U.S. Mac Sales Grow 28.5% in Holiday Quarter, PC Market Suffers Worst Decline Ever [Updated]

[Parasprite]

I switched over to OSX back in 2012 and will never own a Windows machine again.

Unfortunately I had to Bootcamp and install Windows 7 because I still need it for AutoCAD and occasionally playing SimCity 4.

I'm not saying they are any good, bit aren't both of those available for Mac?

Edit: Never mind, you already answered my question.

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Obviously everyone lacks those resources locally. Whenever you are doing a search you are using thousands of computers of Google. That's precisely doing the computation off site. All of us do it, all the time.

I suppose you don't expect everyone to own datacenters just so they can skip a few miles of fiber?

I really can't tell if you're trolling...

The kind of tasks they are talking about require more bandwidth and response time than can even be pushed over USB. It is hardly the same as sending google a few bytes of text and having them send you a few kilobytes of results, even if Google is doing a lot of heavy lifting.

 

[jkichline]

iOS Developer and the Microsoft Surface

OK everyone. I have a confession to make. I'm an iOS developer and Apple shareholder. I love all things Apple, I really do. I have 7 iOS devices on my desk right now for testing and of course a nice bit of OS X kit to do the development. I'm firm entrenched in the ecosystem and I like it.

To my right, there's a new toy... a Microsoft Surface Pro. I picked it up at Best Buy for $600 for 128 GB. Why? Well, I'm looking at using it for my Android and possible Windows app development machine soon. I've made open statements about the Microsoft Surface here and it's issues. For instance, I really don't see how you could use it with a keyboard on your lap, the necessity to use a keyboard and mouse, etc.

But here's the thing. It's good. Now I say that with it sitting on my desk connected to a mouse and keyboard and screen. It's crazy heavy and bulky if you want to walk around with it (remember it's a Pro version) and the battery life is OK (not stellar). The UI. The UI is, for the most part, pretty beautiful. It's nowhere near as simple as the iPad and I get confused switching between the touch mode and the desktop (the desktop is like it's own app so you can have two web browsers running that look completely different, etc). It's not a polished experience but it's nice.

I say all of this because Microsoft might have a chance. I hate Android for a number of reasons. It's terrible to develop for and has a pathetic user interface compared to Apple and Microsoft. What I'm saying it... I'm bidding on Microsoft here.

Price and perception are the biggest issues here. What you need to realize is... a Windows 8 tablet is more akin to an Ultrabook than an iPad. You are getting a full functional laptop. But you're not getting a super streamlined user interface. But it's beautiful. It's nice. The hardware is sharp.

So there you go. I admit it. But I still love my iPads more.

 

[bretm]

We can keep dreaming, huh?

I can't understand what Apple is waiting for, has been waiting for all these years. I know so many people who have toyed with the idea of getting a Mac, were really serious about making the jump off PCs, but ended up buying a Windows box because their choices were an underpowered Mac Mini, a sticker-shock-inducing Mac Pro or an iMac--a machine that appeals not one iota to most Windows users who want to be able to choose different displays or upgrade various parts of the machine.

The intentional omission of a mid-range, headless Mac is perhaps the most puzzling decision Apple has ever made. Just take the parts inside an iMac, put it in a Mac Mini sized box (maybe bigger) and sell it. I'd buy one in a heartbeat.

Because Steve Jobs never thought that computers should be upgradeable. He hated the notion. They create a piece of art and you want to muck with it? Not his cup of tea. The minute he came back into power at Apple he immediately, killed the clones, started focusing on iMacs, iBooks, and laptops. The desktop got one good overhaul to the G5 along the way, and updated to intel as well but Apple NEEDED that group to survive. As that need diminished, so did their focus on machines you could muck with. And when they finally did address it? A tube. A very cool powerful tube. And while components can be upgraded, there's no standard upgrade slots. It's still part of their DNA. And they get away with all this by doing what they do infinitely better than others. Design, support, software/hardware integration, ease of use, etc. So they an charge top dollar for it as well. Whatca gonna do?

 

[jkichline]

Fiscal vs Calendar

Funny how things are different from other analyst.

Apple drops to fourth place in U.S. PC shipments for Q4 2013 with 5.7% drop in shipped units

Apple's Q4 ends September 30th. Their Q1 is October 1st - December 31st. It's not aligned to the calendar year.

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Because Steve Jobs never thought that computers should be upgradeable. He hated the notion. They create a piece of art and you want to muck with it? Not his cup of tea. The minute he came back into power at Apple he immediately, killed the clones, started focusing on iMacs, iBooks, and laptops. The desktop got one good overhaul to the G5 along the way, and updated to intel as well but Apple NEEDED that group to survive. As that need diminished, so did their focus on machines you could muck with. And when they finally did address it? A tube. A very cool powerful tube. And while components can be upgraded, there's no standard upgrade slots. It's still part of their DNA. And they get away with all this by doing what they do infinitely better than others. Design, support, software/hardware integration, ease of use, etc. So they an charge top dollar for it as well. Whatca gonna do?

It's been settled already on various websites that the MacPro is a bargain compared to Windows workstations with the same hardware. Every Apple product I've owned is worth the money and retains it's resale value. You wouldn't trick out a Porsche, but then again, you don't have to and it retains it's value.

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1500 photos? I shot 200 photos just to get our Xmas card right. Where do you put your real photos from your real cameras?

My photos typically stay right on the SD card they were saved to. I'm like my parents who never got the film developed. Oops!

Of course unless you are a photographer, most people are happy to upload those videos to Facebook and share them right away. Professionals usually have a work flow to process the photos quickly and then save on portable, less speed sensitive hardware. Get a good 3 TB thunderbolt drive and save it there when you are done.

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So who's right - IDC or Gartner?

http://9to5mac.com/2014/01/09/apple...s-for-q4-2013-with-5-7-drop-in-shipped-units/

You're comparing Q4 with Q1. Apple does not follow the normal calendar year.

 

[iBug2]

If the tablet is that fast imagine what a server would do.

Obviously, but if everything you do is "instant", you won't need more speed.

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I really can't tell if you're trolling...

The kind of tasks they are talking about require more bandwidth and response time than can even be pushed over USB. It is hardly the same as sending google a few bytes of text and having them send you a few kilobytes of results, even if Google is doing a lot of heavy lifting.

Who is they?

You type in a few lines of code, and then CPU starts crunching. Or you apply a filter to a photo, and CPU starts crunching (again a few lines of code). Your input is being done through the keyboard, which is connected to the computer using USB. So no human being is inputing things faster than a USB 2.0 connection can carry. And then the output is being displayed using displayport, which is a lot faster than USB but still not too fast that cables aren't enough. We have fiber connections today in the lab that can connect a display to your CPU which sits a mile away. In the near future those kinds of connections will be cheap and mass produced.

But people can do even without that today if all they need is big computation. You can deal with a few seconds of output delay obviously if the off site supercomputer will do your calculations 1000 times faster than your home computer.

 

[Yamcha]

It's because of Windows 8, while I've personally been able to adapt the new interface and experience, most people I know find it rather annoying.

My dad, uncle & mom have no clue how to use it, I had to give them all a walkthrough, my dad still doesn't like it .

 

[Piggie]

Apple's Q4 ends September 30th. Their Q1 is October 1st - December 31st. It's not aligned to the calendar year.

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It's been settled already on various websites that the MacPro is a bargain compared to Windows workstations with the same hardware. Every Apple product I've owned is worth the money and retains it's resale value. You wouldn't trick out a Porsche, but then again, you don't have to and it retains it's value.

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My photos typically stay right on the SD card they were saved to. I'm like my parents who never got the film developed. Oops!

Of course unless you are a photographer, most people are happy to upload those videos to Facebook and share them right away. Professionals usually have a work flow to process the photos quickly and then save on portable, less speed sensitive hardware. Get a good 3 TB thunderbolt drive and save it there when you are done.

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You're comparing Q4 with Q1. Apple does not follow the normal calendar year.

But it's not the same hardware is it?
The graphics cards are not the same as the full pc versions I understand.
Plus for the most part you are stuck with it, you can't next year easy just upgrade bits from any supplier.

Even with the same parts, AND more expensive, the pc would be the better serious computer.

 

[D-Dave]

... But even corporations I can see going to a central core processing system with local workstations nothing more than a display and keyboard (if not a virtual keyboard). Storage. Processing. All done centrally.

Don't count on it happening too soon. Currently the cost of a Terminal-Server-Environment is way higher then using a traditional Server + Office-PC Network (just did a calculation for a medium sized Business (250+ PCs))

But, and this is a big "but", if Microsoft does not deliver the next Version of Windows with an interface appealing to Businessusers (Windows 7 is actualy great, Metro+Full-Screen-Madness is NOT) it may well be Linux or OS X taking over the corporate office.

 

[gnasher729]

Wow. Mac sales surged by 28%?

Are you sure it's not including the sale of ipad? From a few last report I always see that Apple computer sales always combining Mac and iPad?
Now if that's the case, the growth would be normal considering Aplle jist released the new shiny iPad Air last holiday?

If iPad sales were included, Apple would be on top of the list, beating everyone else combined. iPad sales for this Christmas quarter are not out, but last year they were over 22 million world wide.

 

[Akaba]

Not for me!

... My data is also proprietary.

No way will I ever live without a laptop!

That is indeed a serious aspect against using some services on the Net to store your data ... you might encounter EULA where the service becomes the owner of your files, like your pics they could use anytime at their own discretion ...

It's not that you have anything to hide or so ... it's just that your data are your data and should remain so when you want to, be it professional or private. So indeed, I will always keep a personal laptop or desktop, not just a tablet or smartphone ...

 

[woody686]

Really?

I'm guessing those figures were calculated on an old dodgy version of Windows as they don't add up to a -7.5% reduction

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If iPad sales were included, Apple would be on top of the list, beating everyone else combined. iPad sales for this Christmas quarter are not out, but last year they were over 22 million world wide.

If you include iPad sales then you need to include all tablet sales for comparison. But if you're going to do that you might as well include all phone sales and MP3/MP4 players. It's going to be quite a big list.

 

[gnasher729]

Could they spin the numbers any more in favor of Apple?

28% increase of practically nothing is still practically nothing. Apple's growth chart is hardly a steady climb. Pick a 1 YR period a few months back and it shows practically NO GROWTH. It's taken them EIGHT YEARS to gain 10% market share. WOOHOO!

86.3% PC marketshare vs Apple 13.7%. Of course,that's bound to increase dramatically once buyers of new Mac's realize their systems are non-upgradeable and their forced to pony up for another new system sooner than expected just to keep up. More RAM? Too bad. Faster SSD? Too bad. Faster WIFI? Too bad. Better graphics? Too bad.

How is this spinning numbers? If Apple grew 10% and they said 28%, that would be spinning. But Apple did grow by 28.5% year over year. Actually, the numbers displayed are extremely spun against Apple. They are unit sales. Each computer sale counts as "1". If someone orders a $9,000 Mac Pro with everything, and a cheap $250 laptop, they each count as one sale. I'd want to hear the revenue numbers, and I'd bet Apple is the US leader.

You're assumption that Mac sales would increase because they have to be replaced due to Apple's fault is just ridiculous. Buyers are not idiots. Or let's say that if you compare people who can afford to pay $1000 to $2000 for a Mac with people who can only afford to pay $250 to $400 for the cheapest of laptops, the first group probably contains fewer idiots. At least they are clever enough to get themselves a decent income. And in my experience, nobody that I know personally (not professionally) has ever upgraded a PC, unless they came to me for help, and I ordered the parts, and I put them in.

On the contrary to what you say, the cheap computers are replaced more often because they break down quickly, or because they are filled with viruses and people buy a new computer. Macs are known to last forever. Even if people upgrade to a new computer, they sell the old ones or hand them down. All these PCs that get replaced are replaced because they are no use to anyone anymore.

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If you include iPad sales then you need to include all tablet sales for comparison. But if you're going to do that you might as well include all phone sales and MP3/MP4 players. It's going to be quite a big list.

My post was a reply to someone who thought the Apple numbers might have been manipulated by including iPads. Adding iPad numbers to computer numbers would totally destroy the purpose of this list, which is about understanding what the computer market is doing, not about getting fanboy points.

 

[Sy7ygy]

Because people really don't need PC's anymore in their homes. Tablets will do just fine. Email, Facebook, music/radio, casual gaming, calenders, note taking - all just fine on a tablet.

PC's/Macs are only need for power users (video, photographers, hardcore gamers, business users on Excel, etc.)

True enough.

I think Windows 8 added salt to that wound.

 

[osofast240sx]

PC's/Macs are only need for power users (video, photographers, hardcore gamers, business users on Excel, etc.)

Not true, iOS can only hold so many personal pictures, video, movies and songs. That alone requires a PC for storage. Not everyone wants cloud storage.

 

[jroadley]

Windows 8

Why on earth would anyone want to use that as their main o/s

Windows 7 = brilliant.

Had a customer bought a Lenovo windows 8 PC - hates it. Wishes she'd pay the extra for a iMac

 

[jav6454]

I thought Mac sales were declining last year; maybe there was turnaround in December.

Mac desktop sales are slumping, but the notebook section is good.

 

[Tech198]

yay.. Dell...

I think most people would hate Windows 8..... It's probably the most hated OS..

While i small percentage of them like it..

 

[Northgrove]

Because people really don't need PC's anymore in their homes. Tablets will do just fine. Email, Facebook, music/radio, casual gaming, calenders, note taking - all just fine on a tablet.

PC's/Macs are only need for power users (video, photographers, hardcore gamers, business users on Excel, etc.)

I agree, and this makes Windows 8 all the more mind-boggling. Since these users who "need" a desktop or laptop are power users, does it make sense to have such a focus on tablet-style usage and Metro apps with 10% of the feature set of their typical desktop apps?

It's ridiculous and I honestly don't get how Microsoft can make this mistake. No wonder they're losing users like mad.

 

[Steve121178]

Windows 8

Why on earth would anyone want to use that as their main o/s

Windows 7 = brilliant.

Had a customer bought a Lenovo windows 8 PC - hates it. Wishes she'd pay the extra for a iMac

Windows 8 in desktop mode thrashes Windows 7 desktop mode in performance and optimisation.

The main issue with Windows 8 is the modern apps and UI as most people do not like it. All people have to do is right click on their task bar and select Properties, then Navigation then check the box "When I sign in, go to desktop instead of Start" to bypass the whole Start screen. It's not rocket science.

I personally am not a big fan of the Start screen & tiles on a PC and I hate it on Server 2012. It also confused the hell out of my parents when I had to rebuild their PC. I don't mean to sound ageist, but it's clear that some older people simply get confused with the new UI. It's not user friendly and it's not intuitive. In order to shut down a PC, having to right click the start button and choosing 'Shut Down' is farcical. Windows 8 desktop mode is fantastic, the best experience yet, but the rest is a sorry mess not suitable for a traditional desktop or notebook PC.

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I agree, and this makes Windows 8 all the more mind-boggling. Since these users who "need" a desktop or laptop are power users, does it make sense to have such a focus on tablet-style usage and Metro apps with 10% of the feature set of their typical desktop apps?

It's ridiculous and I honestly don't get how Microsoft can make this mistake. No wonder they're losing users like mad.

They are not really losing users, you are confusing shipments with the user base. People simply are not buying PC's like they used to. Most PC's are good for 4-7 years so people do not refresh their machines like they used to. Plus with the tough economic times and global recession, how many people can justify spending money on a PC when they are struggling to put food on the table and heat their homes during winter?

Plus a lot of people have bought a tablet or smart phone instead of upgrading or replacing their PC. I know loads of people who simply spent £199 on a Nexus 7 as they only wanted web access.

The PC still has a place in the home and it's a mandatory requirement for business.

 

[Max(IT)]

QFT !

Even the iPad has cannibalized Mac sales. I use my iPad's 85% and my Mac 15% of the time. Apps are typically so much better on the iPad.

I agree .... I don't feel the need to upgrade my 2011 MBP

 

[Rogifan]

Could they spin the numbers any more in favor of Apple?

28% increase of practically nothing is still practically nothing. Apple's growth chart is hardly a steady climb. Pick a 1 YR period a few months back and it shows practically NO GROWTH. It's taken them EIGHT YEARS to gain 10% market share. WOOHOO!

86.3% PC marketshare vs Apple 13.7%. Of course,that's bound to increase dramatically once buyers of new Mac's realize their systems are non-upgradeable and their forced to pony up for another new system sooner than expected just to keep up. More RAM? Too bad. Faster SSD? Too bad. Faster WIFI? Too bad. Better graphics? Too bad.

I don't even need to read the front page stories anymore. They're always bashing PC's, always touting The Great Apple, and spinning the facts. It's not news...it's propaganda.

I use Mac's and iPads and iPhones, and PC's... love them both, but why do the stories here always have such bias?

Um...

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1568934/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1608639/
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1652191/

 

[Macist]

My most powerful Mac is a 2.0ghz MacBook Pro from 2010. I use it heavily for design and photographic work and while it would be nice to have a new machine I just don't really need one. Even for personal video work in Final Cut X it's fine - big renders happen in the background and it's not as if I need them to complete yesterday.

Years ago I used to chance machines much more regularly as I was always gasping for power. Now I don't need to.

Oh, and for light use and content consumption I use an iPad now.

There's just less and less reason for buy a big fat new PC every year.

 

[paulsdenton]

This is just the result of continually striving to offer superior hardware and a continually evolving, easy to use operating system; marketed using a consistent and well executed marketing mix. Apple stays the course and avoids gimmickry that the others use in desperation to differentiate their products.

Keep doing it, Cupertino, keep doing it!

 

[Tiger8]

Thank you microsoft!

This is all Windows 8 at play, ladies and gents.

Funny, Windows 8 actually is not bad at all on the phone...

On desktop, different story. You are like a raging monkey trying to figure out why did internet explorer disappear and you are back to the tiles... wait... how do I start task manager? what the hell is the charm? Am I still signed on or was I signed off?

Surface should just... not exist...

One experience for all!

 

[kazmac]

that's good news

Glad to see Macs of all kinds growing in ownership. Now if Apple gets their QC down awesome!