All iPads I'm angry with Apple, and Disappointed (Safari reloading tabs)

[Dmunjal]

That IS the point even if you want to ignore it. Apple doesn't need to do what every other tablet maker out there does. They make a better tablet more people want to buy. They don't need to copy anyone. Just because Android needs 2GB to work doesn't mean iOS needs it.

Try comprehending this very simple fact before YOU reply to ME.

You are spot on. The point I think they are making is if Apple just did a LITTLE more like put in 2GB, make a 5" phone, add some functionality into iOS, they would literally own the market like they did with iPods. These Android users would have never left in the first place. But Apple keeps creating openings for their competitors.

 

[Ezhik]

That IS the point even if you want to ignore it. Apple doesn't need to do what every other tablet maker out there does. They make a better tablet more people want to buy. They don't need to copy anyone. Just because Android needs 2GB to work doesn't mean iOS needs it.

Try comprehending this very simple fact before YOU reply to ME.

And yet iDevices continue to struggle with RAM issues, while all high-end tablets around them DO NOT. We are talking about this one issue here, even if you choose to ignore it because Apple is so ~special~.

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If they don't solve the problem I described above, they can even put 8 Gb inside iPad Air 2, but ram will be eaten nevertheless ...

Btw is very interesting to note as people here just wanna whine and cry instead of doing some proper testing and report results to the community.
Yeah, is much better to say "android uses 2-3-32 Gb" instead of understand if the problem is ram quantity or not ...

Well hey, I said that I always had this problem with every single iDevice I have ever owned, which were all 32 bit, said that it could be avoided if Apple used more RAM, but apparently my problems don't exist and Apple spending 5$ more on a better RAM chip is not an option because iPads sell more than Androids.

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So in the end I get a worse browser experience than on a 200$ tablet, become a beta tester for an unfinished OS, even though I paid more for a device from a company that's known for releasing good high quality products - and somehow it's all my fault.

 

[Max(IT)]

OMG could you do a research by yourself ? Do we need to speak about android on this forum ?
Well, with a little search you could find people bitching about android on Galaxy S4 eating about 850-1.0 Gb of ram alone !!! I say again: up to 1.0 Gb just to run the ***ing os !!
Can they use 1 Gb on android ? No they can't because manufacturer like Samsung can't optimize their products (Apple iOS eat no more than 400-450 Mb !).
Search by your self "galaxy S4 free memory" and enjoy ...

And about the "better ram chip" , Apple uses DDR3 ram, while most of the Android flagships are still on DDR2 (the galaxy S4 is DDR3 also, but HTC One for example still use DDR2 chips). There is nothing cheap in iDevices ....

 

[arefbe]

If they don't solve the problem I described above, they can even put 8 Gb inside iPad Air 2, but ram will be eaten nevertheless ...

You're right about that.

 

[samiznaetekto]

If they don't solve the problem I described above, they can even put 8 Gb inside iPad Air 2, but ram will be eaten nevertheless ...

You're right about that.

No, he's wrong about that. Memory leaks can be of two kinds: a "spill" and a continuous leakage. He'd be right if there was a continuous memory leakage in Safari: it just seats there and allocates more and more memory until there no more left. Then throwing in more RAM won't help much because memory will be eaten away even while Safari sits idle.

Instead, Safari has one-time (per tab) spills - it uses much more memory per tab than is necessary if it were carefully coded and optimized. In this case, more RAM is helpful, because your typical usage pattern may safely pass under the plank.

With 1GB, you have about 500MB left to apps after iOS loads. With 2GB, you'd have 1500MB available, THREE times more! So if you typically load 6 tabs and they keep reloading, on 2GB they won't. For most users, 2GB will provide much better, less frustrating user experience.

Shame on you, Apple!!!

 

[Max(IT)]

No, he's wrong about that. Memory leaks can be of two kinds: a "spill" and a continuous leakage. He'd be right if there was a continuous memory leakage in Safari: it just seats there and allocates more and more memory until there no more left. Then throwing in more RAM won't help much because memory will be eaten away even while Safari sits idle.

Instead, Safari has one-time (per tab) spills - it uses much more memory per tab than is necessary if it were carefully coded and optimized. In this case, more RAM is helpful, because your typical usage pattern may safely pass under the plank.

With 1GB, you have about 500MB left to apps after iOS loads. With 2GB, you'd have 1500MB available, THREE times more! So if you typically load 6 tabs and they keep reloading, on 2GB they won't. For most users, 2GB will provide much better, less frustrating user experience.

Shame on you, Apple!!!

I explained quite clearly that Safari eats ram also when tabs are closed , without releasing unused ram ....
Right now I have only this page opened, and iMessage in background, and the free memory is 130 Mb !!!
On iPad 4 it was more like 400 Mb ...

 

[ZBoater]

And yet iDevices continue to struggle with RAM issues, while all high-end tablets around them DO NOT. We are talking about this one issue here, even if you choose to ignore it because Apple is so ~special~.

I can't help it if you automatically assume that RAM is causing iOS issues, and I have used plenty of iDevices with no issues whatsoever.

So, specifically, about the Safari reloading tabs on the iPad Air (since you brought up iDevices), you think the inordinate amount of reloading is caused by lack of RAM? I disagree. I've seen iDevices with half the RAM of the Air work fine. It's not a RAM issue. And no matter how much RAM Google puts into their devices, the cause of the Air's issue is not going to change.

 

[Max(IT)]

I can't help it if you automatically assume that RAM is causing iOS issues, and I have used plenty of iDevices with no issues whatsoever.

So, specifically, about the Safari reloading tabs on the iPad Air (since you brought up iDevices), you think the inordinate amount of reloading is caused by lack of RAM? I disagree. I've seen iDevices with half the RAM of the Air work fine. It's not a RAM issue. And no matter how much RAM Google puts into their devices, the cause of the Air's issue is not going to change.

This

 

[jonnyb098]

Everyone is also forgetting that safari uses the new swipe to go back feature. This is essentially also still keeping pages loaded like a tab would. Sometimes it's noticeable the swipe has to reload a page and sometimes it doesn't. Obviously there's an issue to resolve here but it's already been proven to be a memory leak. More ram would only delay the crashes. Not stop them.

 

[Max(IT)]

Everyone is also forgetting that safari uses the new swipe to go back feature. This is essentially also still keeping pages loaded like a tab would. Sometimes it's noticeable the swipe has to reload a page and sometimes it doesn't. Obviously there's an issue to resolve here but it's already been proven to be a memory leak. More ram would only delay the crashes. Not stop them.

Yes, but on iPad 4 the memory leakage is way less problematic than on iPad Air, so it couldn't be the swipe to go back feature, since it is included in both.

 

[Ezhik]

OMG could you do a research by yourself ? Do we need to speak about android on this forum ?
Well, with a little search you could find people bitching about android on Galaxy S4 eating about 850-1.0 Gb of ram alone !!! I say again: up to 1.0 Gb just to run the ***ing os !!
Can they use 1 Gb on android ? No they can't because manufacturer like Samsung can't optimize their products (Apple iOS eat no more than 400-450 Mb !).
Search by your self "galaxy S4 free memory" and enjoy ...

And about the "better ram chip" , Apple uses DDR3 ram, while most of the Android flagships are still on DDR2 (the galaxy S4 is DDR3 also, but HTC One for example still use DDR2 chips). There is nothing cheap in iDevices ....

And yet... I will not have this browser issue on a Galaxy Note 2, or a Galaxy S4, or a Lumia 1020, or a Galaxy Tab 3, or a Microsoft Surface, or a Dell Venue 8, or a Nexus 7 2013, or a Kindle Fire HDX... Do I have to go on? You can claim that iOS is so great with RAM and Android is terrible all you want, but the fact is still there: iOS will reload tabs because it's out of memory, but any other OS will not.

 

[Krazy Bill]

What you're all missing is that even if the iPad had more memory the coders would continue to waste it with inefficient code and API's just to crank it out faster. Nobody has time to "optimize" it these days. More RAM is just a band-aid for "bloat".

That said, give me a band-aid please. Anything to stop that time consuming "refresh" while switching between certain apps.

 

[Ezhik]

I can't help it if you automatically assume that RAM is causing iOS issues, and I have used plenty of iDevices with no issues whatsoever.

So, specifically, about the Safari reloading tabs on the iPad Air (since you brought up iDevices), you think the inordinate amount of reloading is caused by lack of RAM? I disagree. I've seen iDevices with half the RAM of the Air work fine. It's not a RAM issue. And no matter how much RAM Google puts into their devices, the cause of the Air's issue is not going to change.

Well I used plenty of iDevices as well, and they ALL suffered from this issue, which could've been avoided if Apple wasn't so cheap and put some more RAM in their devices.

Like how iPad 1 had RAM issues, which weren't there with the iPhone 4 - essentially the same device, but with 512 MB of RAM. However that was 3 years ago, so RAM usage is rising, with Retina assets and features like Siri eating more and more. And I bet you that the iPhone 4 now has these RAM issues as well.

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What you're all missing is that even if the iPad had more memory the coders would continue to waste it with inefficient code and API's just to crank it out faster. Nobody has time to "optimize" it these days. More RAM is just a band-aid for "bloat".

That said, give me a band-aid please. Anything to stop that time consuming "refresh" while switching between certain apps.

Gee, if only Apple could control the apps that get on their devices... That could've made developers feel responsibility for their actions!

Also iOS can kick apps out of memory if it feels like it - just like Safari does with tabs.

 

[Dmunjal]

What you're all missing is that even if the iPad had more memory the coders would continue to waste it with inefficient code and API's just to crank it out faster. Nobody has time to "optimize" it these days. More RAM is just a band-aid for "bloat".

That said, give me a band-aid please. Anything to stop that time consuming "refresh" while switching between certain apps.

But RAM is cheap. Cheaper than expensive coders.

 

[Krazy Bill]

Gee, if only Apple could control the apps that get on their devices... That could've made developers feel responsibility for their actions!

Apple wouldn't have to control anything if they gave developers something to work with. Exactly who butters Apple's bread anyway? Besides, Apple makes the API's and development SDK's. Hands are somewhat tied depending on what you want to do.

But RAM is cheap. Cheaper than expensive coders.

I hear you and don't understand it myself.

 

[Ezhik]

Okay, so I googled around, and:

Elpida F8164A1MD, the 1GB chip used in the iPad Air costs $10.50.
K4E4E324EB-EGCE, the 2GB chip used by Samsung's Galaxy S4 costs $11.88.

$1.38. That's the price Apple would've paid for doubling the amount of RAM.

And that's what you guys argue with me about. One dollar and thirty eight cents.

 

[sebastian...]

How come Opera Browser can have even on ipad 1 multiple tabs open without any reloading ?
Even 17 tabs I managed to open on ios5 ipad 1, all were available without reloading.

Just try it !

Also back and forward are instant, no loading. How come ?

And probably no one uses that browser (low compatibility with some websites I think)

 

[samiznaetekto]

Okay, so I googled around, and:

Elpida F8164A1MD, the 1GB chip used in the iPad Air costs $10.50.
K4E4E324EB-EGCE, the 2GB chip used by Samsung's Galaxy S4 costs $11.88.

$1.38. That's the price Apple would've paid for doubling the amount of RAM.

And that's what you guys argue with me about. One dollar and thirty eight cents.

Brilliant! Everyone experiencing frustration when their tabs reload, entered web form data lost, Safari crashing, other apps reloading anew, games losing your progress - visualize Tim Cook holding a dollar and devilishly smiling at you.

 

[WilliamG]

That's the part that the fanboi group doesn't understand. Most folks here, who are throwing out criticisms, are 90% happy wih what apple is doing. It's that 10% that is sooooooooo frustrating. In this case, not having 2Gigs of RAM is causing a much worse user experience. You and your buddies are trying to convince people that loading tabs constantly in safari is a good thing. We're not buying it, no matter how much FUD you push out.

Agreed 100%. I'm disappointed that 7.1 beta 2 doesn't fix this problem. And it's absolutely right that it's even more infuriating since 90% of the user experience is so great. That 10% drives me a bit crazy.

I think this tread has run its course. The issue is long fixed.

Incorrect.

 

[ukiss]

Why did Apple release such an unfinished OS (or product) ? I mean the crashes are obvious. I am curious whether they did tried to use the browser for 15 minutes. lol
Btw, I've read that 64bit system uses more ram. Don't know if that's true though.

 

[ZBoater]

Like how iPad 1 had RAM issues, which weren't there with the iPhone 4 - essentially the same device, but with 512 MB of RAM. However that was 3 years ago, so RAM usage is rising, with Retina assets and features like Siri eating more and more. And I bet you that the iPhone 4 now has these RAM issues as well.

Ok, so I'm quoting you here, so don't shoot the messenger.

So the iPhone 4 didn't have issues, but now it does.

Did the RAM in the iPhone 4 shrink?

 

[jonnyb098]

Okay, so I googled around, and:

Elpida F8164A1MD, the 1GB chip used in the iPad Air costs $10.50.
K4E4E324EB-EGCE, the 2GB chip used by Samsung's Galaxy S4 costs $11.88.

$1.38. That's the price Apple would've paid for doubling the amount of RAM.

And that's what you guys argue with me about. One dollar and thirty eight cents.

Yeah now multiply that by how ever many million iPads apple makes. They are a business. Every dollar counts in the end.

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Yes, but on iPad 4 the memory leakage is way less problematic than on iPad Air, so it couldn't be the swipe to go back feature, since it is included in both.

This is apples first 64 bit chip for ios. Growing pains may apply. I know this issue is annoying but it's not really a deal breaker. I'm much more concerned with the random resprings. That's something that literally inhibits what you are doing.

 

[samiznaetekto]

Yeah now multiply that by how ever many million iPads apple makes. They are a business. Every dollar counts in the end.

If Apple makes, say, $300 of profit on average on each iPad sold, then if only $1.38/$300*100% ~ 0.5% of customers decided to buy Android or Windows instead of iPad because of Safari reload issue, Apple will lose revenue. This doesn't make any business sense.

 

[l0gikb0mb]

Ok, so I'm quoting you here, so don't shoot the messenger.

So the iPhone 4 didn't have issues, but now it does.

Did the RAM in the iPhone 4 shrink?

So clueless. It's called software updates which require more ram. iOS 7 requires a lot more memory than iOS 6.

 

[Max(IT)]

And yet... I will not have this browser issue on a Galaxy Note 2, or a Galaxy S4, or a Lumia 1020, or a Galaxy Tab 3, or a Microsoft Surface, or a Dell Venue 8, or a Nexus 7 2013, or a Kindle Fire HDX... Do I have to go on? You can claim that iOS is so great with RAM and Android is terrible all you want, but the fact is still there: iOS will reload tabs because it's out of memory, but any other OS will not.

I'm not saying the problem is not existent. I'm saying it's annoying and it's related to Safari or to 64-bit iOS 7 implementation.
BTW I'm trying Atomic Web Browser and Mercury to see if it's related to Safari only.

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Brilliant! Everyone experiencing frustration when their tabs reload, entered web form data lost, Safari crashing, other apps reloading anew, games losing your progress - visualize Tim Cook holding a dollar and devilishly smiling at you.

We could send him a dollar and half for each iPad

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Agreed 100%. I'm disappointed that 7.1 beta 2 doesn't fix this problem. And it's absolutely right that it's even more infuriating since 90% of the user experience is so great. That 10% drives me a bit crazy.



Incorrect.

You are the first I saw who said 7.1b2 didn't solve the problem.
I can't try by myself ....