instore before committing a serious amount of money.
Even more curious are the reported record number of people that have preordered without trying it.
Not something I would do. Hope it meets everyone's expectations!
I'm waiting for some reviews to come in before dropping that much money. I wouldn't buy anything this expensive without being able to have some hands on time with it first

My understanding is that these machines fall under the festive season returns period. So we have until mid January to return them.

Given I have not seen this machine etc, I have pre-ordered with the Assumption of evaluating and seeing it for the first time, something that could have been avoided if apple had units in store.

I assume there will be a considerable returns once people use the machines and decide on the price/value ration.

Im almost certain ill go for a 2015 machine just for the cost here.....but as you said, Apple gave me no choice to see this unit they expect me to pay $$$$$$$ for.

So I plan to give it a good test drive and post reviews / comparisons for other users here who are undecided .

 

[cerberusss]

I have the Apple USB-C to HDMI adapter and it works about 65% of the time

That is completely unacceptable. In general, Apple stuff is solid. But every now and then, something slips through and I hate that. I had it with the white 2009 MacBook, of which the case started chipping and cracking.

In the interest of progression, have you tried other HDMI dongles like the Belkin one?
http://www.belkin.com/us/p/p-F2CU038/

 

[MacBH928]

Agree with you post.

I needed up ordering even though there is 80% chance that I will end up returning it. I guess many will do the same. I saw the 13' in store and kind liked it but not sure if I want to spend all that money on this machine.

when you return it, do you get a full refund?
It doesn't make sense to Apple since they now have to sell it for less since its "used".

 

[MH01]

Unfortunately, some of us have employees that develop code on MacBook Pros. And can only do it on such. We literally can't afford to keep them on 3 year old computers anymore :-(.

Can I ask why you would upgrade to the new MacBook pro as a developer machine for writing code? Or are these graphic intensive applications?
[doublepost=1479032395][/doublepost]

when you return it, do you get a full refund?
It doesn't make sense to Apple since they now have to sell it for less since its "used".

You get 100% refund.

This applies to any hardware you purchase in from apple, you return it for 100% refund (unless under contract maybe - iPhone)

Normally its 14 days, but is extended from now to mid January for festive season returns.

 

[Steve P]

This has to be the worst launch Apple ever did. Not saying about the product but about their supply chain. Yesterday I went to 2 Apple Stores and they don't even have the new MacBook on display. I was told it may take another 2 weeks for them to get one to display. How is that possible? Not even an Apple Store gets one?

One of the Apple reps in London was telling customers only seven stores had demo models. It is in this video I did two weeks ago...

Strangely he goes on to say they are there to show what they can do, not what they can't do! You can hear this in the middle of the video!

 

[MacBH928]

I too find it curious that Apple haven't even given their customers to try it instore before committing a serious amount of money.
Even more curious are the reported record number of people that have preordered without trying it.

I have a feeling that after the first shipment sales will drop big time, because everyone who wants a macbook has ordered it already. When people see that price tag and realize that non of their current accessories like controllers, HDDs, and SD cards works with this computer, many will not buy it thinking it just "doesn't work" not knowing about all the different dongles.

The USB-C is so new Microsoft didn't include it in the SurfaceBook Pro. Apple went "All USB-C" a few years early.

 

[wozmatic]

Does anyone else think the touch bar is cheesy and stupid and gimmicky and slows down productivity and is a stupid little trend that people will get over very quickly and not worth the extra $600 and dongles and dongles and dongles?

 

[Steve P]

I too find it curious that Apple haven't even given their customers to try it instore before committing a serious amount of money.
Even more curious are the reported record number of people that have preordered without trying it.
Not something I would do. Hope it meets everyone's expectations!
I'm waiting for some reviews to come in before dropping that much money. I wouldn't buy anything this expensive without being able to have some hands on time with it first

From all accounts the machines are good and the 16gb limit not a problem with Apple Software (e.g. Final Cut). From what I found using the first MacBook Air (2008) the SSD is very useful in this. And the new SSD is particularly fast.

It does not help that some Apple reps are saying, strangely, the untouchable demos where there to show what they can do, not what they can't do! (You can hear this in the middle of the video I linked in another comment.)

 

[cerberusss]

The only sorta concern would be the esc key, but since I rebind that to caps lock anyway it doesn't matter

This!

A bit off-topic: I always used Karabiner for that, but since Sierra this is a standard function. Love it. I finished college working at Lucent and got a Sun workstation where the keyboard had no Caps Lock but an actual Escape key (not Control). Never found another keyboard like that, and in hindsight I suspect I got a keyboard nobody wanted. But I loved it.

 

[sudo1996]

I just saw the touchbar rMBP in a sealed glass case in the Apple retail store. It looks really nice (aesthetically). But I already know it's gonna suck because I tried the non-touchbar version... The keyboard is trash, like the retina MacBook's. They made it super shallow, so the keys almost don't push down at all when you press them, making it incredibly hard to type on unless your fingernails have just been trimmed. Even then, I can't imagine it being very good because it feels like typing on an iPad screen. Darn. MacBooks keyboards used to be among the best on the market, and now they're among the worst.

The Apple Pencil with iPad, on the other hand, was pretty impressive, but I have no use for it. I guess I'll be buying a used 2015 rMBP eventually.

 

[Ghost31]

Why are these things always reported for every new Apple product? Is this really newsworthy? Slow news day? Stop the presses....Apple is shipping it's new item to customers.

Probably because it's Mac related news on a Mac news website. I'd get it if you were wondering "well gee why is Mac rumors reporting on the new flavor of Pizza Hut pizza?" Sure ok. But this is a new highly anticipated Mac computer. I mean....duh right?

Well....I guess it's not obvious to some people

 

[Abazigal]

If sales numbers have anything to do with quality then Apple actually made complete crap for nearly all of their existence. See, you can't have it both ways. Do you believe that sales=quality? (In which case why are you making the argument you just made since obviously by your reasoning Microsoft makes the best OS?). It's far too easy to sell crap to the ignorant.

Sales is a derivation of price and quality. Apple undeniably sells a lot of devices for the prices they charge, and I think that cannot be understated.



And you wonder why so many analysts routinely get Apple wrong. For almost forty years Apple has proven they can have success doing things in their own unique way. And for most all of those same forty years, critics have derided Apple as a cult. Apple is one of the great success stories of our times. Pretending that Apple’s success is irrational is not only irrational, it does us all a great disservice.

We shouldn’t be trying to explain away Apple’s success. We should be trying to explain it.